King Andre
New User
i have noticed that marat puts loads of lead tape at 3, 9, and occasionally 12. What is his racket weight and balance? Also, what tension is the racket strung with?
safin's racket specs
- Thread starter King Andre
- Start date
King Andre
New User
hummer23 said:
Iight thx.
HP is so not a tennis town. So yeah, its boring.
so hows SB, Hummer23?
King Andre
New User
yo beast tells me that he's injured for three weeks. He wants us to replace him. so Im gonna move to SB during Christmas and we're gonna lead the team to States and a T of C win. Along the way, we will trash NB and EB so hard that their grandmammas will feel it.
btw marat safin is the man
btw marat safin is the man
.
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
Last time I measured one of his sticks (strung with overgrip) it was about 353g.
crosscourt
Professional
Michael -- does that mean that the frame as stock is lighter than the PC that is/was commercially available and then weighted up? If so what do you think that the racket weighs without lead?
many thanks
cc
many thanks
cc
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
Yes, his frames start out lighter than a retail Prestige. However, with the addition of lead tape, a custom molded handle, etc, it ends up close to stock spec (330g/315mm), only with a swingweight 15 units higher than the average retail Prestige. Add strings, overgrip, and pads, and your right around 353g.
arky-tennis
Semi-Pro
That's neat how you know that, how do you measure Safin's racquets.... That's cool...
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
Marat arrived before his stringer at the Nasdaq in 2004, and needed a few frames done. When they came in, I threw them on the diagnostic machines we had, as it was part of my job(s) as one of the onsite stringers. Owning one also helps.
jackson vile
G.O.A.T.
So his racket is only 11.7oz? I must have done the math way wrong
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
That's an unstrung weight conversion.
RiosTheGenius
Hall of Fame
all that work to customize his rcquets and the guy just breaks them as if it was his job. 
jackson vile
G.O.A.T.
Michael Ludwig said:
I just expected it to weigh a lot more, seems low for all the hubub people are talking about pros with such heavy rackets and such high swing weights.
It is my personal theory that we play with almost the same racket stats of the majority of the tour pros.
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
jackson vile said:
Your theory, while true in some instances, varies from player to player. Sure, there are guys out on tour playing with basically off the shelf models (with minor modifications), but then there are others who play with frames not available in the retail market. It all depends on the player really, and what he or she is comfortable with.
crosscourt
Professional
Michael -- many thanks for the information. A light Prestige Classic that I could then weight to my preference would be the racket that I would go for if I was able to dictate terms to Head. I had better head to the practice court.
Do you know if the mould that he has for his grip is just a variation on the stock Head shape os does he (and other pros) have somethinfg special done to their grips?
Do you know if the mould that he has for his grip is just a variation on the stock Head shape os does he (and other pros) have somethinfg special done to their grips?
johncauthen
Semi-Pro
I am going to answer another thread here.
The best racquet I have; it's a frame that isn't available is 346g at 10.5cm. No racquet like that is available but I learned almost all pro's racquets are in that range. The lightest racquet I can buy is modified to 368g at 30.7cm, strung, with an overgrip.
The Technifibre TFight 325 is 346g strung, balanced at 31cm, which seems like my best racquet. We have Technifibre racquets at Don's Tennis. But the problem is too much weight in the forks.
The problem with the Pure Drive was too much weight in the forks. When stretched, the head begins to feel heavier than the forks and it becomes a different racquet.
The same is true for the RDX500. It becomes a different racquet. The NSRQ-7, 100" becomes a different racquet when the head is stretched.
The solution Yonex could employ is less weight in the forks.
I strung one of Kournikova's former racquets. Bollettieri and Kournikova were in Charlotte. They auctioned off her old racquets. A man brought one in to have it strung. It was brand new, and never been strung or modified. It felt lighter in the forks and heavier in the top of the head than the same racquet on the wall.
I bought a Prince O3 Red, after playing with the demo. The racquet I bought felt clumsy and it had noticeably more weight in the forks than the demo. I didn't want to believe "They" know what works but aren't selling it to us. Or they make the demos good, but the racquets we buy are bad.
Otherwise, companies like Yonex can start making racquets with better balanced heads. We modify our racquets, but we don't have the tools they have. We add weight to the top of the head. They should make the forks and string bridge lighter.
The Technifibers have too much weight in the forks, and stringbridge, and shoulders of the head. You can't fix them by stretching the heads. And no one buys them.
Someone at Technifibre may have thought, if they are going to make the head light compared to the handle, they should make the bottom of the head light compared the top of the head. That was a mistake.
You can stretch head of a Head Radical Tour Mid (with the dense string bed that feels heavy like a player’s racquet is supposed to feel). When stretched, the top of the head overcomes the bottom of the head and the racquet goes from feeling heavy to just right. Regular players, who don't like player's racquets like it. I’m pretty sure pros use racquets that feel just right.
We know that most if not all frames we buy are too heavy to be modified like we want. One problem is too much weight in the string bridge and fork area. The racquet can seem head light. It can measure out head light, measure out just like a pro's racquet, but if it has too much weight in the string bridge area we can’t do anything to fix it. Add a lot of lead tape to the top of the head and the racquet is really about 355g at 33cm when the head is balanced properly. The question is, did they do that knowingly? Are they selling us heavier racquets than they make for Safin?!!
The best racquet I have; it's a frame that isn't available is 346g at 10.5cm. No racquet like that is available but I learned almost all pro's racquets are in that range. The lightest racquet I can buy is modified to 368g at 30.7cm, strung, with an overgrip.
The Technifibre TFight 325 is 346g strung, balanced at 31cm, which seems like my best racquet. We have Technifibre racquets at Don's Tennis. But the problem is too much weight in the forks.
The problem with the Pure Drive was too much weight in the forks. When stretched, the head begins to feel heavier than the forks and it becomes a different racquet.
The same is true for the RDX500. It becomes a different racquet. The NSRQ-7, 100" becomes a different racquet when the head is stretched.
The solution Yonex could employ is less weight in the forks.
I strung one of Kournikova's former racquets. Bollettieri and Kournikova were in Charlotte. They auctioned off her old racquets. A man brought one in to have it strung. It was brand new, and never been strung or modified. It felt lighter in the forks and heavier in the top of the head than the same racquet on the wall.
I bought a Prince O3 Red, after playing with the demo. The racquet I bought felt clumsy and it had noticeably more weight in the forks than the demo. I didn't want to believe "They" know what works but aren't selling it to us. Or they make the demos good, but the racquets we buy are bad.
Otherwise, companies like Yonex can start making racquets with better balanced heads. We modify our racquets, but we don't have the tools they have. We add weight to the top of the head. They should make the forks and string bridge lighter.
The Technifibers have too much weight in the forks, and stringbridge, and shoulders of the head. You can't fix them by stretching the heads. And no one buys them.
Someone at Technifibre may have thought, if they are going to make the head light compared to the handle, they should make the bottom of the head light compared the top of the head. That was a mistake.
You can stretch head of a Head Radical Tour Mid (with the dense string bed that feels heavy like a player’s racquet is supposed to feel). When stretched, the top of the head overcomes the bottom of the head and the racquet goes from feeling heavy to just right. Regular players, who don't like player's racquets like it. I’m pretty sure pros use racquets that feel just right.
We know that most if not all frames we buy are too heavy to be modified like we want. One problem is too much weight in the string bridge and fork area. The racquet can seem head light. It can measure out head light, measure out just like a pro's racquet, but if it has too much weight in the string bridge area we can’t do anything to fix it. Add a lot of lead tape to the top of the head and the racquet is really about 355g at 33cm when the head is balanced properly. The question is, did they do that knowingly? Are they selling us heavier racquets than they make for Safin?!!
jackson vile
G.O.A.T.
John where are you from, also what is your solution?
Next what can you do to for my LMprestige+ to make it feel better, what string and tension do you recomend, the uper hoop feels a bit dead at times.
And lastly what is the fork of the racket?
Next what can you do to for my LMprestige+ to make it feel better, what string and tension do you recomend, the uper hoop feels a bit dead at times.
And lastly what is the fork of the racket?
johncauthen
Semi-Pro
I'm from Charlotte, NC.
Every pro racquet falls into the general weight and balance range of 345 - 369 grams overall weight; balanced 31 cm from the butt. That's a light racquet.
I add a weight that looks like this.
That's my Babolat with a "stretched" head (5/32"). It doesn't look stretched.
I think pro racquets have a slightly lighter string bridge and thoat, and a large chunk of weight where I added weight. I've tried perfecting the feel by shaping the weight.
Pro racquet specs were revealing, because when I add a weight that length, that shape, and in that location, all the racquets I have that don't feel too heavy -- balanced just short of 31cm -- weigh between 345 and 369 grams: the same weight as pro racquets balanced at 31cm. I have a Hammer 6.3 Mid that feels slightly heavy. When enough weight is added in that location so it is balanced at 31 cm, the Hammer 6.3 weighs 372g, a little outside the range of pro racquets. But I set up my Hammer at 314g, about 34cm, with 45 grams added, a weight just like the photo. It still feels heavy because the head itself is too heavy.
The Babolat in the photo is in the weight range of pro racquets at 367.8g, 30.7cm. It feels light enough. I think most racquets are too heavy and can't be fixed.
The solution is what you indicated. First, they should stop the mis-information. We are told pros use heavy racquets, when in fact, they start with racquets that are lighter than ours. A pro's racquet can weigh 355 grams, which is 50 grams heavier than racquets they sell us, but it's light headed, and feels light.
Other than that Babolat, racquet companies aren't providing us with racquets that are light enough in the head, string bridge, and the throat (where the racquet divides into two forks). But look how well Ljubicic is playing with a Babolat. Maybe other companies actually don't know this stuff. The Babolat is easy to make right. It's spectacular, when stretched and weighted like this. An alterantive to stretching is to make the throat lighter.
My weight is contured around the grip and held on with plastic tape, covered with an overgrip. I left it flat to show up in the photo. Hold the racquet with your thumb on the side of the weight; it doesn't touch the weight. It may be similar to a pro's racquet. All that stuff would be hidden inside the graphite on a custom racquet. You can hardly feel that weight when you hold the racquet.
It makes the racquet more solid, very quick for volleys, and gives it control.
Every pro racquet falls into the general weight and balance range of 345 - 369 grams overall weight; balanced 31 cm from the butt. That's a light racquet.
I add a weight that looks like this.
That's my Babolat with a "stretched" head (5/32"). It doesn't look stretched.
I think pro racquets have a slightly lighter string bridge and thoat, and a large chunk of weight where I added weight. I've tried perfecting the feel by shaping the weight.
Pro racquet specs were revealing, because when I add a weight that length, that shape, and in that location, all the racquets I have that don't feel too heavy -- balanced just short of 31cm -- weigh between 345 and 369 grams: the same weight as pro racquets balanced at 31cm. I have a Hammer 6.3 Mid that feels slightly heavy. When enough weight is added in that location so it is balanced at 31 cm, the Hammer 6.3 weighs 372g, a little outside the range of pro racquets. But I set up my Hammer at 314g, about 34cm, with 45 grams added, a weight just like the photo. It still feels heavy because the head itself is too heavy.
The Babolat in the photo is in the weight range of pro racquets at 367.8g, 30.7cm. It feels light enough. I think most racquets are too heavy and can't be fixed.
The solution is what you indicated. First, they should stop the mis-information. We are told pros use heavy racquets, when in fact, they start with racquets that are lighter than ours. A pro's racquet can weigh 355 grams, which is 50 grams heavier than racquets they sell us, but it's light headed, and feels light.
Other than that Babolat, racquet companies aren't providing us with racquets that are light enough in the head, string bridge, and the throat (where the racquet divides into two forks). But look how well Ljubicic is playing with a Babolat. Maybe other companies actually don't know this stuff. The Babolat is easy to make right. It's spectacular, when stretched and weighted like this. An alterantive to stretching is to make the throat lighter.
My weight is contured around the grip and held on with plastic tape, covered with an overgrip. I left it flat to show up in the photo. Hold the racquet with your thumb on the side of the weight; it doesn't touch the weight. It may be similar to a pro's racquet. All that stuff would be hidden inside the graphite on a custom racquet. You can hardly feel that weight when you hold the racquet.
It makes the racquet more solid, very quick for volleys, and gives it control.
PurePrestige
Semi-Pro
John,
What methods of stringing, string tension for mains and crosses, degree of stretch would you recommend for a Liquidmetal Prestige Mid. Current preference of tension is 51m 49x.
Also, how much and where could I add weight to make the racquet feel better such as you do with racquets? Thanks for the help.
What methods of stringing, string tension for mains and crosses, degree of stretch would you recommend for a Liquidmetal Prestige Mid. Current preference of tension is 51m 49x.
Also, how much and where could I add weight to make the racquet feel better such as you do with racquets? Thanks for the help.
johncauthen
Semi-Pro
The Prestige is the right length going in, but it comes out compressed. Mount it normally in the machine. String the mains at 40 and the crosses at 51.
Putting the mains in at 40, the crosses will push the mains out to the tension of the crosses, and the racquethead will be about a half millimeter longer as the mains go from 40 to 51. It should feel exactly the same tension that you have, but the racquet will feel lighter because its better balanced. It will feel more lively, and you won't need a vibration dampener.
I prefer stringing the crosses more than 11 lbs tighter, but you can't put the mains in at less than 40; they won't be stretched enough. They might have to stretch 2mm to get from 35 to 51, which would distort the head. If the mains at 40lbs are stretched to most of their final length, the crosses will finish them and make them about the same tension as the crosses without pushing the head out much.
The key with the LM Prestige is the head won't be compressed.
Adding weight to the handle is mysterious. But if the head is not compressed and balanced right, that racquet will hit better than you expect it to without any extra weight. If it doesn't, string the crosses tighter than 51 with the mains at 40, or 41. You could string the crosses at 62 and mains at 41, but it will feel like 62. If you string the crosses at 55, the mains 41, it will feel like 55.
Putting the mains in at 40, the crosses will push the mains out to the tension of the crosses, and the racquethead will be about a half millimeter longer as the mains go from 40 to 51. It should feel exactly the same tension that you have, but the racquet will feel lighter because its better balanced. It will feel more lively, and you won't need a vibration dampener.
I prefer stringing the crosses more than 11 lbs tighter, but you can't put the mains in at less than 40; they won't be stretched enough. They might have to stretch 2mm to get from 35 to 51, which would distort the head. If the mains at 40lbs are stretched to most of their final length, the crosses will finish them and make them about the same tension as the crosses without pushing the head out much.
The key with the LM Prestige is the head won't be compressed.
Adding weight to the handle is mysterious. But if the head is not compressed and balanced right, that racquet will hit better than you expect it to without any extra weight. If it doesn't, string the crosses tighter than 51 with the mains at 40, or 41. You could string the crosses at 62 and mains at 41, but it will feel like 62. If you string the crosses at 55, the mains 41, it will feel like 55.
PurePrestige
Semi-Pro
Wow, that is pretty interesting. Will stringing like that distort or damage the frame? With the drastic difference in tension between mains and crosses, it won't distort or warp the head? Isn't that kinda like having a broken string for awhile, I dunno, I have a racquet out to be strung and I think I might try it.
As far as weighting goes, i've used different amounts of lead mostly i've added strictly to the head. I've added 8 grams along the top of the head, 2 8 inch pieces of 1/2 g/in lead tape across the top of the head. I've also added considerably more lead along the lines of 13-15 grams, and i've once added 18 g at 3&9 with 18g in the handle.
The point of this is, my racquets are back at stock for the moment, without lead. Should I add lead? Or will my racquet be appropriate as is.
The reason I ask is because i've only recently dropped my tension this low, and added lead at the same time. I found the ability to hit deep in the court consistently without making my swing erratic.
I don't know what to attribute this to, but I restrung it at tensions such as 62/60 and 57/55 and I find them to be too tight for me to play the way I want to regardless of lead amounts. I've tried many setups.
Low tensions i've played with are 53/51 and 51/49. I have 2 LM Prestige Mid's. I have one being restrung so I will try your recommendation and see how it works out. This post is more or less for future reference once I determine if I need lead, or if the new setup will have no need for it.
Thanks
As far as weighting goes, i've used different amounts of lead mostly i've added strictly to the head. I've added 8 grams along the top of the head, 2 8 inch pieces of 1/2 g/in lead tape across the top of the head. I've also added considerably more lead along the lines of 13-15 grams, and i've once added 18 g at 3&9 with 18g in the handle.
The point of this is, my racquets are back at stock for the moment, without lead. Should I add lead? Or will my racquet be appropriate as is.
The reason I ask is because i've only recently dropped my tension this low, and added lead at the same time. I found the ability to hit deep in the court consistently without making my swing erratic.
I don't know what to attribute this to, but I restrung it at tensions such as 62/60 and 57/55 and I find them to be too tight for me to play the way I want to regardless of lead amounts. I've tried many setups.
Low tensions i've played with are 53/51 and 51/49. I have 2 LM Prestige Mid's. I have one being restrung so I will try your recommendation and see how it works out. This post is more or less for future reference once I determine if I need lead, or if the new setup will have no need for it.
Thanks
jackson vile
G.O.A.T.
johncauthen said:
John I finally realized what you are doing here and I am not sure if you do, you are increasing the headlightness so that it is more head light.
I remember reading something saying that you want a racket that is 10pts head light as that is what the best generally speaking use.
So John how do you feel about people that do the reverse of what you suggest and string the main higher with the crosses better?
jackson vile
G.O.A.T.
Flexxed said:
Michael Ludwig
Rookie
This was posted by Don/sysop from Uli Barbian (Head's "pro player liaison") on the old message boards on September 17,2000: "Marat has done a lot of tests during the last couple of month with (head-) heavier frames but at the end he has always prefered the "lighter" specs." The so called lighter specs he prefered at the time was 335g/310mm.
And yes, I do believe that one of Marat's favorite things about the Prestige, is that he can destroy them so easily (as opposed to his Dunlop?).
And yes, I do believe that one of Marat's favorite things about the Prestige, is that he can destroy them so easily (as opposed to his Dunlop?).
vantagepoint
Rookie
Yes, I believe the 'testing' they refer to may have been the racquet-against-court crunch test, rarely performed by amateurs for fear of having to replace the frame, if nothing else...
