Prince Phantom Pro and Phantom Pro100P

[haegger]

I hit with Phantom 100 and 100p today.
I could not tell any difference.
Could barely tell the difference compared to 93P also.
Just too many variables, and you never get the same ball twice.
O-ports have muted feel? Didn't notice.

Only thing I noticed was 93P is heavier when I pick it up.
But, swing feels all the same.

I have same feeling when i use PP100P and 93P as well.

 

[flanker2000fr]

I have same feeling when i use PP100P and 93P as well.

For me, they feel very similar as long as I hit the sweet spot, with a higher launch angle on the PP100P (no surprise here). Outside of the sweet spot, the 93P returns a fairly weak shot that struggles to clear the net, while the shot tends to fly on the PP100P.

Then, I find the 93P more maneuverable than the PP100P, but more tiring if playing for an extended period of time.

 

[Searah]

has anyone switched from the phantoms to a different racket?

i hit with a countervail 97 and the 2019 pure aero and i just played so much better then my phantom 100p.

i think for me it was the weight difference. the 100p feels much heavier then both the rackets i mentioned.

maybe the 100p isn't suited for me

 

[tata]

has anyone switched from the phantoms to a different racket?

i hit with a countervail 97 and the 2019 pure aero and i just played so much better then my phantom 100p.

i think for me it was the weight difference. the 100p feels much heavier then both the rackets i mentioned.

maybe the 100p isn't suited for me

Yeah the phantom 100p does feel heavier to the other racquets near the same weight class. I have added weight localised down the bottom under the buttcap and it swings much easier now. I started with 3g and i think 6g did the trick for me.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

has anyone switched from the phantoms to a different racket?

i hit with a countervail 97 and the 2019 pure aero and i just played so much better then my phantom 100p.

i think for me it was the weight difference. the 100p feels much heavier then both the rackets i mentioned.

maybe the 100p isn't suited for me

My match results are far better with the Beast 98 or the Tour 100s compared to any Phantom (even though I love hitting with the Pro!)

 

[Dartagnan64]

has anyone switched from the phantoms to a different racket?

i hit with a countervail 97 and the 2019 pure aero and i just played so much better then my phantom 100p.

i think for me it was the weight difference. the 100p feels much heavier then both the rackets i mentioned.

maybe the 100p isn't suited for me

It is heavier. And that's a good thing

I tried playing with a Clash and was awful with it. No control compared to my Phantoms. Only thing I could do reasonably well with it is serve into the middle of the box.

Pure Aero and Pro Staff are fine premium sticks that offer a lot. They are also stiff and harder on the arm than Phantom. I'd rather spare my arm than fuss about wins and losses. People don't gravitate to Phantoms because they are easy to play with. They gravitate to them because they offer comfort, feel and control.

And for me at least, my results are entirely dependent on me and me alone. The racket is merely a passenger. IF you work on the assumption that you can beat the opponent with any frame and all you want from your racquet is a comfortable and fun ride, you can play well with anything. If you believe the stick is an important way to optimize your performance, you'll be sucked down the rabbit hole forever.

 

[Dartagnan64]

I hit with Phantom 100 and 100p today.
I could not tell any difference.
Could barely tell the difference compared to 93P also.
Just too many variables, and you never get the same ball twice.
O-ports have muted feel? Didn't notice.

Only thing I noticed was 93P is heavier when I pick it up.
But, swing feels all the same.

The 100 ported feels like a pillow compared to the 93P. I'm shocked you couldn't feel the difference in crispness. Were you swinging against air?

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Nope, was doing some very aggressive rallying and played a set.
I felt no difference in any of the 4 rackets. 93, 100, O-ports, 14x16, 18x20, whatever
As usual, internet overhypes everything regarding gear.

I also find the worse the player is, the more gear obsessed they are.
(@Dartagnan64, not talking about you)

But, Pros will use any racket that pays them, they barely care.
Yet 3.0 players are the most gear obsessed, thinking they've found the holy grail to their garbage strokes.

As for me, I will pick the grommets since O-ports are apparently a nightmare to string.
I will pick 100 over 93, since I already have a 93 POG, and if most pros can use 100, so can I.

Now, I can go back to focusing on lessons and my strokes, which is 99% of the equation.

 

[edelp]

man, while in your text, there might be some truth, you do not feel happy about others feeling happy discussing gear. Let them, us, do what we like as well, even though it is only 1% of the equation.
By the way, saying they all (phantoms) feel the same, is rather exaggerated, but clear that they do not save the individuals´s level of tenis.

Enjoy!

 

[Dartagnan64]

Nope, was doing some very aggressive rallying and played a set.
I felt no difference in any of the 4 rackets. 93, 100, O-ports, 14x16, 18x20, whatever
As usual, internet overhypes everything regarding gear.

I also find the worse the player is, the more gear obsessed they are.
(@Dartagnan64, not talking about you)

But, Pros will use any racket that pays them, they barely care.
Yet 3.0 players are the most gear obsessed, thinking they've found the holy grail to their garbage strokes.

As for me, I will pick the grommets since O-ports are apparently a nightmare to string.
I will pick 100 over 93, since I already have a 93 POG, and if most pros can use 100, so can I.

Now, I can go back to focusing on lessons and my strokes, which is 99% of the equation.

My only gear obsession is finding sticks that feel comfortable on my arm and offer great feel. I'm in no way trying to find that holy grail stick like some folks are. I think I can play bad tennis with any stick.

But I don't think the internet is overhyping the differences between the Phantoms as they are all different. Sure the 100's all feel reasonably comparable but they don't feel the same as the mids which are significantly crisper. 55 RA is pretty different from 61 RA. None are as harsh as a 68-72 RA stick but still, I'd think you could notice a 6 point difference in flex.

But I wouldn't put your inability to note differences in feel a problem with internet users and hype. I'd say the issue is more your inability in this area. You may be much like my wife who doesn't notice anything when it comes to strings and rackets. Her body awareness seems tragically unwired.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

So far, I've ruled out the O-ports and the 14x16 93P.

Today, I hit again with:

• POG 93 (14x16)
• Phantom 93P (18x20)
• Phantom Pro 100 (16x18)

POG 93
Felt the best for serving. Great spin.

93p
Does feels heavier
18x20 does not shift strings at all

100p
Feels less stable. Lighter?
Strings displace like crazy, yet are hard to press back into place.
Serves felt weak.
I think this feels less powerful

I am kind of undecided still.
I think I prefer 18x20 since strings don't move.
That seems to give a more consistent response.
I think I am going to rule out the 100p
I don't need to go to the MOST softest racket, just something not quite as harsh as Pure Drive / Poly.

I will do another session soon.

 

[Dartagnan64]

The Pro 100 18x20 might be the stick you are looking for since it offers a little more forgiveness than the 93P but still has that great control.

 

[goherd27]

Dartagnan,

How do you think the pro 100 18 x 20 will play with a full bed of gut?

 

[Dartagnan64]

Dartagnan,

How do you think the pro 100 18 x 20 will play with a full bed of gut?

I think it would play fine. I'm using gut/soft poly and it plays superb. FB gut will up the feel and touch but reduce the spin somewhat (depending on whether you use ball friction vs snapback to generate most of your spin). The stick is low powered enough that it can handle gut without overpowering the ball.

I always struggled with FB gut in tweeners because it shredded too quickly and I had to run very high tensions to control the power. The Phantoms are far better sticks for FB gut and gut hybrids.

 

[goherd27]

Thanks for the reply. I have used a lot of sticks with a FB of gut with decent results due to elbow and shoulder issues. This frame sounds like an interesting one to try it in. I knew you mentioned in an earlier post that you used gut/poly and got good results. I have demoed the phantom and the phantom 100p. Of the two, I preferred the 100p. Next up to demo is the 18 x 20.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

The Pro 100 18x20 might be the stick you are looking for since it offers a little more forgiveness than the 93P but still has that great control.

I agree, but you know the crazy thing? I have 40 ft packs, not reels.
100 sq.in. @18x20 will be a disaster to string since I bet I will run out of string.
Nothing worse than trying to tighten the last string and running out

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

I agree, but you know the crazy thing?
100 sq.in. @18x20 will be a disaster to string since I bet I will run out of string.
Nothing worse than trying to tighten the last string and running out

I've had the 18 main blade 104 in the past, and that would require a bridge to machine pull the last main for a 20 foot piece.

The 100 speed pro does as well! The 100p tour didn't need that though.

Even so, looseness for the outer main is actually a good thing.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I'm not gonna chance it.
I don't want to make stringing stressful.
I'd rather use 93P at 18x20
I like that 18x20 can be strung lower for TE issues
I generate my own power and spin, so I don't need open pattern.

Closed pattern = low power.
Phantom = low power
Gut = high power.
55 tension = low power

This will allow me to swing like a maniac

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

I generate my own power and spin, so I don't need open pattern.


This will allow me to swing like a maniac

The first sentence is very wise tennis understanding.

The second one is the opposite of that!

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[aaron_h27]

I'm not gonna chance it.
I don't want to make stringing stressful.
I'd rather use 93P at 18x20
I like that 18x20 can be strung lower for TE issues
I generate my own power and spin, so I don't need open pattern.

Closed pattern = low power.
Phantom = low power
Gut = high power.
55 tension = low power

This will allow me to swing like a maniac

18x20 frames are generally harsher on the arm than open patterns, due to small sweetspot and boardy feeling.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

18x20 frames are generally harsher on the arm than open patterns, due to small sweetspot and boardy feeling.

Completely disagree with this. The 16 x 18 p100p has the sweetspot the size of a nickle but the 18/20 tour 100p has a generous sweetspot if the tension is reasonable.

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[TimeToPlaySets]

What is the size of the 93P sweet spot? Penny?

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

18x20 frames are generally harsher on the arm than open patterns, due to small sweetspot and boardy feeling.

Yes, there will be less deflection but soft racket and soft strings will mitigate.
I played a Pure Drive with Poly and did not think it was a board.
So, anything else will be softer by comparison.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

Half dollar.

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[TimeToPlaySets]

93P has bigger sweet spot than 100 ????

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

93P has bigger sweet spot than 100 ????

Bigger than the 100p but not the other 100 phantoms.
The 100p is dog s..t. It has the wrong beam and the wrong hoop shape. I wanted to like it but sadly it sucks.

Once they put Twaron into the throat of these phantoms they will all play better.
(Won't hinder feel but will give more control and power). The Ra will increase somewhat, of course, but really no decline in comfort.

 

[flanker2000fr]

93P has bigger sweet spot than 100 ????

Absolutely, positively not. The P100P has a larger sweetspot than the 93P. But when you hit really off center, close to the beam, the ball ends up flying because the string pattern is so open in those areas. Interestingly enough, at least in my experience, even though the ball flies, it ends up dipping inside the court more often than not.

 

[Dartagnan64]

18x20 frames are generally harsher on the arm than open patterns, due to small sweetspot and boardy feeling.

Sweetpot opens up nicely if you string at lower tensions and thinner gauges. I wouldn't consider my 93P with 17g Gut and 19g poly at 50/45 lbs as feeling harsh or boardy at all.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Bigger than the 100p but not the other 100 phantoms.
The 100p is dog s..t. It has the wrong beam and the wrong hoop shape. I wanted to like it but sadly it sucks.

Once they put Twaron into the throat of these phantoms they will all play better.
(Won't hinder feel but will give more control and power). The Ra will increase somewhat, of course, but really no decline in comfort.

Can you be more specific on which Phantom 100 you hated?
O-port? Grommet? String pattern?

 

[flanker2000fr]

Bigger than the 100p but not the other 100 phantoms.

I can't make any sense of this. The 93P has a generous sweet spot for its head size, and really plays more like a 95 sq. in. racquet, but to suggest that it has a larger sweet spot than the PP100P, or any 100 sq. in. racquet for that matter, is ridiculous. This is backed by TW Racquet Comparison tool, showing a sweet spot of 17 sq. in. for the PP100P vs. 16 sq. in. for the 93P.

What is true, however, is that the response is less consistent outside the sweet spot on the PP100P than on the 93P. But that is somewhat offset by the fact that the 93P is so low on power that hitting outside the sweet spot results in a weak shot.

Here's what happens, in my experience of playing the 93P for 7 months at least twice a week vs. the PP100P for 3 months at the same frequency. A typical instance of hitting outside the sweet spot is when I am really stretched outside of the court in a defensive situation, having to make a shot on the run:

- with the 93P, I struggle to clear the net as a result of the low power and low launch angle
- with the PP100P, I generally clear the net, but lack control both directionally and in length

As for the rest of your statement, I get it that the PP100P didn't work for you, but it works quite well for me. Still I am interested in the Pro 100 18x20. It could be a happy middle ground. I am just concerned at the lack of pop on serve. I don't serve as well with the PP100P as I do with the 93P, and would be concerned that the Pro 100 18x20 drops power on serve even further, as it is a big part of my game.

 

[tata]

Lowering string tension definitely solved the sweet spot problem for me.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

Can you be more specific on which Phantom 100 you hated?
O-port? Grommet? String pattern?

Right, I thought it was understood that in 2019 all the Oports needed to be burned on the ashheep of history as a complete embarrassment of a frame.
I honestly would give the tour 16×18 a shot first.

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[B Cubed]

I can't make any sense of this. The 93P has a generous sweet spot for its head size, and really plays more like a 95 sq. in. racquet, but to suggest that it has a larger sweet spot than the PP100P, or any 100 sq. in. racquet for that matter, is ridiculous. This is backed by TW Racquet Comparison tool, showing a sweet spot of 17 sq. in. for the PP100P vs. 16 sq. in. for the 93P.

What is true, however, is that the response is less consistent outside the sweet spot on the PP100P than on the 93P. But that is somewhat offset by the fact that the 93P is so low on power that hitting outside the sweet spot results in a weak shot.

Here's what happens, in my experience of playing the 93P for 7 months at least twice a week vs. the PP100P for 3 months at the same frequency. A typical instance of hitting outside the sweet spot is when I am really stretched outside of the court in a defensive situation, having to make a shot on the run:

- with the 93P, I struggle to clear the net as a result of the low power and low launch angle
- with the PP100P, I generally clear the net, but lack control both directionally and in length

As for the rest of your statement, I get it that the PP100P didn't work for you, but it works quite well for me. Still I am interested in the Pro 100 18x20. It could be a happy middle ground. I am just concerned at the lack of pop on serve. I don't serve as well with the PP100P as I do with the 93P, and would be concerned that the Pro 100 18x20 drops power on serve even further, as it is a big part of my game.

I'd definitely say try the 18x20. I didn't find any issue with the serve (pop) due to the more headlight set up for hit.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Right, I thought it was understood that in 2019 all the Oports needed to be burned on the ashheep of history as a complete embarrassment of a frame.
I honestly would give the tour 16×18 a shot first.

I did not notice that o-ports played any differently,
but I decided to reject since it's harder to string.
Did not notice any "muted" feel, as people claim.

 

[tigonian02]

I’ve been experimenting with the weight of my P100Ps. I replaced the regular grip with a leather grip, then put 3 overgrips over it and added a little lead at 7:30 and 4:30 and the difference in feel and power cannot be overstated. It’s incredibly smooth now, and even more comfortable. This is with a full bed of polys. The power level got a bump up as well, but not in an uncontrollable way. The swing weight is still very manageable.

 

[grhcan99]

18x20 frames are generally harsher on the arm than open patterns, due to small sweetspot and boardy feeling.

Assuming you do not compensate in relation to the more open patterns by lowering tension. I am attracted to generally lower-powered, smaller-frame-sized 18x20s simply because it gives me an opportunity to string much lower without sacrificing control.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Today, I hit again with:

• Phantom 93P (18x20)
• Phantom Pro 100 (16x18)

I noticed that I liked the weight of the 93P when I am blocking back a BH that has been driven deep into the corner.
The heft of the racket allows me to block (instead of slice), and the ball goes over the net.

 

[Kavaron]

Prince Phantom Pro 100 16X18 (PP100) review: I am a 3.5 player, 40 years old.
Still the best racket I ever played with. Even though I never had arm issues this racket feels so soft and you get a butter feeling when you hit the ball. The spin is amazing and the back hand slices are also uncomparable with any other racket I ever hit with. Ideally this racket suits players who like to hit deep high trajectory topspin balls and not the big bangers who make fast paced winners. You won't get many winners with this but you will put tremendous pressure on your opponent.

Serve game and net game are not my strong areas but I am pretty sure that the thin beam helps a lot.

Regarding the strings after trying 3 different ones, HDX technifibre (nice control but no power and also broke after few hours), Signum pro Xperience (not enough spin for me) and my latest one, hybrid Signum Pro Plasma HEXtreme 1.20 / Poly Plasma 1.18, I have to say that the last one (hybrid) is the best. The power and depth is amazing and you also get the necessary spin you need for this racket. Of course strung at 22 kgs always.

I would like to also try the PP100P to compare but it is not available in Greece unfortunately. Very satisfied overal with my racket.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

Did not notice any "muted" feel, as people claim.

Right. The word I use is "vague" feel regardless of where impact is, which I personally find hard to build consistency with.

Just got a texteme tour 290 that I added weight to and am absolutely loving that thing! (Do wish the mains were a bit tighter)

BTW, TW leather grips are fantastic. Low profile, no seam, great bevel feel and just enough tack. [emoji16]

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[ashridge]

Completely disagree with this. The 16 x 18 p100p has the sweetspot the size of a nickle but the 18/20 tour 100p has a generous sweetspot if the tension is reasonable.

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I agree with this, and it irritates me, because I own a Phantom Pro 100p and I've demo'd the TT100P 18x20 several times and overall I like the Phantom Pro 100p better, but the TT100P does have a bigger sweet spot. I've been playing with lead placement on the Pro 100p to try and enlarge the sweet spot some.

 

[flanker2000fr]

So I customised the PP100P with 5g of tungsten in the buttcap and 2g of tungsten at 12. This brings the balance of the racquet roughly to 9-10pt HL, similar to that of the 93P, which I really like. The extra weight at 12 seems to be working for the serve, where I gained a bit more pop. Still not exactly as good as the 93P in this respect, but noticeably better. It appears that this frame lends itself well to customisation.

 

[tata]

So I customised the PP100P with 5g of tungsten in the buttcap and 2g of tungsten at 12. This brings the balance of the racquet roughly to 9-10pt HL, similar to that of the 93P, which I really like. The extra weight at 12 seems to be working for the serve, where I gained a bit more pop. Still not exactly as good as the 93P in this respect, but noticeably better. It appears that this frame lends itself well to customisation.

Similar set up. 6g in buttcap and it feels really fast and solid. Contempt with no weight in the hop.

 

[flanker2000fr]

Hyper G 16L @48lbs broke around the 9 hours mark in the PP100P, which is about 1-2 hours more than in 17 gauge. But still far from the 12+ hours I was getting out of the 17 in the Phantom 93P.

Will try 16 gauge and drop the tension by 1lb, see how that plays and how long it lasts.

 

[tennisboy2121]

Is anyone playing the pp100p 18x20 stock. I have owned the porter phantom since it has come out. From day 1 I had to put lead at 10 and 2. I just hit several times with the 93p 14x18 and found stock form to be excellent. I keep debating everyday to go with the pp100p or 93p.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

Is anyone playing the pp100p 18x20 stock. I have owned the porter phantom since it has come out. From day 1 I had to put lead at 10 and 2. I just hit several times with the 93p 14x18 and found stock form to be excellent. I keep debating everyday to go with the pp100p or 93p.

All the extra weight for the 18×20 is in the handle, so there wouldn't be much extra power on full swings.

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[Dartagnan64]

Is anyone playing the pp100p 18x20 stock. I have owned the porter phantom since it has come out. From day 1 I had to put lead at 10 and 2. I just hit several times with the 93p 14x18 and found stock form to be excellent. I keep debating everyday to go with the pp100p or 93p.

Nope I have a bit of lead at 12 oclock in the 100 18x20 (and a bit more in my ported 100). No lead in my 93P. That one is just about perfect stock.

 

[jonestim]

I have been playing mostly with the 93P and the POG 107. I found a PP100P for a really good price and am hoping it is a good in-between. I am wondering how I should string it.

93P is strung 17g lux gut / Prince Tour XC 17L @ 46/42. Looking for a bit more spin and depth when on the run, and a higher launch angle than this setup. I don't usually use gut/poly, but I found I needed the extra power in this frame.
107 is strung with 17g Firewire / Tour XC 17L @ 55. Looking for more precision. Spin is quite good. Also glad the pp100p is lighter / more HL and should be a little easier to get around. Typically would use a full bed of poly in this, the Warrior I had and most of the Prince Tour frames I have used.

Mid tension gut/poly (48/44ish) or low tension (40ish) full poly in this one? Other recommendations?

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

Low tension full poly.

 

[jonestim]

Low tension full poly.

Went full bed of 17g Tour Bite @ 42 lb. I have used it in the 93p at 40 and have a POG OS strung at 54 with it. Also used it in the Tour 100P at around 42.

 

[Balaji_R]

Well well well, where did i bump into this one -
Prince Phantom Pro 100 18x20

? Nice review and specs. Is this the cure for TE? Is this similar to the older Prince tour 100 that had similar stiffness rating? Is this more arm friendlier than say prokennex ki5 320, prokenex q+ tour pro 315 and 325?