Serena Apoligies To Linesperson

[jamesblakefan#1]

Brilliant post.
i can't beilieve the hatred on here ofr serena...

she's already been punished...get it? she was docked a point and that led
to her losing the match...end of story....she shook clijsters hand and that was
the end of that.

It's happened in men's matches too...eg Johhny mac 90 aussies open...and
as far as I can remember mac wasn't *banned* for anything after that.

In the 2001 wimby final...goran called a linesguy a "F#$g*t" audible on TV
in front of millions too..not only did he not get defaulted...nothing at all happened.

How about Roddick going ballistic at refs in aussie or multiple male players
cursing refs and linespeople?

serena already been punished so just get on with life.

Right. I posted this in the 'Federer cursing' thread, but I guess it applies here as well. Where's the outrage for Sharapova cursing @ umpires or even worse, pulling something like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNPYU4TZBb4

Where's the outrage? Huh? I hadn't even heard a/b this or even heard mention of this, and to me cursing the crowd is worse than cursing the linesperson.

 

[JankovicFan]

Give me a freaking break. Assault w/ a deadly weapon? Yeah, there's a huge rash of tennis racket/tennis ball related deaths all around the US...:roll:

Logical fallacy. Actually, I believe the question of whether the lineswoman felt threatened by that waving racket is still an open question.

 

[jamesblakefan#1]

Logical fallacy. Actually, I believe the question of whether the lineswoman felt threatened by that waving racket is still an open question.

So let me ask you something, do you really think Serena would have hit the linesperson and murdered her on the court? Or even more laughable, the people who seem to think Serena would really shove a ball down someone else's throat. You can call Serena a bad person, but that's no reason to think she'd actually kill someone...:roll:

 

[paulfreda]

Check with a lawyer

I have a hard time understanding how anybody could describe what Serena did as being assault with a [deadly ?] weapon. Twice

I can understand your skepticism. I too was very surprised to learn that assault does not require that the victim be touched; that is what is required for it to be a battery. Don't take my word for it, check with a good criminal attorney.

Serena was threatening while approaching the woman, spewing profanity and waving a weapon within a few feet of her. Whether or not you believe she would EVER actually hit someone is irrelevant. Her actions incite fear and violence and that is why it is illegal; that is if we value peace and civility in our society. She is a criminal and that is a fact.

Roddick, McEnroe, Conners, Nastase and Hewitt never did anything remotely approaching illegal.

As for the question of it being a 'deadly weapon' , I would ask you what would happen to someone struck several times in the head with a tennis frame made of material stronger than steel [graphite] ?

Serena's actions reveal her character and her unconvincing feign apologies say even more.

Truth ............ very hard to swallow more often than not.

 

[HellBunni]

So let me ask you something, do you really think Serena would have hit the linesperson and murdered her on the court? Or even more laughable, the people who seem to think Serena would really shove a ball down someone else's throat. You can call Serena a bad person, but that's no reason to think she'd actually kill someone...

before, if someone asked if you think Serena would've said what she said to alineswoman, you would say that person is crazy. There is no reason to think she'd actually threaten someone.

Crime of passion, crime of opportunity
She could have killed the lineswoman (considering how "passionate" she is, and how she wasn't thinking clearly, and she did have a weapon in her hands. And how the lineswoman was so within range looking "stupidly" with that "bad" call.)
"I is a very passionate person, and I am only human, I can make mistakes"

 

[Rabbit]

Racism is more than "plain stupidity. "Plain stupidity" does not carry the legacy of centuies of subjugation, disrespect and other intolerable abuses. The moral cancer of racism does, and Hewitt's tirade was seen for what it was: stated racism in action. Yes, observers were shocked and offended, yet no punitive action was taken, which carries the stench of official acceptance, when the PTB (with all of their claims of tolerance and singing the praises of King and Ashe) should have eliminated Hewitt for such a monumental offense.

...again, no punitive action was taken.

...again, making Serena's non-violent act seem loving in comparison.





I've watched for decades as well, and Serena's rant pales in comparison to Hewitt's exercise in racial hatred...unless we are now considering Serena's non-threat (as no action was carried out) worse than one of the most destructive kinds of mindsets ever known in human history...

I'm not defending Hewitt, first and foremost.

However, I cannot believe you would seriously think:

"Look at him"

is worse than

"I will take this ####ing ball and stuff it down your ####ing throat and kill you"

Likwise, I don't see

"You're the pitts of the world"

or

"You're a joke"

or

"You're an abortion"

as even in the same class.

When Harold Solomon played Adriano Panatta in the Italian Open and accused the Italian linesmen of making bad calls, was that racist as well? Was Solomon lumping all Italians in the same racist boat? The race card is easily and over played.

Sorry, but race or gender have zero to do with my stance on Serena Williams. Her tirade was totally inappropriate, went far beyond anything I've seen McEnroe or Connors ever do. What sealed the deal was her totally insincere "apology" which was really an excuse clothed as an apology.

In the end, calling someone a name is not the same as threatening physical violence against them. IMO, Serena would have been far better off to call the woman names rather than threatening her. And who wouldn't feel threatened with a 6 foot 180 pound woman weilding a tennis racquet?

 

[pmerk34]

I can understand your skepticism. I too was very surprised to learn that assault does not require that the victim be touched; that is what is required for it to be a battery. Don't take my word for it, check with a good criminal attorney.

Serena was threatening while approaching the woman, spewing profanity and waving a weapon within a few feet of her. Whether or not you believe she would EVER actually hit someone is irrelevant. Her actions incite fear and violence and that is why it is illegal; that is if we value peace and civility in our society. She is a criminal and that is a fact.

Roddick, McEnroe, Conners, Nastase and Hewitt never did anything remotely approaching illegal.

As for the question of it being a 'deadly weapon' , I would ask you what would happen to someone struck several times in the head with a tennis frame made of material stronger than steel [graphite] ?

Serena's actions reveal her character and her unconvincing feign apologies say even more.

Truth ............ very hard to swallow more often than not.

She's not a criminal. That's a fact.

Her actions revealed nothing. If this was who she is we would have seen it dozens of times. Like we did with McEnroe ad naseum

 

[JankovicFan]

So let me ask you something, do you really think Serena would have hit the linesperson and murdered her on the court? Or even more laughable, the people who seem to think Serena would really shove a ball down someone else's throat. You can call Serena a bad person, but that's no reason to think she'd actually kill someone...:roll:

I for one am going to assume that players will from this point be well advised not to wave a racquet at a seated official when standing over them close by and yelling obscenities and threats of physical harm at them.

 

[Azzurri]

I thought what Hewitt did was much worse. I've seen a lot of people in my life totally lose their temper and say they're going to shove something in another person's orifice, and we always understood, "they're angry." But what Hewitt did, if one of my friends did that, I wouldn't hang out with them any more. One is a very generic form of expressing anger in my world. What Hewitt did was much more specific, not just generic s$%t talk I've heard a millions times, but very specific and thought out. With that said, I don't hate the guy.

LOL...on the soap box. Give me a break. who are you kidding. friends (true friends) are people you accept for whatever faults they have. Not talking about being buddies with Hitler, but if a buddy made a silly comment like Hewitt its just that, SILLY. You must have world class friends..the best of the best. I assume they give all their money to the poor, never curse, read instead of watch TV, etc, etc, etc...the perfect person. Again, you are completely full of crap.

 

[drakulie]

"F" is the only grade for you, junior. Here is the reason why: Hewitt's disgusting self rants about the race of his two targets--all out in the open--but you want to wave your limp, magic spin stick and transform Serena's tirade into one which had no trace of racism at all.

Try again, boy.

I undertand. Serena is such a victim of racsim, she is actually someone's slave, picking cotton in somones backyard. Further, she is only allowed to prepare for Slams, which expalins her poor results at other tourneys, and not being able to reach # 1 in the world. She is also force fed krispy kreme to keep her fat. A grand master plan brought on by the "White Man". :roll:


Fact is, she was way out of line and the USTA is also out of line for not immediately suspending her. Her actions are way worse than Hewitt, making some silly little remark from over 100 feet away to a linesman.

LOL...on the soap box. Give me a break. who are you kidding. friends (true friends) are people you accept for whatever faults they have. Not talking about being buddies with Hitler, but if a buddy made a silly comment like Hewitt its just that, SILLY. You must have world class friends..the best of the best. I assume they give all their money to the poor, never curse, read instead of watch TV, etc, etc, etc...the perfect person. Again, you are completely full of crap.

Agreed. These momos will do everything they can to make EVERYTHING about racism. Fact is, they are the racists, and ones who try desperatley to cling on to anything, however miniscule, so they could jump at it and call it "racism" to excuse any type of behavior.

 

[Rabbit]

Agreed. These momos will do everything they can to make EVERYTHING about racism. Fact is, they are the racists, and ones who try desperatley to cling on to anything, however miniscule, so they could jump at it and call it "racism" to excuse any type of behavior.

^^^^^^^^^^^
Agreed and very well stated. Any and all discussions used to end when the card was played. It is an old and tired one and just doesn't work any more. How in the world anyone can defend Williams' actions, her inability to admit fault, and her total and classless defense of her actions is beyond me. If racism were truly a problem, Serena Williams would not be a part owner in the Miami Dolphins or a multi-millionaire.

Hewitt has proven himself an idiot on more than one occasion, my saying that does not make me jingoist again Australia. Quite the contrary, judging someone's character by their actions the standard by which we should all be judged. Defending those actions or excusing them by accusing others of racism is a racist action in itself.

 

[Azzurri]

Drakulie,
it simply amazes me how race is even brought into this situation. I have as thick a skin as anyone and could care less about political correctness. I rather enjoy when a players argues (when they have something to fight for or have good reason) with officials. While I think the call was poor (it seems as if she did foot-fault) simply because of timing, Serena showed her inner anger that she obviously hides. I never cared for either Williams, but race has nothing to do with it. It's all about the attitude. I cannot stand Sharapova and she is lilly white. I dislike all three for the exact same reason. But no one would accuse me of racism with Sharapova, but say something bad about a minority person and the poop hits the fan.

Bottom line, Serena went way, way over the top in a live, televised event. I believe she did threaten to kill the lineswomen (why would she make something like that up? there were hundreds of people within earshot and others heard it). Mac was suspended (people forget) for like 6 months for his outburst (at the AO?). This is no different. How she is not suspended is beyond me. I was redcarded and suspended for 6 matches (in my soccer playing days) for calling the ref a fat sow. This is far worse.

At first I was not bothered much by it, but after some time to think about the sitation, Serena should have been suspended.

 

[pmerk34]

Drakulie,
it simply amazes me how race is even brought into this situation. I have as thick a skin as anyone and could care less about political correctness. I rather enjoy when a players argues (when they have something to fight for or have good reason) with officials. While I think the call was poor (it seems as if she did foot-fault) simply because of timing, Serena showed her inner anger that she obviously hides. I never cared for either Williams, but race has nothing to do with it. It's all about the attitude. I cannot stand Sharapova and she is lilly white. I dislike all three for the exact same reason. But no one would accuse me of racism with Sharapova, but say something bad about a minority person and the poop hits the fan.

Bottom line, Serena went way, way over the top in a live, televised event. I believe she did threaten to kill the lineswomen (why would she make something like that up? there were hundreds of people within earshot and others heard it). Mac was suspended (people forget) for like 6 months for his outburst (at the AO?). This is no different. How she is not suspended is beyond me. I was redcarded and suspended for 6 matches (in my soccer playing days) for calling the ref a fat sow. This is far worse.

At first I was not bothered much by it, but after some time to think about the sitation, Serena should have been suspended.

She may still yet get suspended

 

[jorel]

i also agree that the race card is being overplayed here...

if Kim had done the same thing as Serena (which i could never see her doing) i would have the same opinion of Kim...

it would actaully be scarier if Kim did it...nothing scarier than a nice girl snapping into a psycho

 

[jorel]

to me... when you look at Serena right after the call.. she seems calm... it almost seems like shes calculating what she wants to do next and decides to explode... im not so sure if it was pure passion or a delibrate decision to verbally threaten the line judge

 

[CaptainInsano]

Man, that degenerated badly for sure... I had to go a couple of pages back to see where it all started: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=3944537#post3944537

I think drakulie was being sarcastic as bringing the Hewitt incident to position Serena's incident as "not as bad incident as it may seem" was a bad judgement on your part THUNDERVOLLEY.

2 separate events, 2 separate behaviours adn 2 separate actions.

Hewitt incident (for reference, I had to use it to refresh my memory): http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/tennis/2001/us_open/news/2001/09/01/hewitt_folo/

Going back to the point: Serena verbally threatened a person with her choice of words and physically showed violent behaviour by the tone of voice used, pointing and shaking her racquet at the line judge.

It goes much farther than a simple comment.

 

[Azzurri]

She may still yet get suspended

Have you heard anything? You could be right. I guess it depends on the professional league the athlete is associated with. But the WTA will look bad if they don't do more. Look at Justin Gimelstob. He was crucified because he was acting jerky and fooling around (while disrespecting women), but he in now way threatened and verbally assualted anyone. The guy was suspended, removed from ads and was required to sit down with Billie Jean (very classy and respectful person). Fining Serena 10 cents (to her 10K is 10 cents to me) is a joke.

 

[topspin]

Ok imagine this: you walk into a hospital or clinic and you act like Serena. Result: you arrested. Now if you act like Hewitt did then you'd just get frowned upon. Big difference. Verbal and physical intimidation is very real. Anyone who does not realize this is likely to abuse their spouse emotionally and verbally. It is serious and can hurt as much or even more than some physical pain.

 

[Azzurri]

Man, that degenerated badly for sure... I had to go a couple of pages back to see where it all started: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=3944537#post3944537

I think drakulie was being sarcastic as bringing the Hewitt incident to position Serena's incident as "not as bad incident as it may seem" was a bad judgement on your part THUNDERVOLLEY.

2 separate events, 2 separate behaviours adn 2 separate actions.

Hewitt incident (for reference, I had to use it to refresh my memory): http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/tennis/2001/us_open/news/2001/09/01/hewitt_folo/

Going back to the point: Serena verbally threatened a person with her choice of words and physically showed violent behaviour by the tone of voice used, pointing and shaking her racquet at the line judge.

It goes much farther than a simple comment.

How anyone can compare the two incidents is beyond me. Someposters are just a sad joke.

 

[rommil]

So much for equality and equal prize money at the US Open. The USTA would have reacted differently if we change the characters a little bit. Imagine if the player and the linesperson were both men or if the player was male and the linesperson female. Worse, if the player were white and the linesperson was black.
Yet disregarding those alternate scenarios, Serena should get some amount of suspension. It's not only what she did, it was what she said.

 

[THUNDERVOLLEY]

I undertand. Serena is such a victim of racsim, she is actually someone's slave, picking cotton in somones backyard. Further, she is only allowed to prepare for Slams, which expalins her poor results at other tourneys, and not being able to reach # 1 in the world. She is also force fed krispy kreme to keep her fat. A grand master plan brought on by the "White Man". :roll:

^ Completely bereft of even rudimentary sense. The wheels are off and just rolling down the road to nonsenseville.

Fact is, she was way out of line and the USTA is also out of line for not immediately suspending her. Her actions are way worse than Hewitt, making some silly little remark from over 100 feet away to a linesman.

Of course you would say this. You do not believe racism to be a moral cancer, so you will downplay Hewitt's unforgivabe tirade, while trying to pump mere anger in the moment, which is not a constant. Racism is a constant--a hardline, hard wired system of beliefs, not some "in the moment" but unusual psychological collapse. Because it is not, Hewitt instantly leaping to racist conclusions only illustrates the colossal level of ingrained hatred he carried within him, sending a significantly stronger message to the world about his nature (and the PTB for side-stepping it) than short-lived anger anyone can express.

 

[drakulie]

^ Completely bereft of even rudimentary sense. The wheels are off and just rolling down the road to nonsenseville.



Of course you would say this. You do not believe racism to be a moral cancer, so you will downplay Hewitt's unforgivabe tirade, while trying to pump mere anger in the moment, which is not a constant. Racism is a constant--a hardline, hard wired system of beliefs, not some "in the moment" but unusual psychological collapse. Because it is not, Hewitt instantly leaping to racist conclusions only illustrates the colossal level of ingrained hatred he carried within him, sending a significantly stronger message to the world about his nature (and the PTB for side-stepping it) than short-lived anger anyone can express.

Wow. :shock:

So let me get this straight. We should develop a scientific engineering marvel, that is able to look into our thoughts, and punish us acordingly?

You've watched one too many bad movies. This isn't, Minority Report where people are arrested/prosecuted/punished before they actually act.

Try again.

 

[precision2b]

Drakulie,
it simply amazes me how race is even brought into this situation. I have as thick a skin as anyone and could care less about political correctness. I rather enjoy when a players argues (when they have something to fight for or have good reason) with officials. While I think the call was poor (it seems as if she did foot-fault) simply because of timing, Serena showed her inner anger that she obviously hides. I never cared for either Williams, but race has nothing to do with it. It's all about the attitude. I cannot stand Sharapova and she is lilly white. I dislike all three for the exact same reason. But no one would accuse me of racism with Sharapova, but say something bad about a minority person and the poop hits the fan.
Bottom line, Serena went way, way over the top in a live, televised event. I believe she did threaten to kill the lineswomen (why would she make something like that up? there were hundreds of people within earshot and others heard it). Mac was suspended (people forget) for like 6 months for his outburst (at the AO?). This is no different. How she is not suspended is beyond me. I was redcarded and suspended for 6 matches (in my soccer playing days) for calling the ref a fat sow. This is far worse.

At first I was not bothered much by it, but after some time to think about the sitation, Serena should have been suspended.

I agree Azzurri. 100% I don’t care much for Sharapova for the same reasons I don’t like the Williams sisters…

 

[drakulie]

I agree Azzurri. 100% I don’t care much for Sharapova for the same reasons I don’t like the Williams sisters…

I'm sure there is a woman out there somewhere that will read, Azzurri's post and say, "he is racist towards women".

 

[CaptainInsano]

^ Completely bereft of even rudimentary sense. The wheels are off and just rolling down the road to nonsenseville.



Of course you would say this. You do not believe racism to be a moral cancer, so you will downplay Hewitt's unforgivabe tirade, while trying to pump mere anger in the moment, which is not a constant. Racism is a constant--a hardline, hard wired system of beliefs, not some "in the moment" but unusual psychological collapse. Because it is not, Hewitt instantly leaping to racist conclusions only illustrates the colossal level of ingrained hatred he carried within him, sending a significantly stronger message to the world about his nature (and the PTB for side-stepping it) than short-lived anger anyone can express.

Come on man. You're trying to make this about racism and about Hewitt's incident. I see that by bringing racism into the pot here you want to make it sound like reacting to Serena's event could be racist since that level of reaction was not shown for Hewitt's.

Again, 2 completely separate events with different things that were said. You can't expect something that happened 8 years ago should be used as input for what's currently happening.

This is about what Serena did and what the WTA should do. The fact that she happens to be african-american is irrelevant.

 

[Breaker]

^ Completely bereft of even rudimentary sense. The wheels are off and just rolling down the road to nonsenseville.



Of course you would say this. You do not believe racism to be a moral cancer, so you will downplay Hewitt's unforgivabe tirade, while trying to pump mere anger in the moment, which is not a constant. Racism is a constant--a hardline, hard wired system of beliefs, not some "in the moment" but unusual psychological collapse. Because it is not, Hewitt instantly leaping to racist conclusions only illustrates the colossal level of ingrained hatred he carried within him, sending a significantly stronger message to the world about his nature (and the PTB for side-stepping it) than short-lived anger anyone can express.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dUGXtiMNqk&feature=related

The actual incident, Blake isn't even brought into the discussion and he doesn't point at Blake either. Before he says the "look at him and tell me what the similarity is" he says that it's only happening on one end of the court. Far too inconclusive to classify it as a racist tirade or something worse than threatening to...well that one's self explanatory.

 

[sureshs]

Why is no one asking whether the lineswoman was racist? It was clearly not a foot fault, as shown by the replay and by JMac's remarks at that time. Why was she so eager to call it? And why did she pretend that Serena's remarks, which is the way many people talk in private or in humor about shoving something somewhere, was about killing her? She sure seemed to be very eager and ready with complaints, almost as if she had planned to bait Serena.

This is not the first time this has happened to the sisters. Some years ago, a female chair umpire advised one of their opponents to challenge a call.

People seem to always talk about racism as a Black and White issue. But Asians can be very racist as well.

 

[Keifers]

Why is no one asking whether the lineswoman was racist? It was clearly not a foot fault, as shown by the replay and by JMac's remarks at that time. Why was she so eager to call it? And why did she pretend that Serena's remarks, which is the way many people talk in private or in humor about shoving something somewhere, was about killing her? She sure seemed to be very eager and ready with complaints, almost as if she had planned to bait Serena.

This is not the first time this has happened to the sisters. Some years ago, a female chair umpire advised one of their opponents to challenge a call.

People seem to always talk about racism as a Black and White issue. But Asians can be very racist as well.

Are you Asian?

I just want to know where you're coming from on this.

 

[sureshs]

Are you Asian?

I just want to know where you're coming from on this.

I did not say the lineswoman was upto something. I asked: why is nobody even mentioning the possibility? I watched the incident twice. I don't believe that someone who is used to being around pro players doesn't know how they talk. The lineswoman seemed to be have a built-in fear of Serena. Maybe it was her relative size, I don't know. We should start from the starting point: a wrong call at a crucial moment in the match. How much of it was incompetence and how much was it a desire to make Clijsters win as soon as possible? Probably, 100% and 0%, but I don't know.

 

[Rabbit]

Why is no one asking whether the lineswoman was racist? It was clearly not a foot fault, as shown by the replay and by JMac's remarks at that time.

Really? I watched the match and did not see an angle that showed that. Certainly there was no angle as good as the linesperson had on the call. Serena herself said she had been called for footfaulting the entire tournament. Serena herself said "maybe I was footfaulting".

And yet you would imply the lineswoman was racist? Hello?

Why was she so eager to call it?

Because it's her job? You see when you call the baseline, you have to make the call.

What makes you think she was eager? I thought she was fairly routine about it. Your choice of wording is prejudicial to say the least. It's prejudicial in support of an assumption; a false one at that.

And why did she pretend that Serena's remarks,

Pretend? So the incident never happened? Serena didn't make the remarks?

which is the way many people talk in private or in humor

Serena was neither in private or being humorous.

about shoving something somewhere, was about killing her?

I'd take this ####ing ball and shove it down your ####ing throat and kill you.

Does that clear it up for you? Serena didn't intend for the ball once shoved down the throat to feed her...and Serena said as much herself. It was so bad, that Serena would not repeat what she said in her press conference. Williams knew she'd crossed the line.

She sure seemed to be very eager and ready with complaints,

It is the duty of a linesperson to report violations. They are told that. It is called doing their job.

Watch the tape. The linesperson, while taking the abuse, looks over to the chair. I believe she was waived over by the chair.

Agassi was defaulted from the Sybase a number of years ago for comments made to a linesperson. He said something, the linesperson got up and reported it. When the linesperson came back, Agassi said something else and the linesperson made another trip. Agassi was defaulted.

almost as if she had planned to bait Serena.

This is the single most ridiculous statement, even for you, that I've seen yet.

This is not the first time this has happened to the sisters. Some years ago, a female chair umpire advised one of their opponents to challenge a call.

Umpires routinely advise players to challenge. In the mens' finals, the chair was freely telling either player that the ball was clearly out, or that they could/should challenge. To suggest that this is somehow racially motivated behavior on the part of the chair is again, ridiculous and disingenuous.

People seem to always talk about racism as a Black and White issue. But Asians can be very racist as well.

I think is your most telling comment.

 

[sureshs]

^ Completely bereft of even rudimentary sense. The wheels are off and just rolling down the road to nonsenseville.



Of course you would say this. You do not believe racism to be a moral cancer, so you will downplay Hewitt's unforgivabe tirade, while trying to pump mere anger in the moment, which is not a constant. Racism is a constant--a hardline, hard wired system of beliefs, not some "in the moment" but unusual psychological collapse. Because it is not, Hewitt instantly leaping to racist conclusions only illustrates the colossal level of ingrained hatred he carried within him, sending a significantly stronger message to the world about his nature (and the PTB for side-stepping it) than short-lived anger anyone can express.

Good points. Same points were made by Jimmy Carter yesterday about Joe Wilson. The immediate cause always looks like something else, but most likely the behavior pattern is deep rooted. It is only when the full picture is looked at that such things become obvious - namely, what happened in other situations and with other people, and what did not happen.

In this case, Serena deserves a huge fine and a suspension. That goes without saying.

 

[CaptainInsano]

I did not say the lineswoman was upto something. I asked: why is nobody even mentioning the possibility? I watched the incident twice. I don't believe that someone who is used to being around pro players doesn't know how they talk. The lineswoman seemed to be have a built-in fear of Serena. Maybe it was her relative size, I don't know. We should start from the starting point: a wrong call at a crucial moment in the match. How much of it was incompetence and how much was it a desire to make Clijsters win as soon as possible? Probably, 100% and 0%, but I don't know.

This is far fetched don't you think?

What if there was a foot fault and she didn't called it because it was "too close and too much of a delicate moment in the match". Would that be fair to the other player (especially if she could end up loosing the match)?

There was not just Serena and the lineswoman at that match. It's a Grand Slam event, not a backyard friendly match. There were 20,000+ people plus the millions (?) watching it. Completely different context than arguing in a locker room.

 

[Rabbit]

I did not say the lineswoman was upto something. I asked: why is nobody even mentioning the possibility? I watched the incident twice. I don't believe that someone who is used to being around pro players doesn't know how they talk. The lineswoman seemed to be have a built-in fear of Serena. Maybe it was her relative size, I don't know. We should start from the starting point: a wrong call at a crucial moment in the match. How much of it was incompetence and how much was it a desire to make Clijsters win as soon as possible? Probably, 100% and 0%, but I don't know.

That's exactly what you said! Don't crawfish now.

How do you know the call was wrong? Did you see a definitive angle? Even Williams said she was foot faulting and had been called in all her matches. Were all the linesmen out to get her?

The only starting point here was Serena Williams total loss of control after a call was made. To say that it was a "wrong call" is completely an assumption on your part. You don't know because you weren't on the baseline. The lady that called the footfault hadn't done anything during the entire match to provoke Williams. Williams was getting her butt beat and just vented on the poor woman. She was having a bad day and took it out on someone she figured she could abuse without any fear of retribution or reprisal and she was wrong.

Williams should be suspended for 6 months.

 

[sureshs]

Really? I watched the match and did not see an angle that showed that. Certainly there was no angle as good as the linesperson had on the call. Serena herself said she had been called for footfaulting the entire tournament. Serena herself said "maybe I was footfaulting".

And yet you would imply the lineswoman was racist? Hello?



Because it's her job? You see when you call the baseline, you have to make the call.

What makes you think she was eager? I thought she was fairly routine about it. Your choice of wording is prejudicial to say the least. It's prejudicial in support of an assumption; a false one at that.



Pretend? So the incident never happened? Serena didn't make the remarks?



Serena was neither in private or being humorous.





Does that clear it up for you? Serena didn't intend for the ball once shoved down the throat to feed her...and Serena said as much herself. It was so bad, that Serena would not repeat what she said in her press conference. Williams knew she'd crossed the line.



It is the duty of a linesperson to report violations. They are told that. It is called doing their job.

Watch the tape. The linesperson, while taking the abuse, looks over to the chair. I believe she was waived over by the chair.

Agassi was defaulted from the Sybase a number of years ago for comments made to a linesperson. He said something, the linesperson got up and reported it. When the linesperson came back, Agassi said something else and the linesperson made another trip. Agassi was defaulted.



This is the single most ridiculous statement, even for you, that I've seen yet.




Umpires routinely advise players to challenge. In the mens' finals, the chair was freely telling either player that the ball was clearly out, or that they could/should challenge. To suggest that this is somehow racially motivated behavior on the part of the chair is again, ridiculous and disingenuous.



I think is your most telling comment.

The incident I am refering to about the chair was different, not like with Fed and DP.

You are right though. There is no evidence to support any bias of the lineswoman. I am asking why no one has raised it, while Serena hate threads pop up all over the place on any boring day.

 

[Rabbit]

Good points. Same points were made by Jimmy Carter yesterday about Joe Wilson. The immediate cause always looks like something else, but most likely the behavior pattern is deep rooted. It is only when the full picture is looked at that such things become obvious - namely, what happened in other situations and with other people, and what did not happen.

In this case, Serena deserves a huge fine and a suspension. That goes without saying.

So now we bring Joe Wilson and Jimmy Carter into this? You have gone from the ridiculous to the sublime.

Joe Wilson should face censure. He is not racist, he's an idiot. He is a living, breathing representation of how dumbed down even the Congress has become. To suggest that everyone living in the South is somehow ingrained with racism is stupid, plain stupid.

 

[Keifers]

I did not say the lineswoman was upto something. I asked: why is nobody even mentioning the possibility? I watched the incident twice. I don't believe that someone who is used to being around pro players doesn't know how they talk. The lineswoman seemed to be have a built-in fear of Serena. Maybe it was her relative size, I don't know. We should start from the starting point: a wrong call at a crucial moment in the match. How much of it was incompetence and how much was it a desire to make Clijsters win as soon as possible? Probably, 100% and 0%, but I don't know.

Are you Asian? I ask because if you are, your comment may come from particular insight or experience or knowledge.

 

[sureshs]

That's exactly what you said! Don't crawfish now.

How do you know the call was wrong? Did you see a definitive angle? Even Williams said she was foot faulting and had been called in all her matches. Were all the linesmen out to get her?

The only starting point here was Serena Williams total loss of control after a call was made. To say that it was a "wrong call" is completely an assumption on your part. You don't know because you weren't on the baseline. The lady that called the footfault hadn't done anything during the entire match to provoke Williams. Williams was getting her butt beat and just vented on the poor woman. She was having a bad day and took it out on someone she figured she could abuse without any fear of retribution or reprisal and she was wrong.

Williams should be suspended for 6 months.

I saw the incident, and heard JMac.

How did you know that Nadal was doping (your famous deleted thread)? You never provided any sources that you mentioned. Here, at least I can use my own eyes. How did you conclude Nadal was doping?

 

[CaptainInsano]

Foot fault rule: http://www.tennisonline.net/rules/rules/rule8.html

"USTA Comment: This rule covers the most decisive stroke in the game, and there is no justification for its not being obeyed by players and enforced by officials. No official has the right to instruct any umpire to disregard violations of it. In a non-officiated match, the Receiver, or his partner, may call foot faults after all efforts (appeal to the server, request for an umpire, etc.) have failed and the foot faulting is so flagrant as to be clearly perceptible from the Receiver's side.

It is improper for any official to warn a player that he is in danger of having a foot fault called on him. On the other hand, if a player asks for an explanation of how he foot faulted, either the Line Umpire or the Chair Umpire should give him that information."

 

[Rabbit]

There is no evidence to support any bias of the lineswoman.

Then why introduce something so inflammatory? To accuse the victim of somehow wanting it? asking for it? You truly have sunk to a new low.

I am asking why no one has raised it, while Serena hate threads pop up all over the place on any boring day.

No one has asked it because it is just plain ridiculous.

 

[Bloodshed]

Get over it people, she apologized. You all demanded it, she did it, yet you still find flaws in it. It's ridiculous.

Ok I'll tell you why this bothers me alot:

Yes she wrote a formal speech before her doubles match, yes she wrote another apology on her blog forun, however she had a chance to apologize in her post match interview, she didn't. She had a chance to apologize after her win in her doubles match while being interviewed by Patrick Mcenroe, she didn't. She had another chance in Good Morning America where they were talking about her book and came the question to apologize, she never did.

That's why her written "apologies" are phoney and insincere. She's a selfish human being.

 

[sureshs]

So now we bring Joe Wilson and Jimmy Carter into this? You have gone from the ridiculous to the sublime.

Joe Wilson should face censure. He is not racist, he's an idiot. He is a living, breathing representation of how dumbed down even the Congress has become. To suggest that everyone living in the South is somehow ingrained with racism is stupid, plain stupid.

No thanks, I will go with Carter, the genuinely humane and religious man, than the hypocrites of today. I think he has a much better geniune insight into many things than anyone on this board. And I think he has lived there much longer than everyone else.

 

[sureshs]

Then why introduce something so inflammatory?

What were your sources for Nadal doping?

 

[split-step]

Ok I'll tell you why this bothers me alot:

Yes she wrote a formal speech before her doubles match, yes she wrote another apology on her blog forun, however she had a chance to apologize in her post match interview, she didn't. She had a chance to apologize after her win in her doubles match while being interviewed by Patrick Mcenroe, she didn't. She had another chance in Good Morning America where they were talking about her book and came the question to apologize, she never did.

That's why her written "apologies" are phoney and insincere. She's a selfish human being.

If she had done all those things, there are people that still will not be satisfied and call her apologies phony.
Someone has already said, you don't go from being as angry as she was to penitent. In that case, nothing she does will suffice!

Serena knows and will do what's best for Serena. She also knows whether her apologies are sincere or not.

As for me, I will let the ITF do what it has to do and leave it at that. I have taken her apology and it is good enough for me.

 

[Libertarian]

Doesn't she have some professional available to proof read stuff like this first? It's one thing when you can't control what you are saying (on and off court) but once you put anything in writing, have it checked by some one who does these things for a living and might count the number of times you use the word "I" when it is about "you". It's all phony anyway so you might as well.

 

[sureshs]

Ok I'll tell you why this bothers me alot:

Yes she wrote a formal speech before her doubles match, yes she wrote another apology on her blog forun, however she had a chance to apologize in her post match interview, she didn't. She had a chance to apologize after her win in her doubles match while being interviewed by Patrick Mcenroe, she didn't. She had another chance in Good Morning America where they were talking about her book and came the question to apologize, she never did.

That's why her written "apologies" are phoney and insincere. She's a selfish human being.

Why she "apologized" partially:

1. To reduce the fine and suspension by indicating her remorse publicly
2. Because others in high positions forced her to
3. She wants to fend off any possible lawsuit by the lineswoman

Why she didn't apologize fully?

1. She is arrogant
2. The call was wrong.

 

[Rabbit]

No thanks, I will go with Carter, the genuinely humane and religious man, than the hypocrites of today.

and probably the worst president of the 20th century, what's your point? Does that mean he's infallible? Hardly. If you had any perspective, you'd remember 20% interest rates when he was president.

Carter hardly got anything right when he was president. Carter has come out with other off the wall comments in the last few years. Carter's mother even said she should have remained a virigin.

I think he has a much better geniune insight into many things than anyone on this board.

Really? And what exactly gives him these "insights"? What qualifies him as knowing Joe Wilson and what is in the man's heart? It's clear Joe Wilson is a brainless dweeb with no respect, but to dub him racist? That's a stretch for most logical people, but I can see how you'd jump to it.

And I think he has lived there much longer than everyone else.

Wow! So being an old far qualifies you for being smart? How does living a long time in Georgia qualify Carter for anything other than what goes on in Georgia?

What were your sources for Nadal doping?

Sources inside the professional game, smart guy, what are yours other than your own ASSumptions?

 

[Bloodshed]

If she had done all those things, there are people that still will not be satisfied and call her apologies phony.
Someone has already said, you don't go from being as angry as she was to penitent. In that case, nothing she does will suffice!

Serena knows and will do what's best for Serena. She also knows whether her apologies are sincere or not.

As for me, I will let the ITF do what it has to do and leave it at that. I have taken her apology and it is good enough for me.

I get what you're saying. But all I'm saying is she can write a million of apologies on forums, blogs, etc... but they will always sound bogus because I hardly believe she wrote any of this.

In the end, I'll have to accept it because I know deep down inside, she's not sorry for her actions.

 

[Bloodshed]

Why she "apologized" partially:

1. To reduce the fine and suspension by indicating her remorse publicly
2. Because others in high positions forced her to
3. She wants to fend off any possible lawsuit by the lineswoman

Why she didn't apologize fully?

1. She is arrogant
2. The call was wrong.

I agree with you about the partially apology because otherwise she would be in trouble with a severe suspension, lawsuit etc... I'm sure her intelligent agent told her the procedures within the next couple of days and what to do kind of stuff.

Now whether the call was wrong or not will never be justified since the evidence is not good enough proof of that. It's just soo sad that the greatest WTA player of the last decade is also the most despicable of them all.

 

[sureshs]

Sources inside the professional game, smart guy, what are yours other than your own ASSumptions?

Sad that your thread was deleted.

Your standards of judgement must be much higher than mine. I saw it on TV and heard a tennis legend say it was a wrong call. What were your standards? At least name the insider sources. Surely you are not a person who reads other's minds and jumps to conclusions? You must have not only seen Nadal do it, you must also have analyzed the chemical composition before your inflammatory thread. So please tell us how you knew about Nadal's doping.

 

[rommil]

Everything so far is a PR stint. It would do Serena good if she seeked out the lineswoman and apologize face to big face and keep what transpires on the meeting to themselves.