How does Serena's behavior during USO Final compare to McEnroe during 1990 AO?

  • Serena's behavior was worse

    Votes: 88 58.3%
  • McEnroe's behavior was worse

    Votes: 38 25.2%
  • Both behaved about the same

    Votes: 25 16.6%

  • Total voters
    151
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robert.s

Professional
Also, how stupid it is to go on insulting and threatening a man who can give you penalties? It's like asking to be penalized. But I guess she was mad she was losing and just couldn't control herself.

OK, fine, it can happen. These are pressure moments where you can lose your temper. But don't go blaming others, and play the victim card or some idiotic thing like that. Own it. Osaka was dominating her, she was playing better, and she lost her cool. It happens.

The very nasty part is how she goes all the way and forces everything to win an argument knowing she and her entourage caused it by not playing by the rules. It's very disingenuous and shows a vicious character. This part is no longer an 'in the heat of the moment' thing.
 
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Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
"More experienced players always get advantages"

Is that something that you approve of, so that you comment on it as though as it should be normal and not paid attention to?
No. Stating what to me is simply how the world works.
The umpire didn't "mess up the score". I don't know what match you were watching.
The same one you watched.
You remember the mess, because Serena was instrumental in that during and after the match, not because the umpire did what he did.
I don't agree.
Upholding the rules and the integrity of the game is good. I thought that you had a better perspective than the one you here demonstrate.

:cool:
Should I lose sleep because you don't respect my perspective? :)

I don't think the rule about no communication between the box and players is realistic because I do not believe it is enforceable.
 

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
You are either not an English-speaker or you are just making things up with regard to the word 'thief'.

Federer has never used the word thief in his tirades against umpires, thus, he would never get a warning. It is the most terrible word in the English language. It is the new line you must not cross in tennis
 
D

Deleted member 756486

Guest
He is. Roddick's adoration of Serena is my least favorite thing about him.

You can idolise someone without having to agree with everything they do. Something Serena fans should learn from.

That said, at least Roddick admits he's very biased himself.
Well we can’t all be perfect.

I’m rarely funny for example. We still seem to get along. :oops:
 

Rogfan

Professional
I can’t believe what I was reading. I’d have thought OP made up the whole story if a link wasn’t provided. What a load of BS. How SJWs are ready to twist the facts and are ruthless to attack the so-called oppressor to play their identity politics. Glad at least news.com.au has some common sense.
 

Russeljones

G.O.A.T.
After being penalised for throwing her racket early in the second set:

'This is unbelievable. Every team I play here I have problems.

'I didn't get coaching, I didn't get coaching. I didn't get coaching. You need to make an announcement that I didn't get coaching. I don't cheat, I didn't get coaching. How can you say that?

'You owe me an apology. You owe me an apology. I have never cheated in my life. I have a daughter and I stand for what is right for her and I've never cheated. You owe me an apology.

After being broken to trail 4-3 in the second set:

'I never got coaching. I explained that to you and for you to attack my character then something is wrong. You're attacking my character. Yes you are. You owe me an apology.

'You will never, ever, ever be on another court of mine as long as you live. You are the liar. When are you going to give me my apology? You owe me an apology.

'Say it, say you're sorry. Then don't talk to me, don't talk to me. How dare you insinuate I was cheating? You stole a point from me. You're a thief too.'

After being docked a game:

'Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? Because I said you were a thief? You stole a point from me. I'm not a cheater. I told you to apologise to me. Excuse me I need the referee, I don't agree with that.

With tournament referees:

'This is not right. INAUDIBLE. He said I was being coached but I was not being coached. That's not right. You know me. You know my character. This is not fair. This has happened to me too many times. This is not fair. To lose a game for saying that is not fair. Do you know how many men do things that are much worse than that? This is not fair.

'There are a lot of men out here that have said a lot of things and because they are a man it doesn't matter. This is unbelievable. No I don't know the risk because if I say a simple thing, a thief, because he stole a point from me.

'There are men out here that do a lot worse and because I'm a woman you're going to take this away from me. That is not right. And you know it and I know you can't admit it, but I know you know that is not right. I know you can't change it but I'm just saying that is not right.

'I get the rules but I'm just saying it's not right. It happens to me at this tournament every single year and it's not fair. That's all I have to say.

Post-match press conference:

'I can't sit here and say I wouldn't say he's a thief, because I thought he took a game from me.

'But I've seen other men call other umpires several things. I'm here fighting for women's rights and for women's equality and for all kinds of stuff. For me to say 'thief' and for him to take a game, it made me feel like it was a sexist remark. He's never taken a game from a man because they said 'thief'. It blows my mind.

'I just feel like the fact that I have to go through this is just an example for the next person that has emotions, and that wants to express themselves, and wants to be a strong woman.

'They're going to be allowed to do that because of today. Maybe it didn't work out for me, but it's going to work out for the next person.'
 

SQA333

Hall of Fame
He is. Roddick's adoration of Serena is my least favorite thing about him.

You can idolise someone without having to agree with everything they do. Something Serena fans should learn from.

That said, at least Roddick admits he's very biased himself.
Well Roddick has barely any notable achievements so he has to live vicariously through his childhood friend.

Also he wants to gain favour from her.
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
I don't know but it's clear her coach knows what he's doing is illegal.

Impressive that the umpire was aware enough to catch it. Even Serena did not see it. :eek:
 

GioV

Rookie
Surely, you don’t empathize with Ramos. He was called a thief in front of the whole world! How embarrassed would you be? If I was in his position, I too would have taken a game away from her
 

reaper

Legend
After being penalised for throwing her racket early in the second set:

'This is unbelievable. Every team I play here I have problems.

'I didn't get coaching, I didn't get coaching. I didn't get coaching. You need to make an announcement that I didn't get coaching. I don't cheat, I didn't get coaching. How can you say that?

'You owe me an apology. You owe me an apology. I have never cheated in my life. I have a daughter and I stand for what is right for her and I've never cheated. You owe me an apology.

After being broken to trail 4-3 in the second set:

'I never got coaching. I explained that to you and for you to attack my character then something is wrong. You're attacking my character. Yes you are. You owe me an apology.

'You will never, ever, ever be on another court of mine as long as you live. You are the liar. When are you going to give me my apology? You owe me an apology.

'Say it, say you're sorry. Then don't talk to me, don't talk to me. How dare you insinuate I was cheating? You stole a point from me. You're a thief too.'

After being docked a game:

'Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? Because I said you were a thief? You stole a point from me. I'm not a cheater. I told you to apologise to me. Excuse me I need the referee, I don't agree with that.

With tournament referees:

'This is not right. INAUDIBLE. He said I was being coached but I was not being coached. That's not right. You know me. You know my character. This is not fair. This has happened to me too many times. This is not fair. To lose a game for saying that is not fair. Do you know how many men do things that are much worse than that? This is not fair.

'There are a lot of men out here that have said a lot of things and because they are a man it doesn't matter. This is unbelievable. No I don't know the risk because if I say a simple thing, a thief, because he stole a point from me.

'There are men out here that do a lot worse and because I'm a woman you're going to take this away from me. That is not right. And you know it and I know you can't admit it, but I know you know that is not right. I know you can't change it but I'm just saying that is not right.

'I get the rules but I'm just saying it's not right. It happens to me at this tournament every single year and it's not fair. That's all I have to say.

Post-match press conference:

'I can't sit here and say I wouldn't say he's a thief, because I thought he took a game from me.

'But I've seen other men call other umpires several things. I'm here fighting for women's rights and for women's equality and for all kinds of stuff. For me to say 'thief' and for him to take a game, it made me feel like it was a sexist remark. He's never taken a game from a man because they said 'thief'. It blows my mind.

'I just feel like the fact that I have to go through this is just an example for the next person that has emotions, and that wants to express themselves, and wants to be a strong woman.

'They're going to be allowed to do that because of today. Maybe it didn't work out for me, but it's going to work out for the next person.'
A good rule of thumb is that when someone is protesting their innocence on the basis of "character," the facts of the matter tend to be against them.
 

4-string

Professional
Might actually use my Wimbledon Ladies Finals tickets next year.

Usually just watch the men knocking up on an outside court before the doubles final.

I did try and make it back to my seat for Venus Garbine second set but it was over by the time I got up the stairs.
How sexist of you.

You owe all women everywhere an apology. Two, if they have daughters.
 

BorgCash

Legend
She was getting her butt kicked by a younger and better player. She created a distraction to try and knock her opponent off her game. Almost worked. The Referee clearly followed the rules, and this is the second time Serena Williams did this at the U.S. Open. I think it is time for her and her sister to retire. They have taken enough from tennis and the fans. Tennis will be much better off without her.
She pull an old Johnny Mac, then cried about it. What a joke the U.S. open has turned into. Her draws was the easiest on record, and still she failed.
This used to be tennis and a gentlemen sport, not promoting players who clearly do not deserve it.
Exactly, but it was her third time.
 

Tennis_Hands

Bionic Poster
You're always good for a vast array of argumentative error.

Rules in tennis could do with a lot more clarification than they currently get.

Just look how long it took them to deal with time-wasting on serves!

And still the first penalty is a mere warning!
They didn't want to deal with the "problem" with the time wasting, because the "problem" is what helps bring in the cash.

Same with pampering the big stars, part of which the current issue is, because Serena (and others) have been for years tolerated in regard to what is allowed, and feels that she is always right.

I have always had a good time reading your efforts at having a cake and eating it too, but if we are honest, your positions are often an exercise in vanity, rather than something substantial.

Through the years you have advocated things like the free use of doping, which would have turned the sport on its head.

I don't particularly mind your ideas, as they remain purely theoretical, but even you have to step back from time to time and look at what you are defending.

In this particular case the umpire acted professionally and, unless you show me why you think otherwise, you would be better off theorizing about something useful, instead of being obtuse just for the sake of it.

:cool:
 

BorgCash

Legend
How does it even make him a sexist? It's so odd. It's so cringrworthy and forced. She wants to portray herself as a voice for women's rights and she's looking for anywhere to cry about sexism even in situations like this where it doesn't make any sense and has people laughing at her.
Because she's stupid person thinking that she could do anything especially at US Open.
 
Roddick is a disgrace. He physically attacked Novak in the locker room in 2008 when he lost the match from him. One bully supports the other. Same place of happening (the US Open) and of course the violaters are the domestic players. What's the point in having the rules when domestic players think they don't have to obeyed by them?
 
Surely, you don’t empathize with Ramos. He was called a thief in front of the whole world! How embarrassed would you be? If I was in his position, I too would have taken a game away from her
Since then she has called him a liar & a sexist as well. It is worth remembering that umpires have no recourse to hold press conferences or go on social media putting their side of the story, so instead we get the disgruntled player bad-mouthing them & shifting responsibility from themselves onto the official & whipping up their guard dogs & mindless sycophants who believe they can do no wrong against that individual.
 

GioV

Rookie
Which is ridiculous as she racked up three violations in one set-why is an automatic game penalty was incurred. I guess this is just the brave new world of feminism where men are always to blame even when the problem lies with the woman.
Yes, it’s feminism to want equal treatment. Ramos should be allowed to be emotional and act emotionally as he did today. He was so hurt and embarrassed by being called a thief in front of the whole world that he gave her the game penalty. He is an umpire, but he had fielding too and should be allowed to get back at her
 

LETitBE

Hall of Fame
Petty politicized nonsense promoted by pack minded people who play the thesis and the antithesis Hegelian dialectic. Now it's Man vs Woman, the thesis and antithesis is always there to play on whilst the agitators can sit back and watch the carnage.
i'd say its more idiot vs umpire and a lot of people jumping in for a laugh and to say its about time this has happened
 
And she acts like this before her home crowd and officials, thinking she could do anything there, so week person.
She says she always has problems there-like when she threatened to kill a line judge. Maybe one day the penny might drop that it is you & not everybody else that is the problem-but in her case I highly doubt it.
 

randomtoss

Semi-Pro
Anyone remember that match where Stan Wawrinka got mad at the umpire (happens regularly) and climbed on the umpire's chair to yell at him? In my view, this is the most threatening attitude I've seen from a player towards an umpire - he was physically confronting him. Well, I'm not even sure Stan got a warning for this behaviour.

I think Serena Williams should have kept her cool after the warning. I also think Carlos Ramos wouldn't have given her a game penalty had she been Wawrinka, because men are supposed to be bullies sometimes and women are supposed to be fragile little flowers always.
 

HuusHould

Professional
I don't think Paddy can be blamed in any way for the point/game penalties, but he should get a reprimand for counterproductive coaching as from the highlights I've seen he was encouraging her to hit the ball straight to the Osaka forehand and follow it to the net.......
 

Kalin

Legend
Ramos failed the occasion by being too quick too hand out a coaching penalty and too thin-skinned to take a bit of stick.
Wasn't it initially only a warning? It sure escalated quickly from there...

As for taking stick, I am not so sure. Do this in a big soccer game and you get red-carded (i.e. kicked out) immediately and you get fined and slapped with a match ban on top of that. If the ref decides to pursue it further you usually get banned for a few more matches.
 

Tennis_Hands

Bionic Poster
No. Stating what to me is simply how the world works.

The same one you watched.

I don't agree.

Should I lose sleep because you don't respect my perspective? :)

I don't think the rule about no communication between the box and players is realistic because I do not believe it is enforceable.
So, you just agree with how the world works.

So, why are you here?

The umpire has the job to enforce the rules, and that is what he did.

It is how the world works!

:rolleyes:
 

Minnas

New User
You don’t understand gender bias at all.

I am not talking about misogyny, that is hatred of women.

I am talking about disparate treatment, a double standard, in that a tirade of a woman is punished in a situation where a Man in the same situation would not have been punished.

The disparity is so disgusting and obvious. Man goes on tirade on changeover and yells at ump, and commentators say he is “passionate” and he is “fired up” and he is “barking” and the match is “important to him.” Woman goes on tirade in the final of a major and she gets no warning, and ump makes ludicrous decision to code her. She wasn’t refusing to play. She was literally on her way back out to the court and he hit her with the third code. Terrible use of discretion.

And I cannot think of a match where Serena ever gets away with anything. Can you refresh my memory? I even recall her getting a hindrance call for yelling after she hit her shot against Stosur — can anyone recall that ever being called on someone else?

I’ll bet if you asked Ramos if he would handle things differently with hindsight, he would say yes.
I can show you a video of Novak getting the same treatement from Ramos for argueably less if you’d like? also no warning? It was her third actually. I also understand what gender disparity is, I’d say that people are implying that Ramos has something against women by doing this, unless you think he was ordered by some shadowy faced higher up to screw over the wta.
 
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Yes, it’s feminism to want equal treatment. Ramos should be allowed to be emotional and act emotionally as he did today. He was so hurt and embarrassed by being called a thief in front of the whole world that he gave her the game penalty. He is an umpire, but he had fielding too and should be allowed to get back at her
If she wants equal treatment then she should not want the women to be coached at all events, which the men aren't allowed to be. it leads one to think she is just using the current feminist drivel so popular on social media to further justify her behaviour & get herself over more. Seriously saying I have a daughter during this incident-what sort of bs is that? The game penalty was given because he had no choice-she had already had two violations in the same set & then proceeded to imply he was crooked or biased against her, at which point he had no choice but to issue her with a third violation which was an automatic game penalty, he did his job.
 

Bukmeikara

Legend
Anyone remember that match where Stan Wawrinka got mad at the umpire (happens regularly) and climbed on the umpire's chair to yell at him? In my view, this is the most threatening attitude I've seen from a player towards an umpire - he was physically confronting him. Well, I'm not even sure Stan got a warning for this behaviour.

I think Serena Williams should have kept her cool after the warning. I also think Carlos Ramos wouldn't have given her a game penalty had she been Wawrinka, because men are supposed to be bullies sometimes and women are supposed to be fragile little flowers always.
Ramos was the chair umpire who clashed with Wawrinka in the AO 14 final so .... in your face fragile women ! I hope it didnt sounded that harsh :oops:
 
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