rogers new frame update,

If Wilson has this(profit) in mind, they should release the exact same model Roger uses because there will be huge demand for this racquet, I can assure you. They don't even have to do any more marketing/advertising because it has already been done during the past half year. Once it is released, it will sell out in a few weeks. It will be hard for Wilson to meet the demands, in fact.
"In fact"

Most people have thought they were getting the racquet Federer has used from the beginning. The average consumer thinks they're getting the same racquet that they're told that player plays with. It doesn't matter if it's the actual racquet or not. The average consumer has no idea they're getting a paint job of pro players' racquets.

So no, Wilson knows what they're doing.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
"In fact"

Most people have thought they were getting the racquet Federer has used from the beginning. The average consumer thinks they're getting the same racquet that they're told that player plays with. It doesn't matter if it's the actual racquet or not. The average consumer has no idea they're getting a paint job of pro players' racquets.

So no, Wilson knows what they're doing.
agree with you 100%.
Personally though, I'd appreciate it if at least the frame/hairpin was the same as what the pros actually use. Don't mean weight, balance, etc., just the frame size, beam width, flex and string pattern/density. I know that will never be the case, but it'd be nice
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
"In fact"

Most people have thought they were getting the racquet Federer has used from the beginning. The average consumer thinks they're getting the same racquet that they're told that player plays with. It doesn't matter if it's the actual racquet or not. The average consumer has no idea they're getting a paint job of pro players' racquets.

So no, Wilson knows what they're doing.
I agree, but think about tens of thousand serious rec/competition players who know which racquet Federer actually uses. Add that number on top of the casual fans, the racquet sale will go off the chart.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
I agree, but think about tens of thousand serious rec/competition players who know which racquet Federer actually uses. Add that number on top of the casual fans, the racquet sale will go off the chart.
Even the serious players who know the retail version is not exactly the same as the one Federer actually uses will still buy it if they like it. Look at how many of the previous versions of the Tour 90 these people bought despite knowing the truth.

The bottom line is that it's about the racquet itself, not who uses it or doesn't use it.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
What I can assure you guys is that the new Fed racquet will be a popular piece of memorabilia for tennis fans in general. Just wait and see.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
I agree, but think about tens of thousand serious rec/competition players who know which racquet Federer actually uses. Add that number on top of the casual fans, the racquet sale will go off the chart.
Federer played the same tour 90... He said so himself. The only difference is that his was made from high Quality basalt (and underwent stern quality control) and that he used his own custom handle made by P1, as well as extra 3-5 g of lead at 12.
Essentially, Federer played a higher Quality Tour 90 that was customized. The frame was the same in every other regard.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
Federer played the same tour 90... He said so himself. The only difference is that his was made from high Quality basalt (and underwent stern quality control) and that he used his own custom handle made by P1, as well as extra 3-5 g of lead at 12.
Essentially, Federer played a higher Quality Tour 90 that was customized. The frame was the same in every other regard.
I have no inside information so I can only say one thing for sure. The only real Federer frame available to public in the last 10 years was K-factor, it is believed, and Nate from P1 confirmed that from one of the videos. Tennis enthusiasts know that and K-factor Tour 90 is still quite popular. I know 90 series have been popular among Federer fans, but I am sure the new frame will be popular across the tennis population, even some of the fans who do not actually play tennis may buy one. That blacked out prototype has been a real success as far as publicity is concerned.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
I have no inside information so I can only say one thing for sure. The only real Federer frame available to public in the last 10 years was K-factor, it is believed, and Nate from P1 confirmed that from one of the videos. Tennis enthusiasts know that and K-factor Tour 90 is still quite popular. I know 90 series have been popular among Federer fans, but I am sure the new frame will be popular across the tennis population, even some of the fans who do not actually play tennis may buy one. That blacked out prototype has been a real success as far as publicity is concerned.
… As I said, the frame (hairpin) Federer used was the same as the Regular Tour 90. Federer only let the racquet be customized to his personal preference. He said this in an interview last year. As far as the Prototype goes, it hits the sweetspot for a LOT of ambitious players. It is pretty much the ideal kind of Tour racquet for the modern game. It will probably receive similar praise to the Yonex Tour G, but it will benefit from Roger's publicity as well.
Unfortunately, it's a Wilson, meaning terrible quality control. I'll be spending hours matching racquets again, as I did with my Pro Staffs 95 :cry:
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Unfortunately, it's a Wilson, meaning terrible quality control. I'll be spending hours matching racquets again, as I did with my Pro Staffs 95 :cry:
For those that don't know - ask TW for the lightest you can get and then work up to your desired specs. Or have a service do this for you.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
I think that he may make some more changes in the next month but will decide by then. They could, of course, determine the paint now and just apply it to current and future prototypes but in general, stuff is painted black until it's ready to be released to retail. In some (many?) cases, a frame that is painted is painted over black so that nobody sees what it is going to be.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
here some news for y'all:
Roger Federer at an interview in Miami concerning his racquet “It could be a finished product, but I'm still going to just test a couple of things in the next few weeks, so I should know probably in a month. I definitely will know if this is going to be it or not.”
According to this, the earliest wilson will have an okay from Federer for the racquet is in a month (and looking at his latest performances that is highly likely).
Given his result in Miami, I guess there's still the possibility that he'll switch back to his Tour 90? :shock:
BP… The longer I am on this forum the more you start to irritate me… How about you read what Federer actually said concerning his own racquet? In about four weeks Federer will know whether it is just right for him or if it still needs some tweaking. You don't make such a statement if you're considering going back to your old racquet. Oh by the way, in every interview in which he has been asked about his racquet (pretty much every interview lately), he has expressed his satisfaction with the racquet.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
I just don't understand why this frame isn't box beam. I'm pretty shocked that he didn't just use the Pro Staff 95 mold.
The difference between a customized Pro Staff 95 and a Pro Staff 90 is minimal. Fed probably didn't find the change/improvements he was searching for in the 95. BTW, Wilson even made a PS 93 for him to test and he didn't like it, so I guess he wanted something more… Modern I guess.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
We're pretty much into the tennis year and I think that it would be too late to make any large adjustments. I think that he played fine in Miami - he just ran out of gas against Nishikori and the racquet isn't going to help there.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
Every heard of the "honeymoon period"?

How many people on this board have raved about switching to a new racquet and how great it is and how perfect it is for them only to switch back to their old racquet a few weeks/months later?

If I had a dime for every time this has happened to a tennis player, I'd be richer than Larry Ellison. :)
You are comparing an exceptional professional player, who has a clear understanding of what his game needs, with an amateur. Your argumentation is so flawed it's beyond a joke. Next you'll be telling me that you know what Roger needs better than he himself (or the guys at P1) does.

I am positively, absolutely, completely convinced that Roger would have more than 20 Slams if he had you as his advisor… (sarcasm off).
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
You are comparing an exceptional professional player, who has a clear understanding of what his game needs, with an amateur. Your argumentation is so flawed it's beyond a joke. Next you'll be telling me that you know what Roger needs better than he himself (or the guys at P1) does.

I am positively, absolutely, completely convinced that Roger would have more than 20 Slams if he had you as his advisor… (sarcasm off).
Did Agassi not go back to his old racquet after playing with his new Donnay for a while? Did Connors not go back to his T-2000 after playing with the PS 85 for a while? Did Davydenko not go back to his Prince after playing with his new Dunlop for a while? Did Blake not go back to his old Dunlop after playing with a new Prince for a while? Are they not professional players?

Pros very rarely ever switch racquets. But when they do, they are as likely to end up going back to their old racquet as amateur players are.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
Did Agassi not go back to his old racquet after playing with his new Donnay for a while? Did Connors not go back to his T-2000 after playing with the PS 85 for a while? Did Davydenko not go back to his Prince after playing with his new Dunlop for a while? Did Blake not go back to his old Dunlop after playing with a new Prince for a while? Are they not professional players?

Pros very rarely ever switch racquets. But when they do, they are as likely to end up going back to their old racquet as amateur players are.
much easier to find examples where pros stick with their switch… Also, Federer is playing incredible tennis right now, so there's no reason for him to go back to his old racquet (the results speak for themselves). Additionally, there is a large difference between going for a new racquet for more forgiveness and getting a new racquet for obscure reasons (most of the players you mentioned). Federer clearly feels more confident and comfortable with this racquet, so why would you think that he will go back to his 90 with which he was pushed around a LOT recently? :confused:
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
why does he still have the black paint job?' surely he is no longer testing frames.
It's not a complete finished work yet. Federer has said he may decide whether to make further changes or not within a few weeks. Looks like the decision will be made before Europe.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
What kind of little things could Federer and Wilson be testing?
most likely weight distribution (location of mass on the racquet/amount of mass on particular locations of the racquet) and maybe flex location (where does the frame flex how much).
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
If one could only tell the difference between statistical and anecdotal evidence...
Yes, because there are actually statisticians who record statistics on how many pros and amateurs switch back to their old racquets. :???:
 

jackcrawford

Professional
Did Connors not go back to his T-2000 after playing with the PS 85 for a while? .
And then switched to a modern Slazenger frame, and then a Prince Mono. Ljubičić won a Masters event with a Head Extreme after failing to do so with a Pure Drive. Graff went from Dunlop to Wilson, there are many others.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
And then switched to a modern Slazenger frame, and then a Prince Mono. Ljubičić won a Masters event with a Head Extreme after failing to do so with a Pure Drive. Graff went from Dunlop to Wilson, there are many others.
Connors switched because Wilson had stopped making the T-2000 10 years earlier so he couldn't get any more. He even desperately tried to buy some T-2000s from his fans.

Ljubicic's ranking dropped from #3 in the world to #75 after he switched from Babolat to Head and he was never again a Top 10 player.

Graf had no choice but to switch because Dunlop had stopped making the Max 200G in 1992. Wilson had to make her a racquet as similar to the Max 200G as they could granted that they couldn't do injection molding, but at least it was 85 sq. in.
 
There is a difference between changing for money (sponsorship), because of nescessity (discontinued racket) and for the game in collaboration with your racket manufacturer and P1. Federer has done so before.
 

LiquidWhip

Rookie
Unless I've been grossly misinformed, didn't some bloke called Federer make a rather successful switch from a 85sq in frame to a larger 90sq in frame ;)

Think things worked out pretty well for him the last time he made a major racket switch...
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Unless I've been grossly misinformed, didn't some bloke called Federer make a rather successful switch from a 85sq in frame to a larger 90sq in frame ;)

Think things worked out pretty well for him the last time he made a major racket switch...
And do we know for sure that Federer wouldn't have won just as many Slams (or more) had he NOT switched racquets?

Murray didn't win his first Slam until he was 25. Was that also because the racquet he was using was too small? Or did it have to do with many other factors that had nothing at all to do with his racquet?
 
So I just saw Game, Set and Mats, where Wilander interviewed Federer in Miami. "Unbelievably good" I think was the words Federer used about the change to a bigger racket, but perhaps someone else can confirm whether I remember correctly.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
So I just saw Game, Set and Mats, where Wilander interviewed Federer in Miami. "Unbelievably good" I think was the words Federer used about the change to a bigger racket, but perhaps someone else can confirm whether I remember correctly.
Well, what else is Federer going to say? That his new racquet sucks and that's why he's still using it? :confused:

And what would Wilson say?
 

JoelDali

G.O.A.T.
Dude from Rockville Centre painted his STV 95 black and fakes people out that he GOATed a copy of a RogiRacket.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Well that he's still using it is a good indication he meant it.
Yes, but also keep in mind that he gets paid $2 million a year for life to help Wilson sell tennis racquets.

And if he feels his 98 is "incredibly good" after only a couple of months, how did he feel about his Tour 90 that he used for 12 years? :shock:
 
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