Serena Williams

[DRII]

 

[Djokovic2011]

You've gotta be kidding me, right?! Over 3,200 posts since last night? This has surely gotta be some kind of error.

 

[clayqueen]

Statement by NOW President Toni Van Pelt:

"In what was a blatantly racist and sexist move, tennis umpire Carlos Ramos unfairly penalized Serena Williams in an abhorrent display of male dominance and discrimination. This would not have happened if Serena Williams was a man. She would have been cheered and chided for “gamesmanship.” Male tennis stars are reminding us that they have “done much worse” and have not been penalized.

Ramos claimed he was just following the rules, but in actuality, men stretch the rules all the time and are lionized for being “bad boys” while women are benched. This is also a prime example of how racism and sexism are two of the biggest obstacles that Black women in America face.

NOW is calling on the U.S. Tennis Association to cancel any contracts with Carlos Ramos to umpire tournaments in the future. It’s clear that Ramos abused his authority. This racist, sexist behavior needs to stop."


I think Toni Van Pelt and NOW should be blocked, removed and banned. All according to TTW rules.

Really?

 

[Deleted member 756486]

We’ve talked about this..

Swearing at the umpire isn’t nearly as bad as calling the umpire a “thief” and putting his very credibility into question.

 

[Hamnavoe]

 

[underground]

You've gotta be kidding me, right?! Over 3,200 posts since last night? This has surely gotta be some kind of error.

Think they've merged the threads into one.

 

[DRII]

Even Saint Federer has cursed at an umpire (in a slam final no less). happens a lot on the tour.

just imagine a woman doing this!

imagine Serena doing this!

 

[rmontro]

check your privilege.

Is this PC Principal from South Park?

 

[Deleted member 754093]

you're not recognizing your privilege.

Log off. Plenty of people with more intelligent takes than you don’t have access to the internet. How dare you make passive aggressive assumptions about others. Check your privilege and log off

 

[TheMaestro1990]

Really?

Yes.

https://now.org/media-center/press-release/us-tennis-association-dismiss-chair-umpire-carlos-ramos/

 

[Zeref]

Male umpire to male player- Come on Nick you are really great you really need to try cause even if your tanking like you do every other matchI won't give you a penalty .
Male umpire to female player in gs final- Warning for your coach and you for him moving his hand forward keep him in line.

He did not abide by Rules ( There are no rules for tanking I guess so he should have done nothing ) and got Penalty very next day to umpire Court 12(?).

I guess Strict guidelines must have been given to all umpires to follow standard protocols which Ramos did.

And don't act like she wasn't getting on spot coaching , even her Coach admitted.

 

[DRII]

We’ve talked about this..

Swearing at the umpire isn’t nearly as bad as calling the umpire a “thief” and putting his very credibility into question.

 

[Mr.Lob]

WOW,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,just WOW,,, she hinted that she won't play her own country's open tournament ?????????????????lol

Yeah, says she is "ALWAYS" treated unfairly.

 

[jm1980]

We’ve talked about this..

Swearing at the umpire isn’t nearly as bad as calling the umpire a “thief” and putting his very credibility into question.

None of the swears are directed at the umpire himself. This is a bogus comparison

 

[thrust]

joker by far has the worst post match crowd love maneuver. hand to his heart to each section of the stadium. makes me want to puke agassi’s was pretty lame too

Despite what you think, most in the audience seem to like Novak's maneuver.

 

[TMF]

USTA are upset because Serena didn't win the USO for their country.

Toni Van Pelt is taking his anger out on Ramos.

 

[Deleted member 754093]

Just put DRII on ignore. Don’t waste your breath

 

[Ruark]

I am embarrassed for the tennis world right now.

Serena pulling the sexism card what a complete and total disrespectful thing to do to Osaka and to the integrity of the game

It's incredible how she's so full of herself, she makes EVERYTHING about her. I was appalled by how she "stole the show" from Osaka at the trophy ceremony, especially after Katrina Adam's horrible statement ("This isn't the outcome we wanted...." "You're the champion of all champions..."), yelling slogans ("We'll get through this!!! I don't want her to feel this way!"), etc. and then waving her 2nd-place silver platter high over her head, spinning and laughing like it was a 1st place trophy. When they handed the 1st place trophy to Osaka, tears rolling down her cheeks, she looked like she didn't even want it. Good grief, is there no end to this idiot's self-worship?

 

[AceSalvo]

Sure no one is a saint, but never expected a 23 GS winner to behave like trash after a "coaching violation". Getting caught was more than enough, but she just overplayed her entitlement.

 

[helterskelter]

just imagine what the reaction would be!

so to all of you who choose to ignore the varying ills and isms of society because they don't affect you negatively in a significant way; i suggest you check your privilege.

its called empathy, try it sometime...

Alas, this forum - like most anonymous internet boards - is dominated by right wingers and has a fair number of extreme right wingers. I don't think this thread will get much of a positive response. But, yeah, Ramos clearly should have exercised more discretion than he did.

 

[insideguy]

He did not abide by Rules ( There are no rules for tanking I guess so he should have done nothing ) and got Penalty very next day to umpire Court 12(?).

I guess Strict guidelines must have been given to all umpires to follow standard protocols which Ramos did.

And don't act like she wasn't getting on spot coaching , even her Coach admitted.

She was getting coaching. Discretion is important so you don't blow up a match in a grand slam final. Ramos lit the fuse, That started the breakdown. Or the excuse for the breakdown.

 

[underground]

I dont get it. Yes Ramos was right to punish Serena for illegal coaching, but to penalize her for calling him a 'thief' etc is totally hypocritical, when men have said much worse things to umpires, and I am not even talking about the good ol' 70s and 80s. If you are going to punish Serena (which i was fine with, you shouldnt get away with abusing the umpire), then punish everyone regardless of gender

It's not about the one single word. It's the whole relentless tirade over 2 changeovers, the screaming demands for an apology, the refusal to engage with conversation with Ramos. The "thief" and "liar" accusations was just the trigger.

 

[Big_Dangerous]

That rather foolish individual took the strategy of arguing that if everyone does it then I can do it.

Williams says this is not the case, so expect some interesting conversations in her camp.

Lol, it's like getting pulled over for speeding and telling the officer that everyone else was too.

 

[NuBas]

Clearly all the talk of regulating time for bathroom breaks etc.. dims in comparison to the latitude umpires have in inflicting altering events onto a grand slam final. Osaka probably would have won in the end anyway but the "poor little umpires feelings were hurt" so he issued a game penalty. It was an emotional response which happened because his detractor was a woman. Too much power in the hands of an official. Compare to nfl superbowl. Refs show some restraint but would never penalize due to language or insult. Define verbal abuse. If she had said you f'in piece of gd sh, mf piece of vile crappola, .... calling him a thief was based on a pure form of two sides of a disagreement and no more insulting to the umpire than the call he made towards her.

Naahh, his feelings most definitely not hurt. He is following the strict codes of being an umpire. He has to uphold those standards. Again, USTA had choice of who they wanted to officiate the final. If they wanted a less strict umpire, they could have chosen...

 

[JoelDali]

The Chase Bank marketing team comprised of 11 white women are scrambling to rebrand Mama.

 

[Your Hero]

I'm guessing my stupid thread on the subject didn't get merged but was just
deleted instead and frankly I applaud the action!

 

[insideguy]

He did not abide by Rules ( There are no rules for tanking I guess so he should have done nothing ) and got Penalty very next day to umpire Court 12(?).

I guess Strict guidelines must have been given to all umpires to follow standard protocols which Ramos did.

And don't act like she wasn't getting on spot coaching , even her Coach admitted.

Also moving an ump to a court after he completely disregards the rules aint much. I am sorry.

 

[Ann]

Alas, this forum - like most anonymous internet boards - is dominated by right wingers and has a fair number of extreme right wingers. I don't think this thread will get much of a positive response. But, yeah, Ramos clearly should have exercised more discretion than he did.

This place is an ALT_R bastion of bull.

 

[Deleted member 756486]

Great rebuttal. Sure showed me.

 

[Russeljones]

Nice job, mods. Love it.

 

[HipRotation]

So... rules shouldn't apply in sports?

 

[insideguy]

We’ve talked about this..

Swearing at the umpire isn’t nearly as bad as calling the umpire a “thief” and putting his very credibility into question.

Wait you are allowed to swear at umpires?

 

[TheMaestro1990]

We’ve talked about this..

Swearing at the umpire isn’t nearly as bad as calling the umpire a “thief” and putting his very credibility into question.

Never thought an Arsenal fan would be intelligent

 

[Ann]

Great rebuttal. Sure showed me.

You do realize that swearing at an umpire is a foul. Correct?

 

[ABCD]

Nice job, mods. Love it.

Serena own Washington Post as well as TTW.

 

[Ledigs]

This all makes me so mad. She’s not above the rules.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Zeref]

His every comment is directed at himself and clearly he isn't interested to chat with umpire.

See Serena now *Points at Umpire* You owe me an apology ( WTF ). You are a theif, that's what u are for stealing a point from me(WTF). U owe an apology to my daughter ( LMAO just wanted to include it ).

Now imagine any scenario if Serena is called a theif by someone......

 

[zagor]

Well he enforced them alright.

This time he did, which is the issue here. It seems random which I don't like. For me it's either you enforce the rule consistently in an effort to eliminate undesired behavior or do away with it. That would prevent such calls from beeing seen as out of place because they should be the rule not the exception.

Not that this excuses Serena's and Mouratoglou's behaviour here mind you.

 

[Russeljones]

Serena own Washington Post as well as TTW.

Nah, this really had to be done. The forum was getting run over.

 

[TheMaestro1990]

We need Kyrgios' take on this

 

[insideguy]

I know players swear I have seen female players swear. Not at the umps. But I don't even think you are suppose to be allowed to swear. The umps ignore most of this. This is why when you micro manage matches and even more so big matches things get out of control.

 

[Deleted member 756486]

You do realize that swearing at an umpire is a foul. Correct?

Yes I do. I’m not excusing what Roger did, not at all. But does it even come close to what Serena said to Ramos? Roger was being rude and inpolite but Serena was personally attacking him and his very integrity as an umpire. Way worse.

 

[NuBas]

Players both initiate and control who their coaches are and whether they are present at their matches. Imagine a coach yelling out loudly to disrupt an opponent just as she is about to strike a second serve on break point, and it leads to a double fault. Would your argument be the same: you can't penalize a player for activity they did not initiate or control? Of course not. The player is responsible for the coach and all of the coach's actions. If the coach breaks the rules, then the player is penalized.

I accept arguments that coaching happens all the time, and there is no consistency when it is called, so while the coaching was a clear violation, it was not necessary for the chair umpire to be heavy handed at this stage of the tournament. A "soft warning" during a change over might have been appropriate. But perhaps the chair umpire saw it happen a couple times, and Serena changed her tactics and it was giving her an advantage. Then it needed to be called right away. We don't know what the chair umpire saw and why he called it. All we know is that Serena's coach admitted to coaching, coaching is agains the rules, and the chair umpire enforced that rule. We also know Serena at first accepted his decision.

Then Serena smashed her racquet. That is completely in her control. She has to be given another code violation for that. And that second violation has to be a point penalty. Instead of accepting that, Serena berated the chair umpire over and over and questioned his integrity in an angry and threatening tone. He put up with it for a long time, and then was justified in giving the third code violation, which is a game penalty.

It's hard to see where Serena is the victim here.

Said the same in many posts. If you actually go back and watch the clip, Serena was at her chair arguing with umpire for second violation then clearly says "if you are not gonna apologize, then don't speak to me again" then both were silent, but 30 seconds later, she opens her mouth and starts bad mouthing the umpire who was staring off into the distance.

If the rules said after a point violation there would be another point violation like being down 0-30 then he would have issued that but the next step was being game down so he did his job.

We can discuss this back and forth all we want and try to toss around the blame but its really on Serena. She could have ended it way sooner. Then to have nerve to cry and take the moment away from Naomi, after what she did was completely low, lower than low. As much as Serena doesn't want to admit it, its the truth.

 

[The Green Mile]

Well, us white males do have to check our privileges or so I've been told.

 

[skyline]

I dont get it. Yes Ramos was right to punish Serena for illegal coaching, but to penalize her for calling him a 'thief' etc is totally hypocritical, when men have said much worse things to umpires, and I am not even talking about the good ol' 70s and 80s. If you are going to punish Serena (which i was fine with, you shouldnt get away with abusing the umpire), then punish everyone regardless of gender

But do you have any concrete examples? Honestly I did look but I could not find an instance (save for going back to the age of McEnroe et al.) where someone went on a huge tirade and did not get a formal warning.

 

[Genie Of the Bank]

Wow he did? I don't remember this.

From the horse's mouth, so to speak:

https://www.si.com/tennis/beyond-ba...-roddick-novak-djokovic-fighting-2008-us-open

 

[insideguy]

His every comment is directed at himself and clearly he isn't interested to chat with umpire.

See Serena now *Points at Umpire* You owe me an apology ( WTF ). You are a theif, that's what u are for stealing a point from me(WTF). U owe an apology to my daughter ( LMAO just wanted to include it ).

Now imagine any scenario if Serena is called a theif by someone......

Look man if I say to you I know the F##cking rules I am talking to you. Don't rationalize crap.

 

[jm1980]

You do realize that swearing at an umpire is a foul. Correct?

And so is questioning an umpire's integrity. What's your point?

And if you think Federer hasn't received enough backlash for that comment, you haven't been here long enough.

 

[Apun94]

It's not about the one single word. It's the whole relentless tirade over 2 changeovers, the screaming demands for an apology, the refusal to engage with conversation with Ramos. The "thief" and "liar" accusations was just the trigger.

The 'I am not a cheater' tirade was a load of crap. She deserved it. It was obvious. But she then when she went on that rant about 'thief' and 'liar' thing, Ramos shouldve just tried to calm her down and wait for her to wase off, just like he would have done in any men's matches

 

[underground]

Alas, this forum - like most anonymous internet boards - is dominated by right wingers and has a fair number of extreme right wingers. I don't think this thread will get much of a positive response. But, yeah, Ramos clearly should have exercised more discretion than he did.

Literally the only people who are defending Serena are the bunch of US players, the so called "expert analysts" at ESPN, and the knee jerk reactors on Twitter who either don't the rules or didn't even watch the match themselves. Look around all the social media and you'll see not a single top comment defends Serena.