Fedal? There were Novak, Andy, Stan & Juan Martin waiting in the wings!I’m a Sinner fanboy, and I admire the “poptimism” of the OP celebrating a new YE 1, but a little perspective and a brief history lesson would indicate that the most likely scenario over the next 5 years is a musical chair at the top of the game being shared by Alcaraz and Sinner.
This is the biggest talent gap a duet of players has had over the field since Fedal, and it is not going to change until the deadly younger generation like Mensik and Fonseca matures. SinnCaraz’s only threats are each other, and they are both good enough to snatch the momentum back and forth from each other.
So as it stands it feels much less like the start of a reigning / recurrent dominant No. 1 and much more like a very entertaining duopoly that will unfold.
Looking forward, Sinner’s ability to hold his ranking line is huge because he is so consistent across all surfaces, but the threat from Alcaraz will occur as early as clay season next year, if not sooner depending on whether Jannik can backup his superb start to this season.
Carlitos barely played any lead up events to RG last year. He has a massive points differential to benefit from and he is also likely to repeat at RG.
Sinner will also have few points to defend in the clay season before Roland Garros.I’m a Sinner fanboy, and I admire the “poptimism” of the OP celebrating a new YE 1, but a little perspective and a brief history lesson would indicate that the most likely scenario over the next 5 years is a musical chair at the top of the game being shared by Alcaraz and Sinner.
This is the biggest talent gap a duet of players has had over the field since Fedal, and it is not going to change until the deadly younger generation like Mensik and Fonseca matures. SinnCaraz’s only threats are each other, and they are both good enough to snatch the momentum back and forth from each other.
So as it stands it feels much less like the start of a reigning / recurrent dominant No. 1 and much more like a very entertaining duopoly that will unfold.
Looking forward, Sinner’s ability to hold his ranking line is huge because he is so consistent across all surfaces, but the threat from Alcaraz will occur as early as clay season next year, if not sooner depending on whether Jannik can backup his superb start to this season.
Carlitos barely played any lead up events to RG last year. He has a massive points differential to benefit from and he is also likely to repeat at RG.
“Greatest” is ipso facto subjective. ”Most weeks at number 1“ isn’t subjective.For many it's not subjective at all. It's about numbers. Yes a minority of the base can have any definition possible.
But at the end it comes down to numbers.
Baghdatis Philippoussis Gonzalez era doesn't mean much lol
Oh please! There is absolutely no reason to believe the nonsensical story that his team concocted, with the ATP, to explain how he got clostebol into his body. The ATP is going to bat for this guy, because he was #1 in the world and they don't want to lose the revenue. Do you think they would care, if he was ranked #460? Hell no. The dude would be out of the game.In the event he will not be banned for doping but for objective responsibility towards the behavior of some members of his staff.
Learn to inform yourself before wanting to make rude irony.
Today is a day of celebrations for Jannik Sinner, awarded (and baptized by Boris Becker) for his year-end number 1 in front of his fans.
And by long time I don't mean continuously like Federer 2004-2008, but with great frequency like Djokovic 2011-2023.
How dare you say anything negative about Lord Alcaraz, who is the best thing certain tennis "fans" see in themselves in like--forever!There's no need to talk about Alcaraz, in practice he exploited the ban on Djokovic from participating in many important tournaments to climb to the top of the rankings, from the Australian Open 2022 up to the Sunshine Double 2023. Djokovic, who was unquestionably the best tennis player in the world, was unable accumulate important points to certify his indisputable virtual leadership, which became real as soon as he was allowed to participate in all the tournaments he wanted.
Now with Sinner the situation is totally different given that he is dominating the rankings at a time where the big three have either left the scene, or as in the case of Djokovic they no longer have the ability to aspire to the top of the rankings due to physical wear and tear due at age.
In essence, Sinner's reign arrived at the most opportune moment in giving continuity to what the big three had sown and their ability to constantly be points of reference for the circuit in the rankings.
If you want to become number 1 you know how far you will have to go.
You mean pigeon Roddick, pigeon Hewitt and crying CilicI notice you left out Roddick and Safin, LOLLLLL
Then tell this one--True #1s don’t need PEDs.
You mean pigeon Roddick, pigeon Hewitt and crying Cilic
Djokovic owns FedererRoddick owns Djokovic . LOLLLL
And he can win so efficiently, too! Wow that US Open run was a good example of that. Should have been very tough with everything that Jannik was going through but he strolled to the title.Don't like the talk about the 'true' number 1 too much but it is also correct to state that Sinner is the Nr1 with the biggest point margin* over the competition since the Big3.
P.S. He also dominates in Elo relative to the tour like nobody else since the rise of Djokovic, which bodes well for him.
Defeating Djokovic, the 10 time AO champion and Medvedev the now 3 time AO RU is far more impressive than beating Alcaraz in AO in 2024.Sinner won 2 slams without defeating Alcaraz. If Djokovic had done the same very thing, it would provoke cries of how easy it was!
And until Sinner defeats Alcaraz at a slam again, he's not a real number 1, in my book! He won the first slam, and lost the next two to Alcaraz.Don't like the talk about the 'true' number 1 too much but it is also correct to state that Sinner is the Nr1 with the biggest point margin* over the competition since the Big3.
P.S. He also dominates in Elo relative to the tour like nobody else since the rise of Djokovic, which bodes well for him.
Did Federer only become the real No. 1 when he defeated Nadal in the 2006 Wimbledon final?And until Sinner defeats Alcaraz at a slam again, he's not a real number 1, in my book! He won the first slam, and lost the next two to Alcaraz.
Defeating Djokovic in '23 would be impressive! Defeating the slam-less, rapidly aging Djokovic in '24 was a lot less impressive!Defeating Djokovic, the 10 time AO champion and Medvedev the now 3 time AO RU is far more impressive than beating Alcaraz in AO in 2024.
Federer was the only undisputed no. 1 until his defeat at '08 WB.Did Federer only become the real No. 1 when he defeated Nadal in the 2006 Wimbledon final?
And anyway for the record Sinner has already defeated Alcaraz in a slam (Wimbledon 2022).
Heh, heh, this made me smile.And until Sinner defeats Alcaraz at a slam, he's not a real number 1, in my book!
Nah man. Stan's highest ranking was 3, he was never 1. A re-think of 'true' might be required.I honestly don't think there has been a "true" number one yet since djokovic other than Thiem, Murray, and Stan.
I repeat the question, Federer was number 1 from post Australian Open 2004 until August 2008, but before the 2006 Wimbledon final he had met Nadal (the undisputed number 2 from mid-2005 onwards) twice in the slams losing both matches.Federer was the only undisputed no. 1 until his defeat at '08 WB.
Sinner defeated Alcaraz at '22 AO, before either won a slam. Alcaraz defeated Sinner at two slams that he won!
.............The true number 1 is someone who manages to maintain a consistently high level.....
I was responding to those who said that Sinner cannot consider himself a true number 1 until he beats Alcaraz again in a match within a slam.Nah, man. There is no such requirement. The number 1 player needs only to have the most ranking points on tour, and that fact alone makes them a 'true' number 1 player.
Your attempt to justify otherwise is wide of the mark. Currently, Carlitos has more weeks at number 1 than Jannik. Does that mean he is a better player currently than Jannik? No. But the facts regarding the number 1 ranking are exactly that - the facts. No need for embellishment, or to give it a gloss that has no application to how rankings work.
If what you mean is that it is your opinion that ranking should be as you insist, then that is acknowledged as your opinion - I accept it as such. But your opinion (or anyone else's) is not a fact.
BS!Sinner is the first true number 1 that tennis has had since the big three took up that position on and off
Today is a day of celebrations for Jannik Sinner, awarded (and baptized by Boris Becker) for his year-end number 1 in front of his fans.
First Italian tennis player to do so.
29th number 1 in the history of the computerized system but 19th capable of closing at least one season at the top of the rankings.
Yet beyond these statistical data a reflection arises spontaneously;
Since the beginning of 2004 Federer became number 1 for the first time, well from that moment on, for 20 years the most coveted position has been the prerogative of the big three with the only exceptions being Murray 2016 and Medvedev and Alcaraz 2022/2023.
But they were all impromptu situations resulting from particular circumstances, and in one case (that of Medvedev) they didn't even end the year at number 1.
All this to say that this is truly the first time since the big three established their dictatorship in which one has the feeling that a tennis player who is not actually called Federer, Nadal or Djokovic, is not only deserving of occupying that position, but it also gives you that feeling that this is just the beginning of a reign at the top that is destined to last for a long time.
And by long time I don't mean continuously like Federer 2004-2008, but with great frequency like Djokovic 2011-2023.
Carlos's bigges threat is himself.I’m a Sinner fanboy, and I admire the “poptimism” of the OP celebrating a new YE 1, but a little perspective and a brief history lesson would indicate that the most likely scenario over the next 5 years is a musical chair at the top of the game being shared by Alcaraz and Sinner.
This is the biggest talent gap a duet of players has had over the field since Fedal, and it is not going to change until the deadly younger generation like Mensik and Fonseca matures. SinnCaraz’s only threats are each other, and they are both good enough to snatch the momentum back and forth from each other.
So as it stands it feels much less like the start of a reigning / recurrent dominant No. 1 and much more like a very entertaining duopoly that will unfold.
Looking forward, Sinner’s ability to hold his ranking line is huge because he is so consistent across all surfaces, but the threat from Alcaraz will occur as early as clay season next year, if not sooner depending on whether Jannik can backup his superb start to this season.
Carlitos barely played any lead up events to RG last year. He has a massive points differential to benefit from and he is also likely to repeat at RG.
It does seem that way. When the little maestro gets lost in the moment and starts playing inspired tennis, I don’t think I’ve ever seen him lose.Carlos's bigges threat is himself.
It does seem that way. When the little maestro gets lost in the moment and starts playing inspired tennis, I don’t think I’ve ever seen him lose.
As you say, the issue for Carlos is in finding that inspiration, particularly in hostile conditions that don’t suit his dazzling variety and the effect of his heavy spin.
Agree wholeheartedly. There is a style of tennis that thrives on fast hardcourt that we are not getting the chance to see enough of at the moment.As usually I agree, almost fully this time. Carlos does imho profit more from the current ATP balls than any other top player° as he hits with fh huge spin and has the physical edge. The balls might go dead, as Zverev and Medvedev said, but the spin resists. For Carlos opponents this combination is especially deadly on slower surfaces.
Aggressive & attacking tennis is thus even more important against Carlos but only fairly slick courts allow more people to execute that game plan. On clay his top spin bites and his legs count more making it even for the guy with the biggest weapons from both wings almost impossible to hit through. On grass his sliced returns and strokes get tons of spin and work very well, protecting him.
Daniil also pointed out that the balls at the Olympic Games were 'better' and stayed faster which certainly aided Djokovic in that final to crush winners with the running forehand. As a counter-puncher defending very deep he is of course most vulnerable to the changed ball behavior.
We need at least some faster courts to counter-act that slowing down of the ball but it is far from a perfect solution. In short we need a variety of court speeds and of balls, avoiding reinforcing combinations. Paris masters with the olympic balls would be too much as Indian Wells is right now the other way around. Right now the courts have been sped up a bit but the balls have remained dreadfully slow and bad.
°Ruud and Sinner come in second and third, Fritz profits also imho.
When Alcaraz was number 1, therefore all of 2022 after his victory at the US Open, and then on and off in 2023 pre US Open, the real number 1/best player in the world has always been Djokovic, I knew it, you knew it, and anyone with a minimum knowledge of the dynamics of this sport knew it.No, Alcaraz was.
Agree wholeheartedly. There is a style of tennis that thrives on fast hardcourt that we are not getting the chance to see enough of at the moment.
And players are not incentivised to develop additional fast court techniques because the slicker hard court tournaments and rankings points just aren’t there to exploit on the main tours.
Whenever the men’s or women’s tour is in Japan or South Korea and we see those slightly faster outdoor hardcourts or whenever I watch something like Henman vs Federer 2003 Paris Masters or early improvisational Nalbandian I’m reminded of a style of tennis we are missing out on at the moment.
Djokovic owns Federer
They will just never acknowledge.Sure because he had to wait for Fed to get older. He should be leading by a lot more but he wasn't good enough. It explains why he got more slams after 30 than before. He wasn't good enough peak for peak as proven at FO2011 on a surface that favours his game. LOL, light balls, yeah right.
There is no such thing as GOAT.Fed never won Rome, Monte Carlo and Olympics singles Gold. He's no GOAT.
There is no such thing as GOAT.
Imagine being ranked #1 and your main rival won TWO of the FOUR slams, and you lost ALL THREE matches against him...
That would make you the weakest #1 of all-time!
Sure, Sinner has put together the most dominant single year since the Big 4, but this is super unfair to Alcaraz. He's won 4 Majors and was well and truly the best player in the world for a solid length of time. That wasn't just COVID ranking trickery, he deserved his time at the top as much as Sinner does.Today is a day of celebrations for Jannik Sinner, awarded (and baptized by Boris Becker) for his year-end number 1 in front of his fans.
First Italian tennis player to do so.
29th number 1 in the history of the computerized system but 19th capable of closing at least one season at the top of the rankings.
Yet beyond these statistical data a reflection arises spontaneously;
Since the beginning of 2004 Federer became number 1 for the first time, well from that moment on, for 20 years the most coveted position has been the prerogative of the big three with the only exceptions being Murray 2016 and Medvedev and Alcaraz 2022/2023.
But they were all impromptu situations resulting from particular circumstances, and in one case (that of Medvedev) they didn't even end the year at number 1.
All this to say that this is truly the first time since the big three established their dictatorship in which one has the feeling that a tennis player who is not actually called Federer, Nadal or Djokovic, is not only deserving of occupying that position, but it also gives you that feeling that this is just the beginning of a reign at the top that is destined to last for a long time.
And by long time I don't mean continuously like Federer 2004-2008, but with great frequency like Djokovic 2011-2023.
Alcaraz was never for a single moment the best tennis player in the world.Sure, Sinner has put together the most dominant single year since the Big 4, but this is super unfair to Alcaraz. He's won 4 Majors and was well and truly the best player in the world for a solid length of time. That wasn't just COVID ranking trickery, he deserved his time at the top as much as Sinner does.
Are we using the Neptune ranking system? On this planet, Djokovic was #1 for a lot of that time but certainly not all of it.Alcaraz was never for a single moment the best tennis player in the world.
Half of his slam titles happened when that scepter belonged to Djokovic who was number 1 from Wimbledon 2018 until the 2023 ATP Finals, and the other half he won when that scepter belonged and still belongs to Sinner, who clearly took away that scepter to Djokovic in the semi-final of the last Australian Open (giving him the first real warning statement in Malaga).
That was the real passing of the baton between two worthy number 1s.
As opposed to Wimbledon 2023 and 2024, which were just random upsets by a journeyman?Sinner, who clearly took away that scepter to Djokovic in the semi-final of the last Australian Open (giving him the first real warning statement in Malaga).
That was the real passing of the baton between two worthy number 1s.
If Djokovic was unable to play some tournaments in 2022, in particular 2 slams out of 4, for political reasons, all this does not prevent him from being recognized as the best player of that season too.Are we using the Neptune ranking system? On this planet, Djokovic was #1 for a lot of that time but certainly not all of it.
As opposed to Wimbledon 2023 and 2024, which were just random upsets by a journeyman?
Unserious analysis IMO
Alcaraz was a true #1, what makes you think he wasn't? He beat an in form Djokovic to win Wimbledon. Sinner has won his two slams this year beating nobodies and a really subpar Djokovic.Today is a day of celebrations for Jannik Sinner, awarded (and baptized by Boris Becker) for his year-end number 1 in front of his fans.
First Italian tennis player to do so.
29th number 1 in the history of the computerized system but 19th capable of closing at least one season at the top of the rankings.
Yet beyond these statistical data a reflection arises spontaneously;
Since the beginning of 2004 Federer became number 1 for the first time, well from that moment on, for 20 years the most coveted position has been the prerogative of the big three with the only exceptions being Murray 2016 and Medvedev and Alcaraz 2022/2023.
But they were all impromptu situations resulting from particular circumstances, and in one case (that of Medvedev) they didn't even end the year at number 1.
All this to say that this is truly the first time since the big three established their dictatorship in which one has the feeling that a tennis player who is not actually called Federer, Nadal or Djokovic, is not only deserving of occupying that position, but it also gives you that feeling that this is just the beginning of a reign at the top that is destined to last for a long time.
And by long time I don't mean continuously like Federer 2004-2008, but with great frequency like Djokovic 2011-2023.
Sinner has already achieved a top 10 open era season based on stats. The important tournaments won and ranking domination etc.
He can even beat some of the best seasons like Fed 2005 and Nadal 2008 if he wins ATP finals.
Of course people are thinking Sinner is first true number 1 post big 3. Andy Murray 2016 season was great but it doesn't come in top 15 of open era.
Yes I agree. I am saying sinner year is open era top 10 and it's one of the reason why people are feeling this way. Small difference but sinner is goating right now.Andy was a true #1 with a Slam, 2 Slam finals, a WTF, an Olympics title, 3 Masters 1000s and 3 other titles to finish up that season as #1.