Pros pro art of war specs

had a buddy of mine on the other side of the pond wanted to trade me a head graphite pro for one of his pros pro art of war- he says it’s like in the low 40’s RA; around 11 oz or so strung and head light ? Does anyone have or play with these flexible gems- I asked and got some feed back but didn’t know if it’s changed due to time of my last post
 
I have two of those. They are super flexy, I don't have a way to measure it but low 40's sounds very plausible. If you grip them at the throat and squeeze it flexes like you wouldn't believe. I feel like I could make the two sides meet if I did it hard enough. So first things first - The QC is horrific, one of mine was pretty much on the stated specs, 98 head, 320 gr and about 8 points headlight. The other one was closer to 330 gr and more like 4 points headlight. Also the foam pallet was put on wrong such that the two halfs weren't joined exactly and it was mounted too "low" down the hairpin. This made the racket 27.4 or so in length and grip 3 was closer to 4... With the whole thing vaguely asymmetrical. I cut it down and weighted it up to pretty much match the other (which also got weighted up and "leathered") it's a bit less headlight but I'm not pro enough to care. THe thinner TW leather grip got that close too. It's a passable backup. All that being said, I LOVE them. I wish I had bought a bunch more before they stopped making them. They were 24 euro each, with a 3 pack for 54 euro deal... Oh well. Best feel at impact of any racket I've played and I have multiple Head Pro Tours, Bumblebees and TT Rads etc.... It plays somewhat similar to the Pro Tour 630, but with a deep rich "THRUMM" at impact and more power, like the extra flex lets you slap through the ball.
 
Yeah I heard about the qc being bad- but wow low 40’s RA sounds quite nice . Buying rackets like this is always a surprise on what your going to get though so that’s scary , but yet kinda fun too,
I once “ speaking of weird specs” strung a k90 wilson that had a strung weight under 11 oz and was a low 30’s ra . The guy bought it in the Philippines 3 of them but this one was his fave, I eventually got to buy it off him cause it was magical .it was a fake for sure but it was still incredibly head light . I’ve played with hundreds of frames in my 30 years of playing tennis and it was truly the best racket I’ve ever hit and played with . If I could have found 12 more I would have done so and the hunt would be over for my ho,y grail
And believe you me I’ve tried to find headlight fAke wilson k 90,s since but no one ever takes me seriously enough to let me buy them . Weird I know but true.
I would just go online and buy them but like the pros pro art stick ya don’t know what your getting , that’s why it’s so hard trying to find a fake used stick . And it’s the only way “ as long as the seller understands by head heavy and head
Light to know what your getting .
 
Art of War is still available at €24,-
i may invest that based on your posts:)
You totally should so we could compare and see what the differences if any there are . If you do I’m hoping it’s in the extreme flex category . Man I wish we could get some rackets truly made with a flex in the 30’s and 40’s.
Hell if mats wilander won the us open in 1988 with a racquet with a 35 RA then surely I can play at a 4.5 level with something similar in 2017!
 
Here in Europe at least, they have a new Pros Pro racket called the Pioneer... It looks like the same mold as the Art of War 98... but with a drastically lower weight. No RA is listed, but they never really tell you that and I wouldn't believe it if they did. I might have to give it a try. If it's the same mold, I'm pretty sure I can get Pretige mp cap grommets on there and weight the heck out of the handle. A heavily polarized über-flexy 18x20 would be cool to try.
 
Yeah I heard about the qc being bad- but wow low 40’s RA sounds quite nice . Buying rackets like this is always a surprise on what your going to get though so that’s scary , but yet kinda fun too,
I once “ speaking of weird specs” strung a k90 wilson that had a strung weight under 11 oz and was a low 30’s ra . The guy bought it in the Philippines 3 of them but this one was his fave, I eventually got to buy it off him cause it was magical .it was a fake for sure but it was still incredibly head light . I’ve played with hundreds of frames in my 30 years of playing tennis and it was truly the best racket I’ve ever hit and played with . If I could have found 12 more I would have done so and the hunt would be over for my ho,y grail
And believe you me I’ve tried to find headlight fAke wilson k 90,s since but no one ever takes me seriously enough to let me buy them . Weird I know but true.
I would just go online and buy them but like the pros pro art stick ya don’t know what your getting , that’s why it’s so hard trying to find a fake used stick . And it’s the only way “ as long as the seller understands by head heavy and head
Light to know what your getting .

Well, I love to tinker. If I was playing more competively I would feel otherwise, but I actually like the air of mystery in things once in a while. When do we get that anymore?.... Makes it exiting. Like I say, when they had the 3 for 54€ deal going I could and should have bought 9 (162€ for 9 rackets) and just kept the three that were close enough to to spec... Sell the rest.... Rinse and repeat.
 
Oooooh the pioneer ! I gotta check this out ! I would love to replace my heavy as hell head club pros for a lighter frame as long as the flex is Uber low I’d be set !
 
285 plus or minus 7.5 grams is the pioneers weight . So that’s not too light especially if you get up in the higher 290’s. I like under 11 oz for me with a extreme head light balance . But if I shaved some material paint off and get rid of some grommets and head gaurd I’m sure I could get it down to 10.3 which is my fave weight . 8 to 12 Pts head light .. it can be done I’m sure of it. Especially if there is a lot of glass used instead of brittle low end graphite which does not bode well with thinning down like fiber glass in my experience . Boys I’m going to start a new thread on the pioneer and let’s see if anyone knows of the stiffness . We know weight and head size . Couldn’t make sense of the balance on the web site ? But I’ll make a new post now and hope someone bites with more tech info .
 
I just got two of these. I got lucky. They're only 2g off... 328g and 326g. Balance seems identical, although I don't have a way to officially check. Same with stiffness. The strings are pre-strung eh, and the base grip is complete garbage. I changed one out for a Gamma Hi-Tec that I had lying around. That's thicker and heavier. The grip was a pain to get off. It ripped and didn't all come off in one fell swoop. Had to pick and scrape the super gooey and sticky residue. I want to put leather on, but not real excited about taking the other one off. Grip shape is more rectangular than anything, like non-Speed Heads. Handle is graphite, not foam or pallets. Unfortunately they only have 4 1/2 grips left. Would've preferred 3/8. Each racquet was 20 Euro(s). Shipping for the two was 26 Euros. Fit and finish is better than expected. It'll be interesting to get these strung up with a preferred string. I'm not taking these into competition, or anything, so I was actually hoping to get one with advertised specs and one that was a little out of whack.

This was two weeks ago. I cut the strings out of one, but haven't gotten it strung up yet, and the other I've been playing with the stock strings and grip, with an overgrip. Would love to know what RA is on these things. Flexible for sure.
 
dcc4e73d1b6c58aa4805a65859680c47.jpg
 
Awesome stuff guys! Grip stuff and handle shape doesn’t sound to awful . I really don’t care for square grips like the rossi f200 was really square and some Fischer’s were quite square too . But I digress..
Now if you had to say are they stock head light or more even balanced ?
Or hopefully not head heavy ..
most importantly I know we don’t have an rdc machine to spec the stiffness but .. on your opinion and I understand that’s a loaded question but if would you care to say that they are in the 30’s 40’s or 50’s Rdc RA ?
Any info on feel and flex is so very much appreciative
 
Mine are headlight, maybe 7 points? I really have no idea. I'd say stiffness is in the 50's.
 
Just got an email back from Pros Pro about the Pioneer...

"The Pioneer is not the same racket as the Art of War II, it's a new model.
But they are very similar. The only difference is the weight: Art of War II
had 320 g, Pioneer has 285 g."

Balance point is given as "310 +/- 7,5 mm". 31 cm equates to about a 10 points headlight balance (unstrung I'm sure).... As long as that stays vaguely in the specs range, my Cap-dream could work out pretty well...
 
Just got an email back from Pros Pro about the Pioneer...

"The Pioneer is not the same racket as the Art of War II, it's a new model.
But they are very similar. The only difference is the weight: Art of War II
had 320 g, Pioneer has 285 g."

Balance point is given as "310 +/- 7,5 mm". 31 cm equates to about a 10 points headlight balance (unstrung I'm sure).... As long as that stays vaguely in the specs range, my Cap-dream could work out pretty well...
Great info thank you !
 
Just got an email back from Pros Pro about the Pioneer...

"The Pioneer is not the same racket as the Art of War II, it's a new model.
But they are very similar. The only difference is the weight: Art of War II
had 320 g, Pioneer has 285 g."

Balance point is given as "310 +/- 7,5 mm". 31 cm equates to about a 10 points headlight balance (unstrung I'm sure).... As long as that stays vaguely in the specs range, my Cap-dream could work out pretty well...
Pioneer looks more like a Radical with the V throat shape.
 
Are these only available in Europe?

As far as I know. But apparently they now out of this racquet and not getting anymore. Someone else contacted them and that's what they were told. Got mine just in the nick of time.
 
.

Many PPAOW fans mention difference between pieces on specs.

Look below this wayback capture from 1,5 year ago...


pro_s_pro_aow_I_vs_II.jpg


Same look (PJ or at least same product pic), but different SKU and price!
Could be that an aswer to the specs "variety" ?
Could be from two different molds?
The one from 113 Rad's and the other from Prestige's?
Pro's Pro named as Art of War "II" and "I" equally...
 
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.
Quote from "original" Pro's Pro Art of War thread...

Somebody else tried this racket? Price has dropped to 30 Euro... ;)

My friend Imago, I don't know if finally you get one... I wish you did!

Anyway, I was lucky to got the very last Art of War!
(code A120, Art of War I)

Thank you very much all you guys who brought up again the info about this racquet!

Is this the end of an interesting part of tennis history? (wow, be cool man). If BDAZ is right (if this racquet is not going to reproduced again) maybe yes...

For sure, just after my purchase the product page unpublished (the ex page goes to a 404 error now).

I have it few days now but the weather didn't help to test it sooner.

Unfortunately I’ve lost the first “unboxing” photos where everything was unattached – I take new photos afterwards, but the case is a little bit stretched of my bag, I’ve also put an overgrip and I’ve replace the standard noname finishing rubber ring with a Pro’s Pro “branded one” (yes, you can lol for that last) . These are the pics...

Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-01.jpg


Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-02.jpg


Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-03.jpg


These are my Pro’s Pro Art of War specs which are this thread subject.

Static weight (strung with out anything else on it) = 332 g (11.71 oz)
Frame length = 68.00 cm (26.75 in)
Balance (for this length above) = 32.4 cm (5 HL)
Swing weight (estimated empirically) = from 320 to 325
(I’m going to check that on an RDC as soon as I re-strung it)
Stiffness (estimated empirically) = 50 to 55 RA

Before I play...

Length issue:
I have a fear about that 0.6 mm which are missing, but I’ve used that as the same happens to my IGPMPs in the past, and to my PK Redondo C98 (at -0.3 mm for this) recently (I may extended some time in the future if I like it much). My main fear was that a shorter stick it is possible to play more stiff than the standard one...You can see below an image compared with my Ti.Rad (which is 69 cm long as I've put a new IG butt cap on it).

Overall Quality:
As other players comment in the various Art of War threads, the buying experience – when you unpacking the racquet is very positive!

Case (is A BIG CASE):
First of all, the Pro’s Pro case for the Art of War is really beautiful and really high in very very quality! Two times better than any other branded case I have. Also it's very thick with a lot of thermo foam. Meaning that, if other cases have a production cost eg 5 euros this has at least 10! For a 24 euro racquet this is something surprising!

Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-05c.jpg


Paint / Stickers:
The racquet itself is above average, with a paint quality and stickers similar to any brand. The design is too classic for that decade but the name is so inspired imho! Only two points in the racquet’s paint (which in a “quality” brand will be re-fixed) reveal that is a low cost racquet with very “wide” margin of error in QC. The first are few small marks under the paint and the second an area where the paint has flow and make a line.

Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-04q.jpg



Mold:
The mold is not the “squared” one from Prestige line (PT 630) but that form the Radicals MP, meaning the PT113.

It has same width 21 mm as Rad. I don't have a way to meter the thickness but it maybe be a little less like 20.5 mm (posibily for copyright issues). This may give the flexier result.

(EDIT: The bumper of AOW is different and the strings are passing the holes with a different order. See the picts below.Here the Ti.Rad has Microgel MP grommet where the bumper is longer than AOW's. The original Ti.Rad bumper is even smaller than AOW's).

I find it hard to put both stringbeds in line, but are the same – maybe 2-4 holes have a minus 1-2 mm difference in the position.

Beside the mold they’d even borrowed the Titanium motto!

Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-07vs_Rad.jpg


Pros_Pro-_Art-_Of-_War-06vs_Rad.jpg


Factory Strings:
I can’t say which PP string is on (it’s a mono with an outer coating) , but contrary to another member, mine came to tide, to boardy (I could say at 60lbs).

Out on the court:

The racquet is really perfect – exactly as expected before I take it (a flexier Prestige MP version). As I’ve said “actually”-stiffness (RA) must be in low 50’s, meaning that plays like that.

The power (with those tide factory strings) is above average for that type of racquets – meaning that you can play (with full swing only, but) without any need of lead addition!

The ground strokes are fine. The power is there if you full swing it.

Forehands are more on the flatter side (as with all 18x20 classics), stable and well targeted. The forehand slice is a weapon with AOW as it goes with very fast speed.

Backhands are also very stable and the slices / drop shoots executed easy and successfully.

Serving has a very good pace (rarely you double faulting with AOW), a perfect placement and a medium speed (on serving you have more success with spin eg slice serves that speedy flats).


Vs other 18x20 classics

Compared with Head IG Prestige MP (my racquet of choice for a long period) and ProKennex Heritage Type C98 Redondo MP (I have it in my bag but I use rarely / as is stringed too tide) the PP Art Of War are a much easier and pleasant racquet, in all aspects, with the same stability, but more comfortable, and with a (maybe) bigger sweetspot (as I’ve said is strung too tide which doesn’t help to that).

The Art Of War plays very similar to Ti.Radical MP as it shares (you may see my photos) the same mold.

One thing where the racquets have a difference (again I'm not 100% sure for that due to different strings and lbs) is when you hit the ball close to the tip, Art Of War makes a “plaf” noise, maybe the low flex or the carbon layers do this… But nothing which bothers the racquet’s playability.


Overall Pro’s Pro Art Of War is (unfortunately was) a very good racquet, in a price which is real steal!!!
I wish to be re-produced again asap!

:)
 
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This thread must self destruct in...
It starts as pros pro art of war specs but the really subject is "how some brands sell the same thing 10 times the price and get away with it" !!!
Βut this forum will be useless if they didn't...
:confused:
 
This thread must self destruct in...
It starts as pros pro art of war specs but the really subject is "how some brands sell the same thing 10 times the price and get away with it" !!!
Βut this forum will be useless if they didn't...
:confused:

Βut this forum will be useless wouldn't exist if they didn't...
 
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