Serve: crossover versus noncrossover step

[gzhpcu]

In today's tennis, about 95% of the players land on the front foot (noncrossover) after impact.

In the old days (pre mid-60's), you had to keep in contact with the ground, so with the crossover step, you would step forward with the right foot.

Even after the rule changed and players began jumping, there were still many that still used the crossover step: Newcombe, Laver, Noah, Becker come to mind.

Among the modern players, I can only think of Taylor Dent using the crossover step often.

In Jack Groppel's book High Tech Tennis, he compared the two and stated (p. 157):

We found that the crossover step allowed a smoother and more efficient transfer of force through the body's linked system, whereas the noncrossover step enabled the player to get more vertical movement but caused the action through the linked system to be very abrupt. The ball velocities from these two actions - high rotational momentum for the crossover and high vertical momentum for the noncrossover - were about the same, so no true benefit was derived relative to the final outcome.

Yannick Noah had a very smooth and elegant serve with his crossover step. Becker had plenty of power.

One benefit of the noncrossover step which I see stemming from the high vertical momentum is that the window of acceptance increases, so that more serves go in.

It seems to me, that the main reason for the prevalance of the noncrossover step today, is because it is taught that way by the teaching pros.

 

[larry10s]

the higher the contact point the bigger window of acceptance so if you get off the ground (noncrossover) higher % serves in as you stated above. #2 every inch into the court you contact the ball increases the mph of your relative to the receiver (gets there quicker since it travels less distance) so less reaction time for receiver equals more effective serve .2 good reasons for noncrossover.

 

[larry10s]

i watched some video on ytennisplayer.net of dent serving where you can stop frame the video. #1 he makes contact with both feet off the ground #2 lands inside the court with his LEFT leg is the videos i saw but immediately brings his right leg around instead of having the right leg in back on landing in a traditional noncrossover serve. so he is somewhat a blend of the styles. fed thought there could be something to it watch this. remember these are practice serve so he is not trying to get fully into the court. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMnF2m31QPo&feature=related

 

[larry10s]

again g without having the articles to prove it (btw what is the date of that book since i know you have references from the ice ages, just kidding) i have to beleive for the reasons i stated above that the noncrossover serve has more advantages thats why it is taught. during the transition phase you would have to beleive the staunch supporters of the old way (crossover) would have been resistant to switch if it was not superior. as a tangential analogy there was resistance to the 2 handed bh but enough posistives for it to be mainstream now. so far not enough negatives for the one handed bh to extibuish it .(not yet anyway). the fact that the crossover is extinguished in the pros juniors etc means to me it is inferior. jmho

 

[gzhpcu]

again g without having the articles to prove it (btw what is the date of that book since i know you have references from the ice ages, just kidding) i have to beleive for the reasons i stated above that the noncrossover serve has more advantages thats why it is taught. during the transition phase you would have to beleive the staunch supporters of the old way (crossover) would have been resistant to switch if it was not superior. as a tangential analogy there was resistance to the 2 handed bh but enough posistives for it to be mainstream now. so far not enough negatives for the one handed bh to extibuish it .(not yet anyway). the fact that the crossover is extinguished in the pros juniors etc means to me it is inferior. jmho

Hi larry, Well, you got me there... Groppel's book is from 1992 ( revised edition of the first edition 1984...), so what you say about the old guard arguing for the crossover step makes sense... In a more modern book, World Class Tennis Technique, edited by Paul Roetert and Groppel, 2001, all that is said about the landing after the serve is that 95% of the tennis pros land on the left foot (right foot for lefties, of course...), and that "left-foot landing is indicative of maximal vertical momentum being derived from the serve..." coupled with a comment on the preceding page, saying "There is a strong association between the height of impact and success. If serving at 145 km/h, increasing the height of impact from aporoximately 2.16 meters to approximately 2.68 meters will double your chance of success."

Having said all that, look at Yannick Noah's beautiful, fluid serve here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBfwDBd9Nd0&feature=PlayList&p=E3294FF50676E321&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=9
It seems he has more elegance due to the crossover step (yeah, I know, you don't win points on elegance, but he still got plenty of serves in, as did Rod Laver with the crossover step...)

 

[larry10s]

all the old time legends with crossover serves were beautiful to watch. i tried to find pancho gonzales clip but couldnt. at the club level a crossover serve i think is easier for many players since the timing of the knee bend lift off etc. is simpler. i know for me when i am just warming up my shouder to serve and not really bending or jumping i end up crossing over and get some good serves in. its taken more practice to do the noncrossover for me as well as i do(still improving)

 

[gzhpcu]

Here is a Gonzales clip for you larry...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd0gJzm_EQY&feature=PlayList&p=D18E49876950F6A9&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=22

Enjoy...

 

[LeeD]

NICE clip, but nevertheless, what BS...
We're playing TENNIS here, a game that involves hitting a yellow fuzzy ball, to an opponent's court, and the worse that can happen is you lose, big deal.
A true WARRIOR puts his life, and the lives of his fellow warriors AT RISK, like during real skirmish's and battles.....where the loser DIES, gets maimed, and so does his fellow brothers.
Warriors are reserved for those who put their lives AT RISK. Tennis players just hit a little yellow fuzzy ball for fun and profit.

 

[larry10s]

g thanks for the clip. leeD sorry it touched a nerve.

 

[gzhpcu]

In which case, maybe a newsreel clip touches no nerve...

Olmedo v McKay, Lew Hoad v Pancho Gonzales in the early 60's:
http://www.britishpathe.com/images//preview/00000000/00086000/00086026.WMV

 

[larry10s]

thanks again

 

[Eph]

Hey gzhpcu, want to get together and play some tennis around the 20th?

Chris

 

[gzhpcu]

Hey gzhpcu, want to get together and play some tennis around the 20th?

Chris

Would like to, but might be tough unless you will be in Lugano around then...

 

[Eph]

Would like to, but might be tough unless you will be in Lugano around then...

Will be in Suisse from May 20 to June 3rd. Will be in Ticino 24th and 25th.

Am there every 2-3 months for holidays.

Can meet you any of those days. Preferably meeting close to the SBB as I don't rent a car there.

 

[gzhpcu]

Sure, Monday, May the 25th would be fine. I could pick you up at the train station... we just need to exchange coordinates...

 

[Eph]

Sure, Monday, May the 25th would be fine. I could pick you up at the train station... we just need to exchange coordinates...

Sorry to derail the thread.

CU soon

 

[gzhpcu]

Eph, just read your recovery thread. Your surgeon apparently does not think you are ready to play tennis... aren't you taking a risk?

 

[Eph]

Eph, just read your recovery thread. Your surgeon apparently does not think you are ready to play tennis... aren't you taking a risk?

I can play now with no restrictions. Just have to wait to go to Zermatt in July.

I'll update, thanks for reminding!

 

[gzhpcu]

Just emailed you....

 

[Eph]

Did you get mine? It'll be from another e-mail address which is similiar..

We have some overzealous e-mail filters these days!

 

[gzhpcu]

Yup, just replied...

 

[snvplayer]

The problem with the cross-over step is that if you intentionally did this, you can open up your body too early, which is not what you want.

If you looked at all the serves by Becker, Laver, and Stich, their right leg does swing around and they land on the right leg. But it happens well after the contact has been made.

If I were you, I would stay away from intentionally doing the cross-over. Once you develop this habit, it's really hard to fix.

 

[gzhpcu]

Yes, it tends to make you overrotate your shoulders, instead of cartwheeling them...