rate this guy

very interesting forehand; unorthodox, but it certainly seems to work

I'm going to go ahead and say 5.0, maybe even 5.5
 
TonLars said:
uhhh no. 4.0-5.0, definitely a solid player, need to see results, certainly not higher than 5.0
Click to expand...

Agree. I would say 4.5 +-.5 as well. I would lean just under 4.5 given his age and that "forehand". He has a solid backhand (of a righty), but that forehand (of a righty) is a major handicap IMHO. I think many 4.5's would take him apart. I could be wrong, just the feeling I get. The guy he was playing against didn't look like he was trying to pressure him at all.
 
The forehand is pretty funky, but as well as being a liability stretched wide to his forehand, it saves a step running around the backhand and could be an advantage in that way. Not knowing his match record, I would say equivalent to a 5.0. There are a few top 4.5's who might be able to take him by being aggressive and picking on the weaknesses juniors these days usually have (not cooperating with topspin rallys and attacking wide to the forehand, especially). His consistency will enable him to beat some 5.0's - depends on the matchup. I really like that he will take a short ball and move into the net. He's obviously not a top prospect (Stanford, Georgia chasing him), but in another year probably will be able to play college tennis somewhere.
 
I watched it again and I agree that 5.5 was excessive, but I do think he is a 5 or a very strong 4.5.

Just my opinion. Might be the camera angle.
 
How can you people say definitely this and definitely that, then state at the end you need results. Shouldn't results come first before rating someone?
 
WBF said:
Agree. I would say 4.5 +-.5 as well. I would lean just under 4.5 given his age and that "forehand". He has a solid backhand (of a righty), but that forehand (of a righty) is a major handicap IMHO. I think many 4.5's would take him apart. I could be wrong, just the feeling I get. The guy he was playing against didn't look like he was trying to pressure him at all.
Click to expand...

I disagree with the "+- .5" part appended to the 4.5, as it would imply that he could be a 4.0. This guy's better than 4.0; I don't see anything that would indicate he'd lose to 4.0s. He would need to have some definite mental issues to lose to a 4.0, because based on strokes and footwork he's better than that.
 
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I like the forehand it seams to be a weapon for him!
I've never seen a 4.0 move or hit like that. Pretty neutral serve but that is common for many college players. I'm going to guess 5.0 or higher!
 
From what I saw a 4.5. But you cant tell with montages or clips.
1-He edited it so he not going to put in his blunders.
2- The guy hes playing is going to make him look good or he going to pick some one he knows he can push around.
 
I say around 4.5. His groundstrokes seem to be around 5.0 or higher, his serve around 4.0, movement seems to be 5.0. I don't have a guess for his volleys.
 
if he had a single handed forehand i would rate him 5.0 but his 2handed forahnd is a big major wickness especially if your in the mens gain. he seems to play basline offense. unless your santoro with a good forehand slice to back your game up 2handed foreahand is very hard to play with. I can tell right away he wont be able to get a slice to his forehand very well. His elbows are bent way too much when he hits his foreahnd his reach is very very limited
 
RoddickAce said:
I say around 4.5. His groundstrokes seem to be around 5.0 or higher, his serve around 4.0, movement seems to be 5.0. I don't have a guess for his volleys.
Click to expand...

Volleys need some working... a little sloppy. Agree with solid strokes with great movements... obviously fit. Serves can vary in rating, I dont see the serve itself can force errors other than from his friend. Good return, but its only because the serve wasnt also doesnt force errors... but still solid serves . Definately agree with 4.5ish to low 5.0.
 
TonLars said:
I did not say he is a 4.0....
These threads with rating players are getting rediculous lately
Rating=results
Click to expand...

4.0 ---

Come on.. Lets discuss.

1) His serve can be fixed very easy.
2) I actually like his two handed forehand. I guess because it is different.
3) His volleys are no 4.0 technically..
Lets forget results.. lets assume he is mentally strong.

Your turn.
 
I still say 5.0 plus and the forehand is a strength not a weakness!
I sometimes hit a 2 hander and it never ceases to amaze me how critical people are of it, even after I beat them with it! They are not critical of my 2 handed backhand though.
 
I'm guessing he is mentally strong and he has good form on the serve. He just didn't seam to be going for much. I've seen alot of good college players just spin it in and set up the point with their groundstrokes.

I agree his volleys looked much better than 4.0.
 
Mike Cottrill said:
4.0 ---

Come on.. Lets discuss.

1) His serve can be fixed very easy.
2) I actually like his two handed forehand. I guess because it is different.
3) His volleys are no 4.0 technically..
Lets forget results.. lets assume he is mentally strong.

Your turn.
Click to expand...

I gave a range, because without match results you have a vague idea of what his rating or ranking is. This is pretty long video so it is more helpful than others Ive seen here, if you insist on me doling out an exact guess then I say 4.5.
 
blue12 said:
I'm guessing he is mentally strong and he has good form on the serve. He just didn't seam to be going for much. I've seen alot of good college players just spin it in and set up the point with their groundstrokes.
Click to expand...
He got a small issue with the serve. Can be fixed and not take long for him to adjust to the change.
 
TonLars said:
I gave a range, because without match results you have a vague idea of what his rating or ranking is. This is pretty long video so it is more helpful than others Ive seen here, if you insist on me doling out an exact guess then I say 4.5.
Click to expand...

Actually, I was hoping you would point out issues that make his strokes 4.0 or 4.5..
 
There's nothing to point out!
Anybody got another video? This is fun!

I bet I could put some div 1 players on here and people would say they were 4.0 or 4.5's.
I guess it is possible to have great looking strokes and not play well like TonLars was eluding to.
 
Mike Cottrill said:
Actually, I was hoping you would point out issues that make his strokes 4.0 or 4.5..
Click to expand...

Im basing it off what he does to the ball and how he responds to the opponent in the match play of his video. We can critique his strokes alot but im looking at the result of the shots, not what the technique looks like
 
5.0
From what I saw, he did not miss an approach. good groundies, decent serve..
He has to work on his volleys a bit more since he likes to approach the net so much.
 
Good 4.5. Not a 5.0 yet, based on the essentials that he'll need to compete at higher levels:
1. weak backhand
2. poor forehand timing (it is way too close to his body at contact): if he comes up against a big hitter, that body positioning will cost him dearly
3. weak volleys, particularly the backhand. He does the typical 3.5 BH volley: hits it with his body facing almost away from the shot
4. not enough heat or location on serve

He's got a good forehand, and good court sense. He takes time away from his opponent, which is good, but then he fails to really finish the point sometimes. At college-level, you can't do that.

If this kid tries to play D1 tennis, he is going to get eaten alive. Maybe a weak D2 or D3 school but not D1.

If this is his typical practice partner, he is not doing himself any services, as he is much better than his hitting partner. That's not saying much, and that's not going to help him.
 
most people always say the 2 handed forehand is bad and this and that. WELL tell you what I dont think its anything wrong with the fh if the right people use it. It just limits ur reach thats all..But this guy is able to hit a 1 handed as well so its not really a disadvantage having a 2 handed fh. Also he is a quick guy.
 
There's nothing wrong with hitting two hands both sides, but if hitting with two hands on the forehand side, IMO you have to hold the grip as if it were a backhand on both sides (a lefty backhand and a righty backhand).

This guy's 'backhand' is awesome: great timing, fluent technically, and a nice early contact point. But all this seems to disappear on his 'forehand' wing. Because he keeps his hands on the grip as if he were hitting a right-handers backhand, when hitting the 'forehand' his hands are crossed over and his reach is restricted. He is already 'tied up' before making contact with the ball, and the simple fact of the matter is, a hard heavy ball is going to be trouble! In the video, he is able to cope on his forehand side because the guy is feeding him weak balls, but there's no doubt it's a different story if someones pounding groundstrokes to that side!

I don't really know NTRP ratings, but that forehand is definitely going to be exploited when playing at a high level. Having said that, the rest of his game is very solid, so it's possible he could prevent that shot from being attacked on a regular basis.
 
Seems like he just needs time to grow and get stronger. Looks like a solid player to me, but I'm no judge of ratings, so I'll defer to those more qualified.

Serve looks a touch funky; doesn't load the shoulder enough maybe.
 
Dwhit said:
There's nothing wrong with hitting two hands both sides, but if hitting with two hands on the forehand side, IMO you have to hold the grip as if it were a backhand on both sides (a lefty backhand and a righty backhand).

This guy's 'backhand' is awesome: great timing, fluent technically, and a nice early contact point. But all this seems to disappear on his 'forehand' wing. Because he keeps his hands on the grip as if he were hitting a right-handers backhand, when hitting the 'forehand' his hands are crossed over and his reach is restricted. He is already 'tied up' before making contact with the ball, and the simple fact of the matter is, a hard heavy ball is going to be trouble! In the video, he is able to cope on his forehand side because the guy is feeding him weak balls, but there's no doubt it's a different story if someones pounding groundstrokes to that side!

I don't really know NTRP ratings, but that forehand is definitely going to be exploited when playing at a high level. Having said that, the rest of his game is very solid, so it's possible he could prevent that shot from being attacked on a regular basis.
Click to expand...

not really. I used to have the 2 handed fh since i was 5 until a couple of months ago i made a change due to coach and ppl nagging me. But yeah my fh used to be my best shot and it was better than that guy's in a different style. And no you dont need to turn ur grip.. I mean I just hold my right hand on the bottom with an extreme-eastern grip with a lefty's conti grip for my left hand on the top..and it doesnt look crossover or feel crossed over to me nor did it look like the guy in the video's forehand.. But i have a 1 handed bh so i dont know if this is the same as a 2 handed bh. but ur probably right i guess.
 
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