Safin: Roger is the best ever, other players are boring and play robotic tennis

So what gives?

  • Prophet Safin speaking the truth giving Rafalitos & Nolefam a reality check

    Votes: 58 69.9%
  • Marat being a bit salty that the surfaces are homogenized now allowing easier wins, but he retired

    Votes: 8 9.6%
  • Marat getting carried away thinking only because he beat baby Nole, he can beat peak Nole

    Votes: 4 4.8%
  • This article is obviously fake and I'm an idiot for posting this

    Votes: 6 7.2%
  • I'm 5 years old and who the hell is Marat Safin?

    Votes: 7 8.4%

  • Total voters
    83

Enga

Professional
#2
He mentions that a lot of players use the same playstyle, but I kinda thought they copied his playstyle if anything. I believe he was one of the first of the new generation where you can just hit a winner from anywhere on the court at any time, thanks to advances in strings and racket technologies. He definitely leveraged that in his way to beating out the older generation. Though I would at least agree he's better at it than all the mentioned names.
 
#5
He mentions that a lot of players use the same playstyle, but I kinda thought they copied his playstyle if anything. I believe he was one of the first of the new generation where you can just hit a winner from anywhere on the court at any time, thanks to advances in strings and racket technologies. He definitely leveraged that in his way to beating out the older generation. Though I would at least agree he's better at it than all the mentioned names.
Marat was more versatile than generation Robotics. Had good hands at the net, nice all court game when he was on (by modern standards).

Unfortunately his head wasn't in the right place and as soon as he lost his temper he resorted to brainless down the middle ball bashing.
 
#8
He mentions that a lot of players use the same playstyle, but I kinda thought they copied his playstyle if anything. I believe he was one of the first of the new generation where you can just hit a winner from anywhere on the court at any time, thanks to advances in strings and racket technologies. He definitely leveraged that in his way to beating out the older generation. Though I would at least agree he's better at it than all the mentioned names.
Racket technologies ? He used a very old racquet with plenty of flex and a head the size of a tiny frypan. Safin had so much variety. He could hit winners from anywhere because he was ridiculously talented. Moved exceptionally well for such a tall guy. Wonderful hands at the net as well.
 

Enga

Professional
#15
Racket technologies ? He used a very old racquet with plenty of flex and a head the size of a tiny frypan. Safin had so much variety. He could hit winners from anywhere because he was ridiculously talented. Moved exceptionally well for such a tall guy. Wonderful hands at the net as well.
I dunno what kind of strings he used but it is my guess that he used polyester or other similar slick types of strings. He hit way too many winners from defensive positions for me to think otherwise. I couldn't find enough information about what kinda strings he used, but some people were saying at around 2005-2006 he was using Luxilon Big Banger strings, or the Babolat polyesters.

Theres a clear line between new tech and old tech. Old tech you don't hit winners from the back of the court, you wait for errors or for the right moment to pull the trigger. New tech, you do it any time, anywhere, and more often than not the ball will do what you want it to do.
 
#22
I dunno what kind of strings he used but it is my guess that he used polyester or other similar slick types of strings. He hit way too many winners from defensive positions for me to think otherwise. I couldn't find enough information about what kinda strings he used, but some people were saying at around 2005-2006 he was using Luxilon Big Banger strings, or the Babolat polyesters.

Theres a clear line between new tech and old tech. Old tech you don't hit winners from the back of the court, you wait for errors or for the right moment to pull the trigger. New tech, you do it any time, anywhere, and more often than not the ball will do what you want it to do.
Sampras, Becker and Philippoussis hit winners from anywhere as well. Small head racquets with natural gut strings. Talent.

Wait for errors ?? That’s exactly the way the game is played these days.
 

Tennis_Hands

Talk Tennis Guru
#24
Yeah. Berdych, Dimitrov, Raonic, Djokovic, Wawrinka... Can't spot the differences in their tennis whatsoever.

Marat, Marat... :X3:
He clearly made a distinction between Berdych, Raonic and Dimitrov as a group and Wawa and Djokovic as top players.

Obviously he thinks that their brand of tennis is very similar, but that is it.

:cool:
 

Enga

Professional
#26
Sampras, Becker and Philippoussis hit winners from anywhere as well. Small head racquets with natural gut strings. Talent.

Wait for errors ?? That’s exactly the way the game is played these days.
They did, but it was more balanced in their era I think. Sampras mostly did it on the forehand side while on the run after a long rally, pulling a sharp angle. I cant remember seeing him get pulled out wide and far behind the baseline, and hit a winner from there. Neither can I rememver an instance when Becker hit a winner from far behind. Meanwhile I remember seeing Marat Safin get pulled wide to the backhand side, and hit a sliding backhand passer down the line with pace and spin, from far behind the baseline. Thats the difference between modern and the previous generation. Modern, doesnt matter where or when. In the past, was more predictable. Thats why there was more serve and volley back then. Safin is among the new generation in my mind. Yeah he played the transition era and was a bit transitional himself, but he was doing the things everyone today is doing.
 

Enga

Professional
#32
It's Elo, not ELO.

Also, could this point towards dreaded Elo inflation?
Elo is not a very useful stat in tennis in general, due to people playing for title results rather than Elo results. But I did consider it could be Elo inflation. I also can't help but wonder what the effect of earlier retirement has, because if players retire with a nice big hoard of Elo points, they're gonna take those away from the Elo pool and make it tougher for the lower Elo count players to make up the difference. Compare that to the current generation, where players are playing until their mid thirties a lot of the time, that gives people more opportunity to get massive Elo gains, especially as players decline and give up those points they hoarded over the years.
 
#34
This is the reality true tennis specialists understand. 99.99% of tennis coaches and pros around the world think the same.
Occasionally threads and posts like these come along to remind me there really isn't much room for discussion around here apart from the lolz. But then again, the best lolz come from the ludicrous crap we have to read from the Fedhaters and fans of lesser players trying to claim their boy is GOAT.
 

Wander

Professional
#41
Matches won vs ELO > 2200

2004-09 Federer 53
2008-13 Nadal 66
2011-16 Djokovic 114
Also, could this point towards dreaded Elo inflation?
I checked the Elo ratings by year on that site and I must conclude that it is a bit of a problematic tally to compare because of the number of players with Elo ratings of 2200+ on given seasons.

2200+ Elo players at year end of a season:

(Lew II's selected Federer years)
2004: 4
Federer, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2005: 5
Federer, Nadal, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2006: 2
Federer, Nadal

2007: 3
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic

2008: 4
Nadal, Federer, Murray, Djokovic

2009: 7
Federer, Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Del Potro, Davydenko, Roddick



2010: 6
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray, Del Potro, Soderling



(Lew II's selected Djokovic years)

2011: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Soderling, Ferrer, Tsonga

2012: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2013: 8
Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Federer, Del Potro, Ferrer, Berdych, Wawrinka,

2014: 6
Djokovic, Nadal, Federer, Murray, Nishikori, Del Potro

2015: 9
Djokovic, Federer, Murray, Nadal, Wawrinka, Nishikori, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2016: 8
Djokovic, Murray, Federer, Nishikori, Nadal, Del Potro, Raonic, Wawrinka



It could be that it is easier to tally up wins against 2200+ Elo players when there are 6 to 8 of them around besides yourself instead of 1 to 6.
It's just not a very helpful statistic to compare because of the difference in the field depending on the period.

Unfortunately, as cliché as it is to say, each player can only beat whoever is on the other side of the net on the given day.
 

Lew II

Hall of Fame
#43
I checked the Elo ratings by year on that site and I must conclude that it is a bit of a problematic tally to compare because of the number of players with Elo ratings of 2200+ on given seasons.

2200+ Elo players at year end of a season:

(Lew II's selected Federer years)
2004: 4
Federer, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2005: 5
Federer, Nadal, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2006: 2
Federer, Nadal

2007: 3
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic

2008: 4
Nadal, Federer, Murray, Djokovic

2009: 7
Federer, Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Del Potro, Davydenko, Roddick



2010: 6
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray, Del Potro, Soderling



(Lew II's selected Djokovic years)

2011: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Soderling, Ferrer, Tsonga

2012: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2013: 8
Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Federer, Del Potro, Ferrer, Berdych, Wawrinka,

2014: 6
Djokovic, Nadal, Federer, Murray, Nishikori, Del Potro

2015: 9
Djokovic, Federer, Murray, Nadal, Wawrinka, Nishikori, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2016: 8
Djokovic, Murray, Federer, Nishikori, Nadal, Del Potro, Raonic, Wawrinka



It could be that it is easier to tally up wins against 2200+ Elo players when there are 6 to 8 of them around besides yourself instead of 1 to 6.
It's just not a very helpful statistic to compare because of the difference in the field depending on the period.

Unfortunately, as cliché as it is to say, each player can only beat whoever is on the other side of the net on the given day.
Of course more players had high elo rating in 2011-16, because the level was higher.
 

ABCD

Hall of Fame
#46
I checked the Elo ratings by year on that site and I must conclude that it is a bit of a problematic tally to compare because of the number of players with Elo ratings of 2200+ on given seasons.

2200+ Elo players at year end of a season:

(Lew II's selected Federer years)
2004: 4
Federer, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2005: 5
Federer, Nadal, Hewitt, Roddick, Agassi

2006: 2
Federer, Nadal

2007: 3
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic

2008: 4
Nadal, Federer, Murray, Djokovic

2009: 7
Federer, Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Del Potro, Davydenko, Roddick



2010: 6
Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray, Del Potro, Soderling



(Lew II's selected Djokovic years)

2011: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Soderling, Ferrer, Tsonga

2012: 7
Djokovic, Federer, Nadal, Murray, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2013: 8
Djokovic, Nadal, Murray, Federer, Del Potro, Ferrer, Berdych, Wawrinka,

2014: 6
Djokovic, Nadal, Federer, Murray, Nishikori, Del Potro

2015: 9
Djokovic, Federer, Murray, Nadal, Wawrinka, Nishikori, Ferrer, Del Potro, Berdych

2016: 8
Djokovic, Murray, Federer, Nishikori, Nadal, Del Potro, Raonic, Wawrinka



It could be that it is easier to tally up wins against 2200+ Elo players when there are 6 to 8 of them around besides yourself instead of 1 to 6.
It's just not a very helpful statistic to compare because of the difference in the field depending on the period.

Unfortunately, as cliché as it is to say, each player can only beat whoever is on the other side of the net on the given day.
This is an excellent stat. You have nicely demonstrated that the field was much stronger post-2010 than prior-2010.
 
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