Rank the 3 slam seasons by the big three

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
LOL, fed won the first set vs Kiefer comfortably 6-3, then had 6-0 and 6-2 sets in the 3rd and 4th sets.
Kiefer won a close set 7-5 by playing well.
That's struggling? LOL.

But then you don't have a clue about AO 04 federer. Not a surprise you would be rather clueless about AO 06 as well. :)

I said flat out that I don't remember much about the 2004 tournament. I do remember plenty about 2006 AO though and your reinventions are quite entertaining. Lol.
 

RS

Bionic Poster
I said flat out that I don't remember much about the 2004 tournament. I do remember plenty about 2006 AO though and your reinventions are quite entertaining. Lol.
You should check out Safin-Agassi AO 2004 if you ever got the time.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
I said flat out that I don't remember much about the 2004 tournament. I do remember plenty about 2006 AO though and your reinventions are quite entertaining. Lol.

Yeah, I know what you said about AO 04.
Saying fed struggled against Kiefer when

"Fed won the first set vs Kiefer comfortably 6-3, then had 6-0 and 6-2 sets in the 3rd and 4th sets.
Kiefer won a close set 7-5 by playing well. "

shows how well you remember AO 06, LOLOLOL!!!!

Your delusionally hilarious double standards wrt to Kiefer and Karatsev are hilarious. I mean Kiefer is nowhere near a strong SF opponent by any means, but if you are bigging up Karatsev....
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
I never said Baghdatis was a mug. I've said in the past Baghdatis played quite well that tournament but he was a nobody at that point, in his 1st Slam final and was bossing peak Federer. It's not like Federer was playing well in those 1st two sets. So yea, you guys are overrating this version of Federer.
I agree he didn't play great, but you guys are overrating the level of competition at AO 2021. (y) (y)

FYI, both Fedovic lost the same amount of sets.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Do you think it’s bad to pick Murray to win in say 5 sets?

Not necessarily unless you are putting money on it. My point was holding up AO 2006 fed to peak standards (given fed still had some ankle issues leading to inconsistency) and AO 21 djokovic to 21 standards and then saying AO 21 Djokovic was better and severely under-rating AO 2006 fed.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
He was up two sets to love on Haas and ended up going 5, and he definitely should not have been struggling with Kiefer.
Struggled? He destroyed Kiefer in the last 3 sets. Heck, even in 2005 he lost sets to Kiefer. For some reason he wasn't straightforward for Fed.

Djokovic himself shouldn't have allowed Murray to take him to 5 at the 2015 FO. It happens.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
I agree he didn't play great, but you guys are overrating the level of competition at AO 2021. (y) (y)

FYI, both Fedovic lost the same amount of sets.

I do think Djokovic had the tougher draw. You can take or leave that, but I'm sure you will leave it. Lol

Fair enough, but we must remember Djokovic hurt himself in the middle of the torunament otherwise, he dusts Fritz in 3 sets.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
I do think Djokovic had the tougher draw. You can take or leave that, but I'm sure you will leave it. Lol

Fair enough, but we must remember Djokovic hyrt himself in the middle of the torunament otherwise, he dusts Fritz in 3 sets.
Fed himself wasn't 100% at AO 2006, so it evens out.

Don't think Djokovic had the tougher draw. Haas > Raonic and Davydenko vs Zverev is debatable.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Struggled? He destroyed Kiefer in the last 3 sets. Heck, even in 2005 he lost sets to Kiefer. For some reason he wasn't straightforward for Fed.

Fed won the first set 6-3. lost a close 2nd set 5-7. Then won the last 2 sets destroying Kiefer. 6-0, 6-2. Even better than what you are saying since Fed had a lead by winning the first set.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Fed won the first set 6-3. lost a close 2nd set 5-7. Then won the last 2 sets destroying Kiefer. 6-0, 6-2.
Par for the course. His level was up and down but he still destroyed opponents in sets so it's not as bad as people are saying.

Wouldn't beat top tier competition in that form, but luckily Zed and Med aren't in that category.
 

RS

Bionic Poster
Who wins these matchups?

1. Gonzo AO 07 final vs Tsonga AO 08 final
2. Tsonga AO 08 final vs Nadal AO 17 final
3. Agassi USO 05 final vs Djokovic USO 18 final
4. Murray Wim 12 final vs Djokovic Wim 14 final
5. Ferrero RG 03 final vs Federer RG 06 final
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Fed himself wasn't 100% at AO 2006, so it evens out.

Don't think Djokovic had the tougher draw. Haas > Raonic and Davydenko vs Zverev is debatable.

It actually doesn't considering Djokovic injured himself in the middle of the tournament and Federer's happened in October 2005.

Well there's nothing left for us to discuss. No way am I going to agree with you that that was an overall tougher draw.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Par for the course. His level was up and down but he still destroyed opponents in sets so it's not as bad as people are saying.

Wouldn't beat top tier competition in that form, but luckily Zed and Med aren't in that category.

Yeah, see my edit.
"Even better than what you are saying since Fed had a lead by winning the first set."

Fed played very well in those last 2 sets vs Kiefer to destroy him.
That 2nd set vs Haas was phenomenal. 5th set was pretty good as well given Haas was still playing some good tennis and fed had a pretty sloppy 4th set.
Fed also held his nerve vs Davy who was playing clearly better than anyone Djokovic faced in AO 21, IMO.

Fed had ten 6-0/6-1/6-2 sets in AO 06. Not a small number by any means.

2 each in 4R (Haas), SF(Kiefer), F(Baggy)
 
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RS

Bionic Poster
Not necessarily unless you are putting money on it. My point was holding up AO 2006 fed to peak standards (given fed still had some ankle issues leading to inconsistency) and AO 21 djokovic to 21 standards and then saying AO 21 Djokovic was better and severely under-rating AO 2006 fed.
Do you think Federer winning in 5 is most likely then since you wouldn’t advice betting on AM?
 
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abmk

Bionic Poster
Do you think Federer winning in 5 is most likely then since you wouldn’t advice better on AM?

yes, since Murray would need a significantly better level than fed to actually cross the line vs him in a slam (ala AO 13).
 

RF-18

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, he wasn't great, but he'd still win 2021 AO. You guys are overrating the competition level here. Djoko himself lost 5 sets to win it.

We weren't discussing if Fed would win 21 ao or not. I just proposed to the idea that it ain't too far fetched to believe AO 21 Djokovic would beat AO 06 Fed. What is the issue? Fed wasn't unbeatable that tournament, as evidenced by his run where everyone was having a crack at him. End of story.
 

RS

Bionic Poster
yes, since Murray would need a significantly better level than fed to actually cross the line vs him in a slam (ala AO 13).
Apart from Safin AO 2005 do you think any non ATG's at playing well at AO would be favoured to beat AO 2006 SF/F Federer?
 

Third Serve

Talk Tennis Guru
AO 2021 Djokovic could possibly beat AO 2006 Fed if it's the final form and possibly the semi form. I do think that Fed would get it together whenever he'd find himself in trouble, though (which he would against Djokovic given the way he played for the first couple of sets). In the end, I'd favor him a little but Djokovic winning is a very real possibility given he played the cleaner final even if Med stunk up the court in a way that Baghdatis didn't.

If it's any other round I see Fed winning without much doubt about it.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
To me, Djokovic, Nadal and Sampras at their peaks are 3 of the best athletes ever in tennis. Federer is slightly below them imo, although he is an exceptional athlete himself and I would rank him up there with the best of them. I don't consider racket head speed athleticism. Agassi's amazing racket speed never made up for his slower feet. If he had Djokovic or Nadal's speed, no way he goes 0-4 against Sampras at the USO.

I'm not sure why you think 2006 Federer is a much better athlete than 2021 Djokovic. Djokovic is still exceptional on defense and one of the main reasons next gen are having a hard time beating him. He's a better mover than Zverev, Berrettini and Hurkacz, and just as good as Tsitsipas and only slightly below Medvedev. All these guys are a decade younger than him. A difference between this Djokovic and 2006 Federer would be slight at best.

Aslan did play well. We watched two different matches. The scoreline does not do that match justice. I just don't agree about Zverev.

2015 Djokovic had quite a few close matches with players who were nowhere near as good as Medvedev on movement and defense. He wasn't blowing everybody away. He had a very close one with Berdych in Paris.

Of course, lol.

Fair enough man, I think our perspectives are just fundementally different and shaped by who are favourites are. Hopefully one day we can agree on something aha.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
We weren't discussing if Fed would win 21 ao or not. I just proposed to the idea that it ain't too far fetched to believe AO 21 Djokovic would beat AO 06 Fed. What is the issue? Fed wasn't unbeatable that tournament, as evidenced by his run where everyone was having a crack at him. End of story.
Djokovic could beat him, true. I just disagree that the others would as well.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Apart from Safin AO 2005 do you think any non ATG's at playing well at AO would be favoured to beat AO 2006 SF/F Federer?

Considering from 90s onwards:
Well obviously prime Courier
then you have Korda AO 98, Kafel AO 99, Nalby AO 04, Hewitt AO 05, Gonzo AO 07, Tsonga AO 08, Dasco AO 09, Murray AO 12/13, Wawa AO 13/14/17 who would be close, but I wouldn't make them outright favorites.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
It actually doesn't considering Djokovic injured himself in the middle of the tournament and Federer's happened in October 2005.

Well there's nothing left for us to discuss. No way am I going to agree with you that that was an overall tougher draw.
It wasn't tougher, but it wasn't much worse than you think.
 

RS

Bionic Poster
Considering from 90s onwards:
Well obviously prime Courier
then you have Korda AO 98, Kafel AO 99, Nalby AO 04, Hewitt AO 05, Gonzo AO 07, Tsonga AO 08, Dasco AO 09, Murray AO 12/13, Wawa AO 13/14/17 who would be close, but I wouldn't make them outright favorites.
I thought you would consider the AO 03 QF Roddick -Aynaoui some people now think that is among the best AO matches.
 

Kralingen

Bionic Poster
Fine I'll give my thoughts on nit picking Fed's AO '06. Davydenko played at a similar level to Zverev, except Davydenko engaged in less choking. I think those matches both went about equally so will call it even. Davy better from the ground, Zverev when good was botting at a high level but also coughing up awful DFs/UEs so it evens out.

Kiefer v. Karatsev: well Kiefer was actually a really nice all-court player with a strong serve, forehand, and willingness to come forward. He also took sets from '05 Fed at Wimby/USO. Not a mug by any means. Remember that Medvedev dropped a set to qualifier Botic Van de Zandschulp at the USO. Dropping sets to guys who can play attacking tennis with precision is not really that big of a deal.

Still, Kiefer match was very much NID. Baghdatis match on the other hand was anything but NID, but then his legs gave out. I'd classify that one as where I think Fed was a little flat in the final and was maybe a little fortunate to not go down 0-2, but his 3rd set (while Baggy was still trying) was probably the best he played all tournament. This is still '06 Federer we're talking about guys, his FH was demonic and Fed started to time the Baghdatis serve, it was destruction.

Overall I think AO '21 Djokovic could beat Fed if they met in the final but the fact is Fed could outlast this Djokovic from the baseline. It's just hard for us to picture it this way due to the images of Fed being older than Novak, but in a situation where the ages are flipped, Djokovic would be forced to end points earlier and may struggle. I do think Djokovic would pull it out if he got the first 2 sets, but if it was 1-1 going to the 3rd I'm betting Federer wins it. Fed's level raise in set 3 of the final is being underrated.

This is a WTA account now.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Fair enough man, I think our perspectives are just fundementally different and shaped by who are favourites are. Hopefully one day we can agree on something aha.

True and fair enough. We tend go agree when it doesn't involve Federer and Djokovic. ;)
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
I thought you would consider the AO 03 QF Roddick -Aynaoui some people now think that is among the best AO matches.

I only considered runs where the player had reached the semi and played well enough in semi atleast. Roddick was spent by the time of the AO 03 semi. Not just the El Ayanoui match, but the 5-setter vs Youzhny as well.
Roddick in AO 03 QF vs el ayanoui was amazing, but he was better in AO 04 in general

Edit: AO 04 QF/SF Safin would be favored over AO 2006 SF/F fed, not just AO 2005 Safin. Obviously not the Safin of the final, who'd take 1 of the first 2 sets, but would lose.
 
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RS

Bionic Poster
I only considered runs where the player had reached the semi and played well enough in semi atleast. Roddick was spent by the time of the AO 03 semi. Not just the El Ayanoui match, but the 5-setter vs Youzhny as well.
Roddick in AO 03 QF vs el ayanoui was amazing, but he was better in AO 04 in general

Edit: AO 04 QF/SF Safin would be favored over AO 2006 SF/F fed, not just AO 2005 Safin. Obviously not the Safin of the final, who'd take 1 of the first 2 sets, but would lose.
Fair enough.
 

ffw2

Hall of Fame
ME4UOR6_o.jpg
 

Third Serve

Talk Tennis Guru
Federer Wim 17 final vs Djokovic Wim 18 final?
that's like the worst comparison ever because both guys faced physically compromised opponents and had to do the bare minimum to win. Cilic was probably even worse than Anderson but it's not saying a whole lot
 
It was the peak of the Rafa era.

Rada is a great guy, but the problem is the era touched such epic lows that Berdych of all people reached the Wimbledon final. Definetly 8 times champ Fed and 6 times champ Novak not being at their best cause this, right ?

USO was a great performance but both Fed nd Novak were again down

French was Rafa all the way, too strong so nothing to complain

AO was not won by Rafa anyway

Not to mention Rafa failed to beat Fed at the tour finals in his top year

So you see outside the French Open it was a weak year....

If Federer, Rafa, Novak all are at their peaks born together then you would see Novak take AO, Rodgi take Grass and New York, Tour Finals we would again see Fed vs Novak

Rafa is Godly on Clay but a bit of a mortal outside it.....
 

RS

Bionic Poster
that's like the worst comparison ever because both guys faced physically compromised opponents and had to do the bare minimum to win. Cilic was probably even worse than Anderson but it's not saying a whole lot
Okay you could use SF matches of both instead.
 
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