Previous rounds at slams that have felt like the final

Fabresque

Legend
Djokovic v Nadal RG 2021
Djokovic v Nadal W 2018
Djokovic v Federer USO 2011
Wawrinka vs Djokovic AO 2014
Federer v Djokovic RG 2011
Chang v Lendl RG 1989 (was 4R!)
Nadal v Berdych AO 2012
Raonic v Federer W 2016
Djokovic v Wawrinka AO 2013
Djokovic v Wawrinka USO 2013(?)

Most of these felt like finals to me after the tournament, possibly because of the significance of some of these matches. Djok v Nad FO 2021 will always be known much more than Djok v Tsits in the final. Any others?
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Djokovic v Nadal RG 2021 - yes. Tsitsi eould hace been a gimme for the winner
Djokovic v Nadal W 2018 - yes. Anderson in tge final LOL.
Djokovic v Federer USO 2011 - nope. There was also Nadal in the final, not a gimme oppinent.
Wawrinka vs Djokovic AO 2014 - considering Nadal's injury in the final, yes, this proved to be the teue final.
Federer v Djokovic RG 2011 - with Nadal waiting in a RG F, hell no.
Chang v Lendl RG 1989 (was 4R!)
Nadal v Berdych AO 2012 - definitely not. Not even close.
Raonic v Federer W 2016 - not even close
Djokovic v Wawrinka AO 2013 - nope
Djokovic v Wawrinka USO 2013(?) - nope

Most of these felt like finals to me after the tournament, possibly because of the significance of some of these matches. Djok v Nad FO 2021 will always be known much more than Djok v Tsits in the final. Any others?
To me a de-facto final means that the actual final opponent is close to a gimme.
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
RAFA v Joker RG 2013

tumblr_mrd174lklz1soj9m2o1_500.gif
 

TennisLurker

Professional
Nadal Federer 2005 RG semis

I disagree because even if doped, Mariano Puerta may have given Rafa his toughest final
I'm glad Rafa ended up winning, otherwise it would have been a huge problem for men tennis once the doping was discovered. When it happened with Korda in 1998 it wasn't a problem because the doping was discovered after Wimbledon (people presumed he doped at Australia too but there were no proofs of that)
 

TripleATeam

G.O.A.T.
Depends on what you mean - the most epic match could be "felt like the final", even if the final is not at all bad. I would say an example of this would be USO 21. The most epic match could be argued to be Zverev-Djokovic SF, whereas the final was a step below that in terms of quality. On the other hand, the final still seemed like a contest.

I'd argue you need 3 things for a prior match to "feel" like the final.
  • The two strongest players (or two of the 3-4 strongest) in the tournament need to meet
  • The match those two players have is of at least decent quality and goes on at least 4 sets
  • The final is between the winner of that match and someone with a significantly lower chance of winning, where the winner of the "de-facto final" wins.
These criteria would be met in circumstances like RG 2013, for instance - Nadal and Djokovic were in a class of their own, played an epic 5-setter, and Nadal went on to steamroll Ferrer (we can also assume Djokovic would have easily beaten him too).

In slams like RG 2021, this also works fairly well, though the 3rd point is a maybe. Tsitsipas had a significantly lower chance, but he was easily the 3rd best in the tournament and the leadup to it. Under these criteria, USO 2014 had no match that "felt" like the final too. Cilic would need to be involved in that match, and Cilic either had 3-setters against the favorites (Federer), or had tough matches against people that had no business ever winning (Simon).

My list:
USO - 1971 SF (Okker v. Smith), 90 QF (Lendl v. Sampras), 93 QF (Chang v. Sampras), 98 SF (Sampras v. Rafter), 04 QF (Federer v. Agassi), 08 SF (Djokovic v. Federer) (if any), 17 SF (Nadal v. Delpo).
honorable mentions (Failed on 3rd point) 75 SF (Orantes v. Vilas), 84/5 SF (Mac v. Connors/Wilander), 92 SF (Chang v. Edberg), 01 QF (Hewitt v. Roddick), 11 SF (Djokovic v. Federer).​
Wimbledon - 68 QF (Laver v. Ralston), 73 SF (Taylor v. Kodes), 74 QF (Kodes v. Connors), 97 QF (Sampras v. Becker), 03 SF (Roddick v. Federer), 18 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).
honorable mentions - Failed on 2nd point - 83 SF (Lendl v. McEnroe), 96 QF (Sampras v. Krajicek). Failed on 3rd - 89 SF (Lendl v. Becker), 93 QF (Sampras v. Agassi), 95 SF (Goran v. Sampras).​
Australian Open (post 82) - 01 SF (Agassi v. Rafter), 05 SF (Federer v. Safin) (on the edge since Hewitt had a chance in the final against either), 06 QF (Federer v. Davydenko), 14 QF (Wawrinka v. Djokovic).
honorable mentions - Failed on 3rd - 85 SF (Lendl v. Edberg), 00 SF (Agassi v. Sampras), 21 QF (Djokovic v. Zverev); Failed on 1st - 97 QF (Sampras v. Costa).​
Roland Garros - 76 QF (Panatta v. Borg), 88 SF (Wilander v. Agassi), arguably 94 SF (Courier v. Bruguera), 97 QF (Kafelnikov v. Kuerten), possibly 05 SF (Federer v. Nadal), 09 SF (Delpo v. Federer), 13 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal), arguably 21 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).
honorable mentions - failed on 1st - 95 QF (Costa v. Muster), Failed on 3rd - (arguable on 1st) 08 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).​
Seems like about 1-2 times per decade per major, we get a match that feels like a final. That averages out to about once every 8 majors.

Recently that seems about right - 21 RG SF, 18 WIM SF, 17 USO SF, 14 AO QF, 13 RG SF. Naturally, this seems like in periods of domination we see the final when it should happen (which makes sense, since the dominant player will make it to the final and should steamroll the competition. Every once in a while a player will be met in the semis that is better than the other half's best player, but that isn't incredibly common.)
 

RaulRamirez

Legend
Definitely, both epic Rafa-Novak semis: 2013 RG and 2018 WC. Fed-Safin 2005 AO.

I want to say Rafa-Dasco AO09, but the reward was facing Roger.
 
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Jokervich

Hall of Fame
How? Great match, but Med, obviously, was far from a pushover.
It was mainly because it was a blowout, due to Djokovic being physically gone by that point and mentally couldn't handle the huge occasion. The Zverev match did feel like the final.
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
2017 USO VAMOS-Del Possum semi I think was actually officially designated the final once they realized what developed on the other side of the draw.

VAMOS played an Exo with Kandy on the traditional finals day. I remember thinking why did we pay finals prices for an Exo. :mad:

#VAMOSmugRun

 

Djokodalerer31

Hall of Fame
Djokovic v Nadal RG 2021
Djokovic v Nadal W 2018
Djokovic v Federer USO 2011
Wawrinka vs Djokovic AO 2014
Federer v Djokovic RG 2011
Chang v Lendl RG 1989 (was 4R!)
Nadal v Berdych AO 2012
Raonic v Federer W 2016
Djokovic v Wawrinka AO 2013
Djokovic v Wawrinka USO 2013(?)

Most of these felt like finals to me after the tournament, possibly because of the significance of some of these matches. Djok v Nad FO 2021 will always be known much more than Djok v Tsits in the final. Any others?

I was agreeing on almost everything until i read Berdych v Nadal AO 2012...after that i stopped reading...LOL Not only Djokodal 2012 at AO was absolutely and unquestionably greatest match of the tournament, it is also by many considered as top-3 match of all-times! LMAO
...Also Nadal v Verdasco at 2009 AO -> Nadal v Federer! LOL i mean according to that logic...
 

aldeayeah

G.O.A.T.
I disagree because even if doped, Mariano Puerta may have given Rafa his toughest final
I'm glad Rafa ended up winning, otherwise it would have been a huge problem for men tennis once the doping was discovered. When it happened with Korda in 1998 it wasn't a problem because the doping was discovered after Wimbledon (people presumed he doped at Australia too but there were no proofs of that)
I agree that Puerta was super tough in the final, but that was actually kinda unexpected

I watched both matches at the time, and there was a real "this is the real final" atmosphere when Rafa & Roger met - Rafa having just swept the clay season, and Roger being at the peak of his powers. Nobody gave Puerta or Davydenko much of a chance.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Fed vs Murray AO13 was every bit as evenly matched and competitive as the best Slam finals. Obviously the final was also a gimme...in the opposite direction
 

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
Everytime two of the Big 3 played each other in the semifinal and then played a non-Big 3 player in the final. I would add that I would consider Djokovic to be part of the Big 3 only from late 2010.
 
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TennisLurker

Professional
Everytime two of the Big 3 played each other in the semifinal and then played a non-Big 3 player in the final.

Del Potro US Open 09 is an exception. Federer beat Djokovic in the semifinals. Del Potro beat Nadal.

The Cilic Us Open was freaky, because the upsets of Nishikori and the Nishikori Cilic h2h made people underrate Cilic, even though he beat Federer in straight sets.

And in 2010 I guess Soderling and Nadal were for real the 2 best clay courters.
 

T007

Hall of Fame
Djokovic v Nadal RG 2021
Djokovic v Nadal W 2018
Djokovic v Federer USO 2011
Wawrinka vs Djokovic AO 2014
Federer v Djokovic RG 2011
Chang v Lendl RG 1989 (was 4R!)
Nadal v Berdych AO 2012
Raonic v Federer W 2016
Djokovic v Wawrinka AO 2013
Djokovic v Wawrinka USO 2013(?)

Most of these felt like finals to me after the tournament, possibly because of the significance of some of these matches. Djok v Nad FO 2021 will always be known much more than Djok v Tsits in the final. Any others?
Djoko-rafa 2021 FO wasn't has anything to offer except the long 3rd set. I would still pick the tsitsipas match over it as the final.
 

NAS

Hall of Fame
USO ‘08 SF
WB 12 SF
AO 11 SF
AO 15 SF
AO 16 SF

See where I’m going with this? Two ATGs playing a semi with a non-ATG waiting in the final.
Fed was injured in AO 16 after or during semi, he was not going to win final
 
If we talk about logic and waiting W/O in the final yes-2013 RG SF and 2018 WB SF are the best exemples at least this century . But if we talk about intuition and strong believe i would say 2011 USO SF-after that return which was do or die i was almost certain Novak will win the match and after he make the comeback,although Nadal was waiting in the final, i was 99%sure that there was no way Novak will loose this final.
 

Underdog

Professional
Depends on what you mean - the most epic match could be "felt like the final", even if the final is not at all bad. I would say an example of this would be USO 21. The most epic match could be argued to be Zverev-Djokovic SF, whereas the final was a step below that in terms of quality. On the other hand, the final still seemed like a contest.

I'd argue you need 3 things for a prior match to "feel" like the final.
  • The two strongest players (or two of the 3-4 strongest) in the tournament need to meet
  • The match those two players have is of at least decent quality and goes on at least 4 sets
  • The final is between the winner of that match and someone with a significantly lower chance of winning, where the winner of the "de-facto final" wins.
These criteria would be met in circumstances like RG 2013, for instance - Nadal and Djokovic were in a class of their own, played an epic 5-setter, and Nadal went on to steamroll Ferrer (we can also assume Djokovic would have easily beaten him too).

In slams like RG 2021, this also works fairly well, though the 3rd point is a maybe. Tsitsipas had a significantly lower chance, but he was easily the 3rd best in the tournament and the leadup to it. Under these criteria, USO 2014 had no match that "felt" like the final too. Cilic would need to be involved in that match, and Cilic either had 3-setters against the favorites (Federer), or had tough matches against people that had no business ever winning (Simon).

My list:
USO - 1971 SF (Okker v. Smith), 90 QF (Lendl v. Sampras), 93 QF (Chang v. Sampras), 98 SF (Sampras v. Rafter), 04 QF (Federer v. Agassi), 08 SF (Djokovic v. Federer) (if any), 17 SF (Nadal v. Delpo).
honorable mentions (Failed on 3rd point) 75 SF (Orantes v. Vilas), 84/5 SF (Mac v. Connors/Wilander), 92 SF (Chang v. Edberg), 01 QF (Hewitt v. Roddick), 11 SF (Djokovic v. Federer).​
Wimbledon - 68 QF (Laver v. Ralston), 73 SF (Taylor v. Kodes), 74 QF (Kodes v. Connors), 97 QF (Sampras v. Becker), 03 SF (Roddick v. Federer), 18 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).
honorable mentions - Failed on 2nd point - 83 SF (Lendl v. McEnroe), 96 QF (Sampras v. Krajicek). Failed on 3rd - 89 SF (Lendl v. Becker), 93 QF (Sampras v. Agassi), 95 SF (Goran v. Sampras).​
Australian Open (post 82) - 01 SF (Agassi v. Rafter), 05 SF (Federer v. Safin) (on the edge since Hewitt had a chance in the final against either), 06 QF (Federer v. Davydenko), 14 QF (Wawrinka v. Djokovic).
honorable mentions - Failed on 3rd - 85 SF (Lendl v. Edberg), 00 SF (Agassi v. Sampras), 21 QF (Djokovic v. Zverev); Failed on 1st - 97 QF (Sampras v. Costa).​
Roland Garros - 76 QF (Panatta v. Borg), 88 SF (Wilander v. Agassi), arguably 94 SF (Courier v. Bruguera), 97 QF (Kafelnikov v. Kuerten), possibly 05 SF (Federer v. Nadal), 09 SF (Delpo v. Federer), 13 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal), arguably 21 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).
honorable mentions - failed on 1st - 95 QF (Costa v. Muster), Failed on 3rd - (arguable on 1st) 08 SF (Djokovic v. Nadal).​
Seems like about 1-2 times per decade per major, we get a match that feels like a final. That averages out to about once every 8 majors.

Recently that seems about right - 21 RG SF, 18 WIM SF, 17 USO SF, 14 AO QF, 13 RG SF. Naturally, this seems like in periods of domination we see the final when it should happen (which makes sense, since the dominant player will make it to the final and should steamroll the competition. Every once in a while a player will be met in the semis that is better than the other half's best player, but that isn't incredibly common.)
Very much agree with this. Good metric.
I don’t think ‘11 USO SF, ‘14 AO QF and especially ‘11 RG SF apply to this. Nadal had never lost a set to Stan up until then, was playing well enough to be a strong contender in the final and RG is self explanatory.
The best examples I recall are ‘05 RG SF, ‘13 RG SF, ‘18 WB SF, ‘17 USO SF.
Maybe ‘22 RG QF as well.
 

DSH

Talk Tennis Guru
Djoko-rafa 2021 FO wasn't has anything to offer except the long 3rd set. I would still pick the tsitsipas match over it as the final.
In any case, Nadal would have had no problems against Tsitsipas in an eventual final that time.
:D
 

D.Nalby12

G.O.A.T.
USO ‘08 SF
WB 12 SF
AO 11 SF
AO 15 SF
AO 16 SF

See where I’m going with this? Two ATGs playing a semi with a non-ATG waiting in the final.

To Murray's credit he gave us better match in W12 final than Djokovic in semis. Everything else I agree.
 
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