Slow Chat: Just some thoughts about racquets.

[Klitz]

Thanks. You must be a really good player to adjust the angle of attack consciously. And so confused on #1. Don’t you just to the net as part of a strategy? Like serving and volleying? Attacking a short ball? It seems sooo rare I decide to come to the net that isn’t orchestrated. Sure if you see your ball hurt the opponent you can come in but I certainly won’t know that until the ball lands on the other side.

Can’t you just see your shot is going to get poached?

Scenario: exchanging cross-court forehands in doubles or returning serve on deuce side.

Often times, if I hesitate sprinting to the center of the court, along the baseline, upon "hanging" the ball up through the middle, I will not have a chance to touch the ball that the opposing net player, firmly volleys, in the gap between my partner and I.

However, based on the feedback from the racquet, before looking up, know that my shot is going straight to the net players high forehand volley. Without thinking, I aggressively push my weight towards the center and sprint cross-court.

This allows me to have an opportunity to play one more ball that my opponents often times assume will be a winner.

 

[Shroud]

Scenario: exchanging cross-court forehands in doubles or returning serve on deuce side.

Often times, if I hesitate sprinting to the center of the court, along the baseline, upon "hanging" the ball up through the middle, I will not have a chance to touch the ball that the opposing net player, firmly volleys, in the gap between my partner and I.

However, based on the feedback from the racquet, before looking up, know that my shot is going straight to the net players high forehand volley. Without thinking, I aggressively push my weight towards the center and sprint cross-court.

This allows me to have an opportunity to play one more ball that my opponents often times assume will be a winner.

Wow. That is a whole other level. What lvl are you playing?

Even if I knew all that I would not sprint to the middle. I guess I suck now at doubles. Will try to sprint to the middle next time.

 

[Crocodile]

Hi everyone - just an update about my thoughts about racquets and what people are saying. As a tennis person I always link up with some colleagues, clients and friends on a court, order some gourmet healthy pizza, review books snd even talk about what’s going on in our lives. We meet at a court that is located on an acreage that has views to the mountains and not far from the sea either and has a nice temperate climate.
As I write this it’s Thursday 16th January 2025 and we are right in the middle of the professional tennis season in Australia, it’s school holidays and there are lots of tennis tournaments going on but the major talking point off course is the Australian Open and what we are seeing there both from a player perspective and a racquet perspective and here are some thoughts that we discussed:
1. We are realising that some of us are moving on ( getting older )and the game keeps evolving and there are many new young players that unless you constantly follow the game you may not know who the players are. I think the tennis industry will need to do a job of somehow promoting the new generation as much as they can.
2. The racquets - from what we have seen in the AO lead up events and the AO there are more players using 100sq inch and even just over say 103 or 105 frames in powerful set ups and slightly longer frames.
There was this view particularly of the men using heavy pro stock 95 to 98 frames and not wanting to use new retail type releases and instead the recreational players and some women pros were the ones embracing the new stuff but what we are seeing is the script being flipped with the pros looking for any power advantage they can get plus gut hybrid stringing and we suspect that it’s not just for getting more free power but also to perhaps finish the point faster and spend less time on court getting injured which seems to be a growing concern. The shift has now made many weekend warrior advanced players look like they are the ones being left behind with their old stuff , the 93p’s, Yonex V Core 95 and the PB 10 Mids and PT 2.0, PT 57a and Prestige 2.0 ( all great feeling and fun racquets).
We are not saying that there aren’t those usual international pro stock frames just a noticeable shift in what we are seeing. Anyway what are your thoughts about what’s going on with racquets on the pro tour and with your own tennis community?

 

[jimdontcare]

Hi everyone - just an update about my thoughts about racquets and what people are saying. As a tennis person I always link up with some colleagues, clients and friends on a court, order some gourmet healthy pizza, review books snd even talk about what’s going on in our lives. We meet at a court that is located on an acreage that has views to the mountains and not far from the sea either and has a nice temperate climate.
As I write this it’s Thursday 16th January 2025 and we are right in the middle of the professional tennis season in Australia, it’s school holidays and there are lots of tennis tournaments going on but the major talking point off course is the Australian Open and what we are seeing there both from a player perspective and a racquet perspective and here are some thoughts that we discussed:
1. We are realising that some of us are moving on and the game keeps evolving and there are many new young players that unless you constantly follow the game you may not know who the players are. I think the tennis industry will need to do a job of somehow promoting the new generation as much as they can.
2. The racquets - from what we have seen in the AO lead up events and the AO there are more players using 100sq inch and even just over say 103 or 105 frames in powerful set ups and slightly longer frames.
There was this view particularly of the men using heavy pro stock 95 to 98 frames and not wanting to use new retail type releases and instead the recreational players and some women pros were the ones embracing the new stuff but what we are seeing is the script being flipped with the pros looking for any power advantage they can get plus gut hybrid stringing and we suspect that it’s not just for getting more free power but also to perhaps finish the point faster and spend less time on court getting injured which seems to be a growing concern. The shift has now made many weekend warrior advanced players look like they are the ones being left behind with their old stuff old stuff, the 93p’s, Yonex V Core 95 and the PB 10 Mids and PT 2.0 and Prestige 2.0 ( all great feeling and fun racquets ).
Anyway what are your thoughts about what’s going on with racquets on the pro tour and with your own tennis community?

Necessity is the mother of invention and all that. COVID made balls much slower and pros need to reclaim some advantage. If you're not evolving you're devolving.

On the recreational level, it only helps that polys are getting better and better with fewer and fewer tradeoffs, making it easier for more people to control more powerful racquets.

I'm also sensing a subtle change in our narratives around power. The masculine approach to gear has long been "I'm a strong capable man who can provide my own power," but now I think we're switching to a cowboy-like narrative where a real man can handle whatever power you throw at him. From warrior to horse tamer.

 

[Crocodile]

Necessity is the mother of invention and all that. COVID made balls much slower and pros need to reclaim some advantage. If you're not evolving your devolving.

On the recreational level, it only helps that polys are getting better and better with fewer and fewer tradeoffs, making it easier for more people to control more powerful racquets.

I'm also sensing a subtle change in our narratives around power. The masculine approach to gear has long been "I'm a strong capable man who can provide my own power," but now I think we're switching to a cowboy-like narrative where a real man can handle whatever power you throw at him. From warrior to horse tamer.

It would be interesting to have a discussion about the balls and what’s going on with them. So far this summer here I’m not seeing as many 220km plus serves being sent down - many are serving between the 180km to 200km range. Will have to see what Ben Shelton produces in his next match which should be today after a Tuesday’s win.

 

[Crocodile]

With regards to the tennis balls at the local district level many middle aged players in Australia like the Slazenger Wimbledon balls in the new yellow can. After testing about 50 them in a basket they felt very comfortable on the arm, quite premium and meaty but they do tend to fluff up a little especially on synthetic grass in a night time dew. Pretty close in feel to the Slazenger but a little harder in feel is the current Tecnifibre X One Ball. In fact after weighing every ball the Tecnifibre ball was a very consistent 57 grams which was impressive. Third ball we tested was the Dunlop AO ball and the best way to describe them was that in flight they were very accurate. All 3 brands are pretty good choices. We haven’t been able to measure ball speed but hope to do that soon as well as test more balls.

 

[socallefty]

even just over say 103 or 105 frames in powerful set ups and slightly longer frames.
There was this view particularly of the men using heavy pro stock 95 to 98 frames and not wanting to use new retail type releases and instead the recreational players and some women pros were the ones embracing the new stuff but what we are seeing is the script being flipped with the pros looking for any power advantage they can get plus gut hybrid stringing

Which ATP pros are using racquets bigger than 100 sq inches? Which ATP players below the age of 35 are using gut hybrids?

 

[jimdontcare]

Which ATP players below the age of 35 are using gut hybrids?

Tommy Paul and Jordan Thompson are two. I think I remember seeing Tsitsipas is exploring it.

 

[Tranqville]

2. The racquets - from what we have seen in the AO lead up events and the AO there are more players using 100sq inch and even just over say 103 or 105 frames in powerful set ups and slightly longer frames.
There was this view particularly of the men using heavy pro stock 95 to 98 frames

Fonseca is using a heavy racquet:

Vcore 98 2021 prostock
347,9g
331,5 SW
standard length

Generally, Next Gen finals participants are using 98 racquets, tight control string patterns, and relatively heavy pro setups. Basavareddy even plays with an old 95 Prestige Pro stock. Here's a nice review from @galapagos

 

[Grafil Injection]

With regards to the tennis balls at the local district level many middle aged players in Australia like the Slazenger Wimbledon balls in the new yellow can. After testing about 50 them in a basket they felt very comfortable on the arm, quite premium and meaty but they do tend to fluff up a little especially on synthetic grass in a night time dew. Pretty close in feel to the Slazenger but a little harder in feel is the current Tecnifibre X One Ball. In fact after weighing every ball the Tecnifibre ball was a very consistent 57 grams which was impressive. Third ball we tested was the Dunlop AO ball and the best way to describe them was that in flight they were very accurate. All 3 brands are pretty good choices. We haven’t been able to measure ball speed but hope to do that soon as well as test more balls.

I find that whilst the Wimbledon balls fluff up rapidly, that fluff doesn't come off, so after leaving in the can for a couple if days before playing again, they return to decent condition. Same for Dunlop Forts. The felt for those two has a higher percentage of wool than other brands, so they behave more like cashmere jumpers than plastic base-layers.

 

[Crocodile]

I’m enjoying reading all the posts lately. I was wondering whether many of you do your own get togethers with say friends, colleagues and/or clients at a tennis venue and play tennis and then get around and discuss everything tennis and life around in the clubhouse with a meal or something ? I think it’s an interesting concept. I like to usually find nice courts with a view or beautiful environment and connect with other tennis enthusiasts and build a community.
Tell me what you think about this idea and whether you think it’s worth it ?

 

[jimdontcare]

I’m enjoying reading all the posts lately. I was wondering whether many of you do your own get togethers with say friends, colleagues and/or clients at a tennis venue and play tennis and then get around and discuss everything tennis and life around in the clubhouse with a meal or something ? I think it’s an interesting concept. I like to usually find nice courts with a view or beautiful environment and connect with other tennis enthusiasts and build a community.
Tell me what you think about this idea and whether you think it’s worth it ?

I think america needs more of this in general. Doubly so if tennis is involved.

 

[Power Player]

I’m enjoying reading all the posts lately. I was wondering whether many of you do your own get togethers with say friends, colleagues and/or clients at a tennis venue and play tennis and then get around and discuss everything tennis and life around in the clubhouse with a meal or something ? I think it’s an interesting concept. I like to usually find nice courts with a view or beautiful environment and connect with other tennis enthusiasts and build a community.
Tell me what you think about this idea and whether you think it’s worth it ?

I used to do this when I lived in Florida. I played with the same group of guys for close to 10 years so we would sometimes get together after a 3 hour session and hang out, talk tennis.

 

[jimdontcare]

talk tennis.

He said the thing!

 

[jimdontcare]

Necessity is the mother of invention and all that. COVID made balls much slower and pros need to reclaim some advantage. If you're not evolving you're devolving.

On the recreational level, it only helps that polys are getting better and better with fewer and fewer tradeoffs, making it easier for more people to control more powerful racquets.

I'm also sensing a subtle change in our narratives around power. The masculine approach to gear has long been "I'm a strong capable man who can provide my own power," but now I think we're switching to a cowboy-like narrative where a real man can handle whatever power you throw at him. From warrior to horse tamer.

Turns out Beckett was prepping a video on this exact issue

 

[Crocodile]

Hi guys
Thought I would do an update on what’s been doing the rounds here at my neck of the woods with regards to tennis racquets,
Firstly it’s been very humid on the east coast of Australia and this is making the balls feel quite damp and heavy which is not great on arms.
Anyway I got together with a group of players to try out some frames and here are some observations we made:
1. Volkl C10 Pro 2022 - for a 25 year old design it’s still a very good frame. It’s interesting that when Troy Lara reviewed the Vostra 10 320g he still preferred the silky feel of the C10 Pro and many in my group of testers preferred Volkl’s ICON range to their new stuff. If others also feel this way then it’s a message being sent ri Volkl and a problem and I don’t know how long they can keep selling the C10.

2. Many players get addicted to racquets strung in polyester even when it’s in their arms interest to go with a multi like X one biphase. Some racquets feel very vanilla with a multi while others go well. A 93P feels very nice in a multi.

3. Most of my group who tested the 2024 Dunlop CX 200 Tour and CX98 with the 66 RA preferred the feel of the previous iteration with the 62 RA, especially in the 18 by 20 tour model. Interestingly everybody thought the swing weight was too low on the CX Tour and 98 models with its box beam design and some who usually only liked box beams started to enjoy using the FX Tour 98 with its 65 RA and low SW.

4. Comparing the comfort and feel of some racquets most felt the Tecnifibre TF 40 to be more comfortable than the current CX Dunlop tour but neither were as comfortable as the C10 Pro, V1 EVO, PB 10 Mid , Percept and Phantom 93P but the most comfortable frame goes to the PK Q Tour 315. When combining feel with say comfort then the CX Tour is very good - as is the 93 P.

5. As far as playing with a 305 frame with a 21mm beam many in the group like the V1 Solinco whiteout in the 16 by 19 because they liked the fact that the SW was around 327 and that’s a lot more playable than one with a SW in the low 320’s or lower,

6. Most felt that the best newcomer was the 2025 Yonex Ezone but it’s too expensive she while we haven’t yet hit with any of the the Nordicdots we all agreed that we will buy one when they make a grip 4 or 5 available,

Anyway -,that’s what we discussed in the club house.,Msybe some of you might like to add your own thoughts.

 

[mmazzinin1]

I have slightly changed my mind over the years re the relationship between low / high racquet stiffness and arm-health. In my view, the key is not the RA/DRA of the frame in isolation that matters, but the DRA/vibration frequency of the string + racquet combo.

Having the correct string set up based on the player's level and based on the specific racquet's specs, is the critical success factor both from a playability and an arm-safety perspective. Discussing racquet safety in isolation, ignoring the string set-up, it is a mistake that can cost high $$ in physio later on... Even a PK Q Tour 315 with the wrong string set up (ie stiff poly at higher tension, especially with infrequent string replacements), can be lethal

 

[Tranqville]

Thought I would do an update on what’s been doing the rounds here at my neck of the woods with regards to tennis racquets,

Thanks for an update, but missing most critical info: what did you guys have for a snack: pizza, BBQ, or something else entirely?

 

[Crocodile]

Thanks for an update, but missing most critical info: what did you guys have for a snack: pizza, BBQ, or something else entirely?

We ordered some gourmet pizza with salad, garlic bread from this local healt focused pizza place and some sparkling mineral water infused with lemon and lime;

 

[Tranqville]

We ordered some gourmet pizza with salad, garlic bread from this local healt focused pizza place and some sparkling mineral water infused with lemon and lime;

Nice! Cheers!

 

[Tranqville]

This, but it's about racquets:

 

[Crocodile]

This, but it's about racquets:

Yep

 

[Crocodile]

Hi everyone, just checking in here. We are having quite a mild Autumn ( fall ) with some mega Easter swell that we seem to get this time of the year with some 10 metre waves which some surfers are enjoying - I’m not going out their as I don’t want to end up on the rocks.
Anyway at our Easter tennis gat together we had 14 racquets to test and discuss including 1 Yonex Percept H, 1 Gravity Tour and 1 2025 T Fight 315,’s, some Dunlops, 2 Speed Pros and some Volkl classics.
The thing that most resonated in my mind was how versatile the Head Speed Pros were both in stock form and with a bit of lead at 10 and 2. If you had to choose one racquet that would appeal to the widest audience then this is it.
There has been a lot of YouTube hype about the 2025 Head Gravity Tour and the new T Fights and yes they do have their merits, just not to the extent that some might suggest. I think yes the Gravity Tour has a delightful feel when you hit it right however we did notice a sudden drop in power and stability when you didn’t and yes the glossy teal colour is very nice. You can really hoop the ball with this racquet. With the T Fights we only had the 315 version and I thought it was a really direct and responsive frame that was perfect for crisp doubles play but I think you need to string it on the lower side if you wanted to retain optimal arm comfort. We had ours in hyoer G soft at 48lbs.
Dunlop wise I have now hit with all of the CX range and my favourite one is the Tour 95. Here in OZ the current version is only available in the 16/19 and I think the previous iteration with the 62 RA and 18/20 was a more special racquet especially when it comes to feel. Needless to say the current version needs a bit more weight added to being the SW up around the 328-330 mark to get the best out of it. A lot of YouTubers were very positive about the 400 Tour, however i couldn’t gel with this racquet with its somewhat clunky feel with its thicker, stiffer and head heavy feel. I think the dark horse in this range in the CX 200 OS with its thinner beam and lower RA and I think it could be customised with a leather grip and some lead under the handle. It too has a bit of head weight but I think it’s quite customise-able. The standard. CX 200 with its 98 head has been criticised by many because of its sub 314 SW and you can feel the deficiency with this when you compare it to say a Speed Pro with its 330SW. However what the CX 200 has that many frames. don’t have is this intuitive addictive feel. Yes the CX 98 nerds to be meticulously customised and prepared with the right string. I’m thinking of a gut poly hybrid strung in the low 50’s would work well. I also hit with 2 of the FX frames and the new SX frames and overall my favourite Dunlop is the FX Tour and CX Tour frames. Some testers liked the FX 500 and it’s a very easy frame to use and a much cheaper alternative to a Pure Drive but I found it to be very powerful and whst you need to do with this frame is to find the right balance between power and control while maintaining the right acceptable level of comfort.
I did bring a 2023 C10 Pro and V1 EVO to the court and everyone was quite impressed how good the C10 plays and how comfortable it is. The V1 EVO is also very comfortable but Im not totsl on board with a super variable beam frame that is chock full of thick plastic grommets plus the dual dampening handle system, mainly because I like thin beamed frames with some more feedback;
My favourite frame that we had there was the Yonex Percept H, it’s a real solid frame and you can really crush a forehand with this racquet. For some reason however I found that backhand slices felt more challenging to play for some reason. Anyway that’s what’s been happening;

 

[Crocodile]

Another interesting topic we have been discussing here right now is the price v value proposition in racquet purchasing decisions compared to if you lived overseas. About 10 years ago when $1 00 AUD dollar bought you around $1.08 USD things were a lot more favourable in buying from the US then now when $1.00 AUD is only getting you 62 cents. I remember picking up a Yonex Tour HG for $99 US and a BB Melbourne for $59 US. The savings also extended to stringing and shipping. Now a $169 US PK Q Tour will arrive at my door somewhat over $300 AUD. And the situation is not that good buying from Europe or the UK. A 200 pound frame from the UK will be mid to high $400’s here so you think twice before you make an overseas purchase,
That being said our domestic market does have some sharp deals and some not do shsrp deals. The best value for money proposition here in Australia comes from Dunlop and Prince while our worst deals right now are the new E Zones which are around $419 AUD snd that’s just too much, They slso tried to market the Wilson RF O1 racquets in the $500’s as some sort of oremyim offering but I don’t think people bought idea and this was particularly highlighted with the not so glowing reviews from the YouTube testers who found these frames less than premium. I think premium wise the blue and red versions of the Laver Cup
RF’s are more sought after;

 

[Tranqville]

I visited a Yonex store a few days ago hunting for some shoes. They had an old demo racquet there, Vcore Pro HD in deep green. Wow, it felt so good in the hand, like a meat mallet. Perhaps it was the last generation of traditional player racquets from Yonex. I understand we, the lesser amateur players, benefited so much from this latest crop of user-friendly racquets with better comfort, power and forgiveness. But the racquets lost soul along the way. It was a bitter sweet feel holding the HD in my hand, knowing that I cannot go back to playing it, or to playing my Dunlop 200G Hotmelt, or my Prestige Tour 95. I'm just not good enough, and I'm not getting any younger.

 

[Trip]

A lot of YouTubers were very positive about the 400 Tour, however i couldn’t gel with this racquet with its somewhat clunky feel with its thicker, stiffer and head heavy feel.

Especially in a pleener whose physical attributes are already pushing it towards semi-cumbersome in some ways, the spec you pull is hugely important. And it sounds like yours was over-spec, as was @dr. godmode's and several others here; thus the disparity in take-aways versus those with more properly on-spec samples (Andy from Tennis Euphoria, etc). Even though I'm sure at least some of you would assume not much would change, I would still be curious for you to hit a properly on-spec sample (with a less hoop-dominant mass distribution and unstrung SW down around 290-ish) and see what your thoughts are then.

 

[indyfob2008]

I think Sampras even admitted that if he had switched to a slightly bigger frame, he could've played some more and competed for grand slams. I think Federer learned from Pete and played with bigger frames as he got older to keep up with the younger guys and lengthen his career a little bit.