PST with better feel - modding experiment

Tranqville

Tranqville

Professional
I love my Pure Strike Tour 3d gen and its specs, but want to get a bit more feel. Firm, crisp, powerful attacking frame with enhanced feel and good arm safety. I have an idea to take a similar platform stick and mod it to match PST specs with the help of a racquet customization company.

What could be the best platform stick? 98 headsize, tight 16x19, around 65 RA, 22-23mm beam width.

Some platform racquet candidates:

Tfight 300 RS || 23mm 66 RA
TF40 16x19 315g || 22mm 64 RA
Solinco Whiteout || 21.7mm 66 RA
Dunlop CX200 || 21.5mm 64 RA

Which platform frame would you choose to get more feel? Most important for me is to keep similar mass distribution. I'm leaning Tfight 300 RS, a bit worried about string spacing, as PST is actually quite dense in the center. Should I try to match all the specs religiously, like recoil weight, twistwegith, mgr/I etc?
 
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If you want a softer feeling Pure Strike, check out the Prince Tour ATS 98. You should be able to mod it to PST specs.

For a frame with a more crisper feel than I would recommend the Pro Staff 97 or the Extreme Tour.
 
I considered Price Tour ATS, it has 59 RA. I found that RA around 65 works best for my game, particularly serve and 1HBH. So I want to keep that spec from PST.
The idea of my experiment is not to find a replacement of PST! The idea is to rebuild the PST with better feel from a platform frame.
 
Tranqville said:
I love my Pure Strike Tour 3d gen and its specs, but want to get a bit more feel. Firm, crisp, powerful attacking frame with enhanced feel and good arm safety. I have an idea to take a similar platform stick and mod it to match PST specs with the help of a racquet customization company.

What could be the best platform stick? 98 headsize, tight 16x19, around 65 RA, 22-23mm beam width.

Some platform racquet candidates:

Tfight 300 RS || 23mm 66 RA
TF40 16x19 315g || 22mm 64 RA
Solinco Whiteout || 21.7mm 66 RA
Dunlop CX200 || 21.5mm 64 RA

Which platform frame would you choose to get more feel? Most important for me is to keep similar mass distribution. I'm leaning Tfight 300 RS, a bit worried about string spacing, as PST is actually quite dense in the center. Should I try to match all the specs religiously, like recoil weight, twistwegith, mgr/I etc?
Click to expand...
I’d take string spacing, mgr/i and twistweight into consideration before you buy any frame.

I also agree about getting strings into equasion.

I’d start with Head Radical MP, maybe CX200 or TF40 305. Rad MP plays a lot like a softer Pure Strike 16x19.

RS300 has high twistweight, so you can add lead only at the top of the hoop - this limits your ability to customize. As a platform frame I would choose something with twistweight not higher than 14,5. Otherwise you may end up with a clunky frame after customization.
 
tomkowy said:
RS300 has high twistweight, so you can add lead only at the top of the hoop - this limits your ability to customize. As a platform frame I would choose something with twistweight not higher than 14,5. Otherwise you may end up with a clunky frame after customization.
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PST has 14.8 TW and RS 300 14.9. I quickly looked at the calculator and it looks I'd need to add weight around 10 and 2, increasing TW. You definitely have a point.
 
@Tranqville - I would look at the G360+ Radical MP and the Auxetic Extreme Tour (hear me out on the ET). They are both going to be slightly off from the PST, but in different ways.

The Rad MP is 2 points more head-heavy in stock form and has slightly tighter mains, so it may play a bit more top-of-hoop heavy even after balance-matching, and/or not quite as spin-friendly as you may want. You'll have to test, though.

The Auxetic Extreme Tour lists a 63RA, but based on my experience with anything Auxetic, should still play around a 65, as it tends to lend a certain level of crisp, thuddyness. Also, the string bed, while a bit more open and lively than the Radical, is still pretty controlled. It also has a nice and low Hz value, very similar to your PST in arm-friendliness, and a very mod-able 13.9 twist weight. I would try a more calm string bed right off the bat, though, perhaps by flipping your current hybrid (Max Power in the mains, VS in the crosses, or doing Max Power / NRG2 if you didn't want to burn a half-set of gut on a demo), or playing a full bed Grapplesnake Tour M8 in the mid-upper 40's (M8 is a MUST try for calming down livelier-than-intended string beds, and it has more suppleness and touch than most any poly, with awesome tension maintenance; definitely a "next gen" feel to it).

If you were in Europe, I would also suggest the Auxetic Prestige MP-L, which is a 99" but is a bit long/narrow so it plays more like a 98, and is more head-heavy balance like the Radical, but correctable at such light weight, but alas I don't believe you're in Europe, so that's all a moot point.

Hope some of those suggestions help, and I'd urge you not to shut down the '22 Extreme Tour without at least trying it. You may be surprised.
 
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Tranqville said:
Radical MP specs match well, with 14.4 twistweight, 23mm beam and 65 RA stiffness. My only concern is slightly high vibration frequency of 146 HZ. Combined with no dampening tech.
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I did not realize PST has so low vibrations frequency. Then CX200, TF40 305 16x19 and Head Extreme Tour seem to be best candidates.
 
socallefty said:
Weigh up the Pure Strike VS. It is a solid racquet with more feel than the PST, but it is too light in stock form.
Click to expand...

So no chance for Pure Strike VS Tour to be released any time soon, you say? :-)
Of course, I considered PS VS, my only concern being slightly lower overall stiffness. I'm familiar with 16x20 string pattern from my Vcore 95 days, it's nice.
 
@Tranqville - Very welcome! As for grip shape, it's going to come down to personal taste. I haven't been much of a Babolat player, but I was in on the recent PA23 playtest and they are a bit more rectangular than the current Head TK-82S, which is on all current Head retail frames, except the PT 2.0 which uses the more rectangular TK-82. That may be what you'll need to swap to if you feel you just can't get used to the TK-82S. You'll have to try and see of course.

@socallefty - If he's looking for a 65RA+ type of feel, I think @Tranqville is going to find the PS VS to be too flexible.
 
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When you have time to set up, the VS had no shortage of power or spin for me compared to the PST. When late, it needs more mass and I don’t think the lack of stiffness is a problem.

socallefty said:
Paint job looks fantastic. When I have time to set up, I get faster racquet head speed (RHS) with the VS than with my usual Pure Strike Tour and I’m hitting good shots with slightly more spin. When I’m late or playing defense, I don’t get as much depth as easily as I do with the PST. Blocked returns don’t go as deep as with the PST. Easier to generate spin on 2nd serves than the PST as I have faster RHS. On 1st serves, I miss the PST as the extra mass gives me more pace on flat serves than the VS. I have some timing issues as the SW is 322 and I have been playing with >335 all my life. I haven’t tried it at the net yet. It feels very comfortable both with fullbed poly (HyperG Soft at 44) and hybrid (VS/HGS at 47/44).

I don’t think I will be switching from the PS Tour as first serves, playing defense, hitting deep balls when I’m late, returning are all better with the PST than with the VS. The only advantage of the VS is slightly more pace and spin due to higher RHS on ground strokes when I have time to set up nicely. That’s not enough to make up for the disadvantage on 1st serves, returns and defensive shots. If my wife does not prefer it also to the PST, I’ll probably be selling mine (size 3) relatively soon.

For my game, the Pure Strike Tour with VS/HGS at 47/44 is still the best racquet. I really don’t have problems or need for improvements with the PST and I bought the VS just on a lark to check it out.
Click to expand...
 
Former Pure Strike Tour player. Really enjoyed the frame but had arm issues (even with gut/poly) I now play the Diadem Elevate Tour. Firm, crisp, and powerful like you are looking for. It’s my first experience with a foam filled racket and I’m really enjoying it. Similar to the strike but much better feel. I’d give Diadem a try, I’m sure glad I did
 
TripleFault88 said:
Former Pure Strike Tour player. Really enjoyed the frame but had arm issues (even with gut/poly) I now play the Diadem Elevate Tour. Firm, crisp, and powerful like you are looking for. It’s my first experience with a foam filled racket and I’m really enjoying it. Similar to the strike but much better feel. I’d give Diadem a try, I’m sure glad I did
Click to expand...
Did you have arm issues with the Gen 1 (Red/Black) or Gen 3 (White/Red) PS Tour?
 
@TripleFault88 - I, too, have the EFS Tour and its a nice frame. However, @Tranqville wants as similar a string bed as possible to the PST and the Elevates have super wide spacing of the mains, which creates a fairly open string bed overall, requiring much more windshield-wiper motion to maintain control; hit them too flat and they tend to rocket launch. The Tour is better than the regular EFS about not being as launchy, but nonetheless the string beds do behave a fair bit differently than the PST. Just a head's up.
 
Tranqville said:
I love my Pure Strike Tour 3d gen and its specs, but want to get a bit more feel. Firm, crisp, powerful attacking frame with enhanced feel and good arm safety. I have an idea to take a similar platform stick and mod it to match PST specs with the help of a racquet customization company.

What could be the best platform stick? 98 headsize, tight 16x19, around 65 RA, 22-23mm beam width.

Some platform racquet candidates:

Tfight 300 RS || 23mm 66 RA
TF40 16x19 315g || 22mm 64 RA
Solinco Whiteout || 21.7mm 66 RA
Dunlop CX200 || 21.5mm 64 RA

Which platform frame would you choose to get more feel? Most important for me is to keep similar mass distribution. I'm leaning Tfight 300 RS, a bit worried about string spacing, as PST is actually quite dense in the center. Should I try to match all the specs religiously, like recoil weight, twistwegith, mgr/I etc?
Click to expand...

I highly suggest you take Yonex VCORE 95 out for a spin. It's has that solid feel with good feedback and room to add weight....and it takes the weight beautifully.

Best thing about it is how TRUE it plays, you want to spin? You've got spin. You want to flatten out? Lets go! Voleys and drop shots? All day. Just a great all arounder.

Don't let the "95" designation put you off, it's head shape gives a big spin window and you won't notice a diff compared to a 98.


Karue called it.

 
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Thank you for the suggestion @Anton. I played with Vcore 95 2021, and it gave me wrist pain. In terms of playstyle, Vcore is more of a grinder or counter-puncher stick, PST is an attack racquet, it suits my playstyle perfectly. As I said previously, I'm not really trying to replace PST, I want to replicate it keeping all the key specs but adding a bit extra feel. If that's not possible, I will just stick to the PST until gen 4 Pure Strike arrives in 2023. Of course, I will also be tempted to look at the new generation of attack frames: Radical MP and Pro Auxetic, ProStaff 97 RF v.14, Technifibre ISO 315.
 
Tranqville said:
Thank you for the suggestion @Anton. I played with Vcore 95 2021, and it gave me wrist pain. In terms of playstyle, Vcore is more of a grinder or counter-puncher stick, PST is an attack racquet, it suits my playstyle perfectly. As I said previously, I'm not really trying to replace PST, I want to replicate it keeping all the key specs but adding a bit extra feel. If that's not possible, I will just stick to the PST until gen 4 Pure Strike arrives in 2023. Of course, I will also be tempted to look at the new generation of attack frames: Radical MP and Pro Auxetic, ProStaff 97 RF v.14, Technifibre ISO 315.
Click to expand...

Did you try the VCORE95 with extra weight? PST is 12oz (330SW) compared to VCORE95 11.5oz (316SW), so it's a bit of apples to oranges at stock weight, both in terms of comfort and power.

Mine is at about 12.2oz and can drive the ball pretty hard if I feel like I'm losing the leg game.
 
Tranqville said:
I love my Pure Strike Tour 3d gen and its specs, but want to get a bit more feel. Firm, crisp, powerful attacking frame with enhanced feel and good arm safety. I have an idea to take a similar platform stick and mod it to match PST specs with the help of a racquet customization company.

What could be the best platform stick? 98 headsize, tight 16x19, around 65 RA, 22-23mm beam width.

Some platform racquet candidates:

Tfight 300 RS || 23mm 66 RA
TF40 16x19 315g || 22mm 64 RA
Solinco Whiteout || 21.7mm 66 RA
Dunlop CX200 || 21.5mm 64 RA

Which platform frame would you choose to get more feel? Most important for me is to keep similar mass distribution. I'm leaning Tfight 300 RS, a bit worried about string spacing, as PST is actually quite dense in the center. Should I try to match all the specs religiously, like recoil weight, twistwegith, mgr/I etc?
Click to expand...

i play pst 18x20 by myself. a similar very nice frame is the head extrem tour.(but it needs some lead at 3 and 6 o clock). or you just change your strings to isospeed black fire 1.2. that string solved my arm problems.
 
Anton said:
Did you try the VCORE95 with extra weight? PST is 12oz (330SW) compared to VCORE95 11.5oz (316SW), so it's a bit of apples to oranges at stock weight, both in terms of comfort and power.

Mine is at about 12.2oz and can drive the ball pretty hard if I feel like I'm losing the leg game.
Click to expand...

I played both in stock form and with extra wegith, just could not find the right setup.
 
vscope said:
i play pst 18x20 by myself. a similar very nice frame is the head extrem tour.(but it needs some lead at 3 and 6 o clock). or you just change your strings to isospeed black fire 1.2. that string solved my arm problems.
Click to expand...

Are you talking about the latest Auxetic Extreme Tour, or the previous (Graphene 360+)?
 
vscope said:
i play pst 18x20 by myself. a similar very nice frame is the head extrem tour.(but it needs some lead at 3 and 6 o clock). or you just change your strings to isospeed black fire 1.2. that string solved my arm problems.
Click to expand...

@Trip As I understand, Extreme Tour has low twistweight to facilitate the spin via racquet flip. That's basically how Nadal generates spin, keeping the sides of the frame light and only adding increasingly more weight @12. Would not increasing TW go against the original concept of the racquet? If we do increase TW to match PST, would it perform well? I do not really know. That's why I call it "the experiment".
 
Op, have you tried my string job - VS17 mains and HyperG Soft crosses at 47/44 lbs. I came up with this hybrid after a lot of experimentation with other poly crosses and it works well for me for about 15 hours.
 
Tranqville said:
@Trip As I understand, Extreme Tour has low twistweight to facilitate the spin via racquet flip. That's basically how Nadal generates spin, keeping the sides of the frame light and only adding increasingly more weight @12. Would not increasing TW go against the original concept of the racquet? If we do increase TW to match PST, would it perform well? I do not really know. That's why I call it "the experiment".
Click to expand...
360+ Extreme Tour with lead at 2 and 10 it performs well. I have mine modified: 336 grams, 32,7 cm balance, 334 swingweight. Lead is placed around 2 and 10, so the estimated twistweight is 14,7 (it's my estimate, 14,3 tw stock + lead). I did not notice much difference between 14,3 and 14,7 in twistweight for the same swingweight. Extreme Tour takes lead well and it's layup makes it very maneuverable. After modding different racquets I think that twistweight is just half of the story - head shape and layup affect maneuverability too and it's hard to measure. You have to try the frame.

I have tried different lead placements with same swingweight and twistweight between 14,3 and 15,3. I ended up somewhere in the middle. Anything above 15,0 was noticeably slower to swing for me.
 
head extreme tour stringbed is more narrow and long than pst. so low tw and narrow raquet gives a default small sweetarea in 3 / 9 direction.

for me personally i prefer a bigger sweetarea.

however some people prefer a raquet thats tells them that they didnt hit the ball in the center. its always a matter of taste.

stilll the extreme tour is a nice raquet. the layup is very nice.
play arround with lead placement.

best raquet for me would be pst mold with extreme layup.
 
vscope said:
head extreme tour stringbed is more narrow and long than pst. so low tw and narrow raquet gives a default small sweetarea in 3 / 9 direction.

for me personally i prefer a bigger sweetarea.

however some people prefer a raquet thats tells them that they didnt hit the ball in the center. its always a matter of taste.

stilll the extreme tour is a nice raquet. the layup is very nice.
play arround with lead placement.

best raquet for me would be pst mold with extreme layup.
Click to expand...
Probably that is why ET feels so maneuverable :) Some new frames with wide heads are forgiving but they feel slow, no matter the swingweight…
 
yes thats true
tomkowy said:
Probably that is why ET feels so maneuverable :) Some new frames with wide heads are forgiving but they feel slow, no matter the swingweight…
Click to expand...
yonex sv95 might be the fastest raquet on earth :) aero beam. small head, low tw. if you can play this raquet stock without mishits you are the master of the perfect swing ☺️
 
Tranqville said:
I love my Pure Strike Tour 3d gen and its specs, but want to get a bit more feel. Firm, crisp, powerful attacking frame with enhanced feel and good arm safety. I have an idea to take a similar platform stick and mod it to match PST specs with the help of a racquet customization company.

What could be the best platform stick? 98 headsize, tight 16x19, around 65 RA, 22-23mm beam width.

Some platform racquet candidates:

Tfight 300 RS || 23mm 66 RA
TF40 16x19 315g || 22mm 64 RA
Solinco Whiteout || 21.7mm 66 RA
Dunlop CX200 || 21.5mm 64 RA

Which platform frame would you choose to get more feel? Most important for me is to keep similar mass distribution. I'm leaning Tfight 300 RS, a bit worried about string spacing, as PST is actually quite dense in the center. Should I try to match all the specs religiously, like recoil weight, twistwegith, mgr/I etc?
Click to expand...
Not sure if it would feel as solid, but have you thought about a Pure Strike 100?
 
socallefty said:
Op, have you tried my string job - VS17 mains and HyperG Soft crosses at 47/44 lbs. I came up with this hybrid after a lot of experimentation with other poly crosses and it works well for me for about 15 hours.
Click to expand...

I have not tried this specific string job: with VS17, Max Power worked great for 15h plus, Black Zone was ok-ish but not much longevity, Pro Line 2 I was not happy about. I string at 48/45.
 
Tranqville said:
@Trip if I go with a Head racquet, do I need to change the grip shape to Babolat, or the current shape is close enough?
Click to expand...
new head tk82s grips are quite similar to pst grip. a little bit more rectangular. most difference is the buttcap. i put pst buttcaps on my head raquets since i like the less flare more on them.
 
TripleFault88 said:
Gen 3. Switched to bab gut and Tourna black zone.
Click to expand...

I played happily with this exact setup @48/45. In this setup, Tourna Black Zone dies quickly for me. Have you restrung frequently?
Maybe you need to give your arm some time to recover fully.

My favorite cross with VS is Max Power, @socallefty prefers Hyper-G Soft.
 
I was restringing often. Unfortunately the pain was still there. Nothing too terrible, but enough to scare me away to avoid anything more long term.
 
I would like to suggest the Tfight 305 ISO. It has a similar SW to your pst, very nice and smooth feel because of foam and a very well balance between power and control. You can easily put weight on the handle to achieve the weight and balance of your pst.
 
vscope said:
@Tranqville one question, did you measure your pst specs? cause my 3 pst 18x20 varied a lot in stock form. messured between 332 and 340sw.
Click to expand...

I have two frames. I bought frames with matched specs of 320g unstrung and on-spec balance. Recently measured the SW with an electronic device. Strung weight w/overgrip 341g and 342g, SW 337 and 338. Strings were FB HGS and overgrip Wilson Pro Perforated.

PST only comes in 16x19, perhaps you have a Pure Strike 18x20?
 
Tranqville said:
I have two frames. I bought frames with matched specs of 320g unstrung and on-spec balance. Recently measured the SW with an electronic device. Strung weight w/overgrip 341g and 342g, SW 337 and 338. Strings were FB HGS and overgrip Wilson Pro Perforated.

PST only comes in 16x19, perhaps you have a Pure Strike 18x20?
Click to expand...

pst is pure strike tour right? sorry. i play pure strike 18x20 3d gen leaded up to 338g, 33b, 340 sw. 23/22kg isospeed black fire 1.2
 
GermanBeast said:
I would like to suggest the Tfight 305 ISO. It has a similar SW to your pst, very nice and smooth feel because of foam and a very well balance between power and control. You can easily put weight on the handle to achieve the weight and balance of your pst.
Click to expand...

Tfight ISO has SW of 335, already more than PST at 333. Twist weight for ISO is 15, PST 145.8. So unfortunately, there is not much room for customization. I will consider either 300g or 315g ISO versions to come in January, they both have 16x19 string patterns and are more easily customizable to PST specs.
 
@Tranqville - Regarding your question about the ET and twist weight, yes, a lower twist weight will allow you to twist the racquet more freely about the vertical centerline (going from butt cap to top of the hoop), as that means it has less mass naturally distributed towards 9 & 3 in relation to the mass of the rest of the frame. The nice thing with lower stock twist weight frames is you have the leeway to spec it up to whatever level you desire, which is an especially good fit if one is presuming you're planning on adding weight anyways (as is the case with many (most?) pro stock frames).

I'll maintain that if you really want more feel in a 16-main control pattern 22+mm beam, you're best off with a G360+ Rad MP and/or Auxetic Extreme Tour. A Dunlop CX 200 (or CX 200 Tour) might be a close second, but I have a feeling it's going to be a bit too flexy and too underpowered compared to your PST, at almost any spec -- close to stock and you'll have higher RHS but lower stability and plow; at higher spec, you may get it roughly equivalent in stability and plow, but you may have to weight it up so much that you might not be able to sustain the RHS and endurance you need to operate it longer-term. I could be wrong, and it may be worth a try, but if I had to hedge a bet, I'd lean towards the Head frames.
 
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Tranqville said:
Pretty much Theim's setup.
Click to expand...

yes, i even tried thiems lynx tour / hawk combo. liked it first but got a soar arm pretty fast.
thats why i switched to black fire.

i agree with @Trip you should try head rad mp / head extreme tour.

another cool raquet is the pure aero vs. very nice crisp feel, plenty power , aero and good control with stock specs.
strange thing, pure aero vs. has completely different grip shape than pst ...
and unfortunatly my wrist collapsed after 10 minutes of play with pure aero vs and isospeed black fire...
so not for me that one...

ps: i have to say thats a nice thread. very competent posters (y)
 
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