scary

[jacktyler627]

I have an alpha revolution electronic stringing machine...

when doing the first pull of the mains where I pull both main strings to set tension inside the clamp (hopefully you know what I'm saying) the stringing machine went out of control and pulled way to much tension so i quickly pressed the button to release tension.

I was stringing poly at 55 and it maxed out the machine to like 90 something pounds,

How do I prevent this or work around it? thanks

 

[kabrac]

Use a starting clamp. Yes it's easier putting the first 2 strings in the gripper, but what the gripper or maybe you haven't thought about is that to reach your certain tension the tension mechanisim has to work about twice as hard to reach the desired tension. Simply put, you are putting too much force on the string, racquet, and the tensioner. One at a time. Starting clamp is a fantastic investment.

 

[struggle]

^^^ BS. 55# is 55#. 1 string or ten, doesn't matter, tensioner should pull 55# if asked to do so.

will each string be tensioned at 55#? no. if doubling up, in theory each string will realize half that.

physics.

pulling two strings at once is merely to set the first clamp on a "tensioned" string. after that
each string needs to be tension separately, although some do otherwise...

 

[bugeyed]

snip you haven't thought about is that to reach your certain tension the tension mechanisim has to work about twice as hard to reach the desired tension. Simply put, you are putting too much force on the string, racquet, and the tensioner. One at a time. Starting clamp is a fantastic investment.

The tensioner pulls at the prescribed tension regardless of how many strings it is pulling. Maybe I misunderstood your point, but the 55lbs. would be divided between the two strings being pulled & the tensioner doesn't know any differently.
To the OP, you can't be sure that your machine isn't going to fail, you just have to react quickly, like you did, if it goes bad. If I were you, I would put a tension calibrator on it & make a bunch of pulls before trying another racquet.

Cheers,
kev

 

[kabrac]

^^^ BS. 55# is 55#. 1 string or ten, doesn't matter, tensioner should pull 55# if asked to do so.

will each string be tensioned at 55#? no. if doubling up, in theory each string will realize half that.

physics.

pulling two strings at once is merely to set the first clamp on a "tensioned" string. after that
each string needs to be tension separately, although some do otherwise...

Have you ever tried this Mr. "I know everything, and I will refute what anyone else says regardless". Try doing this on a dropweight......you have to force(push) the bar down which is totally opposite of how a dropweight functions, because it is being asked to do something that it was not meant to do. This should also apply to the lockout, since the guy said his machine is maxing out 90lbs. Hmmmmm, wonder why it's maxing out? You probably already know this since you're such a freakin' genius.

 

[seekay]

Have you ever tried this Mr. "I know everything, and I will refute what anyone else says regardless". Try doing this on a dropweight......you have to force(push) the bar down which is totally opposite of how a dropweight functions, because it is being asked to do something that it was not meant to do. This should also apply to the lockout, since the guy said his machine is maxing out 90lbs. Hmmmmm, wonder why it's maxing out? You probably already know this since you're such a freakin' genius.

tbuggle is right. Also, never push down on the dropweight's lever.

 

[struggle]

Have you ever tried this Mr. "I know everything, and I will refute what anyone else says regardless". Try doing this on a dropweight......you have to force(push) the bar down which is totally opposite of how a dropweight functions, because it is being asked to do something that it was not meant to do. This should also apply to the lockout, since the guy said his machine is maxing out 90lbs. Hmmmmm, wonder why it's maxing out? You probably already know this since you're such a freakin' genius.

i don't claim to know everything, but i did take physics class.

 

[bugeyed]

Give it up kabrac! The laws of physics don't change just because you don't understand them. Ignorance of the laws of physics does not allow you to break them.
BTW I am not trying to be rude. You should just stop the attacks & try to understand what is at work here.

Cheers,
kev

 

[Irvin]

Before you guys go too far and get the thread locked let me point out the obvious. The OP is having a problem where his tensioner is pulling 90 when set at 55. Maybe he has a gauge on the stringer that tells him this. Da I would think the way an eCP works is somehow a circuit senses the tension and shuts off the pulling force until the tension drops to a certain % of the reference then it kicks in again.

I would think there is something wrong in the electronic sensor and would not venture a guess as to how to fix it. Unless the OP has experience in electronic circuits I would not recommend to the OP to try to fix it. I would send it back for repair or replace it with a new machine.

Maybe if you're an electrical engineer you may want to volunteer your time to help the OP out.

EDIT: If you want to get it repaired Alpha 03 Tennis Machines would be a good place to start.

 

[kabrac]

Give it up kabrac! The laws of physics don't change just because you don't understand them. Ignorance of the laws of physics does not allow you to break them.
BTW I am not trying to be rude. You should just stop the attacks & try to understand what is at work here.

Cheers,
kev

You and others seem like the kind of people that if I asked what time it was you would tell me how a clock works....not what I asked.....and not what the OP is asking. Or you could reply on this forum because I am not right next to you, "time to go get a watch". Whatever...............

Now, let's review the question one more time: "I want to tension my strings @ 55lbs. but I'm pulling 2 strings at a time. Why is my machine maxing out at 90lbs. when I do this?"

Answer: Your tensioner is used to and built for pulling one string at a time; you can pull two, but for arguments sake, let's just stick with the basics. If I put in one string, the tensioner, if calibrated properly, will lockout @55lbs. Now let's pull 2 strings. To get a correct tension of 55lbs. pulling two strings, means the tensioner would need to pull at a force of about 110lbs to get the desired tension on each string, hence why your machine is maxing out at 90lbs. 110/2 =55. We could also put three strings in there................................I think you get what I'm saying.

bugeyed....I'm sure you're cursing and scratching your head at the same time thinking "how could I have missed something so easy?" It's because you lack the "COMMON".

tbuggle... I think I just buggled your mind!

 

[struggle]

if the tensioner is set at 55, that is what it should pull.

the tensioner has no idea how many strings you are pulling, see it has no brain...only a setting at which to pull.

the fact that his tensioner pulled up to 90 lbs means it was not functioning properly, nothing more or nothing less.

it's really simple.

 

[kabrac]

tbuggle is right. Also, never push down on the dropweight's lever.

Not telling you to. Using it as reference. JESUS people!!!!!!. THERE IS A REASON YOU HAVE TO FORCE THE BAR DOWN ON A DROPWEIGHT WHEN YOU PULL 2 STINGS AND WANT TO GET A TENSION OF 55LBS FOR EACH STRING. BECAUSE THE MACHINE DOESN'T HAVE THE FORCE TO DO IT SINCE IT MAXS'S OUT AT 90LBS. THAT IS AS HIGH AS IT GOOOOESSSS. WE NEED A FORCE OF 110LBS. FOR YOU NOT TO HAVE TO FORCE/PUSH THE DROPWEIGHT DOWN.

I'M DOOOOONNNNNNNNE!!!!!!. Stay inside the lines when ya'll color!!!!!!.

 

[kabrac]

if the tensioner is set at 55, that is what it should pull.

the tensioner has no idea how many strings you are pulling, see it has no brain...only a setting at which to pull.

the fact that his tensioner pulled up to 90 lbs means it was not functioning properly, nothing more or nothing less.

it's really simple.

Yeah so, his machine is just off by about 45-50lbs? Yeaaahhhhh.........ummmm.....no.

 

[struggle]

LMAO. kabrac, i ceratainly understand why you are confused.
you simply don't understand physics OR how a stringing machine works.

more than one person has tried to explain it to you but you'd rather flame away with complete, uninformed non-sense.

a dropweight will pull two strings to horizontal when set at 55 if you know what you are doing. each string, however, will only be tensioned to half that (so around 27.5 pounds). after setting a clamp you must re-tension each string individually to reach the desired 55#.

edit: we all understand your point about 110# (that's the physics part) BUT the machine will not try to pull 110 (or 90 if that's the highest setting...) when set at 55 unless it is malfunctioning. Again, the machine has no idea how many strings, loops or whatever you have put into the gripper and will not automatically try to compensate for such.

 

[jim e]

tbuggle is correct.( kabrac, have you ever strung before to know how a machine works?? You should know before you bad mouth someone!!)
If you set an electronic machine at 55 lbs. and pull 2 strings at once to set the anchor clamp it does not double up the tension to compensate for 2 strings, as it still will just pull the set tension which here was 55 lbs, as I typically do this with every string job on an electronic CP machine more times than many here typically string, as it still pulls just the reference tension and each string will be considerably less than the reference, (I then go back and pull each separately as I use the Yusuki method of starting mains, and at that time when you pull each string separately you can see it pull the string more to the set tension) . If machine pulled more on initial pull than it was set then its a problem with machine, no other issue.

With the Yusuki method (as listed in USRSA publication), you pull the 2 center mains to reference at same time ,(each is way less than reference) ,clamp RM1 usual spot with machine clamp, then set starting clamp on outside of racquet on R1M, then release tension , pull LM1, tension and clamp, then LM2 tension and clamp, then go back and repull RM1 and it pulls more than initially as it was a double pulled string, remove starting clamp and clamp with machine clamp.
This technique allows the 1st pull to be not as hard on a single clamp, as the 1st pull would typically have no opposing forces like it would otherwise. Also it keeps the strings straight , so when it is clamped the string is straight in clamp, some tension inside clamped string section and is easier on the string overall. Its a nice way to start main strings, and once you do this you will see that a CP machine will not overpull reference tension because it is 2 strings like some here commented.

If the OP 's machine maxed out like he said, it is machine error, as machine should read reference tension set irregardless of # of strings pulled at same time.

No sense of getting into a p*ssing match here.

 

[SwankPeRFection]

Have you ever tried this Mr. "I know everything, and I will refute what anyone else says regardless". Try doing this on a dropweight......you have to force(push) the bar down which is totally opposite of how a dropweight functions, because it is being asked to do something that it was not meant to do. This should also apply to the lockout, since the guy said his machine is maxing out 90lbs. Hmmmmm, wonder why it's maxing out? You probably already know this since you're such a freakin' genius.

BS, I use a dropweight and I always start my mains like this. Not once do I have to push the bar down. It pulls both mains no problem. The only time this technique is an issue is if the string slips anywhere... which could be what the OP saw because the automatic head couldn't get the desired tension, so it kept pulling further and further because of slippage somewhere. The OP didn't specify if he saw 90 on the digital readout of the actual poundage being pulled or if he marely saw the head max out on the rail of the tensioner, inturn thinking he was maxing out the machine. The OP needs to be more clear on this point.

 

[SwankPeRFection]

Not telling you to. Using it as reference. JESUS people!!!!!!. THERE IS A REASON YOU HAVE TO FORCE THE BAR DOWN ON A DROPWEIGHT WHEN YOU PULL 2 STINGS AND WANT TO GET A TENSION OF 55LBS FOR EACH STRING. BECAUSE THE MACHINE DOESN'T HAVE THE FORCE TO DO IT SINCE IT MAXS'S OUT AT 90LBS. THAT IS AS HIGH AS IT GOOOOESSSS. WE NEED A FORCE OF 110LBS. FOR YOU NOT TO HAVE TO FORCE/PUSH THE DROPWEIGHT DOWN.

I'M DOOOOONNNNNNNNE!!!!!!. Stay inside the lines when ya'll color!!!!!!.

Umm, how exactly do you know how much to push down to get your 55#?

Ya, you don't. The process is as follows. You set your normal tension and pull both mains to horizontal. Then you clamp one of them at the head previous to the last turn (i.e. just like you normally do with previous strings you pulled). Then you let the tension go and both string will relax. Then you grab the main string that's after the clamp and tension that again to your tension and clamp that at the throat. Then you run and tension one more on that side for the mains. Then you go back to the original that was clamped at the head and tension that one. Then you move the clamp from the head to the troat on that one and then run your next main and tension that... and so on. You don't push down on anything to get your set tension on the first two mains.

 

[bugeyed]

You and others seem like the kind of people that if I asked what time it was you would tell me how a clock works....not what I asked.....and not what the OP is asking. Or you could reply on this forum because I am not right next to you, "time to go get a watch". Whatever...............

Now, let's review the question one more time: "I want to tension my strings @ 55lbs. but I'm pulling 2 strings at a time. Why is my machine maxing out at 90lbs. when I do this?"

Answer: Your tensioner is used to and built for pulling one string at a time; you can pull two, but for arguments sake, let's just stick with the basics. If I put in one string, the tensioner, if calibrated properly, will lockout @55lbs. Now let's pull 2 strings. To get a correct tension of 55lbs. pulling two strings, means the tensioner would need to pull at a force of about 110lbs to get the desired tension on each string, hence why your machine is maxing out at 90lbs. 110/2 =55. We could also put three strings in there................................I think you get what I'm saying.

bugeyed....I'm sure you're cursing and scratching your head at the same time thinking "how could I have missed something so easy?" It's because you lack the "COMMON".

tbuggle... I think I just buggled your mind!

You should probably make a graceful exit from this thread now. You have insulted everyone that has tried to point out your error & apparently refuse to take a step back & look at the facts. I understand how you can believe what you do, but the fact is that stringing machines don't work the way you apparently think they do. The OP's machine malfunctioned. No doubt! Now, please retract your insults & take your foot out of your mouth while you have some credibility.

Cheers,
kev

 

[Chotobaka]

Not telling you to. Using it as reference. JESUS people!!!!!!. THERE IS A REASON YOU HAVE TO FORCE THE BAR DOWN ON A DROPWEIGHT WHEN YOU PULL 2 STINGS AND WANT TO GET A TENSION OF 55LBS FOR EACH STRING. BECAUSE THE MACHINE DOESN'T HAVE THE FORCE TO DO IT SINCE IT MAXS'S OUT AT 90LBS. THAT IS AS HIGH AS IT GOOOOESSSS. WE NEED A FORCE OF 110LBS. FOR YOU NOT TO HAVE TO FORCE/PUSH THE DROPWEIGHT DOWN.

I'M DOOOOONNNNNNNNE!!!!!!. Stay inside the lines when ya'll color!!!!!!.

What a nonsensical theory. Just pure fiction. I have been starting my mains the same way for years with both electronic CP and a Stringway. What you are saying does not jibe with reality. Bottom line: the OP has an obvious issue with his tension unit. I am sure Mark will get it straightened out in short order.

 

[gmatheis]

Sorry Kabrac but you are COMPLETELY WRONG

By your reasoning pulling a 16 guage string would require more tension than pulling a 17guage string because there is more of the string.

The reason for your analagy of having to push down on the bar of a dropweight when you tension 2 at a time is because they stretch less.

As for the OP , if your machine is pulling 90lbs then it needs to be fixed no matter how many strings you are pulling at a time.

 

[bugeyed]

Where did jacktyler627 go?

 

[Irvin]

Where did jacktyler627 go?

He asked a question and everyone started arguing about something else. We didn't do much to help him out maybe he just gave up or found the solution on his own.

 

[bugeyed]

He asked a question and everyone started arguing about something else. We didn't do much to help him out maybe he just gave up or found the solution on his own.

Yeah, hopefully he got the message that his machine malfunctioned & there is no work-around. I remember the uneasy feeling of stringing a customers racquet after I restored a Star 4 to operation. It was very stressful for those first few pulls, not knowing whether or not it would pull at 100# in a nanosecond!

Cheers,
kev

 

[jacktyler627]

I did sort of step away from the thread and let the argueing unfold....I am still confused as to what happened since I am new to stringing.

Is there any reason why this would happen only when pulling two strings at a time using poly?? There was no issue stringing the rest of the racket when only one string at a time was pulled.

Also, the stringing machine has a self checking diagnostic system when first turned on, if everything checked out on that before stringing was it just user error??

Are their any other ways to start mains without pulling two strings at once?

Thanks to the posters who simply gave answers or helpful input and didn't teach physics lessons

 

[Irvin]

I can't think of any reason two strings would make a difference. It could just as easily happen with one string. I would call Tennis Machines (1-800-572-1055) and told to them about it. They always seemed willy to discuss problem whenever I called them.

EDIT: There are many ways to start your mains. You could put one main in the machines clamp and back it up with a starting clamp outside the frame hand pulled. You only need enough tension to hold the clamp up. Then pull tension with the machine on the other center main. I would pull two at a time by hand before I set the machine clamp Then pull the main that is clamped and put the starting clamp on it outside the frame.

 

[tinyman]

I did sort of step away from the thread and let the argueing unfold....I am still confused as to what happened since I am new to stringing.

Is there any reason why this would happen only when pulling two strings at a time using poly?? There was no issue stringing the rest of the racket when only one string at a time was pulled.

I can't directly think of something, without pulling some really hare-brained explanations out of an uncomfortable area. What I can think of, as the only outside possibility, is that the control loop in that particular instance went unstable (I'm an electrical engineer). I can't really be more detailed than that unfortunately. I've never played with the internals of an electronic stringer - I've actually only seen one that I know of, and it was just being stored.

Also, the stringing machine has a self checking diagnostic system when first turned on, if everything checked out on that before stringing was it just user error??

Not necessarily, although consumer-ended functions are usually decent. Built In Test (BIT) functions range anywhere from the very thorough and accurate, to the absolute useless. Anything can be called a BIT - I've worked on some very clever and well-thought out ones, but more commonly ones that were hacked together as an afterthought - and are about as useful as I am on a tightrope.

The bottom line is that no, you can not always trust a self-test scheme - particularly to catch 'corner' cases, like what yours may be.

Are their any other ways to start mains without pulling two strings at once?

Thanks to the posters who simply gave answers or helpful input and didn't teach physics lessons

I imagine there are, however I don't know how to do them well, to be truthful. I only string two piece, with a double-pulled main at the start.