Shanghai Masters deserves a demotion, not a promotion to a "super masters"

[wangs78]

Shanghai masters should just lower entrance fees. I'm sure there are enough Chinese around to fill a stadion, if only they could afford paying for it.

To be honest, tennis (and spectator sports in general) really isn't part of mainstream Chinese culture. Marquee matches will get decent attendance bc it's all about the "prestige" of watching a Fed or Djokovic match, etc. playing live. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if a good chunk of spectators consist of expats. Hopefully this will change and sports becomes a bigger part of Chinese life but historically it just isn't and most school sports are viewed as something that you naturally give up when you grow up and get a "real" job. A very different world versus the US where you have the opposite extreme in which professional sports gets tons of attention and athletes (and not just the top players) get paid millions of dollars a year with fans and corporate sponsors all coughing up big dollars to be part of the "show".

 

[Meles]

I can agree with the idea of a "super master". However, the Shanghai tournament asking for this is ridiculous. It feels like a 250 event. If anything Beiijing looked more convincing as a bigger tournament than Shanghai does. The stands are so empty and emotionless, it certainly doesn't do the sport any favor.

Japan Open beats them both handily. Better matches at the end and extremely well attended.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

OP, what's your overall assessment of the year in tennis? Was 2016 a gain for the sport? Feel like it was a mixed bag, but pretty decidedly leaning towards a loss! Would like to be optimistic... but the trends aren't great, if you ask me!

Very much appreciate the question. Honestly not sure about the year in tennis.

Think it was a decent year for the WTA. Quite a few breakthroughs and new players becoming popular and gaining fans e.g. Kerber, Puig, Pliskova. Kerber becoming number 1 has been great and ushers in a new future for tennis. Good to see variety in slam winners with Kerber winning 2 and stunning everyone with the year she's had, Muguruza at the French (but doing nothing much since then) and Serena at Wimbledon showing she still has what it takes. We've seen a big decline in former top 10 players whether injury or form slump e.g. Ivanovic, Jankovic, Bencic, Safarova, Makarova, Bouchard, Errani, Petkovic and Wozniacki (has since turned it around). Had quite a few comebacks such as; Stosur and Venus back to a slam SF, Cibulkova, Kuznetsova back to the top 10. Had great dramatic storylines too; from Sharapova testing positive to a banned substance to Azarenka having a great start to the year and then shocking everyone by getting pregnant. WTA in 2016 had it all.

Can't say the same for the ATP which has been horrendously boring in my opinion. Same old stuff really. Murray v Novak slam finals, Novak dominating the Masters. Occasional upset like at Wimbledon or Rio but both times the end result was the number 2 Murray picking up the prize and not someone else breaking through.. Unfortunate year with injuries for Fed and Nadal. Good to see DelPo return, have Thiem breakthrough and Stan winning a slam (but then falling back into oblivion..). Same old Kyrgios drama and #nextgen players not winning Masters or slams.

 

[Luka888]

I don't buy this 'super master stuff'. However, I do believe that tennis should be promoted everywhere. China is a 'huge country' ... yes, they don't have tennis history but they are getting there. I'm also against any fifth slam ... a big no no.

It seems like Chinese people are in an early stage of 'adopting tennis' if you wish. They love big stars. I watched the Djokovic-Pospisil match today and the stadium was packed.

It's a process. You can't compare Europe or North America with China when it comes to tennis but they will get there at some point.

On the other hand, it makes me sad that nobody is talking about Africa. Forget about the Middle East. Why not have a masters there. Yes, I know the are poor people, still. It's just my 5 cents.

 

[octobrina10]

The match hasn't even started judging by the scoreline. Quite misleading.




Oh wow a packed practice session. Here's Nadal v Troicki. 2016, aka a few days ago.

I spy quite a lot of empty seats AND it's DURING the match. But cool that you think a couple Nadal training session a few years ago means he's more popular then Fed. lol.









Tagged a few of the posts just to prove to some posters that Octo was of course being misleading and painting Nadal in a positive light and Fed in a negative one. Lol.

The match hasn't even started judging by the scoreline. Quite misleading.




Oh wow a packed practice session. Here's Nadal v Troicki. 2016, aka a few days ago.

I spy quite a lot of empty seats AND it's DURING the match. But cool that you think a couple Nadal training session a few years ago means he's more popular then Fed. lol.











Tagged a few of the posts just to prove to some posters that Octo was of course being misleading and painting Nadal in a positive light and Fed in a negative one. Lol.

Thank you for posting a picture that proves stands were crowded during Rafa's match. Only corporate seats were quite empty.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Thank you for posting a picture that proves stands were crowded during Rafa's match. Only corporate seats were quite empty.

Guess you're blind so I circled the empty spots for you.

 

[octobrina10]

... But cool that you think a couple Nadal training session a few years ago means he's more popular then Fed. lol...

I posted photos taken in 2014 & 2015. Photos taken this year are also available:

 

[Aussie Darcy]

I posted photos taken in 2014 & 2015. Photos taken this year are also available:

I count 20 people in the first pic and 25 in the 2nd picture of him practicing whilst I see MANY empty seats in the stadium when he's actually playing. But nice try.

 

[octobrina10]

... Octo was of course being misleading and painting Nadal in a positive light and Fed in a negative one....

It's hilarious that Fed worshippers can't stand anything positive about Rafa!

 

[Bartelby]

You'll always have Paris.

It's hilarious that Fed worshippers can't stand anything positive about Rafa!

 

[Luckydog]

They have nothing except money.And they absurdly think that money is everything.In China, only a small number of people really like tennis and most of them are students.Ironically,most of so called tennis audiences are fan boys or fan girls. They don't care how to judge a player's performance,don't remember match results,they only shout and cry when they see their idols.Only a few spectators know they should keep quiet when the play is going .Most of them only know about Fed,Nadal,Djo and Muarry,or good looking Lopez.The other guys?Sorry,they usually can't say their names. In fact,at most of time,there were few audiences on the stand(if you watch the live,you will know that ),even if the play was on the center court. Generally,they don't care this sport,but only few players,especially the good looking players. Indeed,Shanghai Masters provides very very high prize money and good facilities,but the audiences and atmosphere are too low to match up a genuine Master1000.This event deserves demotion.

 

[ANDYbhGENIUS]

Might as well move the whole tour to china while we are at it.

Seriously though there shouldn't even be a masters tournament in china. Neither Beijing or shangai are good enough to be masters

A rare manly post here at TT, and I agree, sarcasm rightly employed here, as it is just money powers and globalization (so entire tour to china is a long shot ) driving these decisions, most of it out of the public eye.

Calls for Super Masters is just laughable, or despicable. But the big banks who sponsor the entire tour btw, can pull a Masters 1500 out of thin air with a few strokes of the pen.

 

[ArcspacE]

Thank you for posting a picture that proves stands were crowded during Rafa's match. Only corporate seats were quite empty.

Are you blind?

 

[Luckydog]

Yeah, I call ******** on the use of that photo. It's during warm-up and, by the looks of it, the first match of the night session. I bet by the second changeover there would have been twice that many people in there.

Edit. Confirmed. Here's some pics from during the match. Minimum 80% full, more like 90%.

I assure you that at this event Roger is the God.It seems that almost everybody knows his name in Shanghai,even if he/she never ever touches the racket or doesn't know the color of the ball is yellow or green.

 

[Livedeath]

I reckon Chinese people are done with tennis!

 

[mandy01]

When did this thread become about attendance for Fed versus Nadal? What a way to hijack a thread. Octomom. Get lost please.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

It's hilarious that Fed worshippers can't stand anything positive about Rafa!

If you knew me, you'd know I'm not a 'fed worshipper'. More of an 'Aussie worshipper' nice try though. Clearly you can't stand to look at a stadium and see empty stands for your 'God' Rafa.
I wasn't trying to discredit him anyway with my thread... It was about Shanghai but then you made it about Nadal

 

[octobrina10]

If you knew me, you'd know I'm not a 'fed worshipper'. More of an 'Aussie worshipper' nice try though. Clearly you can't stand to look at a stadium and see empty stands for your 'God' Rafa.
I wasn't trying to discredit him anyway with my thread... It was about Shanghai but then you made it about Nadal

I only replied to posters who made this thread about Fed.

 

[Sartorius]

It's hilarious that Fed worshippers can't stand anything positive about Rafa!

It's also hilarious that you can't stand even the sight of Fed's name and, in the most irrelevant fashion, almost always need to...

reply to posters who made the thread about Fed.

(which actually wasn't the case here even - this was not a thread about Fed or Nadal, until you derailed it)

 

[Fedole]

Yeah, I call ******** on the use of that photo. It's during warm-up and, by the looks of it, the first match of the night session. I bet by the second changeover there would have been twice that many people in there.

Edit. Confirmed. Here's some pics from during the match. Minimum 80% full, more like 90%.

/end

 

[octobrina10]

...this was not a thread about Fed or Nadal, until you derailed it)

This was not a thread about Fed until this:

I think that absence of Federer is felt in Shanghai this year. ...

 

[Sartorius]

This was not a thread about Fed until this:

No. That's just one comment/opinion about the thread's actual topic which is Shanghai's status as a tournament and its attendance. Mentioning someone's name or some concept does not immediately turn the conversation (any conversation) about that person or concept - this is especially the case in an internet message board where there are numerous replies in a thread/topic, and users can selectively choose what to respond, hence steer (or in this case, derail) the thread into that certain someone or concept.

This was basically you "unable to stand anything about Fed".

And that's it, I'm out.

 

[octobrina10]

...And that's it, I'm out.

 

[tacou]

Trust octo to immediately turn this into a popularity contest between Fedal. I wonder if she has files on her computer that go like "fedemptyseats.jpg", "fedmtolist.txt"...

On topic, Super Masters is a super-stupid idea. The regular tour doesn't need corporate like powerhouse tournaments.

How does making IW worth 1200 make it a "corporate powerhouse" ?

 

[Sartorius]

How does making IW worth 1200 make it a "corporate powerhouse" ?

It doesn't immediately do that of course but it may well start a trend towards "bigger, more valuable Masters tournaments" (hence the name "super masters") that try to shape other "smaller" ones or simply outshine them - not to mention players might say choose to skip Miami later on.

Ultimately I just don't see the need for it.

 

[70後]

Can't buy self respect with money.

 

[mikeeeee]

They already have events above the Masters series... they're called Grand Slams.

 

[Deleted member 743561]

Very much appreciate the question. Honestly not sure about the year in tennis.

Think it was a decent year for the WTA. Quite a few breakthroughs and new players becoming popular and gaining fans e.g. Kerber, Puig, Pliskova. Kerber becoming number 1 has been great and ushers in a new future for tennis. Good to see variety in slam winners with Kerber winning 2 and stunning everyone with the year she's had, Muguruza at the French (but doing nothing much since then) and Serena at Wimbledon showing she still has what it takes. We've seen a big decline in former top 10 players whether injury or form slump e.g. Ivanovic, Jankovic, Bencic, Safarova, Makarova, Bouchard, Errani, Petkovic and Wozniacki (has since turned it around). Had quite a few comebacks such as; Stosur and Venus back to a slam SF, Cibulkova, Kuznetsova back to the top 10. Had great dramatic storylines too; from Sharapova testing positive to a banned substance to Azarenka having a great start to the year and then shocking everyone by getting pregnant. WTA in 2016 had it all.

Can't say the same for the ATP which has been horrendously boring in my opinion. Same old stuff really. Murray v Novak slam finals, Novak dominating the Masters. Occasional upset like at Wimbledon or Rio but both times the end result was the number 2 Murray picking up the prize and not someone else breaking through.. Unfortunate year with injuries for Fed and Nadal. Good to see DelPo return, have Thiem breakthrough and Stan winning a slam (but then falling back into oblivion..). Same old Kyrgios drama and #nextgen players not winning Masters or slams.

Wow, very nice analysis. Sorry for delayed acknowledgement. Missed notification.

Don't follow WTA much, but sounds like it's been a much more compelling season for them. Of course, I was aware of all the Sharapova drama... wish that stuff were left to other sports.

Yeah, ATP has some issues. I refuse to give up on pro tennis... I do hope it can hang in there.