Sinner right now might have the HIGHEST FLOOR level since Peak Fed

[ghostofMecir]

It is very, very, very difficult to go the entire season without having some match in which things don’t work out, the other player is playing too good, etc., etc. When this happens, you take a beating. Sinner hasn’t taken a real beating all year because his floor level game is so sound and complete with no real weaknesses, much like Djokovic’s game, and his game is highly replicable from match to match, surface to surface, opponent to opponent. This makes beating him difficult, and beating him easily almost impossible, much like it took the jaws of life to easily defeat peak Fed.

Sinner’s lowest dominance ratios in matches in 2024
.86 vs. Carlitos in Beijing
.89 vs. Tsitsipas in Monte Carlo

These are the highest dominance ratios in losses since Peak Fed days. From AO 2003 to IW 2008, Federer played 445 matches and only once had a DR lower than .74, and only 6 matches out of 445 in which his DR was under .80. To say that this is absurd is an understatement.

Federer’s lowest dominance ratios in matches during a season
2005: .85 vs. Nalbandian, TMC; .90 vs. Nadal, RG
2006: .83 vs. Nadal, RG; .89 vs. Nadal, Monte Carlo

Below are the two lowest domiance ratios matches for each of the big three:

Nadal:
2005: .77 DR vs. Blake, USO; .78 DR vs. Gaudio, Buenos Aires
2006: .76 DR vs. Berdych, Canada; .73 DR vs. Federer, TMC
2007: .35 DR vs. Nalbandian, Paris; .43 DR versus Nalbandian, Madrid
2008: .24 DR vs. Youhznhy, Chennai; .55 vs. Tsonga, AO
2009: .55 DR vs. Djokovic, Paris; .57 vs. Cilic, Beijing
2010: .58 DR vs. Federer, Tour Finals; .66 vs Melzer, Shanghai
2011: .35 DR vs. Federer, Tour Finals; .55 vs. Murray, Tokyo
2012: .67 DR vs. Kohlscreiber, Halle; .77 vs Federer, IW
2013: .36 DR vs. Djokovic, Beijing; .70 vs. Djokovic, tour finals
2014: .51 DR vs. Djokovic, Miami; .63 vs. Dustin Brown, Halle
2015: .52 DR vs. Djokovic, tour finals; .61 vs. Djokovic, RG
2016: .42 DR vs. Djokovic, Doha; .61 vs. Coric, Cincinnati
2017: .44 DR vs. Federer, Shanghai; .57 vs. Federer, IW
2018: .76 DR vs. Thiem, Madrid; .79 vs. Delpo, USO
2019: .42 DR vs. Djokovic, AO; .54 vs. Zverev, tour finals
2020: .61 DR vs. Djokovic, ATP cup; .77 vs. Zverev, tour
2021: .77 DR vs. Zverev, Madrid; .86 vs. Djokovic, RG
2022: .59 DR vs. Fritz, Tour Finals; .82 vs. FAA, Tour Finals

Federer:
2003: .58 vs. Squillari, Sydney; .77 vs. JMG, Doha
2004: .64 vs. Nadal, Miami; .82 vs. Guga, RG
2005: .85 vs. Nalbandian, TMC; .90 vs. Nadal, RG
2006: .83 vs. Nadal, RG; .89 vs. Nadal, Monte Carlo
2007: .74 vs. Nadal, MC; .74 vs. Volandri, Rome
2008: .52 vs. Nadal, RG; .60 vs. Fish, IW
2009: .72 vs. Murray, Doha; .73 vs. Djokovic, Miami
2010: .63 vs. Murray, Shanghai; .72 vs. Montanes, Estoril
2011: .48 vs. Nadal, Miami; .57 vs. Djokovic, Dubai
2012: .64 vs. Murray, Olympics; .72 vs. Djokovic, RG
2013: .52 vs. Nadal, Rome; .56 vs. Tsonga, RG
2014: .58 vs. Tsonga, Canada; .67 vs. Nadal, AO
2015: .54 vs. Djokovic, Rome; .62 vs. Stan, RG
2016: .61 vs. Djokovic, AO; .68 vs. Thiem, Rome
2017: .72 vs. Zverev, Canada; .85 vs. Delpo, USO
2018: .53 vs. Coric, Shanghai; .64 vs Djokovic, Cincinnati
2019: .68 vs. Rublev, Cincy; .70 vs. Zverev, Shanghai

Djokovic
2006: .54 vs. Hewitt, AO; .59 vs. Stan, Vienna
2007: .47 vs. Santoro, Paris; .52 vs. Moya, Cincinnati
2008: .69 vs. Federer, MC (ret close to end), .70 vs. Roddick; .71 vs. Safin, Wimbledon
2009: .48 vs. Roddick, IW; .59 vs. Federer, Cincy
2010: .59 vs. Verdasco, MC; .63 vs. Federer, Tour Finals
2011: .50 vs. Ferrer, tour finals; .54 vs. Murray, Cincinnati (ret near end); .82 vs. Federer
2012: .49 vs.Nadal, MC; .61 vs. Federer, Cincinnati
2013: .54 vs. Haas, Miami; .77 vs. Isner, Cincinnati
2014: .63 vs. Federer, MC; .65 vs. Tsonga, Canada
2015: .54 vs. Federer, Cincinnati; .57 vs. Federer, Tour Finals
2016: .55 vs. FLo, Dubai; .61 vs. Delpo, Olympics
2017: .48 vs. Zverev, Rome; .69 vs. Nada, Madrid
2018: .67 vs. Paire, Miami; .67 vs. Zverev, Tour finals
2019: .48 vs. Federer, Tour Finals; .63 vs. Nadal, Rome
2020: .62 vs. Sonego, Vienna; .63 vs. Medvedev, Tour Finals
2021: .74 vs. Zverev, Olympics; .76 vs. Medvedev, USO
2022: .75 vs. Rublev, Belgrade; .85 vs. Nadal, RG
2023: .78 vs. Rune, Rome; .93 vs. Lajovic, Djokovic Open
2024: .41 vs. ADM, UC; .54 vs. Tabilo, Rome

Sinner has also now played 74 matches in a row without a straight set loss, already one of the longest streaks in OE history.

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...ost-in-straight-sets-in-nearly-a-year.736075/

 

[Donkus_Reborn]

peak Federer got dismantled by non peak Nadal, Miami 2004.
peak Federer didn't get dismantled by farmers like baghdathis, gonzo or murray
sinner's time will come when he gets dealt with comfortably, he's just playing crap opponents 85% of the time, and an old man with walking stick

 

[NaDjoFed]

This post is very informative indeed. We often analyse the picks and forget of the floors. After all, this is also a game of consistency

 

[Razer]

peak Federer got dismantled by non peak Nadal, Miami 2004.
peak Federer didn't get dismantled by farmers like baghdathis, gonzo or murray
sinner's time will come when he gets dealt with comfortably, he's just playing crap opponents 85% of the time, and an old man with walking stick

Superman got dismantled by Kryptonite but that won't stop Superman from crushing the skull of most superheroes with his fingers. You can have the highest peak and still have weaknesses.

 

[Donkus_Reborn]

This post is very informative indeed. We often analyse the picks and forget of the floors. After all, this is also a game of consistency

Karlovic had a good floor level, man used to play his normal level and lost tiebreaks. No one talks about karlovic without wondering if they could beat him in a baseline rally

 

[MichaelNadal]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1845410958727905426

 

[Donkus_Reborn]

Superman got dismantled by Kryptonite but that won't stop Superman from crushing the skull of most superheroes with his fingers. You can have the highest peak and still have weaknesses.

???????

 

[FeroBango]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1845410958727905426

When even PavvyG seems vaguely reasonable, it's easy to see how much of a joke the Sinner d*ping scandal has been.

 

[TheGoldenEra1990’s]

On hards maybe. I don’t know. He’s got a lot of work to do on clay and grass though. It’s hard to say because the hardcourt field in Feds day was so much better than it is now. Carlos isn’t great on hards yet and djoker is at the end of his career. From there you only got pretty much Fritz who’s a bum. Roddick, Hewitt, davydenko, older Agassi were better hardcourt players than this current crew in 2024 of alcaraz, Zverev, past it med, Fritz and old djokovic. prime Feds “D-“ game could beat this field easily. I don’t see anyone even close to being as good as 34-35 year old Agassi right now

Hell James Blake would be a top guy today on hards. Sinner is doing great though regardless. It’s hard to compare level to level to a player 20 years ago. I do think the field on hards was better in say 2004 than 2024 though. Not sinners fault though. He can only play who’s in front of him. We don’t have a Time Machine

 

[nolefam_2024]

It's great news for the future when we are seeing one of the all time greats taking the tour by storm.

If Sinner can maintain this level for next 2 years, wow. He has gone from up to up to up.

 

[nolefam_2024]

In next 2 years itself sinner can complete career grand slam at this rate.

 

[NeutralFan]

Glad to see more posters seeing the light, we feel vindicated now for the hype we created , it was worth it .

 

[Djokovic2011]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1845410958727905426

Are you posting this because you agree with him or because you think he's a total embarrassment to Djokovic and his decent fans? I just hope it's the latter.

 

[RS]

Behind the big 3. You can debate outside them.

 

[nolefam_2024]

^

Demonstrably false , proven by OP

But do what you need to cope.

 

[ghostofMecir]

On hards maybe. I don’t know. He’s got a lot of work to do on clay and grass though. It’s hard to say because the hardcourt field in Feds day was so much better than it is now. Carlos isn’t great on hards yet and djoker is at the end of his career. From there you only got pretty much Fritz who’s a bum. Roddick, Hewitt, davydenko, older Agassi were better hardcourt players than this current crew in 2024 of alcaraz, Zverev, past it med, Fritz and old djokovic. prime Feds “D-“ game could beat this field easily. I don’t see anyone even close to being as good as 34-35 year old Agassi right now

Hell James Blake would be a top guy today

The lowest dominance ratio he had in any match on grass was 1.14 in his loss vs. Meddy. He really should’ve won that match.

The lowest dominance ratio he had in any match on clay was .89 versus Tsitsipas and then 1.06 versus Alcaraz at RG. Even on clay, which should favor Alcaraz the most, Sinner actually won the dominance ratio and was holding his own quite well. Right now it’s impossible to beat him easily anywhere.

 

[Donkus_Reborn]

sinnerdope

 

[ghostofMecir]

Behind the big 3. You can debate outside them.

Not really when you look at the numbers, though one could argue that the players that they are playing against today don’t involve the victory themselves.

There’s only 3 seasons in the last 40 years in which a player has not had any match where they were beaten easily: 2005, Federer 2006, and sinner 2024. I would also throw in Djokovic 2021 in there as well.

 

[MichaelNadal]

Are you posting this because you agree with him or because you think he's a total embarrassment to Djokovic and his decent fans? I just hope it's the latter.

Pavvy is as nutty as a wet box of cats lol

 

[nolefam_2024]

Not really when you look at the numbers, though one could argue that the players that they are playing against today don’t involve the victory themselves.

There’s only 3 seasons in the last 40 years in which a player has not had any match where they were beaten easily: 2005, Federer 2006, and sinner 2024. I would also throw in Djokovic 2021 in there as well.

Op can you remove the matches ended by retirement or not? It gives wrong impression on dr when match is not won vs fitter opponent.

 

[TheGoldenEra1990’s]

The lowest dominance ratio he had in any match on grass was 1.14 in his loss vs. Meddy. He really should’ve won that match.

The lowest dominance ratio he had in any match on clay was .89 versus Tsitsipas and then 1.06 versus Alcaraz at RG. Even on clay, which should favor Alcaraz the most, Sinner actually won the dominance ratio and was holding his own quite well. Right now it’s impossible to beat him easily anywhere.

Well. If djoker was just a year younger he would probably be beating sinner easily still. Djoker declined a lot after the year end tournament last year. I need to see sinner start dominating Carlos for me to compare him to the caliber of Fed because he went 0-3 for the year and two of those losses came on hards. That’s unacceptable to me. Because Carlos worst surface is hard. I don’t see prime Fed losing to Carlos at all on hards. Probably wouldn’t drop more than a set most of the time. Definitely wouldn’t lose to him on grass

 

[ghostofMecir]

On top of all that, this entire season dominance ratio was at 1.4, a number that is very, very difficult to achieve and requires tournament by tournament, match by match, set by set, point by point dominance of a player without any lull anywhere. It takes an extremely complete game as well as incredible mental fortitude not to have any dips.

Seasons of 1.4+ dominance ratios (50+ matches minimum)
(dating back to 1991 when he match stats for ATP matches)

1.44, 2019 Nadal (69 matches played); lowest was .42 vs. Djokovic, AO
1.43, 2017 Nadal (81 matches played); lowest was .44 vs. Federer, Shanghai
1.42, 2015 Djokovic (89 matches played); lowest was .54 vs. Federer, Cincinnati
1.42, 2013 Djokovic (83 matches played); lowest was .54 vs. Haas, Miami
1.42, 2017 Federer (60 matches played); lowest was .71 vs. Zverev, Canada
1.41, 2015 Federer (74 matches played); lowest was .54 vs. Djokovic, Rome
1.40, 2006 Federer (93 matches played); lowest was .83 vs. Nadal, RG
1.40, 2004 Federer (81 matches played); lowest was.64 vs. Nadal, Miami
1.40, 2024 Sinner (74 matches played); lowest was .86 vs. Carlos, Beijing

1.39, 2019 Djokovic
1.38, 2005, 2007, 2011, 2014, 2019 Federer
1.38, 2011, 2021, 2022 Djokovic
1.38, 1997 Pete Sampras

 

[ghostofMecir]

Op can you remove the matches ended by retirement or not? It gives wrong impression on dr when match is not won vs fitter opponent.

I mostly did, though. I kept the ones where the match was more than halfway completed.

 

[Winner Sinner]

Well, the fact that all his few defeats of the season have occurred in the deciding set is already quite indicative. All matches that could have turned differently in the majority of cases before the decisive set. But I raise again, since I have seen all 71 matches of the season of Sinner I say that during the countless victories he rarely found himself with his back against the wall, they can be counted on the fingers of one hand, obviously the final in Melbourne with Medvedev even if the Russian after the first two sets by his own admission was never really a step away from winning it, ergo, Sinner did not concede any more break points in a match with a very similar flow to that of the 2021 Roland Garros final between Djokovic and Tsitsipas. Other victories in which he risked losing I would say a couple in Halle against Grieskpoor and Struff, and in Cincinnati with Rublev and Zverev. For the rest they have always been victories in which Sinner did not always seem totally in control but almost, this even on occasions in which he lost the first set (which happened quite frequently). Yes, a really solid season from the Italian.

 

[Daniel Andrade]

Was it really that good? tell me everything guys