Raonic vs Isner vs Karlovic vs Muller; the SB4 (servebot big four) comparison

George Turner

Hall of Fame
If you're ranking these players by how good they are the order is pretty clear, Raonic>Isner>Karlovic>Muller. Lets compare their accomplishments against Each other.

Raonic;
-Reached a Major final, only one of the SB4 have got past a quarter final
-Only SB4 to beat Andy Murray, who has the best game on tour for countering serve bots.
-140-106 W-L record against top 20 players. 26 wins over top 10 players
-Only SB4 to win a 500 tier tournament
-Has gotten to number 3 in the world
-Has the best return stats of the SB4. Not saying much, considering Isner and Ivo rank among the bottom 5 of all time.
-Only SB4 member to beat Federer in a major.

Struggles most against; Grinders. Has a laughably abysmal record vs Nole (0-9, winning one set) and is also 0-4 against Ferrer, a poor mans Nole. His 2-5 record against Nishikori is another example. Would have struggled against similar players from the past like Hewitt and Chang.

Isner;
-Reached 3 masters finals, an equal feat with Raonic
-Two wins over Djokovic, both when Nole was ranked 1. One win over Fed
-21 wins over top 10 players
-More titles than Raonic, with 12 to Raonics 8
-Winning record over Raonic, 3-1
-8-3 record over the similar ranked Anderson and 3-0 over Simon
-Pushed Nadal to five sets at RG!
-Has ranked 11-20 for the past 8 years, consistently above Ivo but below Raonic pre injury.
-Biggest forehand of the SB4. Whether he can get it in or even get to the ball in time is another matter.

Struggles most against; no style in particular. However he is generally prone to upsets from random lower ranked players particularly in majors. He is more suited to the Bo3 format, having won the most titles of the SB4. Only has one major quarter final and has performed poorest at Wimbledon. Despite his big serve he is hampered here by his need to have alot of time to hit ground strokes.

Karlovic;
- has a 2-1 record against Djokovic.
- Has beaten 3 no.1 ranked players; Federer, Hewitt, Djokovic
- more wins than Muller over top ten players, with 21. Muller has 12.
- more titles than Muller, with 8 to Mullers 2
- winning records over Lleyton Hewitt, James Blake, Fernando Gonzales and Tomas Berdych. Generally the most capable of producing shock results
- 3-2 H2H vs Isner
- Best serving stats
- Competent volleyer. By todays tour standards he's an elite volleyer. Probably better than Raonic
- Moderately Better record than Muller at Masters events, Muller has never reached a masters QF
- Highest peak ranking, no. 14 to Mullers 21.
- Oldest winner of an ATP title in recent times.

Struggles most against; offensive/neutral baseliners with excellent backhands. Notable examples are being 1-7 vs Davydenko, 1-5 vs Gasquet, 1-4 vs Youzhny and 0-3 vs Almagro, all of whoms backhands are at least as good as their forehand. Also was beaten very easily by Goffin at last years Australian open.

Muller;
- Has two wins over Nadal at Wimbledon, only member of the SB4 to beat Rafa in majors.
- Made two major quarter finals to Karlovic's one
- Slightly better return stats than Ivo/Isner, offset by having the weakest serve of the SB4
- Awkward to play against, helped by being a lefty
- Better volleys than Isner or Raonic
- Won Luxembourgs sportsman of the year 4 times in a row!

Struggles most against; hard to tell because of his general inconsistency. Capable of beating top 10 players then losing to the world number 150. Has never quite fulfilled his potential, the rest of the SB4 probably maxed out their talent.

That is the most detailed article on servebots you're likely to find here. Which servebot is your favourite?
 
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atp2015

Hall of Fame
If you're ranking these players by how clear they are the order is pretty clear, Raonic>Isner>Karlovic>Muller. Lets compare their accomplishments against Each other.

Raonic;
-Reached a Major final, only one of the SB4 have got past a quarter final
-Only SB4 to beat Andy Murray, who has the best game on tour for countering serve bots.
-140-106 W-L record against top 20 players. 26 wins over top 10 players
-Only SB4 to win a 500 tier tournament
-Has gotten to number 3 in the world
-Has the best return stats of the SB4. Not saying much, considering Isner and Ivo rank among the bottom 5 of all time.
-Only SB4 member to beat Federer in a major.

Struggles most against; Grinders. Has a laughably abysmal record vs Nole (0-9, winning one set) and is also 0-4 against Ferrer, a poor mans Nole. His 2-5 record against Nishikori is another example. Would have struggled against similar players from the past like Hewitt and Chang.

Isner;
-Reached 3 masters finals, an equal feat with Raonic
-Two wins over Djokovic, both when Nole was ranked 1. One win over Fed
-21 wins over top 10 players
-More titles than Raonic, with 12 to Raonics 8
-Winning record over Raonic, 3-1
-8-3 record over the similar ranked Anderson and 3-0 over Simon
-Pushed Nadal to five sets at RG!
-Has ranked 11-20 for the past 8 years, consistently above Ivo but below Raonic pre injury.
-Biggest forehand of the SB4. Whether he can get it in or even get to the ball in time is another matter.

Struggles most against; no style in particular. However he is generally prone to upsets from random lower ranked players particularly in majors. He is more suited to the Bo3 format, having won the most titles of the SB4. Only has one major quarter final and has performed poorest at Wimbledon. Despite his big serve he is hampered here by his need to have alot of time to hit ground strokes.

Karlovic;
- has a 2-1 record against Djokovic.
- Has beaten 3 no.1 ranked players; Federer, Hewitt, Djokovic
- more wins than Muller over top ten players, with 21. Muller has 12.
- more titles than Muller, with 8 to Mullers 2
- winning records over Lleyton Hewitt, James Blake, Fernando Gonzales and Tomas Berdych. Generally the most capable of producing shock results
- 3-2 H2H vs Isner
- Best serving stats
- Competent volleyer. By todays tour standards he's an elite volleyer. Probably better than Raonic
- Moderately Better record than Muller at Masters events, Muller has never reached a masters QF
- Highest peak ranking, no. 14 to Mullers 21.
- Oldest winner of an ATP title in recent times.

Struggles most against; offensive/neutral baseliners with excellent backhands. Notable examples are being 1-7 vs Davydenko, 1-5 vs Gasquet, 1-4 vs Youzhny and 0-3 vs Almagro, all of whoms backhands are at least as good as their forehand. Also was beaten very easily by Goffin at last years Australian open.

Muller;
- Has two wins over Nadal at Wimbledon, only member of the SB4 to beat Rafa in majors.
- Made two major quarter finals to Karlovic's one
- Slightly better return stats than Ivo/Isner, offset by having the weakest serve of the SB4
- Awkward to play against, helped by being a lefty
- Better volleys than Isner or Raonic
- Won Luxembourgs sportsman of the year 4 times in a row!

Struggles most against; hard to tell because of his general inconsistency. Capable of beating top 10 players then losing to the world number 150. Has never quite fulfilled his potential, the rest of the SB4 probably maxed out their talent.

That is the most detailed article on servebots you're likely to find here. Which servebot is your favourite?

Why is K Anderson missing in your list? He is more accomplished SB than Ivo and Muller.
(GS performance, Career prize money and highest ranking)
 
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The Green Mile

Bionic Poster
I enjoy Ivo the most. He is the most extreme servebot the game has ever seen. Every match just has a strange vibe to it, as someone else pointed out not too long ago. Similar to Simon, his opponents can get extremely rattled and frustrated, often resulting in outburts/racquet abuse, etc, which I enjoy immensely.

Sometimes I think John can rush his serve game, and his first serve can go a little off target at times (even though his first serve % is like around 70), Ivo's is far more unvarying, and is seemingly always focused.
 

Sudacafan

Bionic Poster
I enjoy Ivo the most. He is the most extreme servebot the game has ever seen. Every match just has a strange vibe to it, as someone else pointed out not too long ago. Similar to Simon, his opponents can get extremely rattled and frustrated, often resulting in outburts/racquet abuse, etc, which I enjoy immensely.

Sometimes I think John can rush his serve game, and his first serve can go a little off target at times (even though his first serve % is like around 70), Ivo's is far more unvarying, and is seemingly always focused.
Unfortunately, servebots tend to have extended careers. I believe Dr. Ivo is the oldest active ATP player, at least in the top 100. He’s turning 39 in February.
 

George Turner

Hall of Fame
I enjoy Ivo the most. He is the most extreme servebot the game has ever seen. Every match just has a strange vibe to it, as someone else pointed out not too long ago. Similar to Simon, his opponents can get extremely rattled and frustrated, often resulting in outburts/racquet abuse, etc, which I enjoy immensely.

Sometimes I think John can rush his serve game, and his first serve can go a little off target at times (even though his first serve % is like around 70), Ivo's is far more unvarying, and is seemingly always focused.

It is amusing seeing opponents who consider themselves above him losing their rag over his style of play, the job he did on djokovic in doha 2015 was funny :D

Isner should have learned to serve and volley better rather than be a taller version of Querrey. Being a serve-volleyer requires a good level of coolness and focus (McEnroe and Becker being exceptions) which is to be admired.

Raonic at least has a great forehand and tries to play all court. Anderson would be ranked in 500s if not for his serve.
Anderson is bigger sb than raonic

Raonic does not have a better baseline game than Anderson. He has a bigger serve/forehand and "tries" to play all court, but his slowness means his all round rally game isn't better. Being slow is a classic side effect of being a serve bot.

Raonic consistently ranks 3rd in serving stats, a serving level Anderson has never been at.
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
Isner is my favorite servebot because his serve is fun to watch, he's got a personality, and he tends to have a lot of high drama matches.

He also took down peak Djokovic, Federer on clay (was it BO5?), and pushed Bull to 5 at RG (not many can say that).
 

Fedinkum

Legend
Anderson should replace Muller. Muller’s game is not that One dimensional, he can volley. Anderson is a bigger servebot
 

George Turner

Hall of Fame
Anderson should replace Muller. Muller’s game is not that One dimensional, he can volley. Anderson is a bigger servebot

Across their careers Mullers averages aces per match is a bit higher than Andos. He also hits more aces per match than Roddick and Sampras! :eek:

As for the return stats Karlovic and Isner rank in the bottom 5, Muller ranks in the bottom 10. Andos return stats are somewhat higher, though still pretty rubbish.

You don't have to be one dimensional to be a serve bot. A serve bot is simply someone whose serve is far better than the rest of their game.
 

atp2015

Hall of Fame
It is amusing seeing opponents who consider themselves above him losing their rag over his style of play, the job he did on djokovic in doha 2015 was funny :D

Isner should have learned to serve and volley better rather than be a taller version of Querrey. Being a serve-volleyer requires a good level of coolness and focus (McEnroe and Becker being exceptions) which is to be admired.



Raonic does not have a better baseline game than Anderson. He has a bigger serve/forehand and "tries" to play all court, but his slowness means his all round rally game isn't better. Being slow is a classic side effect of being a serve bot.

Raonic consistently ranks 3rd in serving stats, a serving level Anderson has never been at.

Based on serve effectiveness - the current big 5 SBs are:

Player 1st SvI 2nd SvI Total SvI

Ivo Karlovic 79.2% 56.1% 73.3%
John Isner 78.3% 54.3% 72.4%
Feliciano Lopez 83.3% 37.1% 68.9%
Kevin Anderson 77.7% 42.5% 68.4%
Milos Raonic 77.4% 36.0% 66.0%

http://www.tennisabstract.com/blog/category/serve-statistics/
 
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WhiskeyEE

G.O.A.T.
Muller isn't so much a serve bot as he is a serve game specialist. He needs to be the server to be effective at his style of play (S&V).

Kyrgios is probably more of a serve bot in that he relies heavily on aces and unreturnables.
 

Fedinkum

Legend
Well, stats are more objective than subjective opinion.
Maybe your definition of servebot is different to mine. To me, servebot is someone who constantly serve big and only get out of trouble by serving big.

Lopez can serve big but he has the ability to mix in with slower lefty slices. He also has many other options to win a point: he can chip or hit heavy on both sides; he can stay back or he can volley. His game does not rely solely on serving big with every point.
 

atp2015

Hall of Fame
Maybe your definition of servebot is different to mine. To me, servebot is someone who constantly serve big and only get out of trouble by serving big.

Lopez can serve big but he has the ability to mix in with a slower lefty slice. He Also has many other weapons to win a rally, he can chip or hit heavy on both sides. He can stay back or volleys. He game does not rely solely on serving big with every point.

The stats tell you that he wins 68.9 pct of the points with unreturned or extremely weak replies to serve. He may not hit as big as ivo or isner, but the serve is extremely effective in winning the point in less than 3 shots.
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
Isner is my favorite servebot because his serve is fun to watch, he's got a personality, and he tends to have a lot of high drama matches.

He also took down peak Djokovic, Federer on clay (was it BO5?), and pushed Bull to 5 at RG (not many can say that).

Yes. It was in DC in 2012.
 
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