Pro Coaches..............

[pabletion]

I was watching Sharapova's match 2nite, listening to argentinian commentators, and one of 'em is J.L. Clerc, who I dont particularly like but I'll grant him he knows his stuff. He was talking about some of the pro coaches around the ATP and WTA, stuff like, some of em cant even hit the ball properly or the drills and/or workouts they make their players do are crap etc... A coach he did mention by name (cant remember) is Bartoli's coach, apparently her dad, right? Anyways, Clerc goes: 'Ive seen him around and he cant even hold the racquet properly....; some of the exercises he makes her do are ridiculous, stuff you take care of in the pre season, not in the middle of a tournament...., he puts her in the middle of the court and starts feeding her balls..........., Bartoli should be 15 lbs lighter and work on her movement...'
He basically talked about some of the coaches, specially on the WTA, that no one knows their real backround regarding tennis, specially when they're the parents.
tough words, might be true nevertheless. Clerc finished up saying hes a real fan of technique and he believes that good technique can make the difference on a player. Ive wondered about some of the coaches you see around and whered they come from, for example, Who in the world is Tony Nadal? He's not an ex pro is he? I would think he doesnt have to do much concerning technique and strategy with Nadal, but who knows. Hes gotta be one of the few out there who has made it without being a tennis known man, or just plain lucky, or actually is a guy who has figured out tennis and has ACTUALLY helped Nadal.
What about the others? Are there a lot of hacks out there coaching in the pro tours? How much of an influence is a coach to a player, and how much is he/she involved on a players succes?

 

[Gaudio2004]

Brad Gilbert had a very detrimental effect on Andy Murray and Andy Roddick, so negative both Roddick and Murray dumped him as their coach as he knows nothing about tennis... and this guy is one of the "better coaches"..

Bartoli's father is ridiculous, some of the exercise regimes he has "built" for his daughter basically how just how amateur some of these coaches are, he is just one.. Yuri Sharapov (Sharapova's father and for a long time her coach) wasn't helping with her career at all.

Donald Young will get no-where with his parents as they don't understand anything about tennis.

One of the few coaches who understands tactics (Stefanki) has completely changed one of the "washed up" players this year (Roddick), just shows what a great coach can do.

 

[pabletion]

Oh yeah, Stefanski's one of those names everyone knows in tennis I guess, and Im sure any player would like to have him. His results speak for himself, hes the one that got Rios to No 1 right? among other great results I forget, he coached, what, Gonzales too right?
I dunno the deal with Gilbert. I guess hes more of a psychic help than tennis coach, worked with Agassi, but then again, what could you fix about agassis strokes?

 

[jamesblakefan#1]

Brad Gilbert had a very detrimental effect on Andy Murray and Andy Roddick, so negative both Roddick and Murray dumped him as their coach as he knows nothing about tennis... and this guy is one of the "better coaches"..

You sir, know nothing about tennis. Just look at what Gilbert did for Agassi...and he was Roddick's coach when he won his only slam, don't see how he was detrimental for Roddick's game. And he was telling Murray things others told him-be more agressive, bulk up. Their personalities just didn't match...and now Murray's listening to the same advice, from different coaches.

 

[drwood]

Brad Gilbert had a very detrimental effect on Andy Murray and Andy Roddick, so negative both Roddick and Murray dumped him as their coach as he knows nothing about tennis... and this guy is one of the "better coaches"..

Bartoli's father is ridiculous, some of the exercise regimes he has "built" for his daughter basically how just how amateur some of these coaches are, he is just one.. Yuri Sharapov (Sharapova's father and for a long time her coach) wasn't helping with her career at all.

Donald Young will get no-where with his parents as they don't understand anything about tennis.

One of the few coaches who understands tactics (Stefanki) has completely changed one of the "washed up" players this year (Roddick), just shows what a great coach can do.

Yeah, Gilbert was so bad he turned Roddick from a total headcase with no tactics to a slam winner and #1 in the world in less than a year, and once Roddick fired him, surprise surprise, he turned back into a headcase with no tactics and was no longer a consistent threat at slams.

Gilbert was so bad with Murray that he turned him into a top-10 player.

Bartoli has very little natural talent...the fact that she's made a Wimbledon final, beaten Venus in an American hard court final, and has been a top-10 player shows how good a coach her father has been.

 

[Gaudio2004]

Oh yeah, Stefanski's one of those names everyone knows in tennis I guess, and Im sure any player would like to have him. His results speak for himself, hes the one that got Rios to No 1 right? among other great results I forget, he coached, what, Gonzales too right?
I dunno the deal with Gilbert. I guess hes more of a psychic help than tennis coach, worked with Agassi, but then again, what could you fix about agassis strokes?

Stefanki took Rios to #1, correct, and immediately after reaching #1, Rios fired him as his coach, a very silly decision, really...

Stefanki was also Gonzo's coach and took him to that AO 07 Final, where he had set points against Federer, just shows what a good coach can do to a player.

Don't believe the hype about Brad Gilbert, "psychic help"? Where is the clear evidence of that? Gilbert knows a few dirty tactics to employ (the short chip which Woodforde used for example), but other than that, he isn't a great coach and he hasn't "made" any player, what did he do with Agassi? Teach him to hit a great forehand? ... Doubt it.

 

[deltox]

gilbert is a strategy guy. hes very smart on what to do but his body just didnt allow him to carry it out efficiently.

 

[drwood]

Stefanki took Rios to #1, correct, and immediately after reaching #1, Rios fired him as his coach, a very silly decision, really...

Stefanki was also Gonzo's coach and took him to that AO 07 Final, where he had set points against Federer, just shows what a good coach can do to a player.

Don't believe the hype about Brad Gilbert, "psychic help"? Where is the clear evidence of that? Gilbert knows a few dirty tactics to employ (the short chip which Woodforde used for example), but other than that, he isn't a great coach and he hasn't "made" any player, what did he do with Agassi? Teach him to hit a great forehand? ... Doubt it.

Gilbert took Agassi in mid 1994 from a player with extreme talent but no heart or mental toughness to a player with extreme talent who became consistent and mentally tough -- the results have spoken for themselves:

Eight years of Agassi's career prior to Gilbert = 1 slam, career high #3
Eight years of Agassi's career with Gilbert = 6 slams, 1 Olympic gold medal, #1 in the world

Gilbert is a master strategist and tactician -- that's why even though as a player he had very little talent, he made top 5 with wins over Sampras, Agassi, Chang, Courier, Edberg and McEnroe, and owned prime Becker.

He is best with players who have lots of talent but don't know how to think on the court (Agassi, Roddick, Murray before he coached them). He wouldn't do much for an intelligent player with little talent.

 

[pabletion]

^thats more or less the idea I have of the guy... what I meant with psychic help, maybe poor choice of words.

I always saw him as a great complement to Agassi, because Agassi, a guy with tons of talent, needd someone who, while less talented, used his head to play the game. Thats what makes great champions, THE GAME, the one that takes place upstairs.

Someone get Gilbert's number for Safina.

 

[drwood]

I was watching Sharapova's match 2nite, listening to argentinian commentators, and one of 'em is J.L. Clerc, who I dont particularly like but I'll grant him he knows his stuff. He was talking about some of the pro coaches around the ATP and WTA, stuff like, some of em cant even hit the ball properly or the drills and/or workouts they make their players do are crap etc... A coach he did mention by name (cant remember) is Bartoli's coach, apparently her dad, right? Anyways, Clerc goes: 'Ive seen him around and he cant even hold the racquet properly....; some of the exercises he makes her do are ridiculous, stuff you take care of in the pre season, not in the middle of a tournament...., he puts her in the middle of the court and starts feeding her balls..........., Bartoli should be 15 lbs lighter and work on her movement...'
He basically talked about some of the coaches, specially on the WTA, that no one knows their real backround regarding tennis, specially when they're the parents.
tough words, might be true nevertheless. Clerc finished up saying hes a real fan of technique and he believes that good technique can make the difference on a player. Ive wondered about some of the coaches you see around and whered they come from, for example, Who in the world is Tony Nadal? He's not an ex pro is he? I would think he doesnt have to do much concerning technique and strategy with Nadal, but who knows. Hes gotta be one of the few out there who has made it without being a tennis known man, or just plain lucky, or actually is a guy who has figured out tennis and has ACTUALLY helped Nadal.
What about the others? Are there a lot of hacks out there coaching in the pro tours? How much of an influence is a coach to a player, and how much is he/she involved on a players succes?

BTW, how many top-10 women has Clerc coached from the ground up? He needs to keep his mouth shut before criticizing Bartoli's coach.

 

[SoCal10s]

BTW, how many top-10 women has Clerc coached from the ground up? He needs to keep his mouth shut before criticizing Bartoli's coach.

exactly: you look at Bartoli and the limited athletic abilities she has and she keeps on winning... she moves awkward she looks out of shape , just watch her play... she gets to balls and does things that others cannot do.. if Clerc was coaching her,she'll be home somewhere watching the US open instead of playing in it that's for sure... Clerc ,the idiot would put her 5-10 feet behind the baseline and have her play Spanish tennis like he's promoting to everyone at the USTA camps... everyone is different and they have their own talents in which they do things,Clerc wants to clone everyone to be like J.C.Ferrero,not bad but it's not for everyone..

 

[papatenis]

there are two types of coaches. coaches that teach strokes and footwork.
these coaches usually have the players when they are young and developing their game.
the other coach is the motivational coach. they are the ones that work on the mental side of the game. it's rare to have a coach that can do both, that why players have had many coaches.

 

[boris becker 1]

notice murray has gone from number 6 to number 2 since alex corretja was added to his team.


you could argue oracen williams as well. is she really their coach?


no wonder donald young is a joker that robredo gave a clinic to...

 

[drwood]

notice murray has gone from number 6 to number 2 since alex corretja was added to his team.


you could argue oracen williams as well. is she really their coach?


no wonder donald young is a joker that robredo gave a clinic to...

Richard Williams really was Venus and Serena's coach from the ground up = 18 grand slam singles titles total (and counting). Jimmy Connors' primary coach was his mother from the ground up. Find another coach remotely as successful as these two -- its a very short list.

Parents can be great coaches as long as they have some humility and tactical knowledge, b/c they care more about the well-being of their children than any "professional" coach will. The problem comes when the parent cares more about money than their child's long-term well being (i.e. Stefano Capriati, Jelana Dokic's father, etc.).

 

[NickC]

OP: Toni Nadal was a top ranked junior in Spain and spent a good deal of time playing futures and challengers and even though he never made it in terms of a high ATP ranking, he did make the top 200 at one point, I think.

 

[pabletion]

^ thanks a lot. Even I forgot my own question