bob (who wasn't sure there was much interest in a D1 scholarship for him)
SEC Tennis
- Thread starter TopDawg
- Start date
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
good old Bob....always trashes Jerry Shang...
for the 2nd straight week....Jerry Shang defeats Ben Shelton...this time in DC
I did not realize that Shang was slowed down this year by mono.....
and to think that Shang is not even a worthy college recruit (according to all knowing Bob !!!)
www.atptour.com
for the 2nd straight week....Jerry Shang defeats Ben Shelton...this time in DC
I did not realize that Shang was slowed down this year by mono.....
and to think that Shang is not even a worthy college recruit (according to all knowing Bob !!!)
The Juncheng Shang Train Is Back Up & Running | ATP Tour | Tennis
Learn how Shang Juncheng overcame a bout with mononucleosis to return better than ever. Shang last week played Kei Nishikori and is this week competing at the ATP 500 tennis tournament in Washington.
www.atptour.com
2 weeks in a row to the same lower ranked player is disappointing. Silver lining is this second match was closer. Good luck to Ben the rest of the N. American swing.
Yeah I think Ben is what he is nowadays - a player that can make a living on tour, both singles and doubles, and is capable of beating some of the best in the right conditions and on the right days (often fast hard courts) - and he will have to make some substantial improvements to his return and baseline game over the next year or two if he wants to be a career top 20 guy
Shang is going to be great - easily will end 5+ years in the top 50 unless he has an injury plagued career - great mover, live arm
Would be a tough call for me right now in terms of who is destined for the better career - only considering singles, it might be Shang, despite Shelton’s head start with a handful of nice results (Cinci, AO)
I don't claim to have any technical insight, but Shang impresses me as more of a finished product- he's really polished and is already maximizing his entire tool kit, including some serious mental discipline- really impressive for being what, 18? Ben, on the other hand, strikes me as a kid who's gotten to where he is at the moment largely on his athletic gifts and now it's time to work on his actual tennis game. He's still got work to do on his fundamentals, and he has miles to go on basic mental discipline/situational awareness types of things. I think he's got the potential to take a quantum leap if he deals with his to-do list and can stay healthy physically. Watching him in back-to-back weeks against Shang, it seems like Shang is the more mature player. Ben needs a little more time before we start categorizing him. I love the kid's upside, personally. I hope he doesn't waste the next few months before he has to start defending points.
From my view you guys are covering a lot of what the kid is experiencing. Rapid rise due to massive weapons, lefty, being new to the field. Most all pros at this level can make adjustments mid match, 2nd match up, and execute base on a scouting report. A scouting report was previously not available at this time last year. The pro game is truly shark infested waters Shang’s had more experience internationally, etc. Heck, I think Ben just went overseas for the first time in just the last 9 months. Ben’s going to improve movement, technique and overall tactics in due time. Oh to be so young. Go Ben!
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Shang has been pretty polished since he was 14, think he is now physically maturing more and his game is taking off. Love Shelton but think Shang has higher ceiling, but Shelton also has a high ceiling himself and with more time his results will improve as well, mental game now since he went from the hunter to the hunted in the past 12 months
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Big Ben is not the only former SEC player with recent career high ATP rankings. Some others:
Gabriel Diallo Kentucky 130 10/16/23 turned pro 12/22 (was ranked 940 after playing last KY dual match 5/22)
Adam Walton Tenn 175 10/23/23 turned pro sometime after 5/22 (played 5YR at UT)
Abdullah Shelbayh 212 10/16/23 played one year at FL-made history in Oct as first Jordan player to win Challenger, turned pro 12/22
Oliver Crawford 225 10/16/23 OC reached this CH after reaching finals of Charleston Challenger as a WC ironically losing to fellow Gator Shelbayh above. Oliver left FL after 2020 spring-obviously his career start was affected by pandemic
@mikej Do you know why Oliver has played few events in the US? In looking at his 23 itinerary, he has played mostly Europe plus Tunisia, Kuwait, Quatar, India and after Charleston in South America. I know his parents are British-does he have other relatives in Europe?
As a parent of a Southern junior, there were 3 Southern players of similar age who were only seen at Kzoo-Bryde, Kypson, and Crawford. Kypson was the most obnoxious player even arguing with refs on stadium court when ref calls score, throwing rackets, etc. The polar opposite of Kypson, Crawford was always the most polite player speaking to opponent coaches and/or parents, acting mature and treating opponents with respect even in 14s (he didnt move to USPD until 16s) which was rare at that age. So happy to see OC is now ranked 30 above PK, and hope the upward trajectory continues with possibly more play in US with his higher ranking. I know his coach Bybel is from Hilton Head-think OC's only events in US were Savannah Challenger (lost in R32), Waco (lost in Qualis).
Gabriel Diallo Kentucky 130 10/16/23 turned pro 12/22 (was ranked 940 after playing last KY dual match 5/22)
Adam Walton Tenn 175 10/23/23 turned pro sometime after 5/22 (played 5YR at UT)
Abdullah Shelbayh 212 10/16/23 played one year at FL-made history in Oct as first Jordan player to win Challenger, turned pro 12/22
Oliver Crawford 225 10/16/23 OC reached this CH after reaching finals of Charleston Challenger as a WC ironically losing to fellow Gator Shelbayh above. Oliver left FL after 2020 spring-obviously his career start was affected by pandemic
@mikej Do you know why Oliver has played few events in the US? In looking at his 23 itinerary, he has played mostly Europe plus Tunisia, Kuwait, Quatar, India and after Charleston in South America. I know his parents are British-does he have other relatives in Europe?
As a parent of a Southern junior, there were 3 Southern players of similar age who were only seen at Kzoo-Bryde, Kypson, and Crawford. Kypson was the most obnoxious player even arguing with refs on stadium court when ref calls score, throwing rackets, etc. The polar opposite of Kypson, Crawford was always the most polite player speaking to opponent coaches and/or parents, acting mature and treating opponents with respect even in 14s (he didnt move to USPD until 16s) which was rare at that age. So happy to see OC is now ranked 30 above PK, and hope the upward trajectory continues with possibly more play in US with his higher ranking. I know his coach Bybel is from Hilton Head-think OC's only events in US were Savannah Challenger (lost in R32), Waco (lost in Qualis).
atatu
Legend
Love to see JJ Wolf doing so well compared to Kypson these days.
Also really like OC’s personality, but no insight into his schedule
He reminds me a lot of another of my favorite college tennis players, Duke’s Henrique Cunha, both incredible college players / grinders / fighters who are a little underpowered in the pros - Crawford sticking with it a lot longer than Cunha did in his attempts on tour, and wish him the best, even if the odds are long
Also reminds me a bit of UVA’s Vahaly, fwiw
He had his 15 minutes on tour, maybe Crawford will get his
optimaltennis
Semi-Pro
Apologies for butting in as the question was directed to @mikej; I don't have direct insight in to OCrawford's schedule, but I do talk with quite a few players on their schedule.
To me, it is very very smart to play overseas, as opposed to being state side. Granted, it is more comfortable to be in the USA, but the level of the 15-25k here is significantly higher. For example, during the summer in here in USA, there are quite a few college players who play futures/challengers, many of whom have already trained/played for the past few month, thus are battle tested and match fit. In Europe, you might have 3-4 futures going on at the same time, thus the level is diluted. Additionally, club commitments will often take away players during the summer, further diluting the level at futures. In Asia, the levels are often even weaker. Thus, it makes much more sense, from a rankings perspective, by going overseas. The points you gain at a 25k is the same if it is in USA/Europe/Asia.
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Thanks for jumping in. I do agree that Futures/CH in Asia are probably easier than US-not sure about Europe. The top young Chinese guys were trading Challenger match wins in US (maybe trained at IMG?) with Eubanks, Shelton, etc in 2022. However the Jan-May space (though there probably arent any events in May) could offer better opportunities for young pros post college. Summer and fall are tough in US, but at least some of the top college guys who were grinding in Futures are getting more WCs into CHs. My son dabbled in Futures a few years back-you'd have to play UTR 13.8s in US Future Qualis, while in Asia, Africa, or South America you might have UTR 12s and the occasional 11 in the MD. Now guys high in the lineup for top 8 teams usually go directly to MD of Future is not in Qualis or MD of CHs (esp if player at host univ). However, we knew a guy who earned 2 ATP points in the US his last year of college so he worked and saved up for 6 months to do the Europe, Tunisia, Egypt tour and didnt win another MD match so it all depends on who shows up where... It's funny that occasionally a 15K Future on a Nov weekend has a harder draw ( at least for qualis and maybe MD too) than the 15K the same weekend, because the college guys assume the 15K will be easier and then the 25K ends up with some byes esp with players signed up on both entry lists...
However budget is a big issue with international travel. Guys who play US Futures may have a base to train and through connections find host families for pro events. Plus they can take off a month or two to coach if they run out of funds. I wonder how these young college guys who take 2+ years to reach top 150 manage their finance esp if they play overseas-do they have boosters, sponsors, family $, etc?
optimaltennis
Semi-Pro
This is another reason why I think going to Europe is better, especially if your game better suited for slower outdoor surfaces. Traveling in Europe is super convenient via rail and/or short flights and much less expensive. Asia is similar. Additionally, housing in Europe/Asian is much cheaper than in USA.
As for the part about funding, players will often have a sponsor/family money who can support. Money tournaments, which seem more prevalent in the *******/northeast also help as well as club tournaments. It is now much easier as a lot of players are now coming out of school with top 500 rankings. This allows to jump directly into MD of every 25k as well as opportunities for qualies in most, if not all challengers.
Clemson_tennis
Legend
Liam Draxl wins the Calgary challenger title. Beat Koepfer in the final 6-4 6-3. He is 35-8 since he finished at Kentucky with two ITF titles.
tennisfan17
Professional
Surprised/not surprised by this in a weird way. I really like Draxl but I didn't see his game working the best at the pro level ya know? He's great in college, where he gains a lot of energy and hype from his teammates and that's what always made him dangerous. Happy to see he absolutely can hold up in the pros though.
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
SEC looks weak to me this year.....South Carolina at 5 nationally and Tennessee at 6 nationally...both look too high to me
Tennessee has so many freshman on their roster....https://utsports.com/sports/mens-tennis/roster
Tennessee has so many freshman on their roster....https://utsports.com/sports/mens-tennis/roster
I think with the 3 Brits coming back USC's preseason is close. Their #6 singles and #3 doubles is a question. Depth may be an issue if any of the top 3 get injured.
UT's 1 and 2 are legit. Certainly agree their #6 seems very high. How good are their freshman?
rastapasta
New User
Both Darybabeigi and Sarr are both high-end freshman. Depending on how they play will validate whether that ranking is accurate
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
former Mississippi State player Nuno Borges has quietly developed into a very solid pro player.
Borges into the round of 32 at the Australian Open
unrelated to the SEC...frequent poster Bob...always said that Jerry Shang was not good enough for college tennis
Jerry Shang also into the round of 32 at Aus. Open....Shang will play some guy named Alcaraz
Alex Michelsen elected to turn pro...rather than playing at Georgia. Michelsen upsets a seed last night...also into the round of 32.
and of course, the great Ben Shelton is also in the round of 32 and will play Mannarino tonight
Borges into the round of 32 at the Australian Open
unrelated to the SEC...frequent poster Bob...always said that Jerry Shang was not good enough for college tennis
Jerry Shang also into the round of 32 at Aus. Open....Shang will play some guy named Alcaraz
Alex Michelsen elected to turn pro...rather than playing at Georgia. Michelsen upsets a seed last night...also into the round of 32.
and of course, the great Ben Shelton is also in the round of 32 and will play Mannarino tonight
Michelson was simply super impressive yesterday.
Watched some of Ben's match against O'Connell. He seemed impatient at times, mostly with his BH. Gotta believe he's working on being more aggressive with it and will pay off later in the tourney. The Mannarino match is a popcorn one for me. Super contrast in styles that I love. Mannarino is tricky and should be a fun watch.
Hey hey hey
Let us be fair to Bob
He didn’t say Shang wasn’t good enough for college tennis
Just that he wasn’t good enough for mid-tier teams to waste a full scholarship on
The fact that Shang overcame not getting a scholarship at Cal and is now in the rd of 32 of a slam before his 19th story is just a lovely story
Let us be fair to Bob
He didn’t say Shang wasn’t good enough for college tennis
Just that he wasn’t good enough for mid-tier teams to waste a full scholarship on
The fact that Shang overcame not getting a scholarship at Cal and is now in the rd of 32 of a slam before his 19th story is just a lovely story
Shelton lost in a frustrating five setter. Went down a double break in the fifth uncharacteristically. Clawed one back and could have broken again at 5-4 with Mannarino throwing in a double fault but punched a volley long and put his final forehand in the net. Would have loved to see Ben in a rematch with Djokovic.
Credit to Mannarino though. He handled Ben’s serve well
Credit to Mannarino though. He handled Ben’s serve well
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
I watched Ben in the first round and almost all of his serves were around 115 mph.
Today, he was also not going for his big serve.
Was he serving huge in 2nd round match? Just curious as to whether there might be a health issue.
Today, he was also not going for his big serve.
Was he serving huge in 2nd round match? Just curious as to whether there might be a health issue.
Something seems odd on Ben's FH to me watching during the AM match. Some FH's he doesn't rotate, then seems to over rotate with a pull to his left. Not on all FH's maybe one or two per rally. I understand it may be an adjustment to incoming pace, just looks weird to me. Felt like I noticed a number of shots pulled and or shanked wide cross court. Would like to see some side-by-side from last summer. Maybe I'm wrong.
Fun match overall. AM is no slouch. I know Ben will learn and get better from it. Go Ben!
Fun match overall. AM is no slouch. I know Ben will learn and get better from it. Go Ben!
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
SEC coaches have voted....
The Southeastern Conference announced the men's tennis coaches' preseason poll, Thursday.
South Carolina was picked to finish first in the league. The Gamecocks begin their 2023 season as the No. 5 team in the ITA Division I rankings. South Carolina returns six members of its squad who reached the quarterfinals of the NCAA Championships last season.
The preseason poll is voted on by the men's tennis head coach at each institution and is based on a 13-12-11-10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 vote.
The complete tally for the poll is below.
Team Points
1.
South Carolina 164
2.
Tennessee 156
3.
Mississippi State 128
4.
Kentucky 125
5.
Texas A&M 111
6.
Florida 106
7.
Auburn 92
8.
Georgia 89
9.
Alabama 60
10.
LSU 54
11.
Ole Miss 40
12.
Vanderbilt 37
13.
Arkansas 20
The Southeastern Conference announced the men's tennis coaches' preseason poll, Thursday.
South Carolina was picked to finish first in the league. The Gamecocks begin their 2023 season as the No. 5 team in the ITA Division I rankings. South Carolina returns six members of its squad who reached the quarterfinals of the NCAA Championships last season.
The preseason poll is voted on by the men's tennis head coach at each institution and is based on a 13-12-11-10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 vote.
The complete tally for the poll is below.
Team Points
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
13.
Clemson_tennis
Legend
This looks like a somewhat down year for the SEC. Most teams look to be not as good as last year's version and not a lot of true top 10 teams. And is anyone an actual national title contender?
Probably not any true title contenders - with how good UVA and Texas are, that’s a high bar this year
Clemson_tennis
Legend
Yeah actually it's pretty similar to last year. Everyone looks relatively close to last year's level except LSU and Vandy may be improved while Georgia will take a big step back.
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
I think that South Carolina (5 nationally) and Tennessee (6 nationally) are both highly overrated. I would be surprised if any SEC teams are in the elite 8 at Stillwater in May.
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Anyone know when GA’s 6 indoor courts will be finished? I saw that today’s ITA kickoff matches had to be moved to Clemson 2 hours away. GA plays GT 2/6-think GT will win this year. Hope that match will be moved to GT if GA indoor isn’t finished - that match draws a good crowd. It is ironic that ALTA league matches are still on even for seniors but it is too cold for collegians to play. It is windy today though…would make for sloppy play. Used to be for juniors that it was game on outside as long as above freezing.
Clemson_tennis
Legend
oh sweet. I might head up to see some Auburn vs A&M now.
Clemson is closer to Athens than Atlanta is. And Athens is closer to Clemson than Columbia. Should play each other every year in every sport tbh.
Nice to have functioning indoor facility right UGA?
Wait a minute. How were they planning to play the “indoor” kickoff weekend anyway? Just not going to use an indoor facility this year?
Clemson is closer to Athens than Atlanta is. And Athens is closer to Clemson than Columbia. Should play each other every year in every sport tbh.
Nice to have functioning indoor facility right UGA?
Wait a minute. How were they planning to play the “indoor” kickoff weekend anyway? Just not going to use an indoor facility this year?
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jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Well yesterday it was in 60’s but raining. Usually in ATL rain disrupts more tennis matches than the cold. I don’t understand why GA didn’t have a backup plan earlier-sounds like they didn’t decide to move the match until 9 or 10am.oh sweet. I might head up to see some Auburn vs A&M now.
Clemson is closer to Athens than Atlanta is. And Athens is closer to Clemson than Columbia. Should play each other every year in every sport tbh.
Nice to have functioning indoor facility right UGA?
Wait a minute. How were they planning to play the “indoor” kickoff weekend anyway? Just not going to use an indoor facility this year?
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
Georgia Tech at Georgia will be played at 2 pm.....outdoors in Athens.
Clemson_tennis
Legend
tennisfan17
Professional
Kinda surprised as well but not shocked. I think Steinberg will grow this team but I think it is too early for them to be making big pushes. Not doubt they will though eventually. They just need more time.
Purestriker
Legend
Odd. Can't wait to hear why.
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
really being kept under wraps...
Auburn women’s tennis coach Caroline Lilley abruptly fired after team makes ITA Indoor Championships
By Sunday afternoon, Lilley’s name and image had already been removed from the team’s page on Auburn’s website.
www.al.com
collegetennisisthebest
Semi-Pro
Miss. State lost to VCU and Florida State. Ole Miss lost to Northwestern and UCLA.
Florida was in a much tougher region. Wake Forest and UNC are both stronger than the teams that Ole Miss lost to.
Kentucky is not a top 16 team.
Purestriker
Legend
Really odd, had to be something really bad. Especially since the assistant resigned before they terminated them.really being kept under wraps...
Auburn women’s tennis coach Caroline Lilley abruptly fired after team makes ITA Indoor Championships
By Sunday afternoon, Lilley’s name and image had already been removed from the team’s page on Auburn’s website.
Gruskin (CR) saying Lilley was dismissed because she was in a relationship with a member of the team. Really unfortunate development for the team and the member involved
Clemson_tennis
Legend
Assistant coach dismissed as well for apparently being aware of the situation.
Purestriker
Legend
Wow. Really terrible.
Hate to say it, I saw this coming before this news broke. The level of poor judgement from the coaches is off the charts. Probably not the first time.
rough start to the steinberg era and his very young team (true freshmen at 1-3), with three straight losses to WF (1-4) UNC (2-4) and FSU (0-4)
they'll get roughed up by Texas in a week, then frankly just need to focus on two things this season:
1) getting into the NCAA tournament
2) keeping Kim / Jin / Ganesan on board for next year and finding 1-2 bigtime recruits or transfers to join them...the current guys at 4,5,6 frankly aren't good enough to be on the singles roster of a team that would like to be top 10 again next season, has to be the current top 3 and some new blue chip blood to avoid a 3rd straight rebuilding season
seminoles.com
they'll get roughed up by Texas in a week, then frankly just need to focus on two things this season:
1) getting into the NCAA tournament
2) keeping Kim / Jin / Ganesan on board for next year and finding 1-2 bigtime recruits or transfers to join them...the current guys at 4,5,6 frankly aren't good enough to be on the singles roster of a team that would like to be top 10 again next season, has to be the current top 3 and some new blue chip blood to avoid a 3rd straight rebuilding season
No. 23 Florida State Sweeps Florida at College MatchDay - Florida State University
Orlando – The No. 23 Florida State men's tennis team swept Florida in front of a capacity crowd at the USTA National Campus for College MatchDay. This marks ...
