South Carolina Women

#1
It finally happened yesterday. Jeff McDonald, Vanderbilt's coach and one of the most respected coaches in the women's game, finally lost it. It was in the semi-final match of the SEC Women's championship, being held in College Station, Texas. The match was a tight one between his Commodores and the South Carolina Gamecocks. All of a sudden, Vanderbilt wins a point and McDonald lets out a shriek like one has not heard in a long time. The shriek, mocked the constant screaming and screeching made by not one, but all of South Carolina's players throughout the match. Coaches throughout the SEC have constantly complained to the SEC, and even at last year's NCAA's, about South Carolina's attempt at what can only be described as gamesmanship (screaming and fist pumping right in your opponents face after each and every point). Except for the rare hinderance call, officials have decided not to do anything about this. McDonald had enough yesterday. It's a shame, because SC's roster is loaded with talent, led by #1 Ingrid Martins, probably the best player that nobody has heard about and some other outstanding players. Are the girls being coached to do this? Unfortunately the answer has to be yes. Girls that never uttered a sound in the juniors, have been transformed into screaming machines. If these coaches aren't encouraging this, they are sure standing by idly and allowing it to happen. I'm not going to say anymore. I just hope everyone tunes into the SEC Women's Championship match at 4:30 ET on SEC Network today, and sees for themselves. There is no place in college tennis, for this type of behavior. Watch for yourself, this is taking things a little too far!
 
#2
It finally happened yesterday. Jeff McDonald, Vanderbilt's coach and one of the most respected coaches in the women's game, finally lost it. It was in the semi-final match of the SEC Women's championship, being held in College Station, Texas. The match was a tight one between his Commodores and the South Carolina Gamecocks. All of a sudden, Vanderbilt wins a point and McDonald lets out a shriek like one has not heard in a long time. The shriek, mocked the constant screaming and screeching made by not one, but all of South Carolina's players throughout the match. Coaches throughout the SEC have constantly complained to the SEC, and even at last year's NCAA's, about South Carolina's attempt at what can only be described as gamesmanship (screaming and fist pumping right in your opponents face after each and every point). Except for the rare hinderance call, officials have decided not to do anything about this. McDonald had enough yesterday. It's a shame, because SC's roster is loaded with talent, led by #1 Ingrid Martins, probably the best player that nobody has heard about and some other outstanding players. Are the girls being coached to do this? Unfortunately the answer has to be yes. Girls that never uttered a sound in the juniors, have been transformed into screaming machines. If these coaches aren't encouraging this, they are sure standing by idly and allowing it to happen. I'm not going to say anymore. I just hope everyone tunes into the SEC Women's Championship match at 4:30 ET on SEC Network today, and sees for themselves. There is no place in college tennis, for this type of behavior. Watch for yourself, this is taking things a little too far!
Was it much worse than Danielle Collins going screeching and yelling and going psycho on court ?
 
#3
1. We do in fact coach the girls to do this. It's part of the culture. With all the restrictions that have been levied on the college game in the last few years it's one of the last ways to show emotion. 2. You don't watch much college tennis do you? Every team, at least all of the SEC teams do this. In the last 7 years I've watched 100+ matches between Men and Women. Players of all genders from all teams make noise that's what makes college tennis fun. Just go back to watching pro tennis. 3. Clearly it worked since they beat UGA 4-3 for the SEC title.
 

mikej

Hall of Fame
#4
For the most part, I don’t have a problem with how they acted (having watched on SEC network yesterday) - yes, they’re showing a lot of emotion, both the players on the court and the players cheering on the sideline. They acted like every men’s team in college tennis, so tough if some other women’s teams get unsettled by their volume.

My one caveat, however, is the exaggerated dancing around and intentionally screeching the soles of their shoes during their opponent’s serves. Was happening on lots of courts, and even the returner’s partner in doubles, so certainly being coached / encouraged. That’s getting a little bush league - certainly a hindrance judgment call that I’d like to see some of the refs put a stop to. If it were men’s college tennis with some stronger serves, a couple first serves rifled at the returner’s partner would put a stop to it.
 
#5
For the most part, I don’t have a problem with how they acted (having watched on SEC network yesterday) - yes, they’re showing a lot of emotion, both the players on the court and the players cheering on the sideline. They acted like every men’s team in college tennis, so tough if some other women’s teams get unsettled by their volume.

My one caveat, however, is the exaggerated dancing around and intentionally screeching the soles of their shoes during their opponent’s serves. Was happening on lots of courts, and even the returner’s partner in doubles, so certainly being coached / encouraged. That’s getting a little bush league - certainly a hindrance judgment call that I’d like to see some of the refs put a stop to. If it were men’s college tennis with some stronger serves, a couple first serves rifled at the returner’s partner would put a stop to it.
For the movement on serves it’s all about consistency. If you do it every time it’s routine. If you only do it on certain points it’s a hinderance. Use the rules to your advantage. They’ve been doing it in doubles for at least the last 5 years.
 
#6
1. We do in fact coach the girls to do this. It's part of the culture. With all the restrictions that have been levied on the college game in the last few years it's one of the last ways to show emotion. 2. You don't watch much college tennis do you? Every team, at least all of the SEC teams do this. In the last 7 years I've watched 100+ matches between Men and Women. Players of all genders from all teams make noise that's what makes college tennis fun. Just go back to watching pro tennis. 3. Clearly it worked since they beat UGA 4-3 for the SEC title.
Part of what culture? The culture which disrespects your opponents and the game in general? There's a big difference in what the other teams in the SEC do and what South Carolina does.
 
#7
Part of what culture? The culture which disrespects your opponents and the game in general? There's a big difference in what the other teams in the SEC do and what South Carolina does.
The culture that is about competition and competing for the players beside you in an individual sport. You're attempting to take the college out of college tennis. It doesn't disrespect your opponents or the game. It's not directed at the opponents, that would be against the rules. For the most part it's self talk and releases tension. You probably also think the grunting in tennis is strategic.
 

JLyon

Hall of Fame
#8
The culture that is about competition and competing for the players beside you in an individual sport. You're attempting to take the college out of college tennis. It doesn't disrespect your opponents or the game. It's not directed at the opponents, that would be against the rules. For the most part it's self talk and releases tension. You probably also think the grunting in tennis is strategic.
I agree with you if players are pumping themselves up, but far to many players/teams take it to the disrespectful route of looking right at opponent and screaming and pumping fist, that is taunting not celebrating, not calling out SC either because I saw this way to many times at the Sun Belt this past weekend.
 
#9
I agree with you if players are pumping themselves up, but far to many players/teams take it to the disrespectful route of looking right at opponent and screaming and pumping fist, that is taunting not celebrating, not calling out SC either because I saw this way to many times at the Sun Belt this past weekend.
I think it certainly depends on the situation every time. The first time we played UGA during the regular season the 3 (Lordes) won a competitive match 4 and 3 and literally yelled right at our player all the way from the base line to the net. It lasted like 30 seconds. Our player just turned and walked over to the umpire rather than shaking her hand. It's life. I'm not sure why competition has to be taken out of everything. If you really watch the players you see all sorts of true gamesmanship. For instance in the match yesterday: 3-3 team score, Jokic took an injury timeout down 5-4 in the 3rd. Maybe she was hurt, maybe the match was sliding away after Martins won the last 2-3 games. I personally believe it was gamesmanship but who actually knows?
 
#10
I've seen enough South Carolina matches to know that they are a little over the top for sure. But, they aren't the only ones. I was at the LSU/Ole Miss women's match this year, and LSU was just as bad.
 
#11
Programs without history or relevance need to find gimmicks to try to find a way to win. Screaming is a popular gimmick in women tennis. Hooking in men tennis
 
#14
It finally happened yesterday. Jeff McDonald, Vanderbilt's coach and one of the most respected coaches in the women's game, finally lost it. It was in the semi-final match of the SEC Women's championship, being held in College Station, Texas. The match was a tight one between his Commodores and the South Carolina Gamecocks. All of a sudden, Vanderbilt wins a point and McDonald lets out a shriek like one has not heard in a long time. The shriek, mocked the constant screaming and screeching made by not one, but all of South Carolina's players throughout the match. Coaches throughout the SEC have constantly complained to the SEC, and even at last year's NCAA's, about South Carolina's attempt at what can only be described as gamesmanship (screaming and fist pumping right in your opponents face after each and every point). Except for the rare hinderance call, officials have decided not to do anything about this. McDonald had enough yesterday. It's a shame, because SC's roster is loaded with talent, led by #1 Ingrid Martins, probably the best player that nobody has heard about and some other outstanding players. Are the girls being coached to do this? Unfortunately the answer has to be yes. Girls that never uttered a sound in the juniors, have been transformed into screaming machines. If these coaches aren't encouraging this, they are sure standing by idly and allowing it to happen. I'm not going to say anymore. I just hope everyone tunes into the SEC Women's Championship match at 4:30 ET on SEC Network today, and sees for themselves. There is no place in college tennis, for this type of behavior. Watch for yourself, this is taking things a little too far!
I've seen this behavior from a number of teams across a number of divisions, though it's usually men. I agree that it can be obnoxious, but I don't know, does it really have to be regulated? It's entertaining to see how teams deal with it; though it's understandably probably no fun for the players on the receiving end. Vanderbilt should have given it right back.
 
#15
For the most part, I don’t have a problem with how they acted (having watched on SEC network yesterday) - yes, they’re showing a lot of emotion, both the players on the court and the players cheering on the sideline. They acted like every men’s team in college tennis, so tough if some other women’s teams get unsettled by their volume.

My one caveat, however, is the exaggerated dancing around and intentionally screeching the soles of their shoes during their opponent’s serves. Was happening on lots of courts, and even the returner’s partner in doubles, so certainly being coached / encouraged. That’s getting a little bush league - certainly a hindrance judgment call that I’d like to see some of the refs put a stop to. If it were men’s college tennis with some stronger serves, a couple first serves rifled at the returner’s partner would put a stop to it.
Yes ! Just watching the match vs. Duke it's obvious that they are doing this to distract the server, it's ridiculous.
 
#23
You guys don't understand how coaching works do you? If you look back a year our assistant coach was the National Assistant of the year. Look at our recruiting comparative to the other 7 teams in the top 8. Then look at who won the award. Our coaches actually recruit AND develop players. We're not a school like Stanford, UGA, Duke, UNC where they have 2-3 girls playing that could have gone pro but for some reason ended up in college. Just to give you something else to gripe about, Our number one also got National Senior player of the year.
 
#24
You guys don't understand how coaching works do you? If you look back a year our assistant coach was the National Assistant of the year. Look at our recruiting comparative to the other 7 teams in the top 8. Then look at who won the award. Our coaches actually recruit AND develop players. We're not a school like Stanford, UGA, Duke, UNC where they have 2-3 girls playing that could have gone pro but for some reason ended up in college. Just to give you something else to gripe about, Our number one also got National Senior player of the year.
I’m talking about the behavior being coached. Governing body should not be endorsing intentional serve disruption. Yes he’s otherwise doing a wonderful job with the program.
 
#26
Did I miss the cheating? Can you direct me to the rule that was broken?
I do think it is directly against a rule - there are several threads on talk TW in the adult league section arguing about interpretations of the rule that deals with allowable movement during service motions, and depends on referee interpretation of whether it is solely to distract - not going to spend another 20 posts debating the wording of that rule with you and beating a dead horse. It’s my opinion that ITA should not be endorsing someone who coaches this behavior. Either way Duke silenced you guys so I’m happy as a Duke alumnus.
 
#27
Interesting how it's up to individual referees but over the last 5 years and multiple players doing the same thing it's never been talked about. And Duke played well and they should have considering their 6 could have played 1 for half the teams in the nation. Duke will be even better next year if Navarro and Beck actually both make it to school. My way too early prediction is they will be a top 10 doubles team by the time spring rolls around as long as they're left together. Emma will also be in the individual singles tournament next spring as long as the coach doesn't keep her too low in the lineup.
 
#28
Like I’ve previously said I like a lot about what S.C. is doing. Bringing more vocal player / crowd support is great. More womens’s teams should do that. Their player development is great, I agree. We’ll agree to disagree on the shoe-screeching etc - I cannot support it and would never allow my child to do that regardless of coaching.
 
#29
You guys don't understand how coaching works do you? If you look back a year our assistant coach was the National Assistant of the year. Look at our recruiting comparative to the other 7 teams in the top 8. Then look at who won the award. Our coaches actually recruit AND develop players. We're not a school like Stanford, UGA, Duke, UNC where they have 2-3 girls playing that could have gone pro but for some reason ended up in college. Just to give you something else to gripe about, Our number one also got National Senior player of the year.
Why isn't that considered good recruiting? Getting good players to come to college.
 
#30
Interesting how it's up to individual referees but over the last 5 years and multiple players doing the same thing it's never been talked about. And Duke played well and they should have considering their 6 could have played 1 for half the teams in the nation. Duke will be even better next year if Navarro and Beck actually both make it to school. My way too early prediction is they will be a top 10 doubles team by the time spring rolls around as long as they're left together. Emma will also be in the individual singles tournament next spring as long as the coach doesn't keep her too low in the lineup.
Beck's a 19 and Navarro a 20. Doubt they will be playing doubles together next year. Although Beck and Navarro are a great doubles team, Beck hasn't done much lately in singles.
 
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