Rank the current prestige levels in descending order for all nine masters

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
Indian Wells
Rome
Cincinnati
Bercy
Monte Carlo
Miami
Madrid
Montreal/Toronto
Shanghai

I watch a lot of matches from the first five Masters events including attending IW for 2-3 days. I watch only a few matches from the last four events with more at the semi/final stage. IW is like a fifth Slam for me and it is local. Rome and Cinci are previews of who is in form before the FO and USO. Bercy is the premier event apart from ATP Finals for enjoying indoor tennis and a different style from the rest of the year and when I start watching tennis again after the USO. Monte Carlo is the debut of the clay season and eagerly awaited.

The rest are less important for me as Miami is an after-thought after IW especially after they moved to a parking lot and lost the legacy history of Key Biscayne, Madrid is high-altitude clay and doesn’t speak to form for the FO, Canada has typically had some top stars skipping it and Shanghai has no history/legacy with some stars skipping it and small crowds. I think I’ve seen a few finals for Shanghai and hardly watched it otherwise because of the large time zone difference also. I pay more attention to Adelaide, Dubai, Barcelona and Queens than some of the lesser Masters tournaments.
 
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ChrisRF

Legend
Fruitless endeavor.

All 9 give 1000 pts and similar ball park money. IW/Miami were 2 weeks before but now that is also not different.
Agree. Also no best of 5 finals anymore, so no difference to those which always were best of 3 either. It's the same, just like every Slam is the same for a long while now.

We as fans might like to watch one more than the other, but of course that cannot be a measurement.
 

Golden-24

Rookie
Rome
Indian Wells
Miami
Cincinnati
Paris
Madrid
Shanghai
Canada
Monaco

Monaco isn't even a Mandatory Masters. Players are allowed to skip it if they want (without fine). It is hardly a Masters for me. More like an upgraded ATP500
 
How do you rank all nine of them?
1. Indian Wells
2. Rome
3. Montreal (seems bigger than Toronto for some reason)
4. Shanghai
5. Monte Carlo
6. Madrid
7. Cincinatti
8. Paris Bercy
9 Miami (the move to the Dolphins NFL stadium as made it almost cartoonish)
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
1. Rome
2. Indian Wells
3. Cincinnati
4. Canada
5. Paris
6. Monte Carlo
7. Miami
8. Shanghai
9. Madrid
 

KingCarlitos

Hall of Fame
1 Indian Wells
2 Cincinatti
3 Rome
4 Shanghai
5 Paris
6 Monte Carlo
7 Miami
8 Madrid
9 Canada

Cincinatti status was elevated after last yrs final.
 

Lleytonstation

Talk Tennis Guru
1. Indian wells
2. Rome
3. Cinci
4. Queens (sue me)
5. Halle (sue me again)
6. Monte carlo
7. Miami
8. Canada
9. Shanghai

Paris and Madrid should not be masters.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
1. Indian wells
2. Rome
3. Cinci
4. Queens (sue me)
5. Halle (sue me again)
6. Monte carlo
7. Miami
8. Canada
9. Shanghai

Paris and Madrid should not be masters.
Paris Masters has a lot of history. Ashe, Smith, Nastase, Becker (3), Edberg, Sampras (2), Agassi (2), Safin (3) all won it. Not much history in Madrid.
 

Djokodalerer31

Hall of Fame
They are all equal these days, prestige order is dictated by the level of competition for each separate edition and how many people are attracted to the event, for an instance this year's Cincinnati has no chance of matching last year's edition, because it's defending champion is not even playing this time and there is a large question mark over the current world number one player playing it as well as we currently speak...so it only leaves Alcaraz, who will either choke to some journeyman in early rounds or goes all the way beating said journeymen and mugs to claim the title, neither of which does any favours for the event this season...so no, i don't see much point in ranking them all in order, this swaps and changes on yearly basis, unless consistent rivalries like the ones between big-4 will be formed, which will make those masters events relevant and entertaining as well again...it doesn't seem like Sincaraz is the one at the moment...
 

ibbi

G.O.A.T.
I mean, it depends on the player really. For me, personally, trying to be objective about it...

1. Indian Wells - It has kind of become the crown jewel of the ATP tour given the money Ellison has pumped into it, the location, how much the players seem to like it, its unique placement removed from any of the majors (Miami has this too, but this comes first, which helps) but at the start of the season when everything and everyone is fresh as opposed to Shanghai and Paris at the end of the season when things are winding up.

2. Rome - These top two are very close, but I think Rome being the second of a back-to-back with just a one week break after it before Roland Garros hurts it in comparison with the desert. It's still the Italian Open and one of the most prestigious tennis events with one of the great lists of champions in all the sport.

3. Cincinnati - Podunk location (no offence to the locals), recently under attack from the Navarro's, but it's still one of the oldest tennis tournaments on the planet, and has in the past decade absolutely wrested dominance away from Canada as the premier US Open warmup.

4. Madrid - I think with the current Italian invasion of tennis, Rome will become a bigger deal to them, and that could hurt Madrid a little, which is why it's below Cincy.

5. Shanghai - For whatever reason, I don't think this has quite hit the heights that it should have. I think its fairly close proximity post-US Open hurts it a little bit when everyone has the post-Major blues. The pandemic era obviously hasn't helped, nor the Peng Shuai stuff, but the centre of the world is moving ever more towards Asia, and this tournament should be elevated by that.

5. Miami - Parking lot, but parking lot in the capital of the tennis world.

7. Canada -It is really amazing how much of a blow this has taken in the big 3 era, for whatever reason. I feel like the rise of the Olympics has really sort of hurt it, because every 4 years it's basically turned into a 500. Cincinnati has also obviously established itself as the big brother of the two (I think Roger preferring it and Novak chasing it helped it a lot), and that's not the case to anything like the same degree with the other two events here that are the second in a back-to-back, so I'm amazed it has become so clearly the case here.

8. Monte Carlo - The downgrading of this tournament continues to break my heart. Like Cincy, it's one of the oldest tournaments on the planet, unlike Cincy, it gets no goddamn respect.

9. :-D Move this POS somewhere else, please. Ever since Roger Federer prioritized his local tournament over it (and since Rafa Nadal decided he liked western Paris a lot more than eastern Paris) it has been dying. It bottomed out that Sock/Krajinovic year, the younger generation have instilled a little life in it, but not much. I actually quite like watching it, because it really is kind of an outlier on the tour as a surface, but it feels so small time, as most post-US Open stuff does.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I mean, it depends on the player really. For me, personally, trying to be objective about it...

1. Indian Wells - It has kind of become the crown jewel of the ATP tour given the money Ellison has pumped into it, the location, how much the players seem to like it, its unique placement removed from any of the majors (Miami has this too, but this comes first, which helps) but at the start of the season when everything and everyone is fresh as opposed to Shanghai and Paris at the end of the season when things are winding up.

2. Rome - These top two are very close, but I think Rome being the second of a back-to-back with just a one week break after it before Roland Garros hurts it in comparison with the desert. It's still the Italian Open and one of the most prestigious tennis events with one of the great lists of champions in all the sport.

3. Cincinnati - Podunk location (no offence to the locals), recently under attack from the Navarro's, but it's still one of the oldest tennis tournaments on the planet, and has in the past decade absolutely wrested dominance away from Canada as the premier US Open warmup.

4. Madrid - I think with the current Italian invasion of tennis, Rome will become a bigger deal to them, and that could hurt Madrid a little, which is why it's below Cincy.

5. Shanghai - For whatever reason, I don't think this has quite hit the heights that it should have. I think its fairly close proximity post-US Open hurts it a little bit when everyone has the post-Major blues. The pandemic era obviously hasn't helped, nor the Peng Shuai stuff, but the centre of the world is moving ever more towards Asia, and this tournament should be elevated by that.

5. Miami - Parking lot, but parking lot in the capital of the tennis world.

7. Canada -It is really amazing how much of a blow this has taken in the big 3 era, for whatever reason. I feel like the rise of the Olympics has really sort of hurt it, because every 4 years it's basically turned into a 500. Cincinnati has also obviously established itself as the big brother of the two (I think Roger preferring it and Novak chasing it helped it a lot), and that's not the case to anything like the same degree with the other two events here that are the second in a back-to-back, so I'm amazed it has become so clearly the case here.

8. Monte Carlo - The downgrading of this tournament continues to break my heart. Like Cincy, it's one of the oldest tournaments on the planet, unlike Cincy, it gets no goddamn respect.

9. :-D Move this POS somewhere else, please. Ever since Roger Federer prioritized his local tournament over it (and since Rafa Nadal decided he liked western Paris a lot more than eastern Paris) it has been dying. It bottomed out that Sock/Krajinovic year, the younger generation have instilled a little life in it, but not much. I actually quite like watching it, because it really is kind of an outlier on the tour as a surface, but it feels so small time, as most post-US Open stuff does.

Great analysis even if I don't necessarily agree with everything. Good post!
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Thank God for sinner. Or we would have top player like raz ducking out from Paris each year like rafa.

We have sinner Medvedev zverev for coming years here. Even rune looked great in 2022/23.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
MC as only not mandatory most be least important. However it is most important to nole becouse of 3x GM.

MC has the most gorgeous setting of all the Masters. Always loved it for that reason alone. Never really understood why it became non-mandatory.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
last 5 years masters by participation.
YearIWMiamiMCMadridRomeRogers cupCincyShanghaiParis
2019888377898978808283
2020----77-76-66
202178667580906580-81
202289827286807985-91
2023798375818781898995
Cummulative837975848476828583

In last 5 years, 1 year was totally washed by covid. Shanghai was not held for 3 straight years.

By participation rate.

Rome
Madrid
IW
Paris
Cincy
Miami
Rogers cup
MC

Shanghai was outlier 85 due to cancellation during covid.

I guess we know what are two worst tournaments by participation. Rogers cup and MC.

Winners in last 5 years in both.

Rogers cup - Sinner, PCB, Medvedev, Nadal. Cancelled in 2020

MC - Rublev, Tsitsipas, Tsitsipas, Fognini. Cancelled in 2020.
 
All equally pointless really . Slams and year end is all that matters. No one has ever looked back and asked “does he have enough masters titles?” I would just use masters events as warmups to slam and worry about getting 25 plus if I’m these kids. The fact that Djoker has the masters record is just gravy. But what makes him GOAT is really the 24 slams. He could have 2 masters titles and it wouldn’t matter
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster

Most 1 time winners since 2014 by tournament.

4 in IW
1 in Miami
3 in Cincinnati
3 in Paris
2 in Rogers cup

Paris is no worse than any other tournament. In fact, IW might be worst in that term.
 

tudwell

G.O.A.T.
My take is something like this:

Top Tier
Indian Wells
Rome
Miami

Rome's become the premier clay Masters of late, with the non-mandatory status of Monte-Carlo and the outlier conditions of Madrid. Miami used to be the fifth slam and I think still carries some cache, although moving it to a parking lot was not a great move. Indian Wells has kind of superseded it as the hard court Masters, I think, being the first of the year, and coming after a long break so all the top players are rested and motivated.

Mid Tier
Cincinnati
Shanghai
Madrid
Canada

Cincy and Canada are both very old tournaments but become a bit indistinguishable with the proliferation of hard court Masters. Cincy at least has a clearer identity as the "fast" Masters (though largely overtaken now by Shanghai). Canada especially suffers with the Olympics. I think the other thing with these two is they shifted away from best-of-five finals much earlier than the Sunshine Double did (Cincy actually switched just a couple years after its inception, looks like, according to Wikipedia) – I think that's helped foster a sense of these not being quite in the same tier as the first two hard court Masters of the year. Shanghai's much newer but is the premier event of the Asian swing and comes at a welcome time, with top players getting plenty of rest after the US Open. Madrid is also on the newer side and has always felt a little "glitzy" by tennis standards, with the model ball girls and so forth.

Low Tier
Monte-Carlo
Paris

Two important tourneys historically but their location in the schedule and, for MC at least, non-mandatory status makes them feel like second-class citizens in the Masters world to some extent.

That said, the gaps between these aren't that huge – they're all worth 1,000 points – and the changing landscape of 96 player draws will probably alter perceptions of importance and prestige as time goes on.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster

Most 1 time winners since 2014 by tournament.

4 in IW
1 in Miami
3 in Cincinnati
3 in Paris
2 in Rogers cup

Paris is no worse than any other tournament. In fact, IW might be worst in that term.
I think Rogers Cup has more than that. Popyrin gets added to that list. Cincy has Coric, Medvedev, Zverev, Dimitrov, Cilic.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
I think Rogers Cup has more than that. Popyrin gets added to that list. Cincy has Coric, Zverev, Dimitrov, Cilic.
I mean masters winner that never won another masters. So taking out Zverev. Otherwise we will put Medvedev's name in this even though he has won 6/9 masters.
 
I mean, it depends on the player really. For me, personally, trying to be objective about it...

1. Indian Wells - It has kind of become the crown jewel of the ATP tour given the money Ellison has pumped into it, the location, how much the players seem to like it, its unique placement removed from any of the majors (Miami has this too, but this comes first, which helps) but at the start of the season when everything and everyone is fresh as opposed to Shanghai and Paris at the end of the season when things are winding up.

2. Rome - These top two are very close, but I think Rome being the second of a back-to-back with just a one week break after it before Roland Garros hurts it in comparison with the desert. It's still the Italian Open and one of the most prestigious tennis events with one of the great lists of champions in all the sport.

3. Cincinnati - Podunk location (no offence to the locals), recently under attack from the Navarro's, but it's still one of the oldest tennis tournaments on the planet, and has in the past decade absolutely wrested dominance away from Canada as the premier US Open warmup.

4. Madrid - I think with the current Italian invasion of tennis, Rome will become a bigger deal to them, and that could hurt Madrid a little, which is why it's below Cincy.

5. Shanghai - For whatever reason, I don't think this has quite hit the heights that it should have. I think its fairly close proximity post-US Open hurts it a little bit when everyone has the post-Major blues. The pandemic era obviously hasn't helped, nor the Peng Shuai stuff, but the centre of the world is moving ever more towards Asia, and this tournament should be elevated by that.

5. Miami - Parking lot, but parking lot in the capital of the tennis world.

7. Canada -It is really amazing how much of a blow this has taken in the big 3 era, for whatever reason. I feel like the rise of the Olympics has really sort of hurt it, because every 4 years it's basically turned into a 500. Cincinnati has also obviously established itself as the big brother of the two (I think Roger preferring it and Novak chasing it helped it a lot), and that's not the case to anything like the same degree with the other two events here that are the second in a back-to-back, so I'm amazed it has become so clearly the case here.

8. Monte Carlo - The downgrading of this tournament continues to break my heart. Like Cincy, it's one of the oldest tournaments on the planet, unlike Cincy, it gets no goddamn respect.

9. :-D Move this POS somewhere else, please. Ever since Roger Federer prioritized his local tournament over it (and since Rafa Nadal decided he liked western Paris a lot more than eastern Paris) it has been dying. It bottomed out that Sock/Krajinovic year, the younger generation have instilled a little life in it, but not much. I actually quite like watching it, because it really is kind of an outlier on the tour as a surface, but it feels so small time, as most post-US Open stuff does.

Good list, but podunk is a bit harsh on Cincinnati as a place, when it's really a medium place (actually, the archetype of a medium place).
 
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