Should Murray skip one of the last masters?

Flint

Hall of Fame
To be more rested in the other tournaments remaining this year?

His schedule actually has him down to play an atp500. Given the year he has had and that he seems to now be burning out like he did in the falls of 2014 and 2015 do you think it would be better if his schedule now involved just 1 of the masters and the WTF?

I don't think he needs to play a 500 at all, I think he should either skip Shanghai so he can have a longer rest now or play Shanghai and skip Paris so he can be well rested to go all out at the WTF. I definitely think the rest of his year should just be 1 masters and the WTF now and thats it.

Also I really hope he doesn't play that Indian Tennis league thing.
And I hope he doesn't play the Davis Cup next year, just focus on Grand Slams and chasing number 1.
 

BGod

Legend
I agree, I think he should just try for Paris and the WTF. He hasn't really come close at WTF and this is his golden opportunity there.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
To be more rested in the other tournaments remaining this year?

His schedule actually has him down to play an atp500. Given the year he has had and that he seems to now be burning out like he did in the falls of 2014 and 2015 do you think it would be better if his schedule now involved just 1 of the masters and the WTF?

I don't think he needs to play a 500 at all, I think he should either skip Shanghai so he can have a longer rest now or play Shanghai and skip Paris so he can be well rested to go all out at the WTF. I definitely think the rest of his year should just be 1 masters and the WTF now and thats it.

Also I really hope he doesn't play that Indian Tennis league thing.
And I hope he doesn't play the Davis Cup next year, just focus on Grand Slams and chasing number 1.
For some reason he's scheduled to play Vienna. I think he can give that one a miss. At least he doesn't have the distraction of another DC final clashing with the WTF so he can fully focus on doing better at the O2 this year. But Andy loves playing DC so I expect he will try to make himself available for at least some of the ties next year if they progress beyond the 1st round.

If he were to skip one of the year end Masters, I think it should be Shanghai given that he's won it twice already. Paris-Bercy is still on his 'to do' list. He finally got past the quarter-finals last year and made his first final there. Maybe he can go one better this year and finally add it to his CV like Rusedski and Henman did before him (it was the only Masters event they ever won)? Plus it would be the ideal preparation leading into London.
 

Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil

Talk Tennis Guru
For some reason he's scheduled to play Vienna. I think he can give that one a miss. At least he doesn't have the distraction of another DC final clashing with the WTF so he can fully focus on doing better at the O2 this year. But Andy loves playing DC so I expect he will try to make himself available for at least some of the ties next year if they progress beyond the 1st round.

If he were to skip one of the year end Masters, I think it should be Shanghai given that he's won it twice already. Paris-Bercy is still on his 'to do' list. He finally got past the quarter-finals last year and made his first final there. Maybe he can go one better this year and finally add it to his CV like Rusedski and Henman did before him (it was the only Masters event they ever won)? Plus it would be the ideal preparation leading into London.
I believe Murray is scheduled to play Beijing too. That's not a great schedule if he wants to have some rest.
 

Noelan

Legend
To be more rested in the other tournaments remaining this year?

His schedule actually has him down to play an atp500. Given the year he has had and that he seems to now be burning out like he did in the falls of 2014 and 2015 do you think it would be better if his schedule now involved just 1 of the masters and the WTF?

I don't think he needs to play a 500 at all, I think he should either skip Shanghai so he can have a longer rest now or play Shanghai and skip Paris so he can be well rested to go all out at the WTF. I definitely think the rest of his year should just be 1 masters and the WTF now and thats it.

Also I really hope he doesn't play that Indian Tennis league thing.
And I hope he doesn't play the Davis Cup next year, just focus on Grand Slams and chasing number 1.
he is in Beijing and Wiena entry list:confused:
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I believe Murray is scheduled to play Beijing too. That's not a great schedule if he wants to have some rest.
The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.
 

Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil

Talk Tennis Guru
The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.
Maybe he figured he could try to deny Djokovic winning the title and close the gap rather than the two of them winning one 500 event each which would make no change to the race.
 

Slice'n'dice

Hall of Fame
For some reason he's scheduled to play Vienna. I think he can give that one a miss. At least he doesn't have the distraction of another DC final clashing with the WTF so he can fully focus on doing better at the O2 this year. But Andy loves playing DC so I expect he will try to make himself available for at least some of the ties next year if they progress beyond the 1st round.

If he were to skip one of the year end Masters, I think it should be Shanghai given that he's won it twice already. Paris-Bercy is still on his 'to do' list. He finally got past the quarter-finals last year and made his first final there. Maybe he can go one better this year and finally add it to his CV like Rusedski and Henman did before him (it was the only Masters event they ever won)? Plus it would be the ideal preparation leading into London.
Don't you think it'd be better to play Shanghai as the conditions suit him better and therefore more likely to win it. Ticking off Paris would be nice I'm sure, but how much is that going to matter to him surely not that much.

I expect him to play both though. Maybe cut one or both of the 500s out, he burnt out at the US Open last year but he finished the year quite strongly. His WTF performances were surely down to one eye on the Davis Cup just didn't really care that year.

He does really seem to like the Davis Cup so I imagine he will play some next year.

The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.
Leaving the Japan open for the Honourable Samurai to win his home tournament once again I suppose. Good man Andy.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Don't you think it'd be better to play Shanghai as the conditions suit him better and therefore more likely to win it. Ticking off Paris would be nice I'm sure, but how much is that going to matter to him surely not that much.
Well, I opted for Paris because I presume it would be a better jumping off point for London (same indoor hardcourt conditions) as well as the fact that he has yet to win it.

I expect him to play both though. Maybe cut one or both of the 500s out, he burnt out at the US Open last year but he finished the year quite strongly. His WTF performances were surely down to one eye on the Davis Cup just didn't really care that year.
As I said, I'm puzzled why Vienna is on his iterinary. Can't think why he needs to play that unless he's chasing as many ranking points as possible to try and narrow the gap with Djokovic (which might also explain why he's opted to play Beijing instead of Tokyo). But given his fatigue issues, it all seems like an unnecessarily busy schedule to close out the year with. I'd be surprised if he ended up playing all these events frankly.

He does really seem to like the Davis Cup so I imagine he will play some next year.
I think he will but at least he doesn't have to worry about that as well for the remainder of this season.

Leaving the Japan open for the Honourable Samurai to win his home tournament once again I suppose. Good man Andy.
:)
 
I think he should take a break until Paris, make sure he's 100% for that and WTF. Will give him a chance to give these a real ago, otherwise, he may burn himself out.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
He should play Tokyo and Shanghai as he always does. Then, if there is a reasonable chance for him to catch and overtake Djokovic on the rankings, he may need to play Paris. He usually plays Tokyo-Shanghai-Paris-WTF anyway, so maybe he should just stick to his original schedule which won't be that taxing.
 

MCallanan

Semi-Pro
As I said, I'm puzzled why Vienna is on his iterinary. Can't think why he needs to play that unless he's chasing as many ranking points as possible to try and narrow the gap with Djokovic (which might also explain why he's opted to play Beijing instead of Tokyo). But given his fatigue issues, it all seems like an unnecessarily busy schedule to close out the year with. I'd be surprised if he ended up playing all these events frankly.




:)
Where did you see that he was playing Vienna? The schedule on his website, which has been updated since Monday to include Beijing doesn't have it listed. Of course that doesn't mean much because it also doesn't have Paris nor the World Tour Finals listed.

Andy's best chance to become world number one is going to happen between the 2017 Australian Open and the conclusion of the Miami Masters. Andy obviously has finalist points to defend in Melbourne but he had quick exits in both Indian Wells and Miami. Novak has 4,000 points to defend during those three tournaments.

The problem of course is that Djokovic has been close to unbeatable during this leg of the tour for a while now. With a 2,000+ point differential between the two in the year to date ranking it's going to be very difficult for Andy to overtake Novak for the number one ranking next year if he can't close the gap or at least keep it at a 2,000 point differential on this last leg of the tour. I think he understands that and it's probably the reason he has added Beijing and Vienna.

Because of that I like the idea of him adding those tournaments but only if he's healthy. If he's not then he's unlikely to close the gap and is simply going to burn himself out for the World Tour Finals.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Where did you see that he was playing Vienna? The schedule on his website, which has been updated since Monday to include Beijing doesn't have it listed. Of course that doesn't mean much because it also doesn't have Paris nor the World Tour Finals listed.
The Vienna website shows him as down to play it (see below) but I hope you're right and he doesn't. Can't see why he would want to. He's already got enough on.

http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/tournaments/vienna/337/overview


Andy's best chance to become world number one is going to happen between the 2017 Australian Open and the conclusion of the Miami Masters. Andy obviously has finalist points to defend in Melbourne but he had quick exits in both Indian Wells and Miami. Novak has 4,000 points to defend during those three tournaments.

The problem of course is that Djokovic has been close to unbeatable during this leg of the tour for a while now. With a 2,000+ point differential between the two in the year to date ranking it's going to be very difficult for Andy to overtake Novak for the number one ranking next year if he can't close the gap or at least keep it at a 2,000 point differential on this last leg of the tour. I think he understands that and it's probably the reason he has added Beijing and Vienna.

Because of that I like the idea of him adding those tournaments but only if he's healthy. If he's not then he's unlikely to close the gap and is simply going to burn himself out for the World Tour Finals.
I agree with this and I too am worried he may be taking too much on. At least he doesn't have DC to worry about for the rest of this year.
 

Sysyphus

Talk Tennis Guru
The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.
Our Savior wants to strike while the Serbian yogamaster is still ambivalent in his feelings for tennis/domestic life/life itself and the Scot has the wind in his sails.
 

JonnyMac

Hall of Fame
Mainad said:
The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.

Our Savior wants to strike while the Serbian yogamaster is still ambivalent in his feelings for tennis/domestic life/life itself and the Scot has the wind in his sails.

As ever @Mainad dams Murray with faint praise ! He does not believe The Bin Man can take the lovely Nole Scholokovic down ...
 

Flint

Hall of Fame
Andy's best chance to become world number one is going to happen between the 2017 Australian Open and the conclusion of the Miami Masters. Andy obviously has finalist points to defend in Melbourne but he had quick exits in both Indian Wells and Miami. Novak has 4,000 points to defend during those three tournaments.

The problem of course is that Djokovic has been close to unbeatable during this leg of the tour for a while now. With a 2,000+ point differential between the two in the year to date ranking it's going to be very difficult for Andy to overtake Novak for the number one ranking next year if he can't close the gap or at least keep it at a 2,000 point differential on this last leg of the tour. I think he understands that and it's probably the reason he has added Beijing and Vienna.
I think the best schedule for him to take number 1 from here would be to firstly have 2 weeks rest and then get back into training (on indoor hard courts, plus fitness work). Then go

Paris, WTF, small rest, winter training block, Brisbane, Australian Open, Rotterdam, Indian Wells, Miami.

No Indian Tennis league, no other exho's and no Davis Cup next year.

If he did that, I think he would have a realistic shot at catching Djokovic.
 

HipRotation

Hall of Fame
The Asian swing has always been part of his schedule (if fit). It surprises me that he has chosen to play Beijing, Djokovic's favourite stomping ground, rather than Tokyo where he has enjoyed more success in the past.
Beijing must have a bigger prestige.


 

MCallanan

Semi-Pro
Xs
I think the best schedule for him to take number 1 from here would be to firstly have 2 weeks rest and then get back into training (on indoor hard courts, plus fitness work). Then go

Paris, WTF, small rest, winter training block, Brisbane, Australian Open, Rotterdam, Indian Wells, Miami.

No Indian Tennis league, no other exho's and no Davis Cup next year.

If he did that, I think he would have a realistic shot at catching Djokovic.
The problem with that schedule is given Andy's history in Paris and at the World Tour Finals it almost guarantees that he will be entering the 2017 season 3,000+ points behind Novak. And if Novak returns to being anything close to what he's been since 2014 that very well might be an insurmountable lead. At very least, at that deficit you're thinking his only chance is to win the Australian Open.
 

Flint

Hall of Fame
Xs


The problem with that schedule is given Andy's history in Paris and at the World Tour Finals it almost guarantees that he will be entering the 2017 season 3,000+ points behind Novak. And if Novak returns to being anything close to what he's been since 2014 that very well might be an insurmountable lead. At very least, at that deficit you're thinking his only chance is to win the Australian Open.
How would you schedule Murray from now until the end of Miami to have him take number 1 in Miami? Factoring training and rest as well?

This question is also aimed at @Mainad
 
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MCallanan

Semi-Pro
How would you schedule Murray from now until the end of Miami to have him take number 1 in Miami? Factoring training and rest as well?
I am not sure it's doable with the way he looked after his match with Pella on Sunday. And we saw what happened when he stretched himself out in 2014 albeit even by picking up Beijing and Vienna it'd still be nothing compared to that 2014 schedule. That's why I say if he's having problems with his health forget about world number one for right now. Focus on getting healthy and prepared to try to add a World Tour Final championship to your resume. That's easier said than done.. If you're Andy Murray at 29, watching Novak go through his first real swoon since 2013, Federer on the sidelines, Nadal a shadow of his former self.. Aren't you wondering if this will be your last real chance for a run at the number one ranking?

But if I were to write up a schedule to have a real chance to overtake Novak it would be the exact schedule he's going with but playing Tokyo instead of Beijing -- Tokyo, Shanghai, Vienna, Paris, World Tour Finals. From there as you mentioned play Brisbane or another one of the 250 Aussie warm ups and be willing to play Rotterdam if need be. If he can go into 2017 being within 1200 points of Novak he will be world number one by the start of Monte-Carlo.
 

bigserving

Hall of Fame
If he is not injured, this is what he does. Nobody is ever completely healthy. Does he have any points to defend this Asia?
 

MCallanan

Semi-Pro
If he is not injured, this is what he does. Nobody is ever completely healthy. Does he have any points to defend this Asia?
No one is ever completely healthy but some players are less healthy than others because of busier schedules. Furthermore other players take bigger risks playing through fatigue because of preexisting conditions; e.g. Andy Murray's back.

I think Andy will play Beijing and Shanghai.. If they can pick up points on Novak they'll move forward with the plan to play Vienna and Paris. If Novak increases his lead I'd expect Andy to pull out of Vienna and maybe even Paris to be ready for the WTF.
 
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chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
The Vienna website shows him as down to play it (see below) but I hope you're right and he doesn't. Can't see why he would want to. He's already got enough on.

http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/tournaments/vienna/337/overview




I agree with this and I too am worried he may be taking too much on. At least he doesn't have DC to worry about for the rest of this year.
I think Murray is trying his best to get close to Djokovic on the rankings. Murray's time is running out, he is already 29, so I think it makes sense that he tries whatever he can to chase Djokovic at this stage of his career.

Murray is playing in Beijing instead of usual Tokyo. This seems to be a strategic move. If they play in different tournaments and they both win, the gap will stay the same, but if Murray beats Djokovic in Beijing, he can actually close the gap. The gap is currently roughly 2000, but if Murray wins in Beijing, he will have closed the gap down by at least 200 pts. Then, if he wins in Shanghai, he will narrow the gap by at least another 400 pts. If, however, Murray fails to win both, I suspect he will withdraw from Vienna and just play in Paris because there won't be much point in playing on such heavy schedule. If, however, he somehow wins both Beijing and Shanghai, he will have narrowed the gap by at least 600 pts(to about 1400 pts), and there will be still some chance to catch Djokovic on the rankings, so I guess he'll try everything until the end which is the right approach.

If he then wins Vienna while Djokovic is inactive, the gap will get down to about 900 pts. Then, depending on the results from Paris and WTF, Murray can become YE no.1.

Now, it will be near impossible for Murray to win every single tournament he enters for the remainder of this year, but he should give it a try. If things don't work out in China, I'm sure his schedule will be modified.
 

Russeljones

G.O.A.T.
Like you predict every year Raonic will win Wimbledon ......:rolleyes:

Yep, as ever, spot on....

Please don't take a job at the Met Office Russel.....
How did Raonic do these last two years at SW19? I think your disregard for the player is clouding your judgement.
 

Max G.

Legend
I don't think skipping a Masters would help him win the AO, which should be his next big goal.

Better just play through the end of the year a normal schedule, try to accumulate points, then re-focus for the AO.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
I don't think skipping a Masters would help him win the AO, which should be his next big goal.

Better just play through the end of the year a normal schedule, try to accumulate points, then re-focus for the AO.
Yes. Even if Murray is behind 1,500 points by the end of this year, by winning AO in January, he can take no.1 position away from Djokovic. He should just play normal schedule and wish for the best.
 

JonnyMac

Hall of Fame
How did Raonic do these last two years at SW19? I think your disregard for the player is clouding your judgement.

I can't remember - I don't think he won though ....
Someone was predicting he'd win ( again ).....

The thing about Raonic is ; he is not a good tennis player - but some people seem to think he is ...
Let me know when he wins something. Perhaps I could improve my judgement ?

However, people who predict he's actually going to win something ? They are currently are just wrong.

Perhaps these people would like to predict how long they are going to wrong for ????????????????????????????
I'd really like to know !:D

Don't worry Russel, it's not just you.

There are hundreds if not thousands of idiots here who think Raonic can win something ...
And even if he does, the hype lavished upon him, will never come anywhere near his, at best, mediocre achievements.
 

Russeljones

G.O.A.T.
I can't remember - I don't think he won though ....
Someone was predicting he'd win ( again ).....

The thing about Raonic is ; he is not a good tennis player - but some people seem to think he is ...
Let me know when he wins something. Perhaps I could improve my judgement ?

However, people who predict he's actually going to win something ? They are currently are just wrong.

Perhaps these people would like to predict how long they are going to wrong for ????????????????????????????
I'd really like to know !:D

Don't worry Russel, it's not just you.

There are hundreds if not thousands of idiots here who think Raonic can win something ...
And even if he does, the hype lavished upon him, will never come anywhere near his, at best, mediocre achievements.
You're going over the top again. Raonic is one of the best among a very select group of elite players. Do keep that in mind, please.
 

JonnyMac

Hall of Fame
You're going over the top again. Raonic is one of the best among a very select group of elite players. Do keep that in mind, please.
Absolutely - Gosh ! I wonder who it is outside this 'very select group of elite players' of whom [he] ' is one of the best among' who are able to thrash his pitifully slow over grown frame ?

Has-beens and nobodys no doubt.... I like the ones who deliberately tear up his abductors....
The poor lad, if only he wasn't permanently feigning injury . Or getting his ass kicked by the Bin Man...
 
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