Soft & control oriented polys

John Z.

Rookie
Hi all - looking for alternative to my usual gut/poly hybrid, primarily for humid days and perhaps also to save a few bucks if possible. I have sensitive tendons so i stay away from lux, rpm and the like, but here's what i tried and might want to try. Any comments/info would be appreciated (plz keep it to those soft poly setups you tried and why they were good or not, as opposed to thought experiments... TYVM).

Tried:
1) Hyper G 1.30 - feels great but tendons disagree over time... and perhaps a tad too to much 'ball friction' as i prefer snap-back sling-shot feeling spin generation (difficult to explain).
2) Hyper G 1.30 / Cream 1.28 (cross) - not sufficiently controlled, spraying balls on hard shots.
3) Hyper G 1.30 / PL2 1.25 - great setup but not arm friendly enough and perhaps still a bit too much grab...
4) Cream 1.28 / SPPP 1.28 - poor man's version of gut/poly, plays well but i need more control from the mains.
5) YPTP 1.25 yellow - amazing blend of all characteristics for 2h, after which it became too underpowered for my liking, ironically.

To be tried (?):
1) YPTP 1.30 / PL2 1.25
2) Revolve 1.30 / PL2 1.25
3) Revolve 1.30 / Revolve 1.25
4) TBS 1.30 / PL2 1.25
5) ???

Thanks in advance,
JZ
 
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Automatix

Hall of Fame
4) Cream 1.28 / SPPP 1.28 - poor man's version of gut/poly, plays well but i need more control from the mains.
According to Martin Baxa from Isospeed, Isospeed Rexxxer is between Cream and Black Fire.

REXXXER is oval so this means more spin potential but also good control.

The material mix contains also emastomer but not as much as Cream. So control lavelnis higher and stiffer. Arm protection is still good.

Durability is somewhere in between Cream and Blackfire.
It's a new string though, just released and not available worldwide for the time being.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
Hyoer G has no home for people with sensitive tendons / elbows. Hyper G 1.30mm is as stiff a the other stiff polys you listed and your aren't doing yourself any favor in hybrids with Hyoer G 1.30. Get rid of it. Period.

If your are a 4.5 or 5.0 hitting with Hyper G hybrids vs other 4.5/5.0s, you can easily hurt your elbow to point you tear a tendon like a 4.5A I recently described in a thread on TT.

Your frame of choice, level of play and how quickly you break a specific brand and gauge of string helps determine your level of play. If you break a poly like Hyoer G 1.30mm in 12 hours, you are a different level of player than someone who doesnt break a 1.30mm multi for months.

Volkl Cyclone Tour (VCT) 1.30mm ( do not use 1.25mm VCT) written many posts of numerous 4.5/5.0 men using it in a full bed.

Tier One Boost FW 1.30mm/GW 1.27mm stiffer than VCT

If you need even softer setups:

Here is a glossary of softer strings including one multi, two rubber infused polys and one straight poly.

Tecnfibre HDMX (mult/poly fusion)
Yonex Poly Tour Air = YPTA only made in 1.25
Isospeed Cream 1.28mm
Head Velocity 1.30mm
GhostWire = GW 1.22 or 1.27mm

HDMX 1.30mm / YTPA 1.25mm
HDMX 1.30mm/ Cream 1.28mm
HDMX 1.30mm / GW 1.27mm
HDMW 1.30mm / Velocity 1.30mm (the softest and a straight multi )

YPTA & Cream are rubber infused polys. GW Is a pure poly.

Compare those fours crosses to each other using the same soft multi/poly fused main string from Tecnfibre HDMX. These don't feel like poly and will break more quickly.

GW is the stiffest of those four crosses.
 
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g4driver

Hall of Fame
maybe you could put in a glossary so people not familiar with all the abbreviations can follow along.
Here is what he was referring to:

1) YPTP 1.30 / PL2 1.25
2) Revolve 1.30 / PL2 1.25
3) Revolve 1.30 / Revolve 1.25
4) TBS 1.30 / PL2 1.25

Yonex Poly Tour Pro
Kirshenbaum Pro Line 2
Wilson Revolve
Solinco Tour Bite Soft

Four combos I wouldn't suggest for a client with a "sensitive elbow" who has been using gut/poly. Makes no sense to me to try those poly/poly combos if the elbow is sensitive. They are all poly / poly hybrids and much stiffer than any gut/poly hybrid.

Elbow pain = ditch poly mains completely and use only the softest poly crosses as last resort. Revolve is a last resort and something I would pass on if I had other options like YPTA, Cream, Velocity to use as a cross instead. GW is one step ahead of Revolve as it is still a poly and it isnt as soft as other options.
 

Hansen

Semi-Pro
one thing to add to g4drivers post.
cream hasn´t the best durability even as a cross (loses to even multi mains), but it flattens out and prevents a locked stringbed.
i habve no experience with air or gw.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
one thing to add to g4drivers post.
cream hasn´t the best durability even as a cross (loses to even multi mains), but it flattens out and prevents a locked stringbed.
i habve no experience with air or gw.
.02 gauge matters. Many posters on this forum fail to include the gauge they are using and or breaking. There is a ginormous difference between 1.15 Hyoer G and 1.30 Hyoer G.

Had a guy message me this weekend that he is breaking TIer One FW in 6-8 hours. When I ask what gauge he tell me 1.20mm Fire Wire. For him the simple answer is to use 1.25mm then 1.30mm of Fire Wire to increase durability.

If you aren't already using 1.28mm Cream try it instead of the 1.23mm version. Thicker strings lasts longer.

A 4.5A down from a 2019 5.0 bump up breaks 1.35 HDX Tour mains before he breaks 1.28mm Cream. I wrote a thread about his injury and string journey last week in a separate thread
 

FIRETennis

Semi-Pro
@g4driver, quick on-topic question without trying to hijack thread too much....

What is your recommendation for a good soft non-poly cross for natural gut? I've seen Velocity mentioned a few times.. any other suggestions?
 

Lavs

Hall of Fame
Try Luxilon 4G. Control-wise - nothing on a marked can beat them. And at mid 40pounds they are pretty OK in confort
 

LOBALOT

Professional
one thing to add to g4drivers post.
cream hasn´t the best durability even as a cross (loses to even multi mains), but it flattens out and prevents a locked stringbed.
i habve no experience with air or gw.
Yes, I use Cream and I agree with you. It is not as slippery as other copolymer strings and does flatten/fray/die although not as quick as other strings. Perhaps it is not as slick because of it's rubbery characteristics. I am not sure I would like it in a full bed.

It serves it's purpose for me with natural gut mains as I need something soft, don't like a locked stringbed, and haven't found anything else that soft that lasts that long.
 
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SinneGOAT

Professional
Hyoer G has no home for people with sensitive tendons / elbows. Hyper G 1.30mm is as stiff a the other stiff polys you listed and your aren't doing yourself any favor in hybrids with Hyoer G 1.30. Get rid of it. Period.

If your are a 4.5 or 5.0 hitting with Hyper G hybrids vs other 4.5/5.0s, you can easily hurt your elbow to point you tear a tendon like a 4.5A I recently described in a thread on TT.

Your frame of choice, level of play and how quickly you break a specific brand and gauge of string helps determine your level of play. If you break a poly like Hyoer G 1.30mm in 12 hours, you are a different level of player than someone who doesnt break a 1.30mm multi for months.

Volkl Cyclone Tour (VCT) 1.30mm ( do not use 1.25mm VCT) written many posts of numerous 4.5/5.0 men using it in a full bed.

Tier One Boost FW 1.30mm/GW 1.27mm stiffer than VCT

If you need even softer setups:

Here is a glossary of softer strings including one multi, two rubber infused polys and one straight poly.

Tecnfibre HDMX (mult/poly fusion)
Yonex Poly Tour Air = YPTA only made in 1.25
Isospeed Cream 1.28mm
Head Velocity 1.30mm
GhostWire = GW 1.22 or 1.27mm

HDMX 1.30mm / YTPA 1.25mm
HDMX 1.30mm/ Cream 1.28mm
HDMX 1.30mm / GW 1.27mm
HDMW 1.30mm / Velocity 1.30mm (the softest and a straight multi )

YPTA & Cream are rubber infused polys. GW Is a pure poly.

Compare those fours crosses to each other using the same soft multi/poly fused main string from Tecnfibre HDMX. These don't feel like poly and will break more quickly.

GW is the stiffest of those four crosses.
Why not VCT 1.25? Just too much power? How about 18?
 
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YPTA & Cream are rubber infused polys. GW Is a pure poly.

GW is the stiffest of those four crosses.
We would like to clarify that Ghost Wire is not a pure polyester string, it is a co-polyester compound.

Also, could you please elaborate on the statement that Ghost Wire is the stiffest of those four crosses? Is this based on personal experience or lab testing?
 

Humbi_HTX

New User
I have been trying ghostwire 19g for over a month and my impression is that it is soft at impact and vibration is muted (for poly) but "feels" stiff or un-elastic. I will try lower tension next time (I think 24k was too much) and maybe 1k less would give me a little more power and feel.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
We would like to clarify that Ghost Wire is not a pure polyester string, it is a co-polyester compound. Also, could you please elaborate on the statement that Ghost Wire is the stiffest of those four crosses? Is this based on personal experience or lab testing?
@TierOneSportsOfficial Allow me to clarify my comments. Other than Yonex Poly Tour Air or Isospeed Cream, no string I have ever played with or written about on the TW Talk Tennis forum has any elastomer (rubber) in the string to my knowledge. If a manufacturer like Tier One uses elastomer (rubber) in their strings, please by all means let users know so they understand exactly what they are buying. I used the word "poly" in the post you quoted instead of using the correct term "co-poly". I do have 20+ reels of co-polys in stock, including four reels of Tier One strings.

But even the message board you are posting on, Tennis Warehouse, refers to co-poly strings as polys, just like I did. The semantics of "polys" vs "copolys" by the TW website, TW employees, and my posters like myself are just that, semantics. Can you and I accept the fact the first generation of polyester strings like Kirschbaum made are pretty much dinosaurs and not really relevant in this thread titled "Soft & control-oriented polys"? :) I don't think the OP can edit the title, but clearly he meant co-polys, as soft "polys" are like unicorns. So per the TW filter, they don't even sell co-polys, just polys and I certainly didn't mean to imply Ghostwire is like a first-generation poly so please forgive me it my post came across in that manner to anyone at Tier One.





I like your strings, but IMO of 40+ years of playing tennis, Ghostwire is indeed stiffer than both Yonex Poly Tour Air1.25mm and Isospeed Cream 1.28mm in my identically weighted 342 gram and balanced four Pure Aero + frames. I have hit with GW 1.27mm in a full bed, just as I have YPTA and Cream 1.28mm, and a cross with Lux 1.30mm Gut. I have further compared Lux 1.30mm mains with YPTA 1.25, Cream 1.28mm, and Ghostwire 1.27mm all at the same 58M/56X tension strung by me personally on my Alpha Ghost and the Ghostwire cross setup felt the stiffest of all.

If you have lab data that offers results comparing YPTA 1.25mm, Isopseed Cream 1.28, and Ghostwire 1.27mm, please share them. I don't have any lab data. Since TennisWarehouse doesn't sell your strings, they have no lab data on TierOne Strings. The USRSA would be the only place that has your lab data to my knowledge and their data shows Ghostwire 1.22mm (thinner than the 1.27mm I used) string stiffness to be 181 lbs/in which backs up my personal experience. I don't get caught up in the data as an end-all and think too many players wrap their head around data, when in fact, they should simply try strings that make them better players instead of ones that match their frames. I have commented many times about 3.0 women using Hyper G in Wilson Blade 98 frames so the green string matches their green Blade 98s. Truly sad, but that is the reality with many rec players.

Tier One makes some great strings for the majority of players and IMO, the majority of rec players using copolys would benefit from using some of your softer strings instead of stiffer copolys like Hyper G. Most players don't generate the RHS to benefit from super stiff strings, yet they play with them to look cool. FireWire and Ghostwire are two such strings that I have found to suit a great many player that I string for. But yes, I have also found two strings softer than Ghostwire and those are Yonex Poly Tour Air and Cream. Don't worry many members on this forum will back up my statement that I have recommend they try your string, so please don't take my input as a slam to Tier One Sports in any manner. You have great strings at great prices!








And yes, even Bob Patterson of the USRSA referred to strings in 2017 as polyester strings.

Collaborative Effort By Bob Patterson:

When it comes to poly strings, we all need to make sure adult recreational players and juniors know the facts. I speak to many manufacturers, coaches, and racquet technicians, and the consensus is that recreational adult players and junior players are using the wrong type of string, tension—or both.

Stiff polyester strings are prevalent in the marketplace and dominate the pro tours, but are they suited for the average club or league player? Most in this industry don’t think so.

First, the very benefit of poly strings is their ability to bend and snap back faster than other materials. This snapback enhances spin on the ball. A pro can swing out and get more spin on the ball while generating a heavier shot. You might think that would be the same for your average junior or club player, but it is most definitely not the case. Most players can’t generate enough racquet-head speed to bend stiff poly strings in the first place. If the string doesn't bend, it can’t snap back, and there is little or no spin enhancement. Many recreational players who switch to a poly never adjust their tension.

I’m always amazed to hear of a 3.5 adult or junior using a full poly set-up at high tensions. This is a surefire way for a player to hurt his or her arm.
Second, monofilament poly strings lose their elasticity—or the ability to snap back—much faster than nylon or other string materials. Since poly strings have a fairly dead feeling to begin with, their decline is less noticeable for recreational players, who tend to not restring as often as they should, which only makes the problem worse. Not only is poly string wrong for most recreational and junior players, it can be harmful. The stiffer string
coupled with stiffer, lighter racquet creates much more shock to the player when the ball impacts the stringbed. In recent years, we’ve seen arm and wrist injuries sideline many top pros, and these athletes train and take every precaution to prevent injury. If we all know it is a problem, how do we fix it? It starts with education: inform players about why they should alter their string set-up. It is better for their health and for their game. Manufacturers need to step up, too.

It is easy to market a string their top sponsored player is using, but companies need to make rec players aware that string may not be best for everyone. Then they need to offer a softer, better-suited string.

The bottom line is that we all need to address this issue. Injured players play less, and may stop playing altogether.

And that’s not good for anyone.

Bob Patterson:
Executive Director of
the U.S. Racquet Stringers Association.

Tennis Industry: Nov/Dec 2017
 
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@TierOneSportsOfficial Allow me to clarify my comments. Other than Yonex Poly Tour Air or Isospeed Cream, no string I have ever played with or written about on the TW Talk Tennis forum has any elastomer (rubber) in the string to my knowledge. If a manufacturer like Tier One uses elastomer (rubber) in their strings, please by all means let users know so they understand exactly what they are buying. I used the word "poly" in the post you quoted instead of using the correct term "co-poly". I do have 20+ reels of co-polys in stock, including four reels of Tier One strings.

But even the message board you are posting on, Tennis Warehouse, refers to co-poly strings as polys, just like I did. The semantics of "polys" vs "copolys" by the TW website, TW employees, and my posters like myself are just that, semantics. Can you and I accept the fact the first generation of polyester strings like Kirschbaum made are pretty much dinosaurs and not really relevant in this thread titled "Soft & control-oriented polys"? :) I don't think the OP can edit the title, but clearly he meant co-polys, as soft "polys" are like unicorns. So per the TW filter, they don't even sell co-polys, just polys and I certainly didn't mean to imply Ghostwire is like a first-generation poly so please forgive me it my post came across in that manner to anyone at Tier One.





I like your strings, but IMO of 40+ years of playing tennis, Ghostwire is indeed stiffer than both Yonex Poly Tour Air1.25mm and Isospeed Cream 1.28mm in my identically weighted 342 gram and balanced four Pure Aero + frames. I have hit with GW 1.27mm in a full bed, just as I have YPTA and Cream 1.28mm, and a cross with Lux 1.30mm Gut. I have further compared Lux 1.30mm mains with YPTA 1.25, Cream 1.28mm, and Ghostwire 1.27mm all at the same 58M/56X tension strung by me personally on my Alpha Ghost and the Ghostwire cross setup felt the stiffest of all.

If you have lab data that offers results comparing YPTA 1.25mm, Isopseed Cream 1.28, and Ghostwire 1.27mm, please share them. I don't have any lab data. Since TennisWarehouse doesn't sell your strings, they have no lab data on TierOne Strings. The USRSA would be the only place that has your lab data to my knowledge and their data shows Ghostwire 1.22mm (thinner than the 1.27mm I used) string stiffness to be 181 lbs/in which backs up my personal experience. I don't get caught up in the data as an end-all and think too many players wrap their head around data, when in fact, they should simply try strings that make them better players instead of ones that match their frames. I have commented many times about 3.0 women using Hyper G in Wilson Blade 98 frames so the green string matches their green Blade 98s. Truly sad, but that is the reality with many rec players.

Tier One makes some great strings for the majority of players and IMO, the majority of rec players using copolys would benefit from using some of your softer strings instead of stiffer copolys like Hyper G. Most players don't generate the RHS to benefit from super stiff strings, yet they play with them to look cool. FireWire and Ghostwire are two such strings that I have found to suit a great many player that I string for. But yes, I have also found two strings softer than Ghostwire and those are Yonex Poly Tour Air and Cream. Don't worry many members on this forum will back up my statement that I have recommend they try your string, so please don't take my input as a slam to Tier One Sports in any manner. You have great strings at great prices!








And yes, even Bob Patterson of the USRSA referred to strings in 2017 as polyester strings.

Collaborative Effort By Bob Patterson:

When it comes to poly strings, we all need to make sure adult recreational players and juniors know the facts. I speak to many manufacturers, coaches, and racquet technicians, and the consensus is that recreational adult players and junior players are using the wrong type of string, tension—or both.

Stiff polyester strings are prevalent in the marketplace and dominate the pro tours, but are they suited for the average club or league player? Most in this industry don’t think so.

First, the very benefit of poly strings is their ability to bend and snap back faster than other materials. This snapback enhances spin on the ball. A pro can swing out and get more spin on the ball while generating a heavier shot. You might think that would be the same for your average junior or club player, but it is most definitely not the case. Most players can’t generate enough racquet-head speed to bend stiff poly strings in the first place. If the string doesn't bend, it can’t snap back, and there is little or no spin enhancement. Many recreational players who switch to a poly never adjust their tension.

I’m always amazed to hear of a 3.5 adult or junior using a full poly set-up at high tensions. This is a surefire way for a player to hurt his or her arm.
Second, monofilament poly strings lose their elasticity—or the ability to snap back—much faster than nylon or other string materials. Since poly strings have a fairly dead feeling to begin with, their decline is less noticeable for recreational players, who tend to not restring as often as they should, which only makes the problem worse. Not only is poly string wrong for most recreational and junior players, it can be harmful. The stiffer string
coupled with stiffer, lighter racquet creates much more shock to the player when the ball impacts the stringbed. In recent years, we’ve seen arm and wrist injuries sideline many top pros, and these athletes train and take every precaution to prevent injury. If we all know it is a problem, how do we fix it? It starts with education: inform players about why they should alter their string set-up. It is better for their health and for their game. Manufacturers need to step up, too.

It is easy to market a string their top sponsored player is using, but companies need to make rec players aware that string may not be best for everyone. Then they need to offer a softer, better-suited string.

The bottom line is that we all need to address this issue. Injured players play less, and may stop playing altogether.

And that’s not good for anyone.

Bob Patterson:
Executive Director of
the U.S. Racquet Stringers Association.

Tennis Industry: Nov/Dec 2017
Our statements/questions were by no means an attack but rather meant for clarification. [emoji6]

Thanks for taking the time to respond!
 

SinneGOAT

Professional
@TierOneSportsOfficial Allow me to clarify my comments. Other than Yonex Poly Tour Air or Isospeed Cream, no string I have ever played with or written about on the TW Talk Tennis forum has any elastomer (rubber) in the string to my knowledge. If a manufacturer like Tier One uses elastomer (rubber) in their strings, please by all means let users know so they understand exactly what they are buying. I used the word "poly" in the post you quoted instead of using the correct term "co-poly". I do have 20+ reels of co-polys in stock, including four reels of Tier One strings.

But even the message board you are posting on, Tennis Warehouse, refers to co-poly strings as polys, just like I did. The semantics of "polys" vs "copolys" by the TW website, TW employees, and my posters like myself are just that, semantics. Can you and I accept the fact the first generation of polyester strings like Kirschbaum made are pretty much dinosaurs and not really relevant in this thread titled "Soft & control-oriented polys"? :) I don't think the OP can edit the title, but clearly he meant co-polys, as soft "polys" are like unicorns. So per the TW filter, they don't even sell co-polys, just polys and I certainly didn't mean to imply Ghostwire is like a first-generation poly so please forgive me it my post came across in that manner to anyone at Tier One.





I like your strings, but IMO of 40+ years of playing tennis, Ghostwire is indeed stiffer than both Yonex Poly Tour Air1.25mm and Isospeed Cream 1.28mm in my identically weighted 342 gram and balanced four Pure Aero + frames. I have hit with GW 1.27mm in a full bed, just as I have YPTA and Cream 1.28mm, and a cross with Lux 1.30mm Gut. I have further compared Lux 1.30mm mains with YPTA 1.25, Cream 1.28mm, and Ghostwire 1.27mm all at the same 58M/56X tension strung by me personally on my Alpha Ghost and the Ghostwire cross setup felt the stiffest of all.

If you have lab data that offers results comparing YPTA 1.25mm, Isopseed Cream 1.28, and Ghostwire 1.27mm, please share them. I don't have any lab data. Since TennisWarehouse doesn't sell your strings, they have no lab data on TierOne Strings. The USRSA would be the only place that has your lab data to my knowledge and their data shows Ghostwire 1.22mm (thinner than the 1.27mm I used) string stiffness to be 181 lbs/in which backs up my personal experience. I don't get caught up in the data as an end-all and think too many players wrap their head around data, when in fact, they should simply try strings that make them better players instead of ones that match their frames. I have commented many times about 3.0 women using Hyper G in Wilson Blade 98 frames so the green string matches their green Blade 98s. Truly sad, but that is the reality with many rec players.

Tier One makes some great strings for the majority of players and IMO, the majority of rec players using copolys would benefit from using some of your softer strings instead of stiffer copolys like Hyper G. Most players don't generate the RHS to benefit from super stiff strings, yet they play with them to look cool. FireWire and Ghostwire are two such strings that I have found to suit a great many player that I string for. But yes, I have also found two strings softer than Ghostwire and those are Yonex Poly Tour Air and Cream. Don't worry many members on this forum will back up my statement that I have recommend they try your string, so please don't take my input as a slam to Tier One Sports in any manner. You have great strings at great prices!








And yes, even Bob Patterson of the USRSA referred to strings in 2017 as polyester strings.

Collaborative Effort By Bob Patterson:

When it comes to poly strings, we all need to make sure adult recreational players and juniors know the facts. I speak to many manufacturers, coaches, and racquet technicians, and the consensus is that recreational adult players and junior players are using the wrong type of string, tension—or both.

Stiff polyester strings are prevalent in the marketplace and dominate the pro tours, but are they suited for the average club or league player? Most in this industry don’t think so.

First, the very benefit of poly strings is their ability to bend and snap back faster than other materials. This snapback enhances spin on the ball. A pro can swing out and get more spin on the ball while generating a heavier shot. You might think that would be the same for your average junior or club player, but it is most definitely not the case. Most players can’t generate enough racquet-head speed to bend stiff poly strings in the first place. If the string doesn't bend, it can’t snap back, and there is little or no spin enhancement. Many recreational players who switch to a poly never adjust their tension.

I’m always amazed to hear of a 3.5 adult or junior using a full poly set-up at high tensions. This is a surefire way for a player to hurt his or her arm.
Second, monofilament poly strings lose their elasticity—or the ability to snap back—much faster than nylon or other string materials. Since poly strings have a fairly dead feeling to begin with, their decline is less noticeable for recreational players, who tend to not restring as often as they should, which only makes the problem worse. Not only is poly string wrong for most recreational and junior players, it can be harmful. The stiffer string
coupled with stiffer, lighter racquet creates much more shock to the player when the ball impacts the stringbed. In recent years, we’ve seen arm and wrist injuries sideline many top pros, and these athletes train and take every precaution to prevent injury. If we all know it is a problem, how do we fix it? It starts with education: inform players about why they should alter their string set-up. It is better for their health and for their game. Manufacturers need to step up, too.

It is easy to market a string their top sponsored player is using, but companies need to make rec players aware that string may not be best for everyone. Then they need to offer a softer, better-suited string.

The bottom line is that we all need to address this issue. Injured players play less, and may stop playing altogether.

And that’s not good for anyone.

Bob Patterson:
Executive Director of
the U.S. Racquet Stringers Association.

Tennis Industry: Nov/Dec 2017
That is an absolute wall of text holy smokes, but I read it all.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
Our statements/questions were by no means an attack but rather meant for clarification. [emoji6]

Thanks for taking the time to respond!
My initial statement wasn't as accurate as it could have been so that's on me. In no way did I mean to offer any sentiment of Tier One other than one of praise. I am a fan of your strings and have hit with each of them in a full bed.

I have 5.0 players using FireWire 1.30mm and 1.27 & 1.22mm GhostWire has replaced Hawk Hawk as a smooth silk cross for many hybrids including GW to soften up Hyoer G for several 4.5 men who like GW in their crosses. I have juniors using Boost (FW 1.25/GW 1.22). Your Black Knight is something I would certainly consider for elite juniors and players who generate the RHS to benefit from it.

I just won't parrot a string like Hyper G that wasn't designed for rec players who don't get any benefit from it. @LOBALOT (at my suggestion ) had a conversation with a respected mentor who is the Head Stringer of an Elite Junior / Solinco sponsored Academy. His son is certainly a junior who could use Hyoer G or Black Knight. Most rec players simply don't hit the RHS to get any bennies from strings like these.

And yes I have reels of 1.30mm and 1.25mm Hyoer G and it has it's place.. that place just isn't for 3.0 to most 4.0 men, despite it matching their frames. [emoji102]

A month ago I witnessed a 3.5 hitting with Hyper G who couldn't get the ball past the service line. I've known him for years and offered to restring his frames completely free after asking him what he thought of his current strings. He told me the club (that charges $70 for a pack of Lux 1.30mm Natural Gut and $25 for a pack of synthetic gut before adding a $25 stringing fee) put it in his frames. I swapped his strings at no charge and asked him what he thought. He is still using the Velocity / Cream in his frames. I got a new client because I didn't just put any string in his frame to match his blade 104 frames.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
@g4driver, quick on-topic question without trying to hijack thread too much....

What is your recommendation for a good soft non-poly cross for natural gut? I've seen Velocity mentioned a few times.. any other suggestions?
Non poly cross = 1.30mm Velocity. There isn't a slicker multi I have found. If you want something more durable, go with YPTA 1.25mm (the only gauge it comes in).


YPTA is super soft for a poly/rubber string. Velocity is slicker than YPTA and will mostly likely break before YPTA. The 4.5A guy I wrote about got roughly 8 hours with it before breaking the Velocity in 1.35mm Touch Tonic / 1.30mm Velocity setup.
 

FIRETennis

Semi-Pro
Non poly cross = 1.30mm Velocity. There isn't a slicker multi I have found. If you want something more durable, go with YPTA 1.25mm (the only gauge it comes in).


YPTA is super soft for a poly/rubber string. Velocity is slicker than YPTA and will mostly likely break before YPTA. The 4.5A guy I wrote about got roughly 8 hours with it before breaking the Velocity in 1.35mm Touch Tonic / 1.30mm Velocity setup.
Great. Will try out both. Trying to see how soft one can go ...
So far the best setup I found for me as a cross with gut is Tourna Black Zone 1.25, it's soft but not too soft with enough control. Restrung within 8 hours gives zero discomfort.
Revolve was softer but had not so good tension maintenance and less control.
 

IVKI

New User
@g4driver - I've been playing Solinco Tour Bite 17 mains at 54lbs with Solinco Vanquish 16 crosses at 58lbs in my Clash Tours (and in a VCore 98 that i'm trying to transition too). I'm UK based so don't have a rating that I could call out, but I'm breaking the Vanquish in about 8 hours and I definitely play a more spin focused game than flat - I love that it's a lot softer than a full bed of Tour Bite but I still get good depth control and spin whilst gaining some nice touch on volleys.

I wouldn't say my elbow is hyper-sensitive but I am conscious of wanting to take care of it. I've been playing 2 years or so, with 4 hours coaching a week. Any combinations you'd suggest? I do notice the Vanquish notches pretty fast.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
Great. Will try out both. Trying to see how soft one can go ...
So far the best setup I found for me as a cross with gut is Tourna Black Zone 1.25, it's soft but not too soft with enough control. Restrung within 8 hours gives zero discomfort.
Revolve was softer but had not so good tension maintenance and less control.
Blackzone is a nice soft poly and the price is great.

Have you tried Tier One Ghostwire ? Pretty soft also with good tension mx. I have it in 1.22 and 1.27mm and like the 1.27mm with 1.30mm Lux mains.
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
@g4driver - I've been playing Solinco Tour Bite 17 mains at 54lbs with Solinco Vanquish 16 crosses at 58lbs in my Clash Tours (and in a VCore 98 that i'm trying to transition too). I'm UK based so don't have a rating that I could call out, but I'm breaking the Vanquish in about 8 hours and I definitely play a more spin focused game than flat - I love that it's a lot softer than a full bed of Tour Bite but I still get good depth control and spin whilst gaining some nice touch on volleys.

I wouldn't say my elbow is hyper-sensitive but I am conscious of wanting to take care of it. I've been playing 2 years or so, with 4 hours coaching a week. Any combinations you'd suggest? I do notice the Vanquish notches pretty fast.
You're using a sharp-edged poly (TB 1.20mm) with a soft multi (Vanquish), so that is literally a hot knife and butter, so not a good combo for string life. If TB isn't hurting you with Vanquish 1.30mm, I would suggest you try TB 1.20 mains with TierOne Ghostwire 1.17mm (18g) or Tourna Black Zone 1.20mm (18g) crosses. Edged polys and multis just don't last very long. If you want to stay away from a full co-poly bed, use a 1.30mm or even 1.35mm Synthetic Gut as your cross instead of Vanquish. You'll get more life out of the syn gut (SG) than you will out of the Vanquish, and it's a cheaper setup. The stringbed will be locked with TB/SG, unlike the poly/poly hybrids I mentioned above.

Hope this helps..
 

junior74

G.O.A.T.
@John Z.

The softest poly strings I have tried are:
Gosen Sidewinder, Big Hitter Black7 and Double AR Diablo star.

I would also recommend trying your favourite poly and cross it with Monogut Zyex. Very soft, allows snap back.
 

IVKI

New User
You're using a sharp-edged poly (TB 1.20mm) with a soft multi (Vanquish), so that is literally a hot knife and butter, so not a good combo for string life. If TB isn't hurting you with Vanquish 1.30mm, I would suggest you try TB 1.20 mains with TierOne Ghostwire 1.17mm (18g) or Tourna Black Zone 1.20mm (18g) crosses. Edged polys and multis just don't last very long. If you want to stay away from a full co-poly bed, use a 1.30mm or even 1.35mm Synthetic Gut as your cross instead of Vanquish. You'll get more life out of the syn gut (SG) than you will out of the Vanquish, and it's a cheaper setup. The stringbed will be locked with TB/SG, unlike the poly/poly hybrids I mentioned above.

Hope this helps..
Thanks! It was my first foray into hybrids and picked up a couple of the pre-packaged sets (I figured that Solinco would know what's best with their strings!) - Any particular Synthetic Gut strings that jump to mind? I'll grab a few sets of Ghostwire and Tourna Black zone to try out too!
 

FIRETennis

Semi-Pro
Blackzone is a nice soft poly and the price is great.

Have you tried Tier One Ghostwire ? Pretty soft also with good tension mx. I have it in 1.22 and 1.27mm and like the 1.27mm with 1.30mm Lux mains.
Haven't done so because I can't find them for sale in Europe. Any idea where they manufacture their strings? US, Japan, Germany or Taiwan?
 

sadowsk2

Rookie
I recommend volkl Cyclone Tour (softest) and Volkl V Square (not quite as soft but still very soft). My daughter is a highly ranked national junior who had arm troubles from Hyper G. Played with both those Volkl strings and settled on V Square as it has a little more control. I use it as well and both of us have had no arm issues. String either in the 40s and you’ll be fine
 

jered

Rookie
I’m a fan of the Grapplesnake line of copoly. Definitely in the comfortable but controlled camp.
 

GracelynePro

New User
Gracelyne has released a soft poly string, that is new enough that we are asking for help naming it. Here is a link. Use the promo code "freewhitestrings" to receive a free set (we just ask that you pay shipping - $5 in the US, may be more international). It's really fun to play with, because you get plenty of power from the trampoline effect, but also lots of control because the ball really cradles into the string bed. It works well as a full bed, or in a hybrid configuration.
 

John Z.

Rookie
Thanks everyone for your recommendations.Two of the suggested polys that seemed most interesting to me are

- Gosen Sidewinder 16g
- Volkl Cyclone Tour 16g

Anyone know these well enough to compare them to one another and to Wilson Revolve... in terms of tension maintenance and control for relatively soft polys?

Thanks,
JZ
 

Lavs

Hall of Fame
Never mind but I find Luxilon 4G @ 48-50 plays really soft. I keep silence about control.... just because these strings are the best in this category :)
 

John Z.

Rookie
If a soft string with 4g-like control would exist... this thread would not :)

Lavs - thanks for your recommendation but i'm afraid my tendons are too sensitive for 4g, or even for hyper g or hawk which are already too stiff for me despite being softer than 4g.
 

mctennis

Legend
Hawk is not very soft to hit with. I found it body jarring. I cut it out, horrible to hit with, unless you want to have sore wrists.
 
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Humbi_HTX

New User
If a soft string with 4g-like control would exist... this thread would not :)
You should give ghostwire a try, it really is a soft on the feel but also low powered and controlled in the response. I strung it as mains on a c10pro and a price tt stealth 19g as mains, and it allows you to whack the ball in full control without discomfort.

I am a recreational player, but I go hit the courts 3 times a week and I find ghostwire demanding, I prefer polys that give me a little more back and generate depth, I have another set that I am going to try at lower tension and see if I like it any better.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 

John Z.

Rookie
Hawk is not very soft to hit with. I found it body jarring. I cut it out, horrible to hit with, unless you want to have sore wrists.
Hawk is great cross (very slippery) but unfortunately a bit harsh on arm like most "serious polys". There are a few exceptions of course, YPTP comes to mind.
 

mctennis

Legend
You should give ghostwire a try, it really is a soft on the feel but also low powered and controlled in the response. I strung it as mains on a c10pro and a price tt stealth 19g as mains, and it allows you to whack the ball in full control without discomfort.

I am a recreational player, but I go hit the courts 3 times a week and I find ghostwire demanding, I prefer polys that give me a little more back and generate depth, I have another set that I am going to try at lower tension and see if I like it any better.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Keep us informed if the lower tension works better. Let us know what tensions work best with the GW.
 

serveandvolE

New User
I've been digging Tier One's Black Knight. Pretty soft with decent spin potential and also cheap especially when Tier One has their sales. I also have found Vokl Cyclone Tour (not hot on its tension maintenance though), Gosen Polylon Comfort, and Genesis Black Magic to be soft co-polys. The sleeper of softer strings is Oehms Black Pearl Rough (<$50 reel).
 
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