Starting knot tied to crosses

Discussion in 'Stringing Techniques / Stringing Machines' started by ba4x, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. ba4x

    ba4x New User

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    Does anybody anchor their starting knot on a cross instead of a main?

    I have always anchored to a main, as the stringing instructions for each racket I've strung indicate this. I have yet to notice a racket strung differently.

    Today I was watching a Wimbledon highlights video and caught a glimpse of Federer's racket in slow mo - it shows the crosses tied off on the 2nd cross string (instead of the 5th main, for example).

    The shot lasts only a second or two, starts at 00:14


    Just curious if anyone has seen this or understands the logic. I'm guessing it's to avoid damage to the main string.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
    #1
  2. NDStrings

    NDStrings New User

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    P1 ties poly to poly and gut to gut. Poly tied to gut is stress point and could cause the gut to fail. Of course to do this you need to use a starting clamp for your crosses and not use a starting knot.
     
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  3. FedLex123

    FedLex123 New User

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    Yeah I noticed this as well. Kind of curious to know as to how you tie cross to cross since there doesn't appear to have a shared hole on the top half of Wilson rackets?
     
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  4. kkm

    kkm Professional

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    You'll need to use an awl to enlarge the second cross grommet hole (9H) before you start stringing if you want to tie off there.
     
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  5. krisdrum

    krisdrum Rookie

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    The knot is white/grey in color. The crosses are black. That looks like a main tied to a cross to me.
     
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  6. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    might just be a trick of the light.
     
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  7. krisdrum

    krisdrum Rookie

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    That would really surprise me based on what I've looked at several times on the video. But I guess it could be.
     
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  8. ba4x

    ba4x New User

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    The crosses are grey (ALU Power Rough). The mains are white (Natural Gut). The crosses are anchored on the 2nd cross. If the main was anchored to a cross it would be even more unconventional (ie stringing crosses before mains).

    Thanks all for the insights.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  9. Booger

    Booger Hall of Fame

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    I've always tied gut to poly when the pattern calls for it and never had a problem. Is it really an issue?
     
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  10. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    I wonder if @RJYU will have time to answer....looks like his boy(s) are still cutting grass!
     
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  11. Traffic

    Traffic Hall of Fame

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    I string hybrid. I typically tie my starting knot to a cross for my crosses. It's especially true for stringing with gut hybrid.
     
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  12. AndI

    AndI Rookie

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    If you look closer at other crosses, those closer to the top left corner of the video frame, they all appear to change color from black to silver-grey within the last 10-15 mm before they go into the grommet. This indeed must be the tricky lighting conditions in that shot.
     
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  13. krisdrum

    krisdrum Rookie

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    Yep, that is what I get for not making the video full screen. Tricky for sure.
     
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  14. ba4x

    ba4x New User

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    Here's a better visual of the same concept (this is reportedly Federer's racket from Wimbledon 2007). The crosses are tied off this way on both ends.

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. struggle

    struggle Hall of Fame

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    I tie my hybrid off normally. Haven't had the gut snap there yet, and i use super cheap gut.

    I did tie off crosses to themselves when i was fooling with restringing crosses only.

    No more. But i can see why people would practice such.
     
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  16. CosmosMpower

    CosmosMpower Professional

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    People still use starting knots?
     
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  17. ba4x

    ba4x New User

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    In this case it would be a finishing knot. I should have avoided the phrase "starting knot" in the post title, as it's not correct here.
     
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  18. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    starting knots, hair beads, old funky clothes pins, Sharpie caps, all manner of 'stuff'.
     
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  19. Big Bagel

    Big Bagel Rookie

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    In a gut/poly hybrid, any high-quality stringer will avoid tying poly onto a gut anchor string by using a starting clamp rather than a starting knot. P1 isn't the only place where they do this; if you look at the stringing room of the big tournaments, all of the stringers will be using this technique.

    Head and Yonex have both realized this and now make a second tie-off hole on the second cross rather than just having the traditional tie-off hole for a starting knot on the mains. That way stringers don't have to use an awl and manually enlarge the hole.

    If you tie a good, tight knot with poly strings, it is very easy to damage the gut anchor string. Before I learned how to use a starting clamp, I had to change starting knots to avoid breaking the gut. I see a lot of people tying off finishing knots in very poor fashion, leaving the knots very loose. In these cases, using a finishing knot on the gut probably won't harm the gut, you will just have a very poor knot. The only way to guarantee a quality string job with a gut/poly hybrid is to use a starting clamp and do a quality knot, poly on poly. You might be fine doing it other ways, but you do have that risk of damaging the string.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2018 at 12:27 PM
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  20. Irvin

    Irvin G.O.A.T.

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    You may want to reword that. Tying a cross on a cross with a starting knot?

    EDIT: One way or another if you’re stringing the mains with gut you will more than likely tie of on gut strings, and tugging to tighten a finishing knot can cause more damage than a starting knot. If you use a good starting knot you will not damage the gut anchor string.
     
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  21. Big Bagel

    Big Bagel Rookie

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    Yes, I have reworded it, thank you. I meant starting clamp, not starting knot.

    And it depends how you tie the knots. I've seen starting knots that put a lot of pressure on the anchor strings, such as the original starting knot I was taught. There are other starting knots where it is not an issue. Regardless, as RJYU said, it's better to not tie off on gut unless you have to. If you know what you're doing you should be fine, but you're still better off not doing it at all if you can avoid it.
     
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  22. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    Wow, I have tied poly crosses to gut mains dozens of times and tied poly crosses to nylon mains hundreds of times without a single string breaking at the knot. I use a starting clamp and either a parnel or pro knot.
     
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  23. Ronaldo

    Ronaldo Talk Tennis Guru

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    Tying off a cross to a second cross must make it easier for Fed to just re-string the crosses. Save a nickel
     
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  24. Irvin

    Irvin G.O.A.T.

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    I use a starting knot based on the VS Starting knot, but instead of having the tail sticking out I run the tail up through the loops parallel to the anchor string. It’s similar to the normal starting but inverted that’s why I named it an iKnot. It looks very much like a Parnell after it tied but bigger and easier to tie.
     
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  25. Rabbit

    Rabbit G.O.A.T.

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    ^^^^^^^^
    the 'i' is for Irvin. (don't tell anyone)
     
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  26. MAX PLY

    MAX PLY Hall of Fame

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    I not tell anybody!
     
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