Do you know any other occasion when umpire was called a thief? Everything else is more tolerable as "thief" implies intention. I heard player saying "are you blind", but this is not comparable as it does not imply intention.Bottom line men do this stuff too I watched the match and have watched her matches in the past and her competitive outbursts mirror men moreso than women. There is nothing wrong with that. I think if I looked hard enough I could find three BETTER examples of bad behavior than Serena’s. Was she on thin ice? without a doubt. She should’ve know that. However she isn’t wrong men do it with far more regularly and not much comes come of it.
In the final it’s time to have even thicker skin. And all those touting the rule book thisnand rule book that ... if Novak were to do the exact same thing tomorrow is he given a game penalty? I am just gonna leave that there to sit. Cause I am willing to bet you make it apples and apples he says verbatim what she says does exactly what Serena does he doesn’t get the penalty.
I really begin to think there is more potential in WTA now. Still far away from the golden years off Hingis,Capriati,Mauresmo,Clijsters,Henin.Yeah, anyone who uses that argument in the light of current situation on both tours is just heavily biased. This was Serena in good form (better than she was at Wimbledon) and a young player played fearless attacking tennis against her and kept her composure amazingly well.
Compare that to Thiem not being able to beat out of sorts Nadal even though he literally destroyed him in the 1st set or Kyrgios tanking against very lackluster Fed. Not to mention the golden boy Zverev losing to 40 year old Kohlschreiber who's one foot in retirement. It's a joke.
Do you know any other occasion when umpire was called a thief? Everything else is more tolerable as "thief" implies intention. I heard player saying "are you blind", but this is not comparable as it does not imply intention.
Bumping this upShe was lucky the match wasn't called right then and there. What she did was a defamation of character, and was way over the top in its tone and delivery. In soccer she would have been straight red carded for that and out of the match. No doubt about it.
It was also cowardly. She knew Ramos couldn't say anything back in his position.
Sexist, she says? Really? Seem to remember Nalbandian being ejected from a match for far less.
It's worth noting that these outburts usually happen with Serena at the US Open. That's three times now (and twice she has effectively ruined someone's debut slam win).
Has she done it at any other slam? She's like a school bully who will only have a pop when she has the crowd standing behind her. That's also an example of cowardice.
She is just an absolute disgrace. I think the most depressing thing about this are the half-arsed attempts to defend her from celebrities and broadcasters.
Why has she never improved her attitude over the years? Because too many people tell her there's nothing wrong with it!
Well done Naomi Osaka.
Wow, not going to get your respect as a person? Think she's going to be able to carry on after such a big blow?I repeat. What a total psychopath and narcissist.
Totally ruined Osaka's moment when she was being clearly outplayed.
Now that she ruined the match and the trophy ceremony she's trying to calm things down.
She may go down as the female GOAT but she'll never get my respect as a person.
This is the crux of Serena's problem. She has no idea how to just calmly argue with someone without screaming and finger pointing. And she has a huge victim complex and a lot of cards to play.Thought people were joking but she really brought her daughter up in that exchange. My god.
Carlos, a sincere thank you for having the guts to stand up and call it like it is!
The code violation was for coaching. Her coach's response was that he was coaching "like 100% of coaches in 100% of matches." So Serena is coached routinely in her matches, and a lot of other players are too if her coach is to be believed. If everyone does it they regard it as a technical breach which you get away with if you can rather than cheating. It's not something the sport regards as a particular serious offence either given that the penalty in the first instance is a warning. Rather than pretend professional athletes are morally pure individuals people should just accept they generally push the rules of the games they play to the edge and beyond to obtain an advantage.The code violation did amount to an accusation of cheating, so most people around here would have behaved equally as badly as she did.
He's always been a stickler for rules. Here's a list of calls against the top male players:
– In 2017 at the French Open, Novak Djokovic was given a fault on his serve by Carlos Ramos for time violations. He then received a code violation for unsportsmanlike conduct after yelling.
– In 2018 at Wimbledon, Ramos gave Djokovic a code violation for slamming his racquet into the ground. Djokovic later complained about a double standard from Ramos, who did not penalize Kei Nishikori for something similar.
– In 2017 at the French Open, Ramos called a time violation on Rafael Nadal. Nadal thought the call was selectively enforced and said he was not satisfied with it.
– In 2016 at the French Open, Ramos called Nick Kyrgios for a code violation for yelling at a towel boy. Kyrgios accused Ramos of having a double standard and was described as “mystified” by the penalty.
– In August 2016 at the Olympics, Ramos called Andy Murray for a code violation for saying “stupid umpiring.”
– In July 2017, Ramos called Andy Murray for a time violation for playing too slowly. Murray acknowledged he had been warned before receiving the violation but was still bothered by it.
The code violation was for coaching. Her coach's response was that he was coaching "like 100% of coaches in 100% of matches." So Serena is coached routinely in her matches, and a lot of other players are too if her coach is to be believed. If everyone does it they regard it as a technical breach which you get away with if you can rather than cheating. It's not something the sport regards as a particular serious offence either given that the penalty in the first instance is a warning. Rather than pretend professional athletes are morally pure individuals people should just accept they generally push the rules of the games they play to the edge and beyond to obtain an advantage.
This is the crux of Serena's problem. She has no idea how to just calmly argue with someone without screaming and finger pointing. And she has a huge victim complex and a lot of cards to play.
The coaching violation shouldn’t have been called in a grand slam final. What’s the big deal really? I completely agree with espn commentators on this. It is poor judgement selectively enforcing the rarely enforced rule in a grand slam final.
He's been her coach for years and if he says he coaches her routinely in matches I'm inclined to believe him. He has no motive to implicate himself in a dubious practice, but she has a motive to exonerate herself from one. "Thou dost protest too much" is the usual descriptor for someone whose reaction is as shrill as Williams in this case when the vision shows clear signaling from the coach, and the coach says he does it all the time.Her coach doesn't speak for her and he even claims that she did not see him trying to coach her.
Key point #1:Chair umpire Carlos Ramos managed to rob not one but two players in the women’s U.S. Open final. Nobody has ever seen anything like it: An umpire so wrecked a big occasion that both players, Naomi Osaka and Serena Williams alike, wound up distraught with tears streaming down their faces during the trophy presentation and an incensed crowd screamed boos at the court. Ramos took what began as a minor infraction and turned it into one of the nastiest and most emotional controversies in the history of tennis, all because he couldn’t take a woman speaking sharply to him.
Irrefutable truth. As I--and anyone who followed the sport more than the ages of certain TWW members, Serena did not do anything different than innumerable players I tennis history. Sorry Hooded Haters, but her reaction is nothing compared to outbursts from Nastase, McEnroe, Connors cursing out anyone in sight with McEnroe's violent behavior injuring a fan), cursing out umpires and fans like Sharapova, Jim Courier violently shaking the chair umpire (nearly causing him to be pitched from the seat), or the unforgivable racist tirade against James Blake and a linesperson who happened to be the "wrong" color by the vile Lleyton Hewitt (who should have been banned from the sport for his attack...but was not). Nowhere near yesterday's incident, no matter how much you want it to be that way. So for Ramos to effectively shift the course of a majors final strongly suggests he either hates Williams (for any number of despicable reasons), or as the article points out, he could not stand a woman asserting her rightful opinion to him. Take your pick.Williams abused her racket, but Ramos did something far uglier: He abused his authority. Champions get heated — it’s their nature to burn. All good umpires in every sport understand that the heart of their job is to help temper the moment, to turn the dial down, not up, and to be quiet stewards of the event rather than to let their own temper play a role in determining the outcome. Instead, Ramos made himself the chief player in the women’s final. He marred Osaka’s first Grand Slam title and one of Williams’s last bids for all-time greatness. Over what? A tone of voice. Male players have sworn and cursed at the top of their lungs, hurled and blasted their equipment into shards, and never been penalized as Williams was in the second set of the U.S. Open final.
Of all players in history--female or male to not need on-court coaching, that would be Serena. You do not reach her kind of success by having constant whispers in your ears; a player faces some new and some familiar opponents at any turn, and there's no way to take all of their possible reactons or strategies into consideration enough that it would matter--unless one is a low-skilled player (I will leave them nameless for now). Moreover, there's more than enough players in the WTA and ATP who do receive on-court coaching, but how often are they being penalized?It was pure pettiness from Ramos that started the ugly cascade in the first place, when he issued a warning over “coaching,” as if a signal from Patrick Mouratoglou in the grandstand has ever been the difference in a Serena Williams match.
So, let's see...Nadal threatening Ramos' job security (and the threat meant exactly that) was less egregious than "You're a thief?" Bullsh*t--so once again, it all goes back to what can only be Ramos' motivations / reactions, and by comparison, he barely slapped Nadal on the wrist for a greater, personal threat to his livelihood.it was up to Ramos to de-escalate the situation, to stop inserting himself into the match and to let things play out on the court. In front of him were two players in a sweltering state, who were giving their everything, while he sat at a lordly height above them. Below him, Williams vented, “You stole a point from me. You’re a thief.” There was absolutely nothing worthy of penalizing in the statement. It was pure vapor release. She said it in a tone of wrath, but it was compressed and controlled. All Ramos had to do was to continue to sit coolly above it, and Williams would have channeled herself back into the match. But he couldn’t take it. He wasn’t going to let a woman talk to him that way. A man, sure. Ramos has put up with worse from a man. At the French Open in 2017, Ramos leveled Rafael Nadal with a ticky-tacky penalty over a time delay, and Nadal told him he would see to it that Ramos never refereed one of his matches again.
If was a thief--his sticky fingers were motivated by sickening beliefs. I will let the Serena haters / Ramos defenders try to spin that anyway they can, as failed a mission that will be.Ramos had rescued his ego and, in the act, taken something from Williams and Osaka that they can never get back. Perhaps the most important job of all for an umpire is to respect the ephemeral nature of the competitors and the contest. Osaka can never, ever recover this moment. It’s gone. Williams can never, ever recover this night. It’s gone. And so Williams was entirely right in calling him a “thief.”
This seem to be where western culture is heading. Intolerance of criticism at any level. Universities restricting freedom of speech because someone may take offensive. I feel a Bill Burr style rant coming on but Bill Mayer will do just as well:
Come on, now... Ramos is not there representing the male gender, he is representing the umpiring profession. No umpire should be required to take such crap from anyone. And yes, I have been an umpire myself. Getting abused from entitled players is no fun and, more importantly, prevents the umpire from doing his/her job properly. Hence, the penalties for umpire abuse are usually very severe. As I mentioned in another thread, other sports are much stricter; people get thrown out immediately for much milder behaviour.If Ramos can't take that sort of guff like a man then he has problems with women.