rate me pls (BE GENTLE, I AM NEW HERE)

SweatyGrip

New User

here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit

now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
I'll stick to one hand lol
How long have you played? My initial impression is this is pretty damn good for someone who hasn't nailed down stance and weight transfer yet. I like your balance and weight transfer off your back leg (right) FHs more then a lot of your BHs. You have too many bhs falling back or jumping straight up. It's a ball machine, so basically you are hitting a neutral rally ball that you aren't forced to adjust on. Your 1hbh should happen from a closed stance with your weight all on front (right) foot. No falling back. Go watch Wawrinka bh slow motion video. You can already nail a bh ... I bet it gets even bigger and more consistent getting more up on that right leg.

You don't seem to have much gravity ... can I give you some of mine? :D
 

mad dog1

G.O.A.T.
Against a ball machine, you should be spending more time hitting balls vs more time practicing your jumps. :)

Solid jumping. If you are a beginner, the forehand actually doesn’t look too awful. Backhand is pretty much all arm though.
 
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NuBas

Legend
I see tons of potential and lots of pop off the racquet, not sure from racquet or from leverage of your long arms. Don't concern yourself with silly stuff like WTA vs ATP, just do what works.

Just keep practicing and watching the pros hitting and you gotta get those balls out of the way, you got hops but its an injury waiting to happen then you won't play tennis no more.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
First BH you hit was from weight transfered at a front foot, good stance, this is how you should hit it, though you were bit off balance by non perfect positioning relative to incoming ball trajectory. But it was good. Next two you jumped through the hit, it's not how you should hit BHs as a foundation. If ball at contact is high lift only racquet's head, you don't need to lift the whole racquet.

As for FH, why not learning strokes with more topspin (more closed racquet's face at contact, steeper swing path)? It will pay off quickly in terms of consistency...
 
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FiReFTW

Legend
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.

From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.

Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.



As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.



Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.



Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.

Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.

Some additional tips:

1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.

2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball

3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
 

SweatyGrip

New User
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.

From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.

Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.



As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.



Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.



Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.

Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.

Some additional tips:

1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.

2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball

3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
I lift up very heavy things at Youfit 4 times a week lol

Thanks for the response, love that you took the time to make such a detailed one!
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.

From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.

Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.



As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.



Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.



Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.

Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.

Some additional tips:

1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.

2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball

3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
Good job on going through the coiling/uncoiling. I thought about it but it seemed the "jumping" and "falling back" thing "jumped out". :D That and using the balls as a cone footwork drill. We need Sweaty to live to make another video... I think he can be really good.

I liked his balance and weight transfer on his FHs when he hit off the back leg than many of his BHs. Weight transfer might not be the best term, because I'm not just referring to just transferring onto a front leg (bh). With many of his FHs off back foot, he loads on back leg/foot and passes that into the shot without the loss from falling back you see on too many BHs. So some elements are better about his bh (coil) ... but some are better with his FH. Regardless ... given what he is already doing ... seems like coiling better and removing the balls could payoff quickly.

@SweatyGrip ... I'm in ... I want to subscribe to the video series. :cool:
 

SweatyGrip

New User
Good job on going through the coiling/uncoiling. I thought about it but it seemed the "jumping" and "falling back" thing "jumped out". :D That and using the balls as a cone footwork drill. We need Sweaty to live to make another video... I think he can be really good.

I liked his balance and weight transfer on his FHs when he hit off the back leg than many of his BHs. Weight transfer might not be the best term, because I'm not just referring to just transferring onto a front leg (bh). With many of his FHs off back foot, he loads on back leg/foot and passes that into the shot without the loss from falling back you see on too many BHs. So some elements are better about his bh (coil) ... but some are better with his FH. Regardless ... given what he is already doing ... seems like coiling better and removing the balls could payoff quickly.

@SweatyGrip ... I'm in ... I want to subscribe to the video series. :cool:
Yay another sub

Again thanks for all the tips everyone!
 

Chas Tennis

G.O.A.T.
For your racket drop you do not rotate the racket down distinctly as high level backhands do. Look at the angle of the racket as you lower it. Look at how the top backhands rotate the hitting arm down with the off arm on the racket's throat causing internal shoulder rotation (ISR) that rotates the whole arm. [ISR = the upper arm bone (humerus) rotates around its long axis (line between shoulder and elbow).] This causes ISR and stretches muscles that can be used later for external shoulder rotation (ESR) around impact. This can add top spin to the racket forward motion.

geca has some posts in the same thread on lowering the racket, ISR & ESR etc.. Click arrow on Quote to go to the post & thread and search geca.

Compare the racket drop of Gasquet, Wawrinka and Justine Henin to yours.

Regarding the racket drop motion before the start of the forward swing on the backhand drive - It looks as if the racket, hand and arm are mainly being rotated down by the back arm -

See racket high point in take back and drop before the forward swing. Backhand starts around second 56, racket drop 1:07.

Gasquet, see similar racket drop on several drives.
To examine single frame 1) click "Vimeo", 2) Hold down SHIFT KEY & use ARROW KEYS.

Lopez, see similar racket drop. Starts at second 7. But Lopez's stroke is different on the forward motion. See post #98.

I don't know the function of the racket drop motion of the one hand backhand drive. Is it to position the racket for the incoming ball height? Or, to rotate hand to cause internal shoulder rotation and/or pronation and prestretch ESR and supination muscles. Both functions? Other?

In a Tennis Chanel Academy show, Justine Henin demos this racket drop slowly. I would say that her slow demo does not portray the racket drop very accurately in comparison to the high speed video. Also, she demos ESR and/or supination after impact perhaps indicating pre-stretching was used. ?

What does the racket drop do?
Detailed comparison of forum poster Mojo's one hand backhand to Gasquet's.
This post from another thread shows a comparison and analysis of poster Mojo28's one hand backhand drive and Gasquet's from the start of the forward racket motion. Note the chest and upper arm of the high level backhand.

[ Note for new readers - It is necessary for this analysis to understand the defined joint motions of internal shoulder rotation (ISR) and external shoulder rotation (ESR). The upper arm between the shoulder joint and elbow does not go anywhere, it just spins like a top around the upper arm's center line.]

Pictures of each frame of Mojo's video. The time scales are in milliseconds with "0" milliseconds being impact. -267 milliseconds is about 1/4 second before impact.

I point out differences between better high level strokes and the poster's strokes. A poster can select a high level stroke and copy it or use some other stroke model. Or, go with instruction or on their own without a model or instruction.

Mojo's ball is lower than Gasquet's. Compare similar ball heights for better analysis.

Frame at -267 ms. It looks as if at 267 milliseconds before impact the OP has turned his shoulders back to about the same angle as Gasquet has. Compare also shoulder turn angles at impact, at Frame -0 ms. The positions of the arms and rackets are different. Gasquet's racket has not come down and is still in front of his body. Is Mojo copying some other backhand stroke? Mojo has also done pronation to bring the racket down. Impression is that Mojo is doing his own thing. ? (To see angles more accurately, the cameras for both backhands need to view the players and courts from the same angle. Wear tight fitting clothes or a short sleeve shirt to better see the upper arm, elbow angle, etc.)


Frame at -233 ms. Mojo has brought his racket farther down. Gasquet's racket has gone up slightly. Mojo's elbow looks bent more and his upper arm (between the shoulder and elbow) has more downward rotation (ISR). Compare ISR angle to ISR angle as these frames progress.


Frame at -200 ms. Mojo's racket is still lowering and low. Gasquet's is just starting to lower.


Frame at -167 ms. Mojo's upper arm is down from the shoulder joint. Gasquet's upper arm is more across the chest.


Frame at -133 ms. Mojo's racket still lowering. Gasquet's now lowering with more rapid drop.


Frame at -100 ms. Mojo's upper arm is down at the chest. Gasquet's upper arm is more across the chest. Gasquet now appears to have started more upper body turn. I believe that to produce this early arm and racket acceleration that Gasquet is pressing hard on his upper arm with his chest powered by the forces of turning his upper body. If a credit card were between his chest and upper arm, would it be pressed tightly? How much upper arm pressing Mojo is doing this is not clear (due to the obscuring shirt and arm angle). But his upper body does not appear to be turning as rapidly.


Frame at -67 ms. The racket head speed developed by any rotation depends on the location of the axis of rotation and the distance out from that rotation axis. Look at the arm and racket angle and the distance out from the location of the rotation axis (guessed for now). It looks as if Mojo's arm angle is not favorable for racket head speed. Also, Mojo's racket is already much more rotated toward the ball trajectory. Gasquet's racket is >180° back from the ball's trajectory. Gasquet's upper arm is pressed to his chest as discussed.


Frame at -33 ms. Look at the racket to ball trajectory angle for Mojo, 45°? Look at the racket to trajectory angle for Gasquet still >180°. The total turns of Mojo's and Gasquet's upper bodies from Frame -267 ms seem somewhat similar, similar average speeds. The upper arm and racket have been used differently. Another motion - now look at the elbow bones and estimate the angular position of internal shoulder rotation, or axial rotation of the upper arm in the shoulder joint. Compare ESR from -33 ms to -0 ms.


Frame at -0 ms closest to impact. The big differences from Frame -33 ms to Frame -0 ms are the angular movement of Gasquet's racket and the much larger movement of his hand in the forward direction in comparison to Mojo. Also, Mojo's racket is open and Gasquet's is closed at impact. Possibly the ball height was a factor in how closed the racket was.? Now look at Gasquet's elbow bones and compare them to Frame -33 ms. Gasquet has done rapid external shoulder rotation (ESR) from Frame -33 ms to Frame -0 ms. That has moved the racket up and added to the topspin that the upward hand path already would have produce without ESR. Because Gasquet brought down his racket earlier with a near straight arm, it caused rapid ISR and pre-stretched his ESR muscles, he is using those stretched muscles in this frame. (Search the Stretch Shorten Cycle).


Frame at +33ms after impact. Mojo's hand and racket go more forward. Gasquet's goes more forward and up. ESR has continued.


Frame at +67 ms. Comparison of the follow throughs.


Video.

Last edited: Mar 5, 2017"
Also, look carefully at the area between Gasquet's chest and upper arm bone - the subject of the thread. Is your chest pressing on your upper arm for the initial acceleration? See thread.
 
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mad dog1

G.O.A.T.

here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit

now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
Gentle feedback

Good things:

active feet
Very energetic
Didn’t get aced by any ball machine feed

Things to work on:

Lose the jumping (lots of wasted motion, movement and energy for no good reason)
Off balance a lot
Backhand and forehand technique both need lots of work
 

Liam Grennon

Professional
You will never be able to win points at a higher level than 3.5 tennis like that. You're hitting crazy far behind the baseline.... If I was playing vs you I would just hit a high topspin shot deep to your backhand and approach/ hit a drop shot.

Edit: Also, if you are standing that far behind the baseline you should have more than enough time to step in on the ball, your hitting from a weird open stance, and jumping back into an open stance, you have to step into the court especially when your that far back or your just going to be wasting energy pounding your shots with all arm....
 

mad dog1

G.O.A.T.
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.

From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.

Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.



As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.



Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.



Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.

Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.

Some additional tips:

1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.

2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball

3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
OP asked for GENTLE feedback. He didn’t ask for candid feedback. If he wants candid feedback, then yes, both forehand and backhand need a lot of work. :)
 

Wise one

Hall of Fame

here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit

now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
  • Forehand needs a lot of changes:
  1. Hitting the ball too late, too far back from baseline. Hit it on the rise!
  2. Swing too long, too far back, too fast. Needs to be far smoother, not so violent.
  3. F=MxA. (Force equals Mass times Acceleration.) Slow down your swing (a lot) and step into the ball. The mass of your body will give you more pace on the ball.
  4. Grip too extreme
  5. Weight on back foot instead of even balance; no transfer to front foot at impact
  6. Too much spin, not enough depth (lot of balls netted)
  7. You need to be able to hit slice forehand approach shots. I didn't see you even attempt one:

Chris suggests using eastern or Continental; I use a grip intermediate between Continental and eastern, called the Australian grip.
  • Backhand comments:
  1. Stop jumping into the air as you hit; keep feet on ground
  2. Excessive swing using too much arm
It helps to watch good players. Chris Evert has pretty close to flawless technique. Watch her weight transfer:


Notice how on both her forehand and backhand she takes the racquet up, not back!
 
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ChaelAZ

G.O.A.T.
Note sure if you wanted critiques or a rating, but stroke mechanics are in the 3.5 range, consistency of stroke in practice is probably higher 3.5 to maybe 4.0 because you get to balls. But what would really matter is if you can hit the same in a match with technique and consistency. If you can hit about the same behind a decent serve you could probably hit solid 3.5 or 4.0.
 
D

Deleted member 23235

Guest
Top things I'd probably work on, if i were you:
* shaping the ball with more topspin (especially on bh)... practice hitting balls below the net
* shorter backswing
* weight move forward on every shot + extend out to target - on a ball machine, your technique should be perfect (ie. you know where the ball is gonna be)
 
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Wise one

Hall of Fame
Top things I'd probably work on, if i were you:
* shaping the ball with more topspin (especially on bh)... practice hitting balls below the net
* weight move forward on every shot + extend out to target - on a ball machine, your technique should be perfect (ie. you know where the ball is gonna be)
Oh dear. The instructor should be put away for life for ruining this kid!
 

Nellie

Hall of Fame
Small things I would change sooner -

1) Simplify the take-back - take back the racquet on a level plane (don't loop the raccquest back up over your head) . I like preparing to the height of contact on a flat/topspin stroke and preparing above the height of contact on a slice. Also, don't twist or turn the racquet head when taking back the racquet. You are making your stroke long and slow and introducing a lot of places for error to occur. Also, you are occasionally swinging down at the ball.

2) prepare earlier and wait for the ball in a ready position (shoulders turned and racquet back halfway back). Then, when the ball is near, complete the back rotation and swing. Don't wait for the ball to bounce before you bring back the racquet or you will be rushed and late. this is really easy to work on with a ball machine.

3) don't jump! It ruins your timing and you will spray balls. Power comes from the hips/torso rotating from the ready position.
 

SweatyGrip

New User
Why are people so scared to post footage of themselves on Tennis Tips??? It's not that bad! It's not like your thread will turn south!
 

vex

Legend
Looks like you have good tennis in your future if you don't break an ankle on a ball. Clear all balls always. I have seen a serious injury from stepping on a ball.

I would consider lowering the feed rate ...

I saw those two 2hbhs :cool: ... not as easy is it looks is it?
12 seconds in I rate @SweatyGrip as most likely to suffer a career ending ankle injury.

On topic, your FH isn't imparting enough topspin to counter act how much plow thru you're putting on the ball. Also, your angle at contact discipline is too lose, you shouldn't be dumping FHs into the net against the ball machine.

Hit 10-20% less power, 50% more topspin. Focus on directional control. You don't need to hit as hard as you are to be effective, just need spin and accuracy.

Also, I'd switch to a 2HBH. You poor right arm is racing your ankle to see which can get destroyed first. Tennis elbow is coming if u keep this up.
 
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StringSnapper

Hall of Fame

here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit

now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
Good start. i agree, watch out for the balls on the floor. you can roll your ankle with them.

your FH suffers similarly to how mine did. you just have have more racquet face awareness at contact. sometimes you're hitting them straight into the floor. your racquet face is tilted too down, or you're not swinging up enough for such a tilt. do you use a western grip? maybe you should try a semi-western (you dont have to swing up as much). it should come with time anyway, tennis is a tough sport to learn. but anything worth doing is tough!!
 

AlxThm

Rookie
Your strokes are pretty good, just try to work a little more on the footwork, shorter steps and better anticipation so you can place yourself behind the ball and then transfer energy forward, you know, kind of step-in and not step-out like in the video. And in the one hander, try to lower your body more so you can start to swing more low to high more naturally, so you can add more top spin and "open" the strike zone on your backhand side, but again, pretty nice shots ;)
 

SweatyGrip

New User
Your strokes are pretty good, just try to work a little more on the footwork, shorter steps and better anticipation so you can place yourself behind the ball and then transfer energy forward, you know, kind of step-in and not step-out like in the video. And in the one hander, try to lower your body more so you can start to swing more low to high more naturally, so you can add more top spin and "open" the strike zone on your backhand side, but again, pretty nice shots ;)
Thanks! I'll try to upload some more footage during the week
 
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