Rivalries with contrasting styles to look forward to in the near future:

1. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Rafael Nadal (baseline-retrieving game)

2. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Rafael Nadal (baseline-retrieving game)

3. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Novak Djokovic (baseline-retrieving game)

4. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Novak Djokovic (baseline-retrieving game)

5. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Andy Murray (baseline-retrieving game)

6. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Andy Murray (baseline-retrieving game)

This is by no means an extensive list, but serves to illustrate what lies ahead.

With the opportunity presenting itself to develop new great rivalries with contrasting styles, tennis fans are in for, as well as due for, great, exciting, intense, phenomenal, thrilling, captivating, scintillating, swashbuckling tennis action in the years to come, just as in recent times and the bygone years.

How do you think these rivalries will play out? Only time will tell, but I suppose I know the answer to that already. ;-)
 
OMG. Why people do this. :mad:

Djokovic's style is not "baseline-retrieving game".

Djokovic style is aggressive attacking baseline game.

Also Coric is called "Baby Djokovic", just like Dimitrov is called "Baby Federer" because of similarities in style.

So how come Coric has "attacking all-court game" while Djokovic does not. :roll:

Unbelievable what kind of anti-Djokovic nonsense people try to pull here all the time. :mad:
 
OMG. Why people do this. :mad:

Djokovic's style is not "baseline-retrieving game".

Djokovic style is aggressive attacking baseline game.

Also Coric is called "Baby Djokovic", just like Dimitrov is called "Baby Federer" because of similarities in style.

So how come Coric has "attacking all-court game" while Djokovic does not. :roll:

Unbelievable what kind of anti-Djokovic nonsense people try to pull here all the time. :mad:

Because Coric is a natural talent at net and in transition game, whereas Djokovic isn't. And dat overhead!
 
1. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Rafael Nadal (baseline-retrieving game)

2. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Rafael Nadal (baseline-retrieving game)

3. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Novak Djokovic (baseline-retrieving game)

4. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Novak Djokovic (baseline-retrieving game)

5. Nick Kyrgios (all-court attacking game) vs. Andy Murray (baseline-retrieving game)

6. Borna Coric (all-court attacking game) vs. Andy Murray (baseline-retrieving game)

This is by no means an extensive list, but serves to illustrate what lies ahead.

With the opportunity presenting itself to develop new great rivalries with contrasting styles, tennis fans are in for, as well as due for, great, exciting, intense, phenomenal, thrilling, captivating, scintillating, swashbuckling tennis action in the years to come, just as in recent times and the bygone years.

How do you think these rivalries will play out? Only time will tell, but I suppose I know the answer to that already. ;-)

Other inaccuracies aside, how in the hell could you describe these as rivalries?
 
Nick Kyrgios is an all-courter? :lol:

I don't see much of a "rivalry" since the "baseline retrievers" you mentioned will have severely declined by the time the "all-courters" establish themselves. LOL at the completely wrong use of terminology.
 
I think Kyrgios certainly got the talent to be a top player, not only is he a big hitter I also think he has a great strategic court feel.

However it remains to be seen if he develops into a professional or becomes another "Lleyton Hewitt" type.

Here is my appreciation video of him when he beat Nadal at Wimbledon 2014:



Nadal played good but Kyrgios was simply better.

:grin:
 
Nick Kyrgios is an all-courter? :lol:

I don't see much of a "rivalry" since the "baseline retrievers" you mentioned will have severely declined by the time the "all-courters" establish themselves. LOL at the completely wrong use of terminology.

Sure, Kyrgios is an all-court no-knee-bend-poor-footwork-ballbasher. The perfect recipe to beat Nadal's high bounce! :lol:
 
HE IS more talented. Check their rankings at 17yo.

This is not a valid argument anyway since it is not measurement of how talented player is, but you fail on so many levels here:

Djokovic's first ranking after he turned 17 - May 24th 2004: 338

http://www.atpworldtour.com/tennis/players/top-players/novak-djokovic.aspx?t=rh&y=2004#

Coric's first ranking after he turned 17 - November 18th 2013: 367

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Co/B/Borna-Coric.aspx?t=rh&y=2013#

BTW check Fed's ranking at same age August 10th 1998: 679

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Roger-Federer.aspx?t=rh&y=1998#

So according to you Djokovic and Coric are much more talented than Federer. :roll:
 
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Federer ain't "baby Djokovic". He's the most complete player ever to touch a tennis racquet, with all the tools in his bag. It takes some time to settle in a winning strategy if you have too many tools. With a more straight forward baseline game, finding a winning strategy is easier.

As for Coric, his BH has as much potential as that of Djokovic 17yo. FH is weaker than young Djokovic, but net play and transitional game are much stronger with Coric.
 
Djokovic style is aggressive attacking baseline game.

CENTER]
 
For me Djokovic is what he needs to be. If he wants to slug it out he can, if he wants to attack he will. Djokovic is as flexible as his joints.

There is a truth to it. Djokovic can play excellent defense and because of it Djokovic often adjust his style to what he thinks gives him the best chance of beating the opponent. Against some opponents he would go into defensive, but that is all tactical and smart tennis, which some people confuse with playing defensive style.

His general style is aggressive attacking baseline game. That is clear to all unbiased tennis fans. Only blind fanboys of other players mark him as "defensive grinder or retriever".
 
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Djokovic and Murray are defensive baseliners with some offensive tools at their disposal. And Ivo Karlovic is a servebot.

Move on.
 
Djokovic and Murray are defensive baseliners with some offensive tools at their disposal. And Ivo Karlovic is a servebot.

Move on.

No.
Murray and Nadal are defensive baseliners with some offensive tools at their disposal.
Djokovic is offensive baseliner with some defensive tools at his disposal.

And yes Karlovic is a servebot indeed.
 
^
4 stages, from the baseline to the net:

0. Karlovic is a servebot.

1. Murray, Nadal and Djokovic are all defensive baseliners. They pretty much personify the grinding style of 00s. Each has a monster stamina, low UE count, good serve return. Yes, they all do hit winners at times, but only because they are top 4 after all, not entirely one-dimensional. Djokovic is perhaps more offensive than Ferrer, but he is still a defensive player (as he admitted after his AO 2013 win against Wawrinka). Monfils and Simon are also in this group.

2. Offensive baseliners are guys like Berdych, Del Potro, Soderling. They are tall and strong - they need to hit winners from far away. They prefer to keep the points short, as they do not move very well. Isner and Raonic are in this group too, despite their huge serves - they actually do rally and have decent forehands.

3. Dimitrov, Dolgopolov, Federer are all-court players - some gravitate to the baseline more (Wawrinka), some rush the net more (Federer). This group has good slices, volleys, overheads, dropshots - they need to mix their shots up to compensate for the lack of stamina or power.

4. Llodra and Stakhovsky are S&V players. Federer was a S&V player before 2002.
 
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^
4 stages, from the baseline to the net:

0. Karlovic is a servebot.

1. Murray, Nadal and Djokovic are all defensive baseliners. They pretty much personify the grinding style of 00s. Each has a monster stamina, low UE count, good serve return. Yes, they all do hit winners at times, but only because they are top 4 after all, not entirely one-dimensional. Djokovic is perhaps more offensive than Ferrer, but he is still a defensive player (as he admitted after his AO 2013 win against Wawrinka). Monfils and Simon are also in this group.

2. Offensive baseliners are guys like Berdych, Del Potro, Soderling. They are tall and strong - they need to hit winners from far away. They prefer to keep the points short, as they do not move very well. Isner and Raonic are in this group too, despite their huge serves - they actually do rally and have decent forehands.

3. Dimitrov, Dolgopolov, Federer are all-court players - some gravitate to the baseline more (Wawrinka), some rush the net more (Federer). This group has good slices, volleys, overheads, dropshots - they need to mix their shots up to compensate for the lack of stamina or power.

4. Llodra and Stakhovsky are S&V players. Federer was a S&V player before 2002.
^ pretty much this!

:grin:
 
Sorry but you are wrong about Djokovic. He is offensive baseliner. Everyone who still insists Djokovic is the same as Nadal and Murray and is defensive baseliner and grinder is simply doing that to put down and bash Djokovic. Both Fedal fanboys do that all the time to undermine and make Djokovic lesser player than he is. That is what is going on in this thread as well.
I explained in detail Djokovic's playing style above. Anything else is hate.
 
"Why can't we all get along"?

That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything you say.

Djokovic is a defensive baseliner. There is nothing wrong with that in this era (it is indeed a winning strategy if you are good enough), but that is what he is.

He and Nadal are allergic to the net unless forced to go there (when Nadal can actually shine IMO).

Do you watch any of your guy's matches?

Offensive baselining is what Federer was doing 2-3 years ago.
Federer is now an all-courter/S&V player, and it is working wonders.

Djoko earns his living on the baseline.
 
Djokovic is offensive baseliner. There is no way to deny it. The only people who persistently claim he is defensive "wall" or "grinder" are fedal fanboys here in order to undermine Djokovic and make him lesser player than he is. Let me repeat slowly again to you:

There is a truth to it. Djokovic can play excellent defense and because of it Djokovic often adjust his style to what he thinks gives him the best chance of beating the opponent. Against some opponents he would go into defensive, but that is all tactical and smart tennis, which some people confuse with playing defensive style.

His general style is aggressive attacking baseline game. That is clear to all unbiased tennis fans. Only blind fanboys of other players mark him as "defensive grinder or retriever".
 
That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything you say.

Djokovic is a defensive baseliner. There is nothing wrong with that in this era (it is indeed a winning strategy if you are good enough), but that is what he is.

He and Nadal are allergic to the net unless forced to go there (when Nadal can actually shine IMO).

Do you watch any of your guy's matches?

Offensive baselining is what Federer was doing 2-3 years ago.
Federer is now an all-courter/S&V player, and it is working wonders.

Djoko earns his living on the baseline.

Mmm, sounds to me like you really resent the fact that Djokovic has been the best player in the world these last few years whilst "living on the baseline" while at the same time Federer is out there demonstrating his "all-court game". Roger doesn't, nor should he, receive any bonus points for this and if Novak doesn't need to come to the net because his baseline game is so awesome then why should he? It's obviously highly effective for him so if it ain't broke, why try fixing it?
 
Mmm, sounds to me like you really resent the fact that Djokovic has been the best player in the world these last few years whilst "living on the baseline" while at the same time Federer is out there demonstrating his "all-court game". Roger doesn't, nor should he, receive any bonus points for this and if Novak doesn't need to come to the net because his baseline game is so awesome then why should he? It's obviously highly effective for him so if it ain't broke, why try fixing it?

I said in my post that it is fine for him to do that. I don't personally like it, but it is a legitimate strategy and I most certainly do not resent Djokovic for being a baseliner, or in general. I am happy that Djokovic has stopped Nadal from breaking Fed's records, actually. :twisted:
 
I said in my post that it is fine for him to do that. I don't personally like it, but it is a legitimate strategy and I most certainly do not resent Djokovic for being a baseliner, or in general. I am happy that Djokovic has stopped Nadal from breaking Fed's records, actually. :twisted:

All evidence to the contrary. :wink:
 
I have a fancy theory on why Djokovic's fans are so defensive about Djokovic's defensive game, and so insecure when someone brings up Djokovic's insecurity.

It is an Eastern European thing. "Offensive" does not just sound better/bolder, it implies active/masculine while "defensive" implies passive/feminine. Calling Djokovic "defensive" - according to his fans - is a subtle way to demean him and his legacy by finding him less of a macho.

Djokovic, according to his fans, has no weaknesses and no fear, so why does he need to "defend" when he can "offend" his opponent - tactically, athletically, rectally - you name it?
 
I have a fancy theory on why Djokovic's fans are so defensive about Djokovic's defensive game, and so insecure when someone brings up Djokovic's insecurity.

It is an Eastern European thing. "Offensive" does not just sound better/bolder, it implies active/masculine while "defensive" implies passive/feminine. Calling Djokovic "defensive" - according to his fans - is a subtle way to demean him and his legacy by finding him less of a macho.

Djokovic, according to his fans, has no weaknesses and no fear, so why does he need to "defend" when he can "offend" his opponent - tactically, athletically, rectally - you name it?

LOL. Bunch of BS.

Djokovic game is offensive. He is a shotmker, aggressive winner seeking baseliner. Just a simple truth.
Fedal fans like to undermine him and make him not skilled as their idols hence "grinder", "retriever", "wall", "all about stamina", "no offensive weapons", blah blah blah, ...
Novak's fans just don't let that incorrect misdemeanor stand without exposing it and telling the truth.
 
Djokovic is patient during rallies and trusts himself to go as long as it takes, but I wouldn't class him as a defensive baseliner.
That said Chico... he IS a wall a lot of the time, and there's nothing wrong with that statement, lighten up. He's more of a wall than a "shotmaker".
 
I have a fancy theory on why Djokovic's fans are so defensive about Djokovic's defensive game, and so insecure when someone brings up Djokovic's insecurity.

It is an Eastern European thing. "Offensive" does not just sound better/bolder, it implies active/masculine while "defensive" implies passive/feminine. Calling Djokovic "defensive" - according to his fans - is a subtle way to demean him and his legacy by finding him less of a macho.

Djokovic, according to his fans, has no weaknesses and no fear, so why does he need to "defend" when he can "offend" his opponent - tactically, athletically, rectally - you name it?

What about his non Eastern European fans who don't believe he's a defensive player?
 
^ they need to open their ears: http://youtu.be/jgxrD1iT9lY?t=44s

...and eyes:

Q. You're one of the fittest players on tour. Some of your serving stats have been getting better. Do you feel you're running less on the court than maybe in years past?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: I don't know. You tell me. You know the stats better (smiling). I haven't really...

Q. How does it feel?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: ...Obviously I had to run. I had to run a lot... Really depends. Of course I do want to use the first shot more efficiently. I want to be more aggressive the first shot after serve and after return. I want to try to get into the court and dominate the rally, dominate the play. That's the goal, you know. It's something I have been working on. Obviously I know that I have a good defense game and I can, you know, get the balls, an extra ball back and make the opponent play extra shot. But, you know, why spend so much energy if I can actually execute my shots in first two, three shots of the point better.
 
Djokovic game is offensive. He is a shotmker, aggressive winner seeking baseliner. Just a simple truth.

DtbbuCO

Djokovic, when he plays against Federer (and other offensive players, such as del Potro, Wawrinka), does nothing except block balls back.

Only Safin, at the peak of his game, beat prime Federer with shotmaking, but he had to stave off match points—Federer squandered his one match point with a tweener—enroute to his victory.

Robbie Koenig: "Federer–Djokovic matches are always great, because you have one of the greatest defenders of all time (Djokovic) playing against one of the greatest all-court attacking players of all time (Federer)."
 
DtbbuCO

Djokovic, when he plays against Federer (and other offensive players, such as del Potro, Wawrinka), does nothing except block balls back.

Only Safin, at the peak of his game, beat prime Federer with shotmaking, but he had to stave off match points—Federer squandered his one match point with a tweener—enroute to his victory.

Robbie Koenig: "Federer–Djokovic matches are always great, because you have one of the greatest defenders of all time (Djokovic) playing against one of the greatest all-court attacking players of all time (Federer)."

Not sure why I feed the troll, but this is so wrong.

Did you ever watch Djokoivc - Federer matches? Obviously not. Djokovic always play offensive tennis vs Federer. Did you watch W final 2014, for example? If you take out aces, Djokovic had more winners than Federer - i.e. played more offensively.

Djokovic 68-13 = 55
Federer 75-29 = 46

http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/stats/day21/1701ms.html

Many their matches have the similar statistics.

Djokovic is a good defender, but that does not mean he plays defensive tennis.
 
There is a truth to it. Djokovic can play excellent defense and because of it Djokovic often adjust his style to what he thinks gives him the best chance of beating the opponent. Against some opponents he would go into defensive, but that is all tactical and smart tennis, which some people confuse with playing defensive style.

His general style is aggressive attacking baseline game. That is clear to all unbiased tennis fans. Only blind fanboys of other players mark him as "defensive grinder or retriever".
Chico, you're not the only one on this forum watching Djokovic play and you don't have special insight into his style that the rest of us can't observe. I think the problem and the confusion in this discussion stems from him being both - both offensive and defensive and probably having the best balance between the two. What's his bread and butter? That's the issue. And on that, I agree with MN below:

Djokovic is patient during rallies and trusts himself to go as long as it takes, but I wouldn't class him as a defensive baseliner.
That said Chico... he IS a wall a lot of the time, and there's nothing wrong with that statement, lighten up. He's more of a wall than a "shotmaker".
Imo, Djoko's defense is the no. 1 thing that got him to world no. 1 - just as it is with Rafa. Both are able to take control of a rally and hit ridiculous winners, but what separates them from the rest is primarily their insane defense imo. But both of them have become more offensive and are trying to be more offensive (see also the quote from Netspirit and Djoko coming to the net more).

As to Djokovic, he's obviously quite a bit more offensive than Rafa, which is shown in his court-position (closer to or even on the baseline), his net-play (goes there more often) and his willingness to go for winners and point-enders earlier than Rafa as well as generally playing closer to the lines.

^ they need to open their ears: http://youtu.be/jgxrD1iT9lY?t=44s

...and eyes:
Good points, but see more below.

DtbbuCO

Djokovic, when he plays against Federer (and other offensive players, such as del Potro, Wawrinka), does nothing except block balls back.

Only Safin, at the peak of his game, beat prime Federer with shotmaking, but he had to stave off match points—Federer squandered his one match point with a tweener—enroute to his victory.

Robbie Koenig: "Federer–Djokovic matches are always great, because you have one of the greatest defenders of all time (Djokovic) playing against one of the greatest all-court attacking players of all time (Federer)."
Great quote.
But again, against a lot of players, Djoko will be the offensive player, so I can understand why Chico doesn't want him grouped with Murray and Rafa cause he is more offensive than both. But when he's up against a shot-maker, he's doing the majority of the defending and making them hit those extra shots (while also being offensive, when he gets the chance). It may exist, but I cannot recall a Fed-Djoko match, where Fed wasn't the one doing most of the attacking.

Djoko after their WTF-final in 2012:
Q. Among the more than 80 games you played this year, where would you rate the level of this one?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: I was playing really great tennis throughout the whole week. The first match, you know, still feeling a little bit rusty on the court. But I won against Andy. That was a big confidence booster for me. You know, every match after that I felt like I played really very close to the top of my game.
And tonight, you know, whenever I needed to, to come up with some really good shots, really focus myself and get every ball back in the court, I've done that. So I cannot be more thrilled than I'm feeling now.

Q. Can you describe the feeling of finishing the most incredible year with the most incredible shot.
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Yes. It's best way to finish the match, I guess, with a passing shot ‑ one of my favorite shots. I wasn't intending to get him on the net. I tried to stay in the rally and get more aggressive in that rally. But, you know, he came in. That was the only space left for me to make a passing shot, and I made it.
Q. You won without losing a match. Do you think you made Roger anxious, to try to hit so much, too much, because he made so many mistakes with the forehand? Do you think it was your patience?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: The level was very high. I thought that we both played really well. The momentum was changing, coming to his side and my side throughout the match.
I knew that the only way for me to really win the match is to be consistently focused and committed to every point. You know, he's somebody that is very aggressive, that likes to finish his points very quickly. Especially when he's a break up, he's probably the best player I've played ever against. He comes up always with his A game when he's up. It's very difficult to handle that.
But, you know, I managed to get a lot of his shots back into the court, being passive, a couple meters behind the baseline, coming into an aggressive position. That was one of the goals tonight, to always try to get him into the longer rallies where I think I had the better chance.
http://www.atpworldtour.com/batpwtf/News/Tennis/2012/Interviews/London-Final-Djokovic.aspx

Edit: Chico, as to their Wimbledon and other stats, one of the reasons why Djoko is leading in winners off the ground is that he's better at getting a racquet on any ball, so Fed's winner turns into an unforced error. Another is that Fed comes to the net so much, so Djoko is forced to come up with passing shots winners, but wouldn't you say Fed's the one doing the attacking then? I do think Djoko plays pretty aggressive vs. Fed, which is one of the reasons why I love their matches - I think both of them make each other better and brings out the best in each other when they play
 
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Not sure why I feed the troll, but this is so wrong.

Did you ever watch Djokoivc - Federer matches? Obviously not. Djokovic always play offensive tennis vs Federer. Did you watch W final 2014, for example? If you take out aces, Djokovic had more winners than Federer - i.e. played more offensively.

Djokovic 68-13 = 55
Federer 75-29 = 46

http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/stats/day21/1701ms.html

Many their matches have the similar statistics.

Djokovic is a good defender, but that does not mean he plays defensive tennis.

4rwcNqN.gif
 
Great quote.
But again, against a lot of players, Djoko will be the offensive player, so I can understand why Chico doesn't want him grouped with Murray and Rafa cause he is more offensive than both. But when he's up against a shot-maker, he's doing the majority of the defending and making them hit those extra shots (while also being offensive, when he gets the chance). It may exist, but I cannot recall a Fed-Djoko match, where Fed wasn't the one doing most of the attacking

I more or less agree with you, because I can see what you are getting at.

But shotmaking isn't Djokovic's forte—has never been. Djokovic simply doesn't have the tools to outplay Federer, the greatest all-court attacking player of all time.

At the end of the day, Djokovic is another baseline retriever, with insane defensive skills; and a baseline retriever has never outplayed Federer. All he has ever done is outlast Federer physically.
 
I think Kyrgios certainly got the talent to be a top player, not only is he a big hitter I also think he has a great strategic court feel.

However it remains to be seen if he develops into a professional or becomes another "Lleyton Hewitt" type.

Here is my appreciation video of him when he beat Nadal at Wimbledon 2014:



Nadal played good but Kyrgios was simply better.

:grin:
Not happening. At the same age Nick is, Hewitt was ranked 6 or 7. Nick has a long way to go to get to that level yet.
 
I more or less agree with you, because I can see what you are getting at.

But shotmaking isn't Djokovic's forte—has never been. Djokovic simply doesn't have the tools to outplay Federer, the greatest all-court attacking player of all time.

At the end of the day, Djokovic is another baseline retriever, with insane defensive skills; and a baseline retriever has never outplayed Federer. All he has ever done is outlast Federer physically.

As said. Fedal fanboys trying hard to make Djokovic lesser player than he is. That is all there is behind shallow ignorant posts and threads like this one.

It is clear to anyone impartial that Djokvic is not "defensive retriever" and that he outplayed Federer many times. The last one being in W 2014 and numbers posted above by me clearly prove.
This poster can't deal with iit and need to post MJ pictures and spew nonsense like this.
 
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