If you watch Fed play and know anything about tennis and compare his level to 2006, he is not at his prime. You are a ****** for even alleging so. The only reason Nadal has any slams off of clay is because Fed got mono. No mono and Nadal would be a one surface wonder.
Senario about Federer's claim to GOAT & Nadal
- Thread starter samboy01
- Start date
If you watch Fed play and know anything about tennis and compare his level to 2006, he is not at his prime. You are a ****** for even alleging so. The only reason Nadal has any slams off of clay is because Fed got mono. No mono and Nadal would be a one surface wonder.
Ahaahah, yeah let's look at the reality. He's already resorting to cheating to win matches. We'll see how Nadal does in his "prime". The reality is Nadal's prime began in 2005 and his prime sucks so badly compared to Fed's off of clay that he was only able to win 1 slam per year. Now he won 2 extra slams off of clay because Fed is past his prime and got sick.
davey25
Banned
You love to make excuses for your favorites dont you. Obviously a pretty desperate fan.
So Federer had only a 2 year prime: 2004-2006. A guy with a 2 year prime who gets owned by the #2, some GOAT, LOL! If we want to make excuses had Nadal's knees not blown out last year Federer would have no French Open, would still not have more slams than Sampras, and Nadal would already be at 9 slams vs Federer's 14 (or even 13 since imagine the mental mess he would be by Australian 2010 without a slam title in over a year) and easy reach to pass him soon. Federer fans should give prayers of thanks Nadal's knees collapsed exactly like he did otherwise he would already be being ignored, and people would be focusing on Nadal trying to catch Sampras.
And you call someone else a ****** for implying Federer is still in his prime while winning 3 out of 4 slams, but you are so idiotic to believe 2006 was Nadal's prime. You really are the epitome of fail, to be expected being a Selesestial though, the dumbest group of tennis fans on the planet (even moreso than *******s who come next and you happen to be both).
davey25
Banned
Yeah Nadal in his prime was regularly losing to Blake, Youzhny, Berdych, Gonzalez, in major hard court events. You really like embarassing yourself dont you. I look forward to your tantrum that you already had during the Petzscher match when Nadal wins Wimbledon again in 5 days.
Can you read? I said 2007 was the last year of his prime. You can't have it both ways. If you take away FO09 from Fed for Nadal's knee "injury" then you take away W08 and AO09 for Fed's mono and back problems. That puts Fed even further ahead of Nadal. Even non prime Fed is so good that he can win 3 of 4 slams, it's not like he's Pete Sampras that he has no chance of winning except when the grass is extremely fast and relies only on his serve. Yes you are ******** for not understanding that Nadal's great 2008 only came as a result of Fed's injuries. It's no coincidence that they coincided. In reality Nadal's prime began long before that, because he is such a one-dimensional pusher there's nothing really to develop in his game.
Yeah and now he's regularly losing to Delpo and Lopez and Roddick and Ljubicic! LOLLLLLLLLLLL. Yeah prime is now, my ass.
nadals great 2008 came because of his own improvements. Remember that Nadal nearly took wimbledon in 07 and improved alot by next year and he was going to take wimbledon that year anyway. Your post is pretty pathetic. Nadals great season in 08 had nothing to do with roger, Nadal had chances in the 07 wimby final but blew them. He wasnt going to blow them away the third time.
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davey25
Banned
Federer had mono in January 2008. He himself claimed he was already recovered fully by the 2008 clay court season. And Federer had no major injury in 2009, otherwise he would have missed some events when he did not. More fail on your part.
And Federer likely won both FO 2009 and Wimbledon 2009 due to Nadal's knees going out. So like I said since you are the one starting the "what ifs" we now have 14 slams for Federer and 9 for Nadal with Nadal 5 years younger. So since we should base reality on "what ifs" (according to you) Nadal is all of a sudden likely to pass Federer in what their true slam count should be now. Congrats.
So Nadal is a one dimensional pusher and yet he was beating prime Federer regularly as a teenager on hard courts and owning him on clay since he was in diapers to get into diapers (since Federer older was apparently in diapers). Wow Federer really does suck now, thanks for putting it all into perspective.
davey25
Banned
Nadal has lost only once before the semis of a hard court slam since 2007 and that was to Murray. I thought a rule of Selestials was only the slams count, that way you clear out results such as prime Seles losing 6-3, 6-2 to Sabatini in a tier 1 final and even to a 36 year old Navratilova 6-2, 6-4 in a tournament final (in addition to her embarassing slam flops like her 6-2, 6-1 raping by Graf in the biggest final of tennis on famed Centre Court). You love walking through your own fail.
federer was not "sick" at wimbledon 08, he was completey fine. Nadals 08 came because of his own improvements. You are just an irrational hater.
The effects of mono can last much longer even after it's clinically gone. He himself said it took so much out of his practice time it was hard to get back to top form. In 2009 Fed had back problems which is why he served so badly in AO09. What do you mean other he would have missed some event? Look at Nadal now, he has bicep problems, knee problems, coaching problem, that didn't make him miss W10. So you fail there. HAHAHA and another major fail, you said Federer LIKELY won FO09, W09 which is akin to saying "what if". Likely = what if. And then you stupidly accuse me of using "what ifs". You are grade A major moron to be sure.
What's this got to do with Seles? Stay on topic moron. Who cares if Nadal only lost once before the semis, the fact is he's lost. Period.
davey25
Banned
completely "find". And you even type it twice. Classic. Tell me did you actually ever complete grade school?
No i am not. I dont claim to be perfect(and i am not) but atleast i dont post hateful crap about a certain player. Nadals 08 came because of his own improvements. Did Nadal making the semis of ao and us open for the first time come because of fed? Or did Nadal winning the olympic gold on fast hardcourts come because of fed? Or did nadal winning the queens title on grass for the first time come because of fed? Or did Nadals brilliance in the fo 08 come because of fed? Or did winning titles in Monte Carlo or Montreal? Keep repeating this garbage over and over again, doesnt make it true.
Wouldn't that make you suicidal given that you are in love with Pete Sampras?
Uh yes, I'm sure my IQ is at least 10 times yours.
davey25
Banned
No I am not you. I like certain players but I dont obsess over them to the point I go crazy on forum while the guy who is my favorite players daddy gets down but still comes back to win (eg- Nadal vs Petzscher a few days ago) nor dreaming of such nonsense like Seles winning 10 Wimbledons.
davey25
Banned
Yeah I am sure your intelligence level is just find. :lol:
Why is what I post hateful? Just because I say Nadal's achievement in 08 came as a result of Fed being not in form does not mean I hate the guy. Far from it. You want proof? Fed takes Nadal to 4 sets in each of their previous 3 meetings at RG. And all of a sudden he gets only 4 games and you want to say that is all due to Nadal's own improvement? Give me a break. That match was an aberration, because he was not in form.
You are obviously obsessed over Sampras, Graf and Serena. You are the definition of obsession dude. And I know how much it must have burned you inside after FEd won FO 09....hahaahah eat it!
You do know what a typo is right? You also do realize that the 'd' and 'e' keys are adjacent to one another? Or are you a monkey and you have someone type for you?
and the funny thing about berundi attacking Nadal is that Nadal has a huge impact on his own idols legacy. Like it or not, Nadal is the only all time great that Federer has ever had to deal with. Every other great player during the open era had other greats to compete with. Connors had Borg, Borg has Connors and Mac, Mac had Lendl, Sampras had Agassi. By calling Nadal a moonballer and by diminishing his accomplishments, Berundi is basically saying that his idol faced weak competition in comparison to other great players. Since a one dimensional moonballer has been by far the second best player of federers era, Federers competition must be truly pathetic in comparison to others like Sampras and Borg. Therefore using this logic federer isnt the goat or even close. Since the biggest rival he has ever had is a one dimensional moonballer.
So you're telling me that Pete SAmpras is obsessing over Federer? Ok, good to know.
davey25
Banned
You are obviously obsessed over Sampras, Graf and Serena. You are the definition of obsession dude. And I know how much it must have burned you inside after FEd won FO 09....hahaahah eat it!
I was actually happy for Federer to get a French. I would have rather it came by beating Nadal in the final to prove he wasnt such a pimp to the #2 of his own era, but alas that is beyond his capabilities so it was nice to see him rewarded for many years of consistent play on clay. He would have been one of the best clay courters to not win the French if he hadnt done it. Unlike you I dont slit my wrists when my non favorites win something, that is the thing for people of your disturbing psychological level.
And I am sure it does burn you that your favorite women player of all time (Seles) was such a loser at the Worlds biggest event, made a fool of in her only final there, and spent the final 8 years of her career getting owned by by about 5 different women and looking like an elephant. And with Nadal now ruling the game your bitterness and immense frusteration carries on. Oh well.
You are obviously obsessed over Sampras, Graf and Serena. You are the definition of obsession dude. And I know how much it must have burned you inside after FEd won FO 09....hahaahah eat it!
It will burn him more if Fed wins wimby 2010 to tie Pete's record of 7 wimbys.
he thinks federer will win wimby 2010, "unfortunately".
No he doesn't, he stated here that Nadal will win W10.
well, he did state it here:
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=4811744&postcount=164
may be he changed his mind after the nadal match..
davey25
Banned
You are correct. I initially picked Federer since Nadal was apparently injured vs Petzscher and didnt look very good in his 2nd and 3rd rounds. However after seeing Nadal rebound to great form in this 4th round despite those painful knees I see him now coming out ahead. Federer played great in his last 2 rounds as well, but Nadal and Federer both at their best on any surface, Nadal wins everytime of course.
Ray Mercer
Hall of Fame
Not if they play on fast hardcourt. One of the best matches I ever saw Nadal play was the Masters cup semi with Federer in 2007.
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
nadal has yet to beat federer, when fed is 100% and healthy.
djokovicgonzalez2010
G.O.A.T.
Nadal is not even in the top tier. Why is this even a discussion?
Cesc Fabregas
Legend
After Nadal beats Soderling tommorrow, who are you going to change your avatar to?
The GOAT vs. Non-GOAT profile is an absolutely perfect argument that goes to show that, as I said earlier, losing in the semifinals of a tournament is ALWAYS a step down from losing in the finals, regardless of opponent. Thus, head-to-head is merely a selective statistic that says "When both of the players happened to playing well enough to make the final, who won?" Well, Federer's best has happened a lot more often than Nadal's best so far in their careers.
Cup8489
G.O.A.T.
you make a good point. samboy1 is fixating on the H2H, and foolishly deducing that Nadal is a GOAT in contention with Federer simply because he's beaten Fed more often than not.. but who's won more titles? and who has more majors? I mean, sure, nadal has the record for MS titles, but like with his H2H with Federer, his proficiency on clay horribly skews the numbers. It may well be the case that if the grass season was as long/deep as the clay season, Federer's H2H with Nadal would be much closer to even, and if he had 3 MS titles on grass to fight for, that he could very well be above 20+ MS titles. So Nadal, in a way, is fortunate to have his best surface be one of the most prevalent around the world.
At the end of the day the majority of the tennis following public regards Federer as the GOAT. Around 98% of the general public could care less about player head to head's, these are things that are rarely talked about outside of forums like this one.
Nadal's favourable H2H over Federer (swung so heavily his way because unlike Sampras, Federer was good enough to keep getting to clay finals) will always be used by people on forums and by ex-players who don't like Federer. But go to any Poll open to the general public and you will see that Federer consistently gets anywhere from 75-95% of the vote as the Greatest of All Time. That is Public Opinion, which is by a long way more expansive and encompassing than Tennis Forum opinion, which represents a tiny part of the world tennis-following population.
In effect this discussion has around 0.02% effect on the opinion of the general tennis following public. In most people's estimations that is infinitesimal. Clearly some fools here think they are going to change World Opinion by posting on a Message Board. I hate to burst your bubble or disappoint all you guys and girls trying to knock Federer, but perhaps your time would be better spent elsewhere, like on the tennis court for example...
Nadal's favourable H2H over Federer (swung so heavily his way because unlike Sampras, Federer was good enough to keep getting to clay finals) will always be used by people on forums and by ex-players who don't like Federer. But go to any Poll open to the general public and you will see that Federer consistently gets anywhere from 75-95% of the vote as the Greatest of All Time. That is Public Opinion, which is by a long way more expansive and encompassing than Tennis Forum opinion, which represents a tiny part of the world tennis-following population.
In effect this discussion has around 0.02% effect on the opinion of the general tennis following public. In most people's estimations that is infinitesimal. Clearly some fools here think they are going to change World Opinion by posting on a Message Board. I hate to burst your bubble or disappoint all you guys and girls trying to knock Federer, but perhaps your time would be better spent elsewhere, like on the tennis court for example...
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