Here's your answer from Troy at TW who uses the Vcore Pro:
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...rince-phantom-93p.608796/page-2#post-13155859
Prince 93P 14x18 on TW
- Thread starter TennisHound
- Start date
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...rince-phantom-93p.608796/page-2#post-13155859
Thanks Jacob. I’d still like to hear from Sean as he plays with the 310 version of the Vcore Pro and he decided to switch racquets!
Yes, everyone who's reading these threads saw them yesterday when it went live on YT. I guess it's now on the TW website today.
RedBeard
Rookie
Have you tried lowering the tension on your 18x20? I don't feel like I'm losing any control in the low 40s and I get really good net clearance with a Semi-Western grip. That said, the 14x18 should definitely get you the higher trajectory and spin you're looking for. But will be interested to hear if the power and forgiveness fall off too much in the trade-off.
frogboy2002
Rookie
TW Staff
Administrator
@mimo,
Here are some key differences:
I feel like the VCORE Pro 97 310 is noticeably lower-powered outside the sweetspot, whereas the Phantom has a more even response from the string bed.
The Phantom is softer and less responsive at impact (still plenty of feedback for me though).
The Phantom's launch angle makes it easier for me to hit heavy deep balls without having to expend so much energy.
I found the directional control to be similar, but gauging the depth is easier with the VCORE.
I return a little bit better with the VCORE.
The Phantom is MUCH more string sensitive- if I wasn't playing with a string I really liked, it marred the hitting experience.
The Phantom is more stable (more weight).
I win more matches with the Phantom (this is what ultimately made the decision).
Let me know if there's anything else you want to know!
Best,
Sean, TW
Here are some key differences:
I feel like the VCORE Pro 97 310 is noticeably lower-powered outside the sweetspot, whereas the Phantom has a more even response from the string bed.
The Phantom is softer and less responsive at impact (still plenty of feedback for me though).
The Phantom's launch angle makes it easier for me to hit heavy deep balls without having to expend so much energy.
I found the directional control to be similar, but gauging the depth is easier with the VCORE.
I return a little bit better with the VCORE.
The Phantom is MUCH more string sensitive- if I wasn't playing with a string I really liked, it marred the hitting experience.
The Phantom is more stable (more weight).
I win more matches with the Phantom (this is what ultimately made the decision).
Let me know if there's anything else you want to know!
Best,
Sean, TW
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donnayblack99
Semi-Pro
I'm interested in the difference between the 14x18 vs. the 18x20? I'm a current POG user and looking to move to one of these...
BAAllen
New User
Yes. I have been playing with tension in the low 40’s and I’ve adjusted to the trajectory. I love the racquet, just excited to see how the new pattern works for my game. We shall see.
I wish i hadn't opened this thread and watched that video review. This really looks like a frame that is unique in the market right now. I'm not sure i've seen a playtest where all the players seemed to hit such high quality shots consistently in terms of arc, depth and spin. Really seems to be a special stick.
frogboy2002
Rookie
I think this is what makes Prince so appealing in general, like you could main something else if you wanted but it will always be nice to have a couple of different options in the bag regardless.
Hayward Butler
Rookie
Erik makes five as he has announced that the new Tour 310 is his new racquet of choice.
Yep, I'm exactly the same, I wasn't even looking at a Prince stick until I spotted the 14x18, then I read all about the 18x20, was lucky enough to get to hit with one and now I've ordered both versions of 93P; that was even before I saw the TW video review. I'm thinking I need a matching racket bag as well...
I also noticed the depth of their shots in the video review, and looking at the playsight data some of them had better stats with the 93P.
graycrait
Legend
it is not the same. I purchased 2 sets of 93P 14x18 grommets and they do not work in 1980 14x18 Prince 90s. The throat piece didn't work. The side pieces didn't work and the bumper guard piece didn't work. I tried POG 90, Spectrump Comp 90 and Graphite Comp 90.
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PSC85
Semi-Pro
how is it in terms of string pattern density compared to POG or the old prince 14x18 patterns?
graycrait
Legend
To be clear, I just purchased two 93P 14x18 grommet sets from TW to use in my many 1980s Prince 90s. The grommet sets do not work in 1980s 90s. I don't have the new racket yet.
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Dartagnan64
G.O.A.T.
But is the control there?
BAAllen
New User
I was hardly hitting out against my kids but it seemed pretty good. I didn’t have a single ball fly on me. That may change when I try it for real.
PBODY99
Legend
@graycrait
Is it the barrel size or the drill spacing ?
Is it the barrel size or the drill spacing ?
graycrait
Legend
1. The barrel diameter of the 93P 14x18 grommets is 3.52mm. NOS POG 90 14x18 is 3.82mm
2. Note that the first 5 "barrels/grommets tubes" are considerably longer on the POG 90 (back) vs 93P (front).
3. Note the spacing as well in the overhead
PBODY99
Legend
@graycrait
Thank you for the detailed reply.
I do have a few 90s {2 Spectrum Comps & a Graphite}
which so far are not in need of grommets.
Thank you for the detailed reply.
I do have a few 90s {2 Spectrum Comps & a Graphite}
which so far are not in need of grommets.
graycrait
Legend
Here is some bad news about 80s 90" Princes. The NOS POG 90 that you buy on the auction site for 24.95 from dude in Georgia will not work in a Spectrum Comp or Graphite Comp 90. I love my Graphite Pro 90s so will probably end up using Fittex individual grommets when the time comes.
graycrait
Legend
I rescind the above statement. With some heat I was able to get these NOS POG 90 grommets to fit nicely into the Graphite Comp 90 and a Power Pro 90. The price is sort of steep but bringing life to a little used Prince 90 from the 1980s through spending 25 bucks does not seem unduly expensive.
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PBODY99
Legend
@graycrait
Good to hear. I"invested" in head protection tape early on so my few frames are in good shape. Yes, Fittex are our friends.
Good to hear. I"invested" in head protection tape early on so my few frames are in good shape. Yes, Fittex are our friends.
Looking forward to your more in-depth impressions.
TennisHound
Legend
I know this one is new, but I’m not sure it will test better than the previous Wilson 90s (since the Wilson is actually 92 sq in)?
Since the 14x18 is essentially a different frame than the 18x20, perhaps we should keep the open string pattern discussion on a separate thread. I just received the demo over the weekend, and my only opportunity is to play tomorrow night. Sadly it is forecasted to rain so I probably won't be able to give an input until the weekend.
Pictures are good, so if you haven't seen one in person, this is what it looks like.
The strung weight:
How it came strung:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/160821384@N08/33404745148/in/dateposted-public/
The string pattern is different than the 14x18 from the 80's:
And together with the most popular midsize frames ever produced.. just for fun. The waist(s):
The top of the hoop:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/160821384@N08/32338589997/in/dateposted-public/
Pictures are good, so if you haven't seen one in person, this is what it looks like.
The strung weight:
How it came strung:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/160821384@N08/33404745148/in/dateposted-public/
The string pattern is different than the 14x18 from the 80's:
And together with the most popular midsize frames ever produced.. just for fun. The waist(s):
The top of the hoop:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/160821384@N08/32338589997/in/dateposted-public/
1. The barrel diameter of the 93P 14x18 grommets is 3.52mm. NOS POG 90 14x18 is 3.82mm
2. Note that the first 5 "barrels/grommets tubes" are considerably longer on the POG 90 (back) vs 93P (front).
3. Note the spacing as well in the overhead
Thanks for this. Yeah, the string pattern is different and you will need to do some extensive surgery to the get the grommets from a 93P 14x18 to fit the classic 80's 90 frames. What are you missing in terms of grommets for the Graphite Pro 90? I know those have thinner tubing than the rest of the prince 90's. I think I have the bumper, the throat, and 1 side grommet. Just missing 1 side grommet to complete. LMK
graycrait
Legend
Thanks but I am good. I got everything put together with what you already sent and what I had on hand.
Automatix
Legend
What's the gauge on the 14x18? It looks like it has been strung with dental floss.
BAAllen
New User
Okay, have played about 8 hours with the 14x18 now. I have added some lead at 10 and 2 to give it a little more power on serve and some stability. I was crushing some serves today with this setup. The added weight also brought the launch angle down on groundies a bit for me, which was good. I am still struggling some with the trajectory of the ball. I am getting so much spin that if I don’t crush it I leave the ball short. I have to say the sweet spot vs the 18x20 is massive and I am getting a lot more pocketing. Even with the added weight it swings fairly quick. I really love these frames. Not sure which pattern I prefer yet.
What string setup?
Didn’t realise weight can affect launch angle? Or was it swing path that the weight altered?
BAAllen
New User
Hyper g 17 gauge at 45. Not my favorite string. You are probably right in the launch angle. The weight in the head likely altered my swing path. Whatever it was much different than last time out.
donnayblack99
Semi-Pro
I’m a teaching pro (for frame of reference- no pun intended). I played with my new 93P 14x18s today for about 2 hours hitting with 5.0-6.0 college players. It took a little while to adjust to the smaller head but after about 20 mins I was redirecting pace with authority and cranking winners off of shorts balls. Mine are strung with Prince warrior hybrid 16g at 47lbs. This frame is sold and soft yet feels like it firms up when you need to put some pace on the balls. Touch shots and volleys are solid and easy to hit. My overhead has never felt better as I only needed a 75% swing to get massive push through the court. Plus the smaller head allowed me to go for the lines on all my shots.
This frame reminds me of the POG mid with more solidity if that makes sense. The open pattern was great for pace and spin and I feel the sweetspot was just as big as any 100 sq inch frame. I have been playing with POG 107s off and on for the past couple of years and there really is no difference in feel between these two frames other than the headsize. I LOVE this new frame!
This frame reminds me of the POG mid with more solidity if that makes sense. The open pattern was great for pace and spin and I feel the sweetspot was just as big as any 100 sq inch frame. I have been playing with POG 107s off and on for the past couple of years and there really is no difference in feel between these two frames other than the headsize. I LOVE this new frame!
TheOtherBecker
Rookie
I wasn't too interested when the 93P 14 x 18 was announced, but I pulled out a POG mid and restrung it low with poly, and it seemed to fill in all the gaps in my game I couldn't get a handle on with the 93P 18x20. Volleys - lethal! loads of touch and precision, shank factor: 0. Overheads- found the court then the top of the fence, rather than straght in the net. Groundstokes - could get that extra inch of spin that made everything dip just inside rather than just outside the lines. Especially helpful to get a little spin returning those flat shin high wormburners i've been trying to dig out of. I'm really excited to demo the 93P 14 x 18 now!
I demo'd the 93p 14x18 this week, and was a little disappointed. The only noticeable improvement (for my game) that I felt it had over my Phantom Pro 100p was the higher launch angle and more "bottom falling out of the ball" action. I didn't notice particularly more spin than the 100p. Felt the 93p had a smaller sweet spot than the 100p, and still some instability outside the sweet spot. My return of serve wasn't as much of a weapon last night because I wasn't making as good of contact with the sweet spot on the 93p as with my 100p. Did hit a nice heavy ball, just like the 100p, but I think overall, I might just add a little more lead to my 100p and stick with it.
I will give one caveat: I demo'd it with multifilament strings, which probably does not allow for the best performance with that string pattern, but my arm just can't handle full poly much any more. I've got Head Velocity in my 100p right now so I felt the side-by-side comparison was pretty fair.
I will give one caveat: I demo'd it with multifilament strings, which probably does not allow for the best performance with that string pattern, but my arm just can't handle full poly much any more. I've got Head Velocity in my 100p right now so I felt the side-by-side comparison was pretty fair.
Should be heftier than both POG and 93p. One of mine is about 370 g strung, overgrip, etc. Original flex should be around 59 RA, but I believe the resin deteriorates quickly, judging by the reports of its incredibly low RA readings from some fellow forum members.
TheOtherBecker
Rookie
I’ll weigh mine for you, I believe it’s lighter than either. But for now...
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/prince-graphite-pro-90.274830/
Update: mine is 352.2 g strung with damp & OG, 5 pt HL.
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Thanks
TheOtherBecker
Rookie
Also have a Graphite Powerflex. Similar, but flexier, more fiberglass - 350.1G
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Shangri La
Hall of Fame
Yeah, anybody please.
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