Pronation on topspin serve

[Homey]

I have been studying pronation a little bit and had a question. I am pretty sure I do not pronate on my FLAT serves. I do not have a lot of power or consistency on my FLAT serves. I tried to pronate yesterday and it seemed to help. I was SNAPPING my wrist DOWN towards the ground.

However, shouldn't pronation in a topspin/kick serve be different??? On a kick/topspin serve shouldn't the wrist snap UP instead of DOWN??? On a kick/topspin serve shouldn't the racket be snapping UP towards the sky??

I want to make sure I am doing it right. Could someone confirm if this is true?

 

[TheJRK]

I have been studying pronation a little bit and had a question. I am pretty sure I do not pronate on my FLAT serves. I do not have a lot of power or consistency on my FLAT serves. I tried to pronate yesterday and it seemed to help. I was SNAPPING my wrist DOWN towards the ground.

However, shouldn't pronation in a topspin/kick serve be different??? On a kick/topspin serve shouldn't the wrist snap UP instead of DOWN??? On a kick/topspin serve shouldn't the racket be snapping UP towards the sky??

I want to make sure I am doing it right. Could someone confirm if this is true?

<Sitting at desk practicing "phantom" kick serve>

I don't think you pronate your wrist prior to making contact with the ball... at least I don't think that's what I do. (I'll admit though, this is hard for me to visualize right now since I'm using an umbrella handle as a racket).

If your racket head is pointing down as you finish your service motion I think your wrist would have to pronate... I just can't imagine my wrist not pronating (or worse) turning the other direction as I follow through with my serve (regardless of top spin/kick/flat/whatever).

 

[MrAWD]

Here is one thing that I learned from watching Sampras's serve which has a great load of pronation in it! The main reason you use it is to be able to bring the racquet all the way up in a "sword-cut" type movement (that is a movement where both sides of the racquet follow the same trajectory), which creates the least amount of the resistance through the air and leads to highest racquet speed.

So, in the case of any serve, if you can do something that brings the racquet faster to the ball, you are giving your self a big favor!

Also, in your particular case, if you bring your racquet faster all the way up before hitting the ball and then do what you need to do to hit it the way you want to hit it, you will be better of. One of the thing that you have to do in this case is to pronate your arm, since you can't successfully hit the balls with the side of the racquet!

Fedja

 

[Homey]

Rephrase question

Let me rephrase the question. I think I am making the question more difficult than it really is. Maybe this is because I don't understand pronation completely.

Is there a difference in DIRECTION in your wrist/arm based on topspin serve VERSUS FLAT SERVE??

When I hit a topspin serve I feel like I swing the racket UP and snap the racket UP towards the sky. (Although, I don't snap enough with my wrist, but that is beside the point)

When I hit a flat serve, for more POP I tried to snap the wrist DOWNWARD towards the box I am hitting in.

Is this right??? Or am I totally confused???

Is pronation just the snapping of the wrist or is there more to it???

Thanks!!!

 

[Tennismastery]

The differenciation of serves is greatly dependent on the position of the hitting elbow prior to the pronation of the forearm.

BTW, pronation is not a wrist action, it is the internal rotation of the radius over the ulna, a forearm movement not a flexation or extension of the wrist, which is considered a wrist movement or action.

For a flat serve, the elbow leads forward far more than a slice and even more than a topspin or kick serve. It is impossible to hit a kick serve with the elbow far forward, ahead of the body. The body must be sideways to a degree, but, more importantly, the pronation and upward movement of the racquet can only occur when the hitting elbow is behind the contact point...otherwise, the racquet swing path can't move up the back or the inside of the ball (for a kick serve). It is phyically impossible.

In all honesty, in my 35 years teaching, you almost never have to think about pronation when developing your serve. It is a natural action as players address the serve with speed AFTER they have developed the understanding of the axis of spin they desire. I have almost never mentioned the word, yet every student develops this motion within the context of developing the slice, hybrid, topspin or kick serves.

However, places where they emphasize the concept of "pronation" end up with students who intentionally pronate which almost always occurs too early and they not only hit the ball too flat (and don't learn spins), but they also develop a swing path that often is opposite of a conventional advanced serve. That is, they swing from right to left (right-handed) to compensate for their racquet pronating so early. From edge-on position, the hand naturally pronates to hit the bal.

 

[Mountain Ghost]

Studying Pronation

Studying pronation may help you to pronate (if there’s ever a formal contest for that), but it won’t help your serve, which I assume is your goal. When studying a professional’s serve, it’s those “frames” leading up to impact that are the most important . . . how they get into the proper elbow, wrist and racquet-drop position, and then swing up at the ball. Any “pronation” that occurs is a natural RESULT of the process, and focusing on it will only encourage you to misdirect your physical force, while distracting you from more critical aspects your serve.

It might, however, be beneficial for you to become aware of which way your wrist “breaks” during your serve. Here’s something on that:

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=1852466#post1852466

MG