deltox
Hall of Fame
i dont hate her on a personal level, but i despise her attitude making me have an overall distaste for her and anything she does or stands for. Her Ego is also in the way or my approval as well, although it doesnt matter to her.
Serena: beaten by lucky shots
- Thread starter Marius_Hancu
- Start date
i dont hate her on a personal level, but i despise her attitude making me have an overall distaste for her and anything she does or stands for. Her Ego is also in the way or my approval as well, although it doesnt matter to her.
T. H. Park
Professional
Would you personally say something like "s/he is a good framer and was lucky ... was going for broke ..." whenever you lose? Maybe once in every 1000 matches when it is "really" the case but not on the pro level. She does this habitually when she loses.
I am assuming, for your own sake, that you do not make any such insulting statements. If someone would do that, I would have no respect for that person. It's not about hate. Just no respect. Makes sense?
David_Is_Right
Semi-Pro
A match of two juiced-up freaks... hardly surprising the loser was insulting in the press conference. 'Roid rage.
I remember she said something very similiar a while back when she lost to Justine Henin. She said something to the effect of "it was just one lucky shot after another."
When it comes to sportsmanship she's pathetic.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
bruh, in a perfect world, should she probably not say these things... yes, ur right. Would i say this stuff, of course not. Would Manolo Orantes say this kind of stuff, hell no! But, that said, when ur the best at wat u do u have a couple of priveleges not afforded to those who havent won 11 grand slams. Safina saying something like, "she's a good framer" is not the same as Serena saying it. Y? Cuz Serena has the hardware to bak it up. Plus, we all kno that if they pla at the US, Serena will beat her 6-0, 6-1... PERIOD!
deltox
Hall of Fame
bruh, in a perfect world, should she probably not say these things... yes, ur right. Would i say this stuff, of course not. Would Manolo Orantes say this kind of stuff, hell no! But, that said, when ur the best at wat u do u have a couple of priveleges not afforded to those who havent won 11 grand slams. Safina saying something like, "she's a good framer" is not the same as Serena saying it. Y? Cuz Serena has the hardware to bak it up. Plus, we all kno that if they pla at the US, Serena will beat her 6-0, 6-1... PERIOD!
serena is putting alot of pressure on you guys this year, if she doesnt go deep into the uso this year, phewwww.
jamesblakefan#1
G.O.A.T.
The only person the pressure is on is fraud #1 Safina. Now that's true.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
It would be fun if you posted some test results of PED usage, instead of just tossing that out there.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
c'mon bruh, really? i can understand maybe disliking Serena. But this? This is unnecessary and unwarranted, not to mention u cant even bak up such claims, even if u are kidding.:?
deltox
Hall of Fame
im not backing safina for the ranking either, dont get me wrong. But is there a player in the WTA field who actually dominates like a #1 should be, NO. So we have to go with the unbiased mathematical system in play.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Oh, really? Everyone thought Henin was mentally and physically superior to Bartoli leading into their famous Wimbledon semifinal......how did that turn out?
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
You are being paranoid; it was a serious question, and you avoided answering it for reasons that did not exist.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
3 out of 4 grand slams won by one person IS domination.
drwood
Professional
The sad thing about this is that EVERYONE (including Safina) knows that Serena is the best player in the world. The only reason there's controversy is b/c of Serena's classless behavior (this saddens me, b/c I am a big Serena fan) whenever she loses or doesn't get what she wants.
If Serena had handled this situation with class, everyone would be siding with her about being the best in the world -- she gives people reasons to hate her with her off-court behavior.
It would be like Nadal after Wimbledon last year saying "I'm the real #1"...everyone knew he was the best player in the world, even though he was ranked #2, but he had the class not to show up Federer.
I'm glad Serena is taking tennis seriously again, but she needs to show more class...you can't act like Hingis and expect to be loved like Federer.
deltox
Hall of Fame
you cannot base a fair system off 4 events a year. it would ruin the game, the smaller tourneys would be glorfied challengers and sponsorships would be down to bare minimum.
the system in play now is fine. its the same for every player. just take advantage of it as your ability allows you to.
deltox
Hall of Fame
you really do like to work words around to try to make a point huh. i openly admitted not agreeing with you and not wanting to get into a debate with you (because its like arguing with a mile marker on the interstate). give it a rest, your a poster im not going to debate with, call it a victory for you if that makes you sleep better
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
More defensive nonsense instead of answering a question.
deltox
Hall of Fame
here thundervolley this poster answered the question for you.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Opinions < simple math
No wonder most williams fans need an extra 20% to get into college, they suck at math
Aside from other problems inherent in a comment of that nature, I detect something else.....
Grass_for_cows
Semi-Pro
Opinions < simple math
No wonder most williams fans need an extra 20% to get into college, they suck at math
Nobody's saying Serena is #1 based on the ******** ranking system. She has won 3 out of the past 4 majors, seemingly raising her level to destroy the so-called consistent players when it mattered most. Many people, including former and current tennis champions, believe that Serena's achievements put her at the top of the WTA.
But if it makes you feel better about yourself to bash blacks and hispanics with a poorly disguised jab at affirmative action then go ahead and tell the world your racist rants, you uneducated fool.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Excellent retort.
Grass_for_cows
Semi-Pro
I agree %100 with your post, except this! I loved Hingis when she played because she was catty.
Also I'm sure other WTA players will say something crass and stupid if the mic was in their faces as often as it is for Serena.
Lionheart392
Professional
Is this still being discussed? If Serena deserved to be #1 then she would be. She plays on the WTA tour knowing how the ranking system works and if she has a problem with being #2, she should actually try winning more tournaments. If Safina is such a fraud, I guess the lower ranked Serena must be an even bigger fraud. YES she has won 3 of the last 4 grand slams, but as has been said, they play a big part of the tour but they cannot and should not mean EVERYTHING. Let's see Serena step up to the challenge if she truly believes she is the 'real' #1 (and yes Safina should step up and win a slam too, as Deltox said neither of them are perfect).
David_Is_Right
Semi-Pro
Why would I be kidding?
I think you guys need to think a little deeper, its obvious you want serena to be number 1 reguardless of her tennis. But if you made the grand slams worth that much more why would any top players play in the smaller events? It would collapse the wta because they would only have 4 real tournaments a year. You guys need to use your brains instead of your heart.
In the wta they play two out of three sets in the majors and the other tourneys. It would make sense if this arguement were brought up on the atp because they play 3 out 5 thus making it harder to win. But as it is a wta grand slam is nothing more than an event that takes place over a two week span.
Use the ignore list grass, the next post reflecting any knowledge of tennis will be your first. I dont care if you respond to my posts, much less see them.
In the wta they play two out of three sets in the majors and the other tourneys. It would make sense if this arguement were brought up on the atp because they play 3 out 5 thus making it harder to win. But as it is a wta grand slam is nothing more than an event that takes place over a two week span.
Use the ignore list grass, the next post reflecting any knowledge of tennis will be your first. I dont care if you respond to my posts, much less see them.
T. H. Park
Professional
bruh, in a perfect world, should she probably not say these things... yes, ur right. Would i say this stuff, of course not. Would Manolo Orantes say this kind of stuff, hell no! But, that said, when ur the best at wat u do u have a couple of priveleges not afforded to those who havent won 11 grand slams. Safina saying something like, "she's a good framer" is not the same as Serena saying it. Y? Cuz Serena has the hardware to bak it up. Plus, we all kno that if they pla at the US, Serena will beat her 6-0, 6-1... PERIOD!
I don't hold different standards when someone insulting others. On the contrary, if anything, a person at that position should be more careful. Not less. A lot of people look up to her I am sure and she sets a bad example. I would not want any kids learning tennis to see her interviews (when she loses). I would, however, have them watch it to learn what not to do.
There is no doubt in anyone's mind that Serena is one of the best today and probably will go down as one of the best of all-time. That is not the debate we are having.
Also, there is no guarantee that she will beat someone at any majors. Likely, but never a guarantee. She is not that good. She lost before, will lose again, but will definitely win more than lose, that's for sure. However, this has nothing to do with being insulting and rude. In terms of "manners" she is probably at the top bottom rankings.
T. H. Park
Professional
The comment about the 20% was uncalled for. However, Serena almost lost at the Wimby SF 2009. She was facing match-point. Hardly destroying everyone. She is good. She is, however, not that good and is certainly not no.1 in the rankings, however bad the system is. She got beat fair and square.
DunlopDood
Semi-Pro
Yes lucky shots indeed. Certainly poignant coming from a player whose on court movement is comparable to that of a drunk mule stumbling around. Never liked her or her game, her attitude stinks too.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
WOW! one tough match!!!! Congrats!!!!! U found ONE tough match out of all her grand slam victories!!!! WOOOOWWW!!!! Bruh, if u pla usta tournaments, u kno that if u have one tough match in the semis of a tourni, but straight set everyone else, that u r dominanting the competition... PERIOD.
S
Serendipitous
Guest
LafayetteHitter
Hall of Fame
Yet another screaming example of why S Williams is a d@uche nozzle.
Grass_for_cows
Semi-Pro
Vote for Serena is vote for democracy
It's too bad that Serena gives ammunition to her racist detractors, but feeling is these criticisms will exist with or without her infamous interviews. I feel this way because too often things said about Serena betray complete refusal by the her detractors to acknowledge reality and context. (This is not, of course, always the case. Some criticisms are clearly valid.)
There are worse things can be done in tennis than being stuck-up in the news conference. For instance cheating is far worse than bad interviews, yet someone like Henin who has cheated both blatantly and subtly throughout her career is treated like some tennis messiah.
And who knows what god awful thing Stosur or Wozniacki or whatever is thinking? It's just that they are not given the mic-time given to Serena because they suck.
I sure wouldn't want young children to learn Serena's manners, but that's still hell of a lot better than learning to cheat like some of the other WTA players who do not receive nearly as much hate as does Serena. And that's ultimately my point: Serena is held to a different standard from other champions.
And this is true also regarding her game and her looks. As ugly as she is, Serena is still 100 times more attractive than Dementieva or Hantuchova. She is unfit, but she is one of the best movers ever in the WTA. Her game is as well-rounded as anyone's (in the WTA), and she is also multiple slam winner in doubles. But she is forever type-cast as some Lindsay Davenport clone without the ball-striking skill who just kinda smacks her way through tournaments without ever moving her feet or thinking at all.
When assessing criticism of Serena, one must also assess what is not said in the context. This assessment leads me to believe that racism is at least an unconscious motivation driving much of Serena-hate. I urge all you haters to change your mind, find peace with yourself, and say one nice thing about Serena each day for the new few weeks.
It's too bad that Serena gives ammunition to her racist detractors, but feeling is these criticisms will exist with or without her infamous interviews. I feel this way because too often things said about Serena betray complete refusal by the her detractors to acknowledge reality and context. (This is not, of course, always the case. Some criticisms are clearly valid.)
There are worse things can be done in tennis than being stuck-up in the news conference. For instance cheating is far worse than bad interviews, yet someone like Henin who has cheated both blatantly and subtly throughout her career is treated like some tennis messiah.
And who knows what god awful thing Stosur or Wozniacki or whatever is thinking? It's just that they are not given the mic-time given to Serena because they suck.
I sure wouldn't want young children to learn Serena's manners, but that's still hell of a lot better than learning to cheat like some of the other WTA players who do not receive nearly as much hate as does Serena. And that's ultimately my point: Serena is held to a different standard from other champions.
And this is true also regarding her game and her looks. As ugly as she is, Serena is still 100 times more attractive than Dementieva or Hantuchova. She is unfit, but she is one of the best movers ever in the WTA. Her game is as well-rounded as anyone's (in the WTA), and she is also multiple slam winner in doubles. But she is forever type-cast as some Lindsay Davenport clone without the ball-striking skill who just kinda smacks her way through tournaments without ever moving her feet or thinking at all.
When assessing criticism of Serena, one must also assess what is not said in the context. This assessment leads me to believe that racism is at least an unconscious motivation driving much of Serena-hate. I urge all you haters to change your mind, find peace with yourself, and say one nice thing about Serena each day for the new few weeks.
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err i think its more so because they have respect for other players and like to keep it to themselves?
Toxicmilk
Professional
I respectfully disagree :twisted:
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Ahh, but in their minds, Henin can do no wrong, when it is evident the woman added new chapters to the Bad Sportsmanship Handbook throughout her career. What's worse is that Henin committed her acts on-court, not some interview, where alleged bad sportsmanship does not change the course of a match......yet, how many criticize her?
Agreed.
jamesblakefan#1
G.O.A.T.
I agree w/ the point a/b Henin. One of the worst sports in the history of tennis, and yet she's treated as a savior of tennis on here, just b/c she had a "pretty" one handed bh.
If Serena had done the stuff Henin did (quitting in a slam final, the hand incident), they would have still wanted her banned from tennis. Yet Henin's treated as if she was God's gift to tennis, just b/c her game was pretty, but her actions on the court were far from pretty at times.
Double standards at work.
It was nice to see the double standards in full light earlier this yr, when Serena's opponent @ the FO cheated and lied a/b the ball hitting her, and some fools said that Serena should just STFU and play, instead of exposing the obvious cheat her opponent committed. Ridiculous how much some hate Serena.
Not that it's not warranted at times, but there's still an extra venom there that makes me wonder at times if there's more to it than just her words that shapes people's opinion.
If Serena had done the stuff Henin did (quitting in a slam final, the hand incident), they would have still wanted her banned from tennis. Yet Henin's treated as if she was God's gift to tennis, just b/c her game was pretty, but her actions on the court were far from pretty at times.
Double standards at work.
It was nice to see the double standards in full light earlier this yr, when Serena's opponent @ the FO cheated and lied a/b the ball hitting her, and some fools said that Serena should just STFU and play, instead of exposing the obvious cheat her opponent committed. Ridiculous how much some hate Serena.
Not that it's not warranted at times, but there's still an extra venom there that makes me wonder at times if there's more to it than just her words that shapes people's opinion.
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egn
Hall of Fame
Did anyone look up framer? It means constructor of points? Didn't Serena also say it is all talent in regards to Stosur? Oh yea and seriously do any of you watch the matches or just read the interviews because Stosur made some damn ass lucky shots. I swear if I would have been playing against her I would have thrown my racket and been like what the hell can't I catch a break.
P.s. SERENA IS ARROGANT. We all know this. The first thing I thought in my head was if she losses she will talk about lucky shots. Boom sure enough she does. This is like nothing new. This is like Nadal knee injuries, nalbandian being overweight and Murray actually being scottish. We have heard it all before. Lets move on to something more important. You know the actual tennis and the fact that Stosur is randomly improving out of nowhere and ignore Serena's big fat mouth.
P.s. SERENA IS ARROGANT. We all know this. The first thing I thought in my head was if she losses she will talk about lucky shots. Boom sure enough she does. This is like nothing new. This is like Nadal knee injuries, nalbandian being overweight and Murray actually being scottish. We have heard it all before. Lets move on to something more important. You know the actual tennis and the fact that Stosur is randomly improving out of nowhere and ignore Serena's big fat mouth.
T. H. Park
Professional
Dude, you need to seriously chill out and see the stats. You said everyone, not me. Also, here are the majors stats for her:
AO:
W09, Q08, F07, W06, 3r05, W04
RG:
Q09, F08, 3r07, QF06
Wimby:
W09, F08, QF07
USO:
W08, QF07, 4r06, 4r05
I don't know where you got the idea that she wins every major she enters nor where you got the idea that she overwhelms the competition in majors. She does well, but just isn't that good. One tough match? Is that why she got bumped off early on in quite a few of the majors?
fantom
Hall of Fame
Don't lump Venus in with her little (but bigger) sister. She seems pretty down-to-earth.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
she didnt even care in 05 or 06, and 07 too. It was only in the later parts of 08 and 09 that serena really rededicated herself, hence her dominance in slams through those 1 and a half years.
Bilbo
Semi-Pro
This post is 99% correct. The only parts i disagree with are the parts saying she is ugly, as i find her attractive, and that she is unfit, because she has a heavier body type and will NEVER look as thin as a dementieva, or even her sister.
A part of ur post that i found particularly interesting was the part describing how people wrongly perceive her style of play. They'd like to say she has no skill, no work ethic, and a poor and simple style of pla... overpowering all of her "physically weaker" opponents. When asked how someone with such a "simple and boring" style of pla managed to win 11 majors, their response is simple: Serena has a lot of talent (NATURAL ability she DIDNT work for) and she plays in a weak tennis era (like every other damn era in women's tennis). Serena's detractors can never bring themselves to say, "man, as much as i dislike her press conferences (who the fuh cares about press conferences?) i have to admit, she's worked mighty hard to get where she is today." We never hear this. Nor do we here how versatile of a player she is, seeing as her sister and her dominate doubles draws whenever they enter them.
I find it also interesting that Henin, the only person in years to, on occasion, beat the Williams sisters, is loved by ALL of the Serena haters. I also find it interesting how NO ONE (with the exception of a few) on this forum EVER talk about Henin for wat she was: a cheat.
D
Deleted member 21996
Guest
Despite having a long term Black african girlfriend Im racist after all just because i cant stand Serena!.. go figure!
West Coast Ace
G.O.A.T.
Sad that Blakefan, Thunder, and grass_for_cows are so wrapped up in race - and assume we are. If Serena were white and pulled what she did - we'd have the same lack of respect for her. It's just like the OJ 'thing' - if a white former beloved athlete had been acquitted by an idiot jury of murder we would have been just as outraged. Many blacks live by the teachings of MLK that state that Blacks should favor their own - and they call us racist? Would be funny if it weren't ironic and sad.
All you guys (gals?) can bring up is Henin. 'The Hand' incident was overblown - if Serena saw it, she should have stopped serving. And Henin's retirement against Mauresmo is a non-issue - she couldn't compete - I was glad she did it - saved me 15 minutes of my life. And you guys shouldn't be bringing that up - The Sisters bagged a semifinal match in Indian Wells because they didn't want to play each other - there was no mention of a 'knee injury' until a few minutes before the match.
I doubt most of you will even follow tennis after the Sisters retire - since it doesn't appear there will be another notable black player...
All you guys (gals?) can bring up is Henin. 'The Hand' incident was overblown - if Serena saw it, she should have stopped serving. And Henin's retirement against Mauresmo is a non-issue - she couldn't compete - I was glad she did it - saved me 15 minutes of my life. And you guys shouldn't be bringing that up - The Sisters bagged a semifinal match in Indian Wells because they didn't want to play each other - there was no mention of a 'knee injury' until a few minutes before the match.
I doubt most of you will even follow tennis after the Sisters retire - since it doesn't appear there will be another notable black player...
David_Is_Right
Semi-Pro
You are aware that you're randomly repeating and missing out characters when you type, aren't you? Have you inspected your keyboard for damage?
Also, try being a little less heavy-handed.
JStar7
Rookie
Never in all my life of being taught black history anywhere, whether from Teachers or from my Parents was I ever told that MLK said that blacks should favor their own. That is the complete opposite summary of his teachings and is most likely the idea that racist individuals towards blacks thought about black people.
How can you prove this? Did you not see the post about a week ago of a black girl who played an Adidas racket and had a one-handed backhand? Also have you ever heard of Madison Keys? She's black and only 14 years old on the WTA Tour. She beat Ala Kudryatsova not too long ago, and for 14 years old i'd say that's pretty darn good. So don't ever make false predictions again like the one you just made.
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