Stefanos Tsitsipas has the potential to be a BETTER player than Roger Federer

mike danny said:
In that match Federer was ill and that's well documented.

Tsitsipas is being owned by Oldal whom Federer himself has handled comfortably in his mid 30's.
Click to expand...

Of course he was.

Federer's backhand in mid 30s>>>>>Winningest Federer's backhand, c'mon man, you know this.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent. For starters, I think Tsitsipas is a better baseliner and mentally stronger when compared to Federer. Yes I’m aware of what happened in USO 2020 so don’t bother mentioning it, cause it happens, and I’ve seen enough of Tsitsipas to know he’s one tough motherf*cker. Even Federer himself admitted the guy is tough as nails after struggling against him and losing the two biggest encounters between them.

I have no doubt he’ll achieve great things in the future; however, I don’t think he’ll have the same success Federer had. Tsitsipas’s generation is way more talented than Federer’s generation so unfortunately for him, he won’t have Federer’s luxury as the competition will be fierce. Roddick, Hewitt and Baghadatis are really nothing compared to Medveved, Sinner, Zverev and Thiem. Besides, Tsitsipas seems like a guy who has other interests in life than to keep hitting a ball until he’s 45 years old like Federer. Anyways, that’s not the point.

The point is I believe The Greek God has what it takes to take Federer’s game to the next level. He'll be performing and playing tennis at a higher level. That he’ll do should he put in the effort. His backhand and RoS still leave a lot to be desired and not at Fed’s level yet but he’ll get there. Federer kept improving even in his 30s so Stefanos has a lot of time ahead of him to improve.

One more thing, I’m not sure of this but I can see him becoming even a more popular player than Federer in the future. Two reasons, he’s better looking and more active in the social media, all what’s left is success which is coming his way soon!

#Your heard it here first.
Bump it in a few years.

FedTsitsipas.aspx


Cheers.
Click to expand...

In my opinion, Tsitsipas is already better player than Federer. He just play against stronger field than Federer played in the past.
 
PETEhammer said:
Of course he was.

Federer's backhand in mid 30s>>>>>Winningest Federer's backhand, c'mon man, you know this.
Click to expand...

Prodigy Nadal Shocks Federer at ATP Masters Series-Miami

Prodigy Nadal Shocks Federer at ATP Masters Series-Miami - Tennis News at Tennis-X.com
www.tennis-x.com
"The Swiss was hindered earlier in the week by the flu, which looks to be lingering. "

Fed's BH improved via better equipment. But everything else got worse.

Anyway, Tsitsipas's BH isn't better than Fed's and the fact that it's abused by Oldal is enough proof of that.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss.
Click to expand...
I swear some people in this forum truly enjoy to be proven wrong. Or didn't play tennis. Federer's top skill is to steal time. The ball comes back to the other player too fast. Never ever underestimate this unique power.
 
mike danny said:

Prodigy Nadal Shocks Federer at ATP Masters Series-Miami

Prodigy Nadal Shocks Federer at ATP Masters Series-Miami - Tennis News at Tennis-X.com
www.tennis-x.com
"The Swiss was hindered earlier in the week by the flu, which looks to be lingering. "

Fed's BH improved via better equipment. But everything else got worse.

Anyway, Tsitsipas's BH isn't better than Fed's and the fact that it's abused by Oldal is enough proof of that.
Click to expand...
That's your proof? A tennis-x commentator's opinion that the effects of Federer's flu may have been lingering? Please, try harder
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent. For starters, I think Tsitsipas is a better baseliner and mentally stronger when compared to Federer. Yes I’m aware of what happened in USO 2020 so don’t bother mentioning it, cause it happens, and I’ve seen enough of Tsitsipas to know he’s one tough motherf*cker. Even Federer himself admitted the guy is tough as nails after struggling against him and losing the two biggest encounters between them.

I have no doubt he’ll achieve great things in the future; however, I don’t think he’ll have the same success Federer had. Tsitsipas’s generation is way more talented than Federer’s generation so unfortunately for him, he won’t have Federer’s luxury as the competition will be fierce. Roddick, Hewitt and Baghadatis are really nothing compared to Medveved, Sinner, Zverev and Thiem. Besides, Tsitsipas seems like a guy who has other interests in life than to keep hitting a ball until he’s 45 years old like Federer. Anyways, that’s not the point.

The point is I believe The Greek God has what it takes to take Federer’s game to the next level. He'll be performing and playing tennis at a higher level. That he’ll do should he put in the effort. His backhand and RoS still leave a lot to be desired and not at Fed’s level yet but he’ll get there. Federer kept improving even in his 30s so Stefanos has a lot of time ahead of him to improve.

One more thing, I’m not sure of this but I can see him becoming even a more popular player than Federer in the future. Two reasons, he’s better looking and more active in the social media, all what’s left is success which is coming his way soon!

#Your heard it here first.
Bump it in a few years.

FedTsitsipas.aspx


Cheers.
Click to expand...
Federer is my least favorite of the big 3 but even I can watch a Titsi match and see that Titsi doesn’t have even half of Federer’s ball striking talent. Comparing Titsi’s forehand talent to Fed’s is just laughable.
 
mike danny said:
Nadal himself was better in 2005, but whatever.
Click to expand...
I mean you just randomly swapped to a different match the minute your proof was shown faulty. That shows you're committed to your view regardless. I mean, why don't I just focus on all the matches Nadal won against Federer (24) and ignore the wins Fed has gotten since 2015, and just conclude from that he owns Federer?
 
Nole Slam said:
OP has such a cool username.
Click to expand...
Thanks I guess? I didn't think much of it when I joined. I just went with what I have expertise in.

James P said:
Tsitsipas is good, very likely to win majors at some point, but I don't think anyone in the new class of talent (save unprovens/too early to tell Sinner and Alcaraz) have even ATG talent which apparently is 7-8 slam titles. I don't see any of them doing it. I think there will be a lot of 3-6 major title winners as the Big 3 fade into the sunset.
Click to expand...
Thanks for you comment. I agree we won't see anyone as dominant as the Big 3 anytime soon but there will a couple of ATGs for sure. Tsitsipas is one of them.

Crazy Finn said:
Anything is possible. Stan's a clear outlier in the history of tennis, not winning much and then winning multiple slams at 29. Most people's career trajectory don't go like that.
Also, if Tsitsipas waits till he's Stan's age to win his first slam, that doesn't exactly bode well for how his career has gone up to that point and being a multi-slam winner or ATG becomes much harder.
Click to expand...

Ah here we go with the outliers once again. If anything we have too many outliers these days. Federer is an outlier, Djokovic is an outlier, Nadal is an outlier, Serena is an outlier, Messi is an outlier, Ronlado is an outlier, Brady is an outlier, Ibrahimovic is an outlier, Lebron probable an outlier too. And don't worry, Tsitsipas will win his first slam way before his 29 birthday, I only mentioned as an example as you believe 24 is too late for a tennis player to make an ATG career.

Sunny014 said:
The path of Roger Federer has been the toughest !!!
Click to expand...
I know right? Baggy and Philipossies were very strong. Poor Fed was so unlucky.

NatF said:
There's not a single thing Tsitsipas does better than Federer lol.
Click to expand...
I tried everything I could. I tried to chip it eventually, tried to stay back and hit some. I tried to come forward. And for the most part I actually tried to play up in the court and tried to play aggressive, but of course with his aggression, it's not always easy because he always takes the ball very early himself too. I knew he was going to be incredibly athletic. He was just a little bit better today at all those little things. - Federer on 21 yo Tsitsipas.

travlerajm said:
This seals it.
Click to expand...
Hmm I don't think so but it could tell you how talented they are as youngsters.

mike danny said:
Federer at Tsitsipas's age was already a much better player than Tsitsipas.
Click to expand...
Now this is one comment that made me actually laugh. The main reason I believe Tsitsipas can be better than Federer is because as a youngster he showed a higher level of play. At 21 yo he beat Federer, Zverev, Medvedev and Thiem in one event. Federer got nothing this impressive as a youngster.

mike danny said:
Tsits's BH is abused by Nadal constantly in ways Federer's wasn't.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if I should take you seriously or not. Rafa in his diapers used to abuse peak Federer. At least Tsitsipas is not in his prime years yet.

clout said:
Obviously I don't think Stefanos will be better than Fed, there's literally no chance of that happening. I was just mentioning how it took Fed a few years to put it all together as well and he was a bit older than Stefanos when he officially broke through in 2004. Of course Tstis is not going to have a better career than Fed but he could still have a multi-slam career when it's all said and done, he still is just 22 at the moment.
Click to expand...
Considering his fans thought Federer was already ancient at 26 maybe it's understandable why they think 22-24 is too late to make a great tennis career.

ABCD said:
In my opinion, Tsitsipas is already better player than Federer. He just play against stronger field than Federer played in the past.
Click to expand...
Not yet, he still got a long way to go but he has what it takes for sure. As a youngster he's better and the stronger filed will surely hurt his numbers.

Third Serve said:
TTW collectively reading this thread:

764428.jpg
Click to expand...
I understand, it's a bold claim but that's exactly why it will end up as the GOAT thread.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
I understand, it's a bold claim but that's exactly why it will end up as the GOAT thread.
Click to expand...
Betcha Tsits doesn't even hit ten Slams, let alone twenty lmao.

Even five would be generous.

Guy does everything worse than Fed. FH, BH (dear god lol), serve, volleys, return (trash), etc.

There's a lot he'd need to do to even get halfway to Fed's level. And he can start by not getting taken to five sets by Thanasi Kokkinakis at the Australian Open.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
I know right? Baggy and Philipossies were very strong. Poor Fed was so unlucky.
Click to expand...

Yes they were quite quite strong for those times, Tennis had not yet evolved to the level that it is today, SNV was dying and baseline tennis was coming up so Philippoussis was there in the final, later in 06 Baggy played some amazing tennis coming down from love-2 sets to win in 5 and eliminated David Nalbandian who would have met Federer in the final.

Looks like u have no respect for Tennis in general....Dont call urself an analyst .... you dont know any analysis.

Djokovic was eliminated by some clown in the 1st round, why ? As a 19 year old Novak was such crap, at least Federer eliminated the defending champ Sampras from his own yard....
 
Crazy Finn said:
Anything is possible. Stan's a clear outlier in the history of tennis, not winning much and then winning multiple slams at 29. Most people's career trajectory don't go like that.

Also, if Tsitsipas waits till he's Stan's age to win his first slam, that doesn't exactly bode well for how his career has gone up to that point and being a multi-slam winner or ATG becomes much harder.
Click to expand...
Tennis Analyst said:
Ah here we go with the outliers once again. If anything we have too many outliers these days. Federer is an outlier, Djokovic is an outlier, Nadal is an outlier, Serena is an outlier, Messi is an outlier, Ronlado is an outlier, Brady is an outlier, Ibrahimovic is an outlier, Lebron probable an outlier too. And don't worry, Tsitsipas will win his first slam way before his 29 birthday, I only mentioned as an example as you believe 24 is too late for a tennis player to make an ATG career.
Click to expand...
But these guys ARE outliers. Most tennis players don't have Federer's or Rafa's or Novak's career. Even most ATG tennis players haven't had those guys careers. All of the others are all time great players in their sports. Frankly, Ibrahimovic, for as great a player as he is, probably doesn't quite belong with the others in terms of accomplishments.

Also, all of those outlier GOAT candidate tennis players you mention - Federer, Rafa, Novak, Serena. They got going before 24. Also, I didn't say that it's too late if he hasn't figured anything out by then, but that most ATG players have done something before they turn 24 - which is true.

I actually like Tsitsipas, he seems interesting and he's less of a boring baseline grinder than most of the tour (which says more about the current playing style on tour than Tsitsipas, but anyway...), so I'm kind of rooting for him to be good. He's got some tools and skills, there might be something there. I'm not sure I've seen anything yet that makes me think he'll be better than Federer, but I'm viewing it fairly objectively. Frankly, all I'm hoping for is for him to start to usher the old guys off the stage, a little. I frankly think that Medvedev might be the guy that could start to do that, but I guess we'll see...
 
Third Serve said:
Betcha Tsits doesn't even hit ten Slams, let alone twenty lmao.

Even five would be generous.

Guy does everything worse than Fed. FH, BH (dear god lol), serve, volleys, return (trash), etc.

There's a lot he'd need to do to even get halfway to Fed's level. And he can start by not getting taken to five sets by Thanasi Kokkinakis at the Australian Open.
Click to expand...
Just because Tsitsi's backhand isn't "pretty backhand" doesn't mean its worse. There are shots conventionally considered ugly that are GOAT contenders
 
Tennis Analyst said:
Thanks I guess? I didn't think much of it when I joined. I just went with what I have expertise in.


Thanks for you comment. I agree we won't see anyone as dominant as the Big 3 anytime soon but there will a couple of ATGs for sure. Tsitsipas is one of them.



Ah here we go with the outliers once again. If anything we have too many outliers these days. Federer is an outlier, Djokovic is an outlier, Nadal is an outlier, Serena is an outlier, Messi is an outlier, Ronlado is an outlier, Brady is an outlier, Ibrahimovic is an outlier, Lebron probable an outlier too. And don't worry, Tsitsipas will win his first slam way before his 29 birthday, I only mentioned as an example as you believe 24 is too late for a tennis player to make an ATG career.


I know right? Baggy and Philipossies were very strong. Poor Fed was so unlucky.


I tried everything I could. I tried to chip it eventually, tried to stay back and hit some. I tried to come forward. And for the most part I actually tried to play up in the court and tried to play aggressive, but of course with his aggression, it's not always easy because he always takes the ball very early himself too. I knew he was going to be incredibly athletic. He was just a little bit better today at all those little things. - Federer on 21 yo Tsitsipas.


Hmm I don't think so but it could tell you how talented they are as youngsters.


Now this is one comment that made me actually laugh. The main reason I believe Tsitsipas can be better than Federer is because as a youngster he showed a higher level of play. At 21 yo he beat Federer, Zverev, Medvedev and Thiem in one event. Federer got nothing this impressive as a youngster.


I'm not sure if I should take you seriously or not. Rafa in his diapers used to abuse peak Federer. At least Tsitsipas is not in his prime years yet.


Considering his fans thought Federer was already ancient at 26 maybe it's understandable why they think 22-24 is too late to make a great tennis career.


Not yet, he still got a long way to go but he has what it takes for sure. As a youngster he's better and the stronger filed will surely hurt his numbers.


I understand, it's a bold claim but that's exactly why it will end up as the GOAT thread.
Click to expand...
There is simply too much sense here to get many responses, sadly.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
I tried everything I could. I tried to chip it eventually, tried to stay back and hit some. I tried to come forward. And for the most part I actually tried to play up in the court and tried to play aggressive, but of course with his aggression, it's not always easy because he always takes the ball very early himself too. I knew he was going to be incredibly athletic. He was just a little bit better today at all those little things. - Federer on 21 yo Tsitsipas.
Click to expand...

If Tsitsipas in his early 20s hadn't notched a 50% win record against Federer in his late 30s, it really really wouldn't have looked good. But hey, whatever, let's bump this thread in 10 years I guess.
 
Sunny014 said:
Yes they were quite quite strong for those times, Tennis had not yet evolved to the level that it is today, SNV was dying and baseline tennis was coming up so Philippoussis was there in the final, later in 06 Baggy played some amazing tennis coming down from love-2 sets to win in 5 and eliminated David Nalbandian who would have met Federer in the final.

Looks like u have no respect for Tennis in general....Dont call urself an analyst .... you dont know any analysis.

Djokovic was eliminated by some clown in the 1st round, why ? As a 19 year old Novak was such crap, at least Federer eliminated the defending champ Sampras from his own yard....
Click to expand...
19-year old Fed was crap
 
@travlerajm
CYGS said:
19-year old Fed was crap
Click to expand...
He definitely showed the talent at 19 but still hadn't gotten his temper and consistency under control.
Tennis Analyst said:
Again this is not about the numbers. But even if, Tsitsipas is doing fine so far, better than Federer even.

Numbers after 200 matches played:
Tsitispas (129-71, 5 titles)
Federer (123-77, 2 titles)
Click to expand...
RF got a slower start but he also started the pros at younger age, 17. Wasn't Stef a year or more older for his pro start?

A bit before he turned 22, Rog had I slam title under his belt. Stef turned 22 last Aug. The year after he won his 1st slam title, Roger picked up 3 more. Now Stef has got some catching up to do.
 
Last edited:
A worthless thread this is really ..... the poster who made this must have an IQ of 18 or less which is the number of slams won by novak.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent. For starters, I think Tsitsipas is a better baseliner and mentally stronger when compared to Federer. Yes I’m aware of what happened in USO 2020 so don’t bother mentioning it, cause it happens, and I’ve seen enough of Tsitsipas to know he’s one tough motherf*cker. Even Federer himself admitted the guy is tough as nails after struggling against him and losing the two biggest encounters between them.

I have no doubt he’ll achieve great things in the future; however, I don’t think he’ll have the same success Federer had. Tsitsipas’s generation is way more talented than Federer’s generation so unfortunately for him, he won’t have Federer’s luxury as the competition will be fierce. Roddick, Hewitt and Baghadatis are really nothing compared to Medveved, Sinner, Zverev and Thiem. Besides, Tsitsipas seems like a guy who has other interests in life than to keep hitting a ball until he’s 45 years old like Federer. Anyways, that’s not the point.

The point is I believe The Greek God has what it takes to take Federer’s game to the next level. He'll be performing and playing tennis at a higher level. That he’ll do should he put in the effort. His backhand and RoS still leave a lot to be desired and not at Fed’s level yet but he’ll get there. Federer kept improving even in his 30s so Stefanos has a lot of time ahead of him to improve.

One more thing, I’m not sure of this but I can see him becoming even a more popular player than Federer in the future. Two reasons, he’s better looking and more active in the social media, all what’s left is success which is coming his way soon!

#Your heard it here first.
Bump it in a few years.

FedTsitsipas.aspx


Cheers.
Click to expand...

LMAO at this generation being strong :sick:
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent.
Click to expand...
Utter trollery, and poor trolling at that, but I'll call BS when I see it. This Bozo has seen Fed "since the beginning." So you started watching him in 1998? Really? Since I actually was following Fed in 1998 I will tell you his matches were televised then about 3 times a year and only when he was playing someone like Agassi in Basel.

And you've been watching Stefanos for the "last 5 years," which means you were watching him play in the juniors, since in 2016 that's what he was doing. Juniors matches aren't televised, nor are highlights available on YouTube in most cases.

The entire thread is created by a liar and Fed hater, so nothing new on that front here. Saying Tsitsipas is more talented or has a higher ceiling than Fed is as absurd as claiming Donald Trump is fitter and handsomer than Fognini. Laughable insanity.
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent. For starters, I think Tsitsipas is a better baseliner and mentally stronger when compared to Federer. Yes I’m aware of what happened in USO 2020 so don’t bother mentioning it, cause it happens, and I’ve seen enough of Tsitsipas to know he’s one tough motherf*cker. Even Federer himself admitted the guy is tough as nails after struggling against him and losing the two biggest encounters between them.

I have no doubt he’ll achieve great things in the future; however, I don’t think he’ll have the same success Federer had. Tsitsipas’s generation is way more talented than Federer’s generation so unfortunately for him, he won’t have Federer’s luxury as the competition will be fierce. Roddick, Hewitt and Baghadatis are really nothing compared to Medveved, Sinner, Zverev and Thiem. Besides, Tsitsipas seems like a guy who has other interests in life than to keep hitting a ball until he’s 45 years old like Federer. Anyways, that’s not the point.

The point is I believe The Greek God has what it takes to take Federer’s game to the next level. He'll be performing and playing tennis at a higher level. That he’ll do should he put in the effort. His backhand and RoS still leave a lot to be desired and not at Fed’s level yet but he’ll get there. Federer kept improving even in his 30s so Stefanos has a lot of time ahead of him to improve.

One more thing, I’m not sure of this but I can see him becoming even a more popular player than Federer in the future. Two reasons, he’s better looking and more active in the social media, all what’s left is success which is coming his way soon!

#Your heard it here first.
Bump it in a few years.

FedTsitsipas.aspx


Cheers.
Click to expand...
Quoted by Mortogorue
 
BeatlesFan said:
Utter trollery, and poor trolling at that, but I'll call BS when I see it. This Bozo has seen Fed "since the beginning." So you started watching him in 1998? Really? Since I actually was following Fed in 1998 I will tell you his matches were televised then about 3 times a year and only when he was playing someone like Agassi in Basel.

And you've been watching Stefanos for the "last 5 years," which means you were watching him play in the juniors, since in 2016 that's what he was doing. Juniors matches aren't televised, nor are highlights available on YouTube in most cases.

The entire thread is created by a liar and Fed hater, so nothing new on that front here. Saying Tsitsipas is more talented or has a higher ceiling than Fed is as absurd as claiming Donald Trump is fitter and handsomer than Fognini. Laughable insanity.
Click to expand...

It is impossible to watch Federer since the beginning and be this sour about Roger.

This fake analyst is an imposter :D
 
Tennis Analyst said:
There I said it. I watched Federer since the beginning and I’ve been watching Tsitsipas for the last 4-5 years and I can tell you the Greek has a higher ceiling than the Swiss. He's a very special talent. For starters, I think Tsitsipas is a better baseliner and mentally stronger when compared to Federer. Yes I’m aware of what happened in USO 2020 so don’t bother mentioning it, cause it happens, and I’ve seen enough of Tsitsipas to know he’s one tough motherf*cker. Even Federer himself admitted the guy is tough as nails after struggling against him and losing the two biggest encounters between them.

I have no doubt he’ll achieve great things in the future; however, I don’t think he’ll have the same success Federer had. Tsitsipas’s generation is way more talented than Federer’s generation so unfortunately for him, he won’t have Federer’s luxury as the competition will be fierce. Roddick, Hewitt and Baghadatis are really nothing compared to Medveved, Sinner, Zverev and Thiem. Besides, Tsitsipas seems like a guy who has other interests in life than to keep hitting a ball until he’s 45 years old like Federer. Anyways, that’s not the point.

The point is I believe The Greek God has what it takes to take Federer’s game to the next level. He'll be performing and playing tennis at a higher level. That he’ll do should he put in the effort. His backhand and RoS still leave a lot to be desired and not at Fed’s level yet but he’ll get there. Federer kept improving even in his 30s so Stefanos has a lot of time ahead of him to improve.

One more thing, I’m not sure of this but I can see him becoming even a more popular player than Federer in the future. Two reasons, he’s better looking and more active in the social media, all what’s left is success which is coming his way soon!

#Your heard it here first.
Bump it in a few years.

FedTsitsipas.aspx


Cheers.
Click to expand...

In case, it hasn't been told:

CommentPhotos.com_1391967499.jpg
 
22 years, 9 months comparison:

Roger Federer (as at May 2004)
W/L record: 273 - 114 (70.5%)
Slam Titles: 2
WTF Titles: 1
Masters Titles: 3
Total Titles: 15
W/L record in Finals: 15-8 (65.2%)
W/L record versus Top 10: 32-29 (52.5%)

Stefanos Tsitsipas (as at May 2021)
W/L record: 162 - 84 (65.9%)
Slam Titles: 0
WTF Titles: 1
Masters Titles: 1
Total Titles: 6
W/L record in Finals: 6-9 (40.0%)
W/L record versus Top 10: 20-29 (40.8%)

Disparity will grow in the next 3-4 years or so unless Tsitsipas dominates. Though possible Tsitsipas could bridge the gap slightly after 2024-2025 or so depending on how he grows as a player.
 
Last edited:
He must become then a dominanting force rather soon to match the Swiss. Keep in mind that Federer was a relative late starter compared to the other two, possibly because he relies somewhat more on his serve.
 
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