Team in our League adding Self-rated High level players

gameboy

Hall of Fame
If I am one of the other captains, I don't know why I would help your friend. Why? So, that your friend could sandbag his way to playoffs? Why would I care that he is going instead of your friend?

This all sounds pretty absurd, when you really have no evidence of cheating. They haven't even played a match!
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
That's fine, but it's not going to work if all you have is "but, they're too good". You'll have to research each of these guys, provide specific dates when they played college tennis or when they were ranked juniors or whatever, and crossreference that information with the self-rating guidelines to show that they are not rated correctly. The USTA self-rating grievance guidelines specifically state that grievances that are just whining about players being too good will be rejected.

yes, yes, I will tell him to make sure he provides evidence that they played college tennis in the past. and there are records from several 4.5 local leagues that proves they have been rated incorrectly. and I assure you that many captains are veterans at this and they know exactly when to file grievances.
and division in this area is very closely supervised and seems like every year there are some players that are DQ'ed due to inappropriate Self-rating. and these guys certainly fit the bill.
 

andfor

Legend
Feddie, can you prove they played college tennis and self rated to low? if you can prove they played college tennis file the protest yourself. You don't have to be a captain to file.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
yes, yes, I will tell him to make sure he provides evidence that they played college tennis in the past. and there are records from several 4.5 local leagues that proves they have been rated incorrectly. and I assure you that many captains are veterans at this and they know exactly when to file grievances.
and division in this area is very closely supervised and seems like every year there are some players that are DQ'ed due to inappropriate Self-rating. and these guys certainly fit the bill.

The local league rating & record means nothing. There is absolutely nothing in USTA self-rating guidelines about your rating in non-USTA leagues.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Well, my buddie has seen college record from at least 2 of these self rated guys. he is thinking, let them play a few matches and thru the midway of the season, file a grievance and let other captains friends of his know too. this will probably put them from 1st place to bottom half of the division.
Sounds diabolical but they have to learn that what they have done is against USTA rules and moreover, is in very very poor spirit of sportsmanship of USTA tennis.

and one of these guys is a USPTA professional. and taught at local club for several years. not sure if this means anything but another evidence.
 
Last edited:

andfor

Legend
Well, my buddie has seen college record from at least 2 of these self rated guys. he is thinking, let them play a few matches and thru the midway of the season, file a grievance and let other captains friends of his know too. this will probably put them from 1st place to bottom half of the division.
Sounds diabolical but they have to learn that what they have done is against USTA rules and moreover, is in very very poor spirit of sportsmanship of USTA tennis.

and one of these guys is a USPTA professional. and taught at local club for several years. not sure if this means anything but another evidence.

Being a teaching pro is irrelevant. You should check the USTA self rate guideline. Age and playing history including juniors and college play will tell you where a player can self rate.

Surprised in all your years of USTA this is new for you.
 

gmatheis

Hall of Fame
Well, my buddie has seen college record from at least 2 of these self rated guys. he is thinking, let them play a few matches and thru the midway of the season, file a grievance and let other captains friends of his know too. this will probably put them from 1st place to bottom half of the division.
Sounds diabolical but they have to learn that what they have done is against USTA rules and moreover, is in very very poor spirit of sportsmanship of USTA tennis.

and one of these guys is a USPTA professional. and taught at local club for several years. not sure if this means anything but another evidence.

I provided you link to the usta experienced player guidelines chart, stop being lazy and actually read it. Tennis professionals minimum rating is 4.0 , so there is no conflict there.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
I provided you link to the usta experienced player guidelines chart, stop being lazy and actually read it. Tennis professionals minimum rating is 4.0 , so there is no conflict there.

Read. I said not sure. but these guys have college records and my buddie found it on 2 of these guys. he said he will use it when he files grievance midway thru the season.

and he thinks other captains that he knows will do the same. He had shared this info with one of the other captains which he plays pickup basketball with and he was very upset at the news too.
 

Adles

Rookie
Well, my buddie has seen college record from at least 2 of these self rated guys. he is thinking, let them play a few matches and thru the midway of the season, file a grievance and let other captains friends of his know too. this will probably put them from 1st place to bottom half of the division.


It isn't a sure thing, tho... We filed a grievance for a college kid playing in a 4.0 league and he was bumped up (midseason!) but the three matches he played are standing as played.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Well, my buddie has seen college record from at least 2 of these self rated guys. he is thinking, let them play a few matches and thru the midway of the season, file a grievance and let other captains friends of his know too. this will probably put them from 1st place to bottom half of the division.


It isn't a sure thing, tho... We filed a grievance for a college kid playing in a 4.0 league and he was bumped up (midseason!) but the three matches he played are standing as played.

It is Odd, isn't it ? how different regions handle it all differently. I seen just 2 years ago with exact same situation, in this region, he got DQ'ed and bumped up and ALL of his matches DQ'ed and changed to losses.
 

OrangePower

Legend
Read. I said not sure. but these guys have college records and my buddie found it on 2 of these guys. he said he will use it when he files grievance midway thru the season.
What college did they play for, and how old are they?
Just compare that information with what it says in the self-rating guidelines for experienced players.
If they are within the guidelines, then there is no grounds for a grievance.
If they self-rated outside of the guidelines, then there is no need to wait until midway through the season. File the grievance now.

My guess is that they are within the guidelines and that your buddy is just being a baby, because if he knows their college history and if in fact they self-rated incorrectly, he would just file the grievance and be done with all the fuss.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
These two guys are clearly outside of guidelines. This captain is New, 1st year being a captain. He doesn't seem to know what he is doing. He is just interested in winning the division anyway he can. he is hoping nobody files Grievances.
Why file Grievance now ? when you can do it midway thru the season after they played few matches.
 

OrangePower

Legend
These two guys are clearly outside of guidelines. This captain is New, 1st year being a captain. He doesn't seem to know what he is doing. He is just interested in winning the division anyway he can. he is hoping nobody files Grievances.
Why file Grievance now ? when you can do it midway thru the season after they played few matches.

1. So you can be done with the fuss etc. If your buddy is irritated by all this he will continue to be irritated until it's resolved.

2. So that your buddie's players will get competitive matches instead of playing these alleged sandbaggers. Getting them DQ'd afterwards helps in the standings but we're all here to play aren't we?

3. So that they have less recourse for appeal. For example, if they throw their first few matches, then your buddy files grievance, they already can point to a track record of not being under-rated. And if they don't get DQ'd then, then they can turn it up in the playoffs.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
These two guys are clearly outside of guidelines. This captain is New, 1st year being a captain. He doesn't seem to know what he is doing. He is just interested in winning the division anyway he can. he is hoping nobody files Grievances.
Why file Grievance now ? when you can do it midway thru the season after they played few matches.

You're making a lot of assumptions. It's possible that they rated properly and were granted appeals to play at a lower level, too. Around here, the sectional appeals committee granted appeals for basically an entire D3 team to play as a 4.0 team. The captain of that team - an assistant coach for the program - is new as well, but they did it the right way and went through the proper channels, so no grievance can be filed (so far it looks like they're 4.0s anyway - the program is in a very low level D3 conference).
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
You're making a lot of assumptions. It's possible that they rated properly and were granted appeals to play at a lower level, too. Around here, the sectional appeals committee granted appeals for basically an entire D3 team to play as a 4.0 team. The captain of that team - an assistant coach for the program - is new as well, but they did it the right way and went through the proper channels, so no grievance can be filed (so far it looks like they're 4.0s anyway - the program is in a very low level D3 conference).

We will see. Dont' worry about the fuss part. My buddy wants to teach them a lesson. They actually had done a similar thing in the local league in the past by subbing in a 4.5 guy into the 4.0 division play. Somebody complained 3-4 weeks later and they ended up Forfeiting the Entire line of matches from #1 to #6, got 0 points that week. Put them out of Playoff picuture when they were still in playoff hunt and had a good chance to make it.....LOL

Some guys never learn.
 

Chelsie1

Rookie
Here we rely on the "NTRP Police". Brand new self-rated players are Googled/researched by captains and players. Grievances are filed when appropriate.
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
If your friend and his teammates worked hard over the winter to improve their games, then they will be happy to have the chance to play some good players, no?

Or is he just upset that their sandbaggers are going to upstage his sandbaggers?

It isn't about playing good players. In a league setting, you should be able to expect to play other players of your own level. You can play good players any time you wish to work on your game, but leagues are designed and regulated to pit equally-skilled players against each other with a chance to win and advance to the next level. Bringing in players who have college experience (if they do) to play 4.0 tennis is a dishonest attempt to win a league they don't belong in. It's cheating.

Those who don't play USTA league tennis never seem to understand how crushing it is to do everything right and by the rules, and then be undercut by captains or teams who are simply trying to "buy" a championship by using illegal players. They don't let NBA players go back and play in Division III college basketball games. There's a reason. This is the same principle.
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
While that sounds good at first you run into 2 problems

1 - If self rated players are not allowed to play post season it will be harder for them to get a team since any team with championship aspirations would have no use for them.

2 - If you told me that I have wait until my 2nd year to even have a chance to go to states/sectionals/nationals I may never have started in the first place.

That's a choice you (and each player) have to make. But it is light years ahead of knowingly allowing sandbaggers to play solely to compete for a championship they have no business playing for. If you play and are good enough, you will be picked up by someone the next year.
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
Maybe the true hard-core cheaters would do this. Sign up, pay money, throw games and matches, wait for November ratings -- all part of a devious plan to take over the tennis world and earn a pen and a hat.

Nah. Most sandbaggers do not have the patience to invest all of that time and energy.

Funny thing. I think USTA wouldn't lose a dollar of revenue by making this rule change. Sandbaggers would still sign up. Captains with playoff aspirations would just have to recruit top computer-related players -- which is as it should be.

Again, BINGO.
 

gameboy

Hall of Fame
Those who don't play USTA league tennis never seem to understand how crushing it is to do everything right and by the rules, and then be undercut by captains or teams who are simply trying to "buy" a championship by using illegal players. They don't let NBA players go back and play in Division III college basketball games. There's a reason. This is the same principle.

I have played many years of USTA league tennis.

Not going to playoffs does not "crush" me. Facing a sandbagger does not "crush" me. If someone is so desperate for something as meaningless as USTA league trophy, they can go right ahead, as obviously not many things are right in their life. I like facing tough opponents, I really don't mind.

NBA players cannot go back because they are professionals. If you played Div I basketball but then decides to transfer to Div III basketball, you can.
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
Don't you think your friends improved so that they could play higher-quality tennis?

Or do you really think their main motivation was so that they could get to nationals and be rec tennis GOATS? Because that would be sad.

USTA is about giving people competitive matches, not about going to nationals.

LOL. You are SO out of touch with league mentality. The MAJORITY of USTA league players I know (and I played in 6 various USTA leagues last year) play league to try to win a title. They play other times for fun or to get better, but league play is for competition that offers a chance to advance---and yes, that means something to a lot of us. And it isn't sad at all. It may not appeal to your tennis sensibilities, but for a huge number of us, it is the reason we play leagues in the first place.
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
Unless you can produce some real evidence that those players in question answered the self-rate questions wrongly, I see nothing here that says they are sandbagging. Improving yourself just to get to nationals is kinda sad anyway. If I am working hard to get better, that is because I want to play with better players (which is what these "sandbaggers" will provide) and play better tennis, not because I want some meaningless trophy.

Then you should set up matches with much better players and not join USTA leagues. I couldn't care less about "some meaningless trophy", but knowing I played on a team that fought together to win a league title and advance to Districts or Sectionals or even Nationals IS meaningful. Some of my fondest memories are of tournament victories from years ago when I fought through fatigue, injury, or nerves to win "some meaningless trophy". I don't care about the trophy, but I DO care about what it represents. Maybe those things really are meaningless to you. But I treasure them and the memories of battles won on my own and as part of a team stick with you for a lifetime---"meaningless trophy" or not.
 
Last edited:

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
I have played many years of USTA league tennis.

Not going to playoffs does not "crush" me. Facing a sandbagger does not "crush" me. If someone is so desperate for something as meaningless as USTA league trophy, they can go right ahead, as obviously not many things are right in their life. I like facing tough opponents, I really don't mind.

NBA players cannot go back because they are professionals. If you played Div I basketball but then decides to transfer to Div III basketball, you can.

I heard Wayne Odesnik tried to rate himself as a 3.5.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
LOL. You are SO out of touch with league mentality. The MAJORITY of USTA league players I know (and I played in 6 various USTA leagues last year) play league to try to win a title. They play other times for fun or to get better, but league play is for competition that offers a chance to advance---and yes, that means something to a lot of us. And it isn't sad at all. It may not appeal to your tennis sensibilities, but for a huge number of us, it is the reason we play leagues in the first place.

The MAJORITY of league players play just to have fun and play tennis. If the majority of the players were only in it for the hardware, there would be 4 teams in our league, not 11, since there are only a handful that realistically can make the postseason, and everyone knows it from the start.
 

gameboy

Hall of Fame
My league situation is the same. Usually the same two or three teams get out of our local area. Everybody else (aka THE MAJORITY) pretty much doesn't care. My team certainly doesn't. If we make it to the playoffs, that is great. If we don't that is okay too. We don't play for trophies and most people in my league doesn't either.

It is people who care too much about a meaningless trophy that ruins the fun for the rest of us. I would be perfectly fine if USTA got rid of playoffs all together.
 

dizzlmcwizzl

Hall of Fame
For me my tennis play falls into a couple of categories.

1) I practice to get better and 2) I play socially purely for the social fun aspect of it.

However, league tennis is different. It means just a little bit more. I still get butterflies for big matches, I know I am playing for my team mates as much as I am playing for myself and I know that my results will be recorded and used to measure me against my peers.

This added bit of pressure makes the event mean more. Additionally, playing against clearly out of level players stings just a little more than getting beaten in a practice social match.

Now I know there have been many posts suggesting it is just rec level tennis and I am somehow petty for even caring. Well that is all true in the sense that anything any of us ever do will actually matter in the cosmic scheme of things. Sure we could trivialize any activity any of us compete in, but I like knowing I am playing to win for the "greater good."
 

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
My league situation is the same. Usually the same two or three teams get out of our local area. Everybody else (aka THE MAJORITY) pretty much doesn't care. My team certainly doesn't. If we make it to the playoffs, that is great. If we don't that is okay too. We don't play for trophies and most people in my league doesn't either.

It is people who care too much about a meaningless trophy that ruins the fun for the rest of us. I would be perfectly fine if USTA got rid of playoffs all together.

LOL. It isn't about the trophy. My league doesn't even give any sort of trophy to the league winner and never has. It is about the idea of your team working together to win a championship---much, I would guess, as it is for NCAA basketball teams. The teams I captain play by all the rules and I make sure they do. We are sportsmen who acknowledge the better play of our opponents when we lose, and congratulate the winners. What I don't understand is if you have such a bad taste in your mouth about people who play in leagues to win the thing, why do you play USTA leagues? I play a lot of tennis---social tennis, competitive tennis, local league tennis, USTA league tennis, all of it. Social tennis I play for social reasons. Winning is far less important. But I play USTA leagues because they are competitive and there is something to play for---a championship. If someone isn't so competitive and wants to play simply for fun or to meet people or whatever, I'm absolutely fine with that. But why demean those who compete because they love the battle and the pursuit of a championship?
 

gameboy

Hall of Fame
They to give them out in nationals (pens, I believe)...

I play USTA for several reasons, in order.

-It is a great way to meet and play regularly with people of my level at my club.

-I get to play against a great variety of opponents that I would never play against otherwise. Variety is the spice of life, as they say.

-The team camaraderie aspect is a lot of fun. Miss that from my old high school playing days.

Notice I don't mention anything about winning or getting to playoffs...

The thing about people who take USTA way too seriously is that, because of people like this, we have incidents of hooking, yelling, needless confrontations and whatnot. Rest of us are out there to enjoy ourselves and these killjoys just suck out the fun for the rest of us. I wish there was a separate league without playoffs. I would join that in a heartbeat.
 
Last edited:

storypeddler

Semi-Pro
I played basketball in high school. My senior year we were conference champs. We didn't make a dime playing and probably nobody but the guys on the team even remember it---it was half a lifetime ago. But on the rare occasions when I have gone back to my old high school (across the country from me now) for a reunion, I check out the old banner hanging in the gym. I see a few of my (now much older) teammates do the same thing. Probably nobody cares now except us. I doubt many today even know who played on that team. But it still feels good to me to remember that year so long ago when a bunch of guys I grew up with played together on a team that was a conference champion. Small school, small conference, no great glory. But it is still a nice memory.

Every year when I form a league team (or agree to play on one), I remember past teams---some that struggled to be competitive and some that won it all. Those are great memories. I can relive the victory again and again and it feels pretty darn good even years later. Did a trophy or banner matter? No, not really. But the memories formed by going into "battle" with buddies and teammates do.

I realize not everyone understands or appreciates that mentality, but it's pretty important to me.
 

gameboy

Hall of Fame
But this is not a "battle", and the usual casualties of these "battles" are fun. It maybe fun for you. It is not fun for the rest of us.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
I played basketball in high school. My senior year we were conference champs. We didn't make a dime playing and probably nobody but the guys on the team even remember it---it was half a lifetime ago. But on the rare occasions when I have gone back to my old high school (across the country from me now) for a reunion, I check out the old banner hanging in the gym. I see a few of my (now much older) teammates do the same thing. Probably nobody cares now except us. I doubt many today even know who played on that team. But it still feels good to me to remember that year so long ago when a bunch of guys I grew up with played together on a team that was a conference champion. Small school, small conference, no great glory. But it is still a nice memory.

Every year when I form a league team (or agree to play on one), I remember past teams---some that struggled to be competitive and some that won it all. Those are great memories. I can relive the victory again and again and it feels pretty darn good even years later. Did a trophy or banner matter? No, not really. But the memories formed by going into "battle" with buddies and teammates do.

I realize not everyone understands or appreciates that mentality, but it's pretty important to me.

That's fine. Of course people play sports for the competition and the "battle". But what's going on with the OP here is not the cherished battle on the court, it's one side of a story that sounds a lot like whining about a team and calling them "cheaters" just because he feels they are too good. That's the kind of mentality that we see here that people are complaining about. If there is a team that is that good, you can still "go to battle" and cherish those memories without whining about it. We see this all the time here. Everyone who is better than someone is a "sandbagger" but that person is fine at that level, or in other words, the level should be defined such that that player is the best person at the level so he can win his pen. That's not in the spirit of competition at all, it's just whinng that there are people better than you.

IF it turns out that this captain or his players falsified self-rating forms or didn't get appeals approved to play at that level, OK, fine, they should be dealt with. But we don't have a single iota of proof of that at all, just a bunch of complaining about "cheaters" and some other non-USTA league that doesn't mean a hill of beans. If you're not the best at your level, that doesn't make everyone who is better a cheater.
 

TennisCJC

Legend
That's fine. Of course people play sports for the competition and the "battle". But what's going on with the OP here is not the cherished battle on the court, it's one side of a story that sounds a lot like whining about a team and calling them "cheaters" just because he feels they are too good. That's the kind of mentality that we see here that people are complaining about. If there is a team that is that good, you can still "go to battle" and cherish those memories without whining about it. We see this all the time here. Everyone who is better than someone is a "sandbagger" but that person is fine at that level, or in other words, the level should be defined such that that player is the best person at the level so he can win his pen. That's not in the spirit of competition at all, it's just whinng that there are people better than you.

IF it turns out that this captain or his players falsified self-rating forms or didn't get appeals approved to play at that level, OK, fine, they should be dealt with. But we don't have a single iota of proof of that at all, just a bunch of complaining about "cheaters" and some other non-USTA league that doesn't mean a hill of beans. If you're not the best at your level, that doesn't make everyone who is better a cheater.

Yea, you have a point but there are legitimate sandbaggers in USTA. Many players self-rate too low just to win and go to playoffs. I have played against players like this and unfortunately, I was on a team and our captained recruited 2 kids less than 3 years out of small college tennis program to play on our 4.0 team. We won the division and won the city with these 2 kids (25 to 26 years old) playing 1 and 2 singles. We had complaints filed against the kids playing at 4.0. We were a very, very good 4.0 team before we added the kids. Both kids were bumped to 4.5 and 1 was DQed from the state playoffs. We made the state SFinals without either of them - the one who could have played didn't want to make the overnight trip to compete.

Here's the kicker, we had 4 guys on our team bumped to 4.5 - the kids and 2 others. The team we beat in the city finals had 7 players of the 8 players in their city finals line-up bumped to 4.5. We beat them 4-1.

So, all complaining about sandbagging is not just whining. There are legitimate beefs out there.
 

gameboy

Hall of Fame
So, all complaining about sandbagging is not just whining. There are legitimate beefs out there.

You are still missing the point. Only people whinnying about sandbaggers are other sandbaggers, like the team OP is referring to (and the team you are talking about). Rest of us just don't care.
 

OrangePower

Legend
Those who don't play USTA league tennis never seem to understand how crushing it is to do everything right and by the rules, and then be undercut by captains or teams who are simply trying to "buy" a championship by using illegal players. They don't let NBA players go back and play in Division III college basketball games. There's a reason. This is the same principle.

LOL. You are SO out of touch with league mentality. The MAJORITY of USTA league players I know (and I played in 6 various USTA leagues last year) play league to try to win a title. They play other times for fun or to get better, but league play is for competition that offers a chance to advance---and yes, that means something to a lot of us. And it isn't sad at all. It may not appeal to your tennis sensibilities, but for a huge number of us, it is the reason we play leagues in the first place.

For the record, I have been playing USTA league for the last 7 or 8 years, and have captained teams for most of that time. So please don't tell me I'm out of touch with league mentality. Sure, there are some people like you, for whom advancing in playoffs is a really big deal - but you are in the minority.

What's interesting is that it's the people who place such importance on winning a rec league that are the ones who are willing to work the system to achieve those goals. Not saying that you personally do that. And working the system does not necessarily mean cheating (although of course sometimes cheating is a part of it). But it could also be, for example, getting out-of-area top-of-level ringers, could be offering pay-for-play to the best players in your area, etc... not cheating, but would you be in favor of that kind of stuff?

Once winning at rec tennis becomes more important to you than actually playing tennis, it becomes a thin line...
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
Yea, you have a point but there are legitimate sandbaggers in USTA. Many players self-rate too low just to win and go to playoffs. I have played against players like this and unfortunately, I was on a team and our captained recruited 2 kids less than 3 years out of small college tennis program to play on our 4.0 team. We won the division and won the city with these 2 kids (25 to 26 years old) playing 1 and 2 singles. We had complaints filed against the kids playing at 4.0. We were a very, very good 4.0 team before we added the kids. Both kids were bumped to 4.5 and 1 was DQed from the state playoffs. We made the state SFinals without either of them - the one who could have played didn't want to make the overnight trip to compete.

Here's the kicker, we had 4 guys on our team bumped to 4.5 - the kids and 2 others. The team we beat in the city finals had 7 players of the 8 players in their city finals line-up bumped to 4.5. We beat them 4-1.

So, all complaining about sandbagging is not just whining. There are legitimate beefs out there.

Cool story, bro, and yes, all whining about sandbagging is whining, LOL. There are legitimate beefs and and people who really do cheat, but why whine about it? File your grievance and if they really cheated, they'll be removed. If not, if they signed up and got appeals through the proper channels, then just play the game and see what happens. The whining about it is just very unbecoming.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
Sounds like you have a case but if they play Div 3 tennis they are not definitely 4.5 level.

NCAA D-3 is a pretty wide range of talent. There is one team in this area in a weak conference that all got appeals to play 4.0 this year and are no better than average 4.0s so far. There is another D3 team that is a strong team in a strong conference that made up the majority of a successful 5.0 team last summer.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Ok, now this new captain has added a player that played Junior boys tennis, 2 Star player in boys 18's. Is this legal ? 2 Star junior on adult 4.0 team ?
 

andfor

Legend
Ok, now this new captain has added a player that played Junior boys tennis, 2 Star player in boys 18's. Is this legal ? 2 Star junior on adult 4.0 team ?

Yes Feddie, that's likely legal. You need to look
At the NTRP self-rate guidelines before you come in here.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Yes Feddie, that's likely legal. You need to look
At the NTRP self-rate guidelines before you come in here.

LMAO. Yes I read the guideline. and YES his minimum self rating is 4.5. Do you even play tennis ? I have been playing USTA 4.5 for 10 + years. and was captain 2 times. I know where the rule book is. I actually keep one in my racket bag....:shock: This is actually automatic DQ. but I am going to advise my friend to wait til he played few matches then file the grievance to DQ him.
 

andfor

Legend
LMAO. Yes I read the guideline. and YES his minimum self rating is 4.5. Do you even play tennis ? I have been playing USTA 4.5 for 10 + years. and was captain 2 times. I know where the rule book is. I actually keep one in my racket bag....:shock: This is actually automatic DQ. but I am going to advise my friend to wait til he played few matches then file the grievance to DQ him.

Apparently in your 10+ years you haven't learned very much. I've seen 3 star 18 year olds rate as low as 4.0 and be completly within the guideline. Neither your captain nor you have the guts to protest (which you would lose) so none of this matters.

Show us in the NTRP Guideline the reference to the star system and Tennis Recruiting.com.
 
Last edited:

SunshineJS

New User
LMAO. Yes I read the guideline. and YES his minimum self rating is 4.5. Do you even play tennis ? I have been playing USTA 4.5 for 10 + years. and was captain 2 times. I know where the rule book is. I actually keep one in my racket bag....:shock: This is actually automatic DQ. but I am going to advise my friend to wait til he played few matches then file the grievance to DQ him.

If the kid was never sectionally ranked in the top 10 and hasn't committed to college then he is well within the guidelines to self-rate as a 4.0. Happens all the time here.
 

gmatheis

Hall of Fame
Apparently in your 10+ years you haven't learned very much. I've seen 3 star 18 year olds rate as low as 4.0 and be completly within the guideline. Neither your captain nor you have the guts to protest (which you would lose) so none of this matters.

Show us in the NTRP Guideline the reference to the star system and Tennis Recruiting.com.

Former Junior who had a national or sectional ( foreign or domestic) ranking but did not tour or play in college - Age 35 and under is a 4.5 minimum.

Doesn't say what raking , just that they have one.
 

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
...Once winning at rec tennis becomes more important to you than actually playing tennis, it becomes a thin line...
As usual, you are a real Voice of Reason on these boards. The @storypeddler story about his HS b-ball days was nice - but complete apples and hand grenades - unless the league was bringing in ringers from other school districts...

...and yes, all whining about sandbagging is whining, LOL....
So why do you keep reading these threads? Do you think you're going to convince/convert people? The USTA could stop some of the obvious things (without chasing thousands away from the leagues) but don't.
 

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
As usual, you are a real Voice of Reason on these boards. The @storypeddler story about his HS b-ball days was nice - but complete apples and hand grenades - unless the league was bringing in ringers from other school districts...

So why do you keep reading these threads? Do you think you're going to convince/convert people? The USTA could stop some of the obvious things (without chasing thousands away from the leagues) but don't.

I keep reading mostly to laugh at people who are continually whining about ringers out-ringing their own (completely legit, of course) ringeriness. And to mock them.
 

andfor

Legend
Former Junior who had a national or sectional ( foreign or domestic) ranking but did not tour or play in college - Age 35 and under is a 4.5 minimum.

Doesn't say what raking , just that they have one.

Yea, you got me. Funny how its different when you take the self-rate questionnaire. Believe what you want. Back to getting my news from yahoo and checking it against The Daily Kos.
 
Top