Shapo - different rules for different players
- Thread starter Justshort
- Start date
Probably for a reason
he was juicing since last year. They should investigate his sample at AO
Speaking of very small numbers, what are the odds that either Shapovalov or Kyrgios actually read the ITIA decision in Sinner's case before taking their grievance to social media? One in a million? One in a billion? Asymptotically close to zero?
What does your statement have to do with the question I asked about Shapovalov and Kyrgios? (I'll save you the trouble of replying: nothing.)
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
Who knew…Jannik is a Sinner!Two lower ranked Italian players were suspended in 2021 for the same drug while Sinner skates away.
“Italian tennis players have previously tested positive for clostebol. Matilde Paoletti and Mariano Tammaro, both 17-years-old at the time, tested positive in 2021 when anti-doping was under the jurisdiction of the International Tennis Federation (ITF), according to a report in Honest Sport.
Both players were subject to a mandatory provisional suspension, because their results were AAFs. Neither player was nor is anywhere near close to the notoriety of Sinner, whose test was conducted in the weeks following a decision against the ITIA from the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) in the most recent high-profile anti-doping case in tennis: that of former Grand Slam champion Simona Halep.”
Jannik Sinner receives anti-doping sanction after positive tests for banned substance clostebol
A tribunal following an anti-doping investigation found "no fault or negligence" on the Italian's behalfwww.nytimes.com
Another lower ranked Italian player Battaglino got banned for four years in 2023 for the same drug.
ITIA - Stefano Battaglino suspended under Tennis Anti-Doping Programme
ITIA - Stefano Battaglino suspended under Tennis Anti-Doping Programmewww.itia.tennis
Tennis has always been famous for ignoring the drug use of stars and informing them in advance of ‘random’ drug tests.
E La vita!
I think the amount of people who actually read these documents (and compare them to see and learn why for example the two other Italian players actually did get punished) , are extremely small. Just look at the hordes of folks now screaming 'juicing' and 'doping' here on this board.
Thankfully, Sinner was forced to, and able to back up his claims with evidence.
I'm sure it's much more fun to engage in schadefreude, accuse others of malicious intent and engage in conspiracy theories from the safety of a anonymous forum, etc. But having read these documents and then reading all the false assumptions, the correlation vs cuasation conclusions, the accusations etc are hilarious and depressing at the same time.
I generally expect sloppy thinking and loud speaking from some of the everyday members of a public forum. But I would hope that fellow ATP players would take care to familiarize themselves with the details of a case before making public denunciations. But perhaps that's expecting too much from guys like Shapovalov and Krygios. Their whole shtick is that they are unrestrained loudmouths both on-court and off.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Cook him
Purestriker
Legend
What reason? Those three haven't been relevant for two years, two of them in more than three years.
Ray Mercer
Hall of Fame
Shapo has got to worry about his own mental breakdowns. The guy has been a colossal bust since that epic win against Nadal in 2017. Its been 7 years since that win and he has only a single 250 title to his name. He has been a huge disappointment.
Last edited:
Purestriker
Legend
I am sure they did.
What is relevant then in tennis ? Serena is relevant and Halep isn't ?
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
Purestriker
Legend
No, I would say both Halep and Serena are more relevant than a guy who is more known for drinking maple syrup at a changeover than any tennis results. Shapo's claim to fame on a court is hitting an umpire in the eye and one win over an ATG in the semifinals. The last one, well he is a donut.
Since they are not shy about publicly criticizing Sinner and the ATP on the basis of their obviously incomplete knowledge, it's fair to assume that if they actually had inside information about syringes in butts or other smoking guns, they wouldn't hesitate to bring it up.
Everyone apart from big 3 here are donuts. And you are missing the point. It's not popular to call out Sinner for this, so unpopular guys are making statements. Others are silent as more clever or watching about their own image.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
PTPA should set up a players’ investigative council comprising of Kyrgios, Shapo, Sandgren and Battaglino. They should beat the truth out of Sinner in the locker room! Just kidding.
PSA: Say No to violence as an investigative tool and say No to steroids too!
PSA: Say No to violence as an investigative tool and say No to steroids too!
Last edited:
It's not that they are unpopular per se -- it's that they're generally loud, cantankerous, emotional, and anti-authority in a reactive, puerile way. There are thoughtful criticisms that might be made of the handling of Sinner's case, but these guys certainly aren't making them.
itrium84
Hall of Fame
These guys are always upset though
norcal
Legend
Different rules for different players - what are the players who were banned for contaminated substances thinking now?
^kiefer
I think it's pretty relevant what other players think about this since they undergo the testing/consequences etc.
Someone gonna **** Kiefer now too?
You're not wrong, but the perception of these things is really all about... well, perception. The appearance of unfairness or inconsistency. Protocols may be followed exactly, but that doesn't mean the protocols are right or perfect. For example, Cilic mistakenly took a banned substance that someone else mistakenly bought for him due to a language barrier. Sinner unknowingly absorbed a banned substance that someone else intentionally acquired and took. Cilic was suspended four months, Sinner none. Maybe that's perfectly legit given ITIA's rules, but I think for a lot of people it probably feels inconsistent.
I do hope the blowback on Sinner himself isn't too bad. Most of the other players upset on Twitter seem to be angry at the authorities for apparent favoritism and inconsistency rather than Sinner himself. I don't know if ITIA rules need an overhaul but apparently their PR department may need one if everyone's this upset over a perfectly noncontroversial ruling.
Absolutely - and it didn't help that they "only" introduced the ITIA in 2021. Comparing to cases before 2021 is going to be messy at best anyway.
They can certainly improve a lot on the things you and other players mentioned.
I do appreciate that they are trying to be as open as possible, with publishing these detailed reports. And their full guidelines are available too: https://www.itia.tennis/tacp/rules
To be fair (and this is me speculating for the most part), sinner was actually banned, but he succesfully appealed. I'm speculating that they allowed this appeal solely becuase of the extreme low content found.
I haven't gone through their rules yet on what guidelines they employ for the appeal of a provisionary ban though, if they have any.
Bill Lobsalot
Hall of Fame
If they banned PEDs. they may as well ban using the gym, ice baths, and massages. Hell, if Ernest Hemingway wasn't drunk all the time, he would have never written all those great novels.
Just a random thought while sipping a nice Cab.
Just a random thought while sipping a nice Cab.
TheSlicer
Hall of Fame
The quantity is not important, the fact that IS IS found in the blood, shows It was there, the quantity is at the moment of the test, but It is a substance that your body doesnt produce naturally, it just shouldnt be there
anarosevoli
Semi-Pro
These players are not the most intelligent (especially Shapovalov). They can't see the fine difference between something contaminated and something containing the forbidden substance in specific dosis. In second case it is easy to check plausibility of blood parameters, in first case it is impossible. Using second case for masking is nearly impossible because of specific (low) dosis which has to match, whereas in case of contamination (almost) everything is possible. Different rules for different cases, like it should be.
LOBALOT
Legend
You are correct they are not the most intelligent because they are the ones speaking out. The ones that aren't speaking out are the smart ones.
However, they all know it was doping and they all know it was an excuse made to explain away that it was indeed doping and that the low doses were low by intent. It was his hope that they would be low enough or gone by the the time random testing would happen to pop up and it wasn't and he was busted red handed.
So they needed to come up with a crazy story to explain it away and unfortunately, Yastrzemski's excuse wouldn't work in this case so they decided to follow her lead and put a twist on her story.
messiahrobins
Legend
The irony of this guy commenting on this topic lol,
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
Even if you believe Sinner's explanation (which seems plausible enough to me), this is not a good look on the ATP, who clearly protected him and allowed him to continue competing despite the failed test. He should have been provisionally suspended like everyone else.
It also fuels more speculation on who else did they protect? When a certain player regularly missed large chunks of his season in his 20s due to "injuries", there were rumors of it being a cover-up for a silent ban due to doping offenses. These have only been made more credible by these developments
-NN-
G.O.A.T.
Eh? Which player is this regarding?
messiahrobins
Legend
Except the player you are inferring isnt the player the Establishment would want there to be speculation over. The timing of this saga is quite interesting.
Darren Cahill said "we don't know", lol he's hiding something
Mike Sams
G.O.A.T.
The disgruntled clowns are the ones who are most vocal.
No surprise it's Shapovalov, Kyrgios the Novak fanboy, and Broady. All of who achieved nothing on the tour considering the hype they got. Well Broady was a joke from the beginning. The other 2 guys had some hype about them at the beginning but fizzled.
No surprise it's Shapovalov, Kyrgios the Novak fanboy, and Broady. All of who achieved nothing on the tour considering the hype they got. Well Broady was a joke from the beginning. The other 2 guys had some hype about them at the beginning but fizzled.
airchallenge2
Hall of Fame
The fact that he skipped Olympics in the last minute doesn't help his story. No wonder the players are not happy, even those who wouldn't be able to beat him on a tennis court ...A billionth of a milligram LOL
I'm sure Kyrgios and Shapovalov and all the other tour clowns would've kicked Sinner's ass on the court if not for huge amount of steroids in his system
TheSlicer
Hall of Fame
Lol you dont get It right? When the doping agency finds a positive test at the tour the france, do you think quantities are much higher than that? Players are not stupid, in case of doping, what probably happened was that he continously used those steroids in pre season, then It didnt disapear on time from the body, or even when its about a blood transfusion, it could be own blood from the pre season that contains that substance he was using then, the fact that most positive tests have minimum amounts of the substance shows obviously small miscalculations from the teamA billionth of a milligram LOL
I'm sure Kyrgios and Shapovalov and all the other tour clowns would've kicked Sinner's ass on the court if not for huge amount of steroids in his system
Mike Sams
G.O.A.T.
Hope Kyrgios meets Sinner at the US Open.
airchallenge2
Hall of Fame
+1.
Similar threads
