Ranking the level of Nadal’s 11 FO Final Opponents

[Nadalgaenger]

How would you rank the 11 opponents’ level (not the players overall) in the finals.

Here is my best effort:
1) Federer 2011! (Fed’s best overall performance against Nadal in a FO final. He really should have won the first set. Should have at least taken Nadal the distance).
2) Fed 2006 (Probably the consensus choice, given Fed’s overall level that year. Stormed out of the gates and gave Nadal a breadstick in the first set, only to peter out for the rest of the match).
3) Djokovic 2012 (Djokovic had Rafa on the ropes for a while but they stopped play due to rain and then Nadal showed up the next day and crushed him).
4) Djokovic 2014 (won the first set and looked like he finally had the right stuff but, like Fed in 2006, just kind of went away after that).
5) Fed 2007 (arguably should be higher, as he had many break points in this final, but at the same time, he choked away so many BP that he doesn’t deserve to be in the top 4!)
6) Puerta 2005 (took the first set off the youngster but was overwhelmed thereafter by the King)
7) Thiem 2018 (looked good at various times and really deserved the first set based on overall level. Lost belief in the second set and let the bull bully him).
8) Soderling 2010 (Never really stood a chance in this match, as Nadal was a man on a mission. The match felt very routine).
9) Ferrer 2013 (Put up about as much resistance as one could have hoped from a guy that didn’t belong in the final to begin with!)
10) Wawrinka 2017 (Sad performance from Stan. Stanimal domesticated like a docile puppy).
11) Fed 2008 (Worst match of Fed’s career and Rafa at peak level on clay).

 

[BrokenGears]

How would you rank the 11 opponents’ level (not the players overall) in the finals.

Here is my best effort:
1) Federer 2011! (Fed’s best overall performance against Nadal in a FO final. He really should have won the first set. Should have at least taken Nadal the distance.
2) Fed 2006 (Probably the consensus choice, given Fed’s overall level that year. Stormed out of the gates and gave Nadal a breadstick in the first set, only to peter out for the rest of the match).
3) Djokovic 2012 (Djokovic had Rafa on the ropes for a while but they stopped play due to rain and then Nadal showed up the next day and crushed him).
4) Djokovic 2014 (won the first set and looked like he finally had the right stuff but, like Fed in 2006, just kind of went away after that).
5) Fed 2007 (arguably should be higher, as he had many break points in this final, but at the same time, he choked away so many BP that he doesn’t deserve to be in the top 4!)
6) Puerta 2005 (took the first set off the youngster but was overwhelmed thereafter by the King)
7) Thiem 2018 (looked good at various times and really deserved the first set based on overall level). Lost belief in the second set and let the bull bully him.
8) Soderling 2010 (Never really stood a chance in this match, as Nadal was a man on a mission. The match felt very routine).
9) Ferrer 2013 (Put up about as much resistance as one could have hoped from a guy that didn’t belong in the final to begin with!)
10) Wawrinka 2017 (Sad performance from Stan. Stanimal domesticated like a docile puppy).
11) Fed 2008 (Worst match of Fed’s career and Rafa at peak level on clay)

Djoko so unlucky. Rain and sickness

 

[nolefam_2024]

Djoko so unlucky. Rain and sickness

2014 was unlucky. 2012 he didn't have chance without rain delay.

 

[BrokenGears]

2014 was unlucky. 2012 he didn't have chance without rain delay.

He was playing well in the rain conditions, then rain delay

 

[BrokenGears]

Djoko morale goat of 4 FOs

 

[aman92]

1. Federer 2011
2. Djokovic 2014
3. Federer 2006
4. Djokovic 2012
5. Federer 2007
6. Puerta 2005
7. Soderling 2010
8. Thiem 2018
9. Ferrer 2013
10. Wawrinka 2017
11. Federer 2008

 

[Antonio Puente]

Pretty amazing - 6 sets lost in 11 matches. The difference between #1 and #11 is one set, and #1 ended with a 6-1 fourth set. The top challenger out of eleven went out 6-1 in the fourth.

 

[Checkmate]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

 

[BrokenGears]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

It was semis

But 2013 against Rafa was Rafa’s roughest match on clay outside of Soderling

 

[Antonio Puente]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

SF

 

[aman92]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

It was semis but even saying so Djokovic's level was only high for the last 2 sets. The first 3 sets were a bit patchy by both players and Djoko barely avoided a bagel in the 3rd. A bit like their Aus Open 2012 match... people only remember the last 2 sets.

 

[Checkmate]

2012 Djokovic' s serve deserted him like no tomorrow.

Such a superb return game that a standing ovation would have been deserved.

But That was the biggest act of Fraudulence done by any stroke on any other stroke.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

Yeah, that would be the obvious top choice, but it was a SF.
Nothing like a titanic SF to prepare for a Nadal/Ferrer FO final

 

[Checkmate]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

 

[Checkmate]

Yeah, that would be the obvious top choice, but it was a SF.
Nothing like a titanic SF to prepare for a Nadal/Ferrer FO final

I always get confused thinking Ferrer / Nadal was SF.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

Very hard to say. 2015 Djokovic looked even better on paper but couldn’t beat Stan!

 

[Antonio Puente]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

The hypothetical matches - the only RG matches Nadal loses.

 

[zep]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

2016 Djokovic wasn't that impressive. He played a 5 setter against Schwartzman and Murray was awful in the final. IMO he played better in 2015.

Edit: Schwartzman 5 setter was last year my bad

 

[Checkmate]

Very hard to say. 2015 Djokovic looked even better on paper but couldn’t beat Stan!

GOATing Stan is another matter and he choked big time in the final.

I mean 3-0 15-0 up in the fourth set and lost it?

 

[TheAssassin]

2016 Djokovic wasn't that impressive. He played a 5 setter against Schwartzman and Murray was awful in the final. IMO he played better in 2015.

Djokovic played a 5 setter against Schwartzman in 2017. In 2016 he beat everyone convincingly.

 

[zep]

Djokovic played a 5 setter against Schwartzman in 2017. In 2016 he beat everyone convincingly.

Yeah realized that just after writing it.

 

[Checkmate]

2016 Djokovic wasn't that impressive. He played a 5 setter against Schwartzman and Murray was awful in the final. IMO he played better in 2015.

Very wrong.

Schwartz was 2017 elbow pain Djokovic.

2016 was Nole slam Djokovic who straight set'd Nadal in Rome 16 despite being unable to serve properly in that tournament.

 

[Checkmate]

2016 Djokovic wasn't that impressive. He played a 5 setter against Schwartzman and Murray was awful in the final. IMO he played better in 2015.

Edit: Schwartzman 5 setter was last year my bad

And after losing the first set against Murray, he went 15 - 4 in games against him.

Straight sets win over a very good Thiem.

 

[abmk]

And after losing the first set against Murray, he went 15 - 4 in games against him.

Straight sets win over a very good Thiem.

Thiem was nowhere near very good in the RG 2016 semi.

 

[abmk]

puerta had 3 (?) SPs in the 4th set. He was the one closest to take it to a 5th set.

 

[abmk]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

2016 djoko definitely loses to 12 Nadal. Still loses to 2013 Nadal. 18 Nadal ? Before the final, could beat him. Final, not sure..
Vs 2014 Nadal ? Could beat him.

 

[vive le beau jeu !]

puerta had 3 (?) SPs in the 4th set. He was the one closest to take it to a 5th set.

but he was the most 'doped' of all...

(not counting the nadal, of course)​

 

[Raining hopes]

2016 djoko definitely loses to 12 Nadal. Still loses to 2013 Nadal. 18 Nadal ? Before the final, could beat him. Final, not sure..
Vs 2014 Nadal ? Could beat him.

2012 apart from conditions affected stretch was a bit one sided to be honest.Rafa was probably at his second best level after 2008.

2018 will be interesting He might not win the second set and Dominic had his chances in the first but Novak would not let the chance presented to him due to the hand injury stretch of the match( few games but enough to get a break) Takes it to five I think.Might end up winning it,no one knows Rafa's stamina because no one pushes him that far

2014 is probably the weakest I have seen Rafa in RG final and I will pick this year as the one where Djokovic definitely wins

 

[KINGROGER]

1. 2011 Federer. Insanely high level and imo outplayed Rafa for 3 sets. Needed a 2-1 lead to have a chance of winning.
2. 2006 Federer. Had the game there to beat Rafa but bottled it after the 1st set. Tactically awful.
3. 2012 Djokovic. Rain helped him win some games otherwise would’ve been straight sets.
4. 2014 Djokovic. Didn’t bring his best form. 2013 Djokovic wins this final imo.
5. 2007 Federer. Outside of a few shots tactically awful. Really weak BH, not enough short slice following the wide serve etc. Able to manage a set thanks to his natural ability.
6. 2005 Puerta. Close to going 5 sets vs peak Rafa
After this not much difference.
7. 2010 Soderling
8. 2018 Thiem
9. 2013 Ferrer
10. 2017 Wawrinka
11. 2008 Federer

 

[abmk]

@KINGROGER :
Fed's bh was excellent in the RG 2007 final. It was his forehand that let him down in that match. You might want to watch that again (or highlights atleast)

 

[KINGROGER]

Probably only my opinion but I think 2016 Djokovic would have defeated 12,13,14 and 18 Nadal on the final day.

I think 2011/2015 Djokovic can beat 2014-2016 Nadal and have a shot at 2011. Was 2015/16 Djokovic playing at a higher level than 2013 version at RG?

 

[KINGROGER]

@KINGROGER :
Fed's bh was excellent in the RG 2007 final. It was his forehand that let him down in that match. You might want to watch that again (or highlights atleast)

Been a while since I watched the full match but from the extended highlights his BH was even weaker than 2006 and he kept playing those short mid court topspin BHs that Nadal would eat up easily with his FH.

Will rewatch the highlights now.

 

[abmk]

Been a while since I watched the full match but from the extended highlights his BH was even weaker than 2006 and he kept playing those short mid court topspin BHs that Nadal would eat up easily with his FH.

Nope, his BH was very good and held up very well. I re-watched the whole match and took down the stats some time last year.(after the RG 17 final I think)

Massive contrast b/w how well Fed's BH held up and how stan's crumbled.

And in 06 final, he was too slice happy and it was weak in contrast to the 07 final.

 

[Druss]

I agree with OP on the rankings, except the top 3 could be interchangeable.

 

[nolefam_2024]

I think 2011/2015 Djokovic can beat 2014-2016 Nadal and have a shot at 2011. Was 2015/16 Djokovic playing at a higher level than 2013 version at RG?

In early rounds I think yes.

 

[nolefam_2024]

2015, of course it was Gasuqet, but he said best Djokovic he had ever seen.

 

[KINGROGER]

Nope, his BH was very good and held up very well. I re-watched the whole match and took down the stats some time last year.(after the RG 17 final I think)

Massive contrast b/w how well Fed's BH held up and how stan's crumbled.

And in 06 final, he was too slice happy and it was weak in contrast to the 07 final.

3-2 40-40

Edit point after he plays a good BH that opens the court for a FH winner. I’ll keep watching but I’ll take your word for it.

 

[Checkmate]

May have been the best Djokovic but 2016 Djokovic had higher peak play than 15 Djokovic despite having lower average play.

 

[KINGROGER]

3-2 40-40

Edit point after he plays a good BH that opens the court for a FH winner. I’ll keep watching but I’ll take your word for it.

Watching the first few minutes of those highlights, why is he looping every high ball to his BH back to mid court? There’s no chance he can control a shot that high so his best bet is a deep defensive slice to reset the point, or an actual defensive lob.

Just poor tactics. So frustrating.

Can’t watch any more of this crap lol. Spinny FH nowhere near as good as his fearhand of 03-06... looping high balls back to mid court with no control. Poor tactics.

 

[bananaforehand]

Thiem deserved the first set today?

He was under pressure possibly every service game bar one.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

3-2 40-40

Edit point after he plays a good BH that opens the court for a FH winner. I’ll keep watching but I’ll take your word for it.

What was Fed’s BP conversion rate in this match?

 

[Nadalgaenger]

Thiem deserved the first set today?

He was under pressure possibly every service game bar one.

Thiem had the upper hand in the majority of baseline rallies. He was pushing Rafa around a lot!
Had he served only slightly better, he would have won the set.

 

[bananaforehand]

Thiem had the upper hand in the majority of baseline rallies. He was pushing Rafa around a lot!
Had he served only slightly better, he would have won the set.

I thought Thiem played well first set and it was tight, but I don't feel he had the upper hand at any point really.

Agreed on his serving though, didn't land enough first serves.

 

[bananaforehand]

Thiem had the upper hand in the majority of baseline rallies. He was pushing Rafa around a lot!
Had he served only slightly better, he would have won the set.

I thought Thiem played well first set and it was tight, but I don't think he ever looked like causing too many issues.

Agreed on his serving, not enough first serves in!

 

[Northern]

French Open 13 Djokovic?

I thought Djokovic played at a ridiculously high level that day.

It's just not included because it was the semifinal.

 

[Lozo1016]

What was Fed’s BP conversion rate in this match?

1 for 17.

 

[mistik]

Strange things happen 2013 RG semi with Novak remains the most epic and high quality match ever in RG for Rafa.

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Djoko so unlucky. Rain and sickness

Wouldn't have beaten him anyway, kiddo.

 

[NEW_BORN]

Level wise i agree with the OP that it's 2011, besides the disappointing 4th set, the other 3 sets were very high quality. Only wish that Fed had won 1 of the first 2 sets so the outcome would have been more in doubt.

In terms of being closest to beating Nadal, it has to be 2006, because Federer was up 6-5 in the 4th, which he eventually lost in a tiebreak, so he was only a few points from taking Nadal to 5.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

Level wise i agree with the OP that it's 2011, besides the disappointing 4th set, the other 3 sets were very high quality. Only wish that Fed had won 1 of the first 2 sets so the outcome would have been more in doubt.

In terms of being closest to beating Nadal, it has to be 2006, because Federer was up 6-5 in the 4th, which he eventually lost in a tiebreak, so he was only a few points from taking Nadal to 5.

Nice point about 2006.

I’m sure you remember Fed missing the drop shot on set point in the 1st set. Had his dropshot landed just a couple of inches differently, he takes the first set.