Tennis Movement: what does it entail?

[Nathaniel_Near]

What is movement in tennis?

Speed?

What makes Murray a better mover than Monfils? Or is he?

Movement consists of these attributes: speed (top speed), quickness (recovery in switching directions and acceleration), footwork, anticipation.
These are the four core elements of movement. Can you guys think of anything I'm missing?

 

[NatF]

Footwork and anticipation are more important than just speed IMO.

Footwork is why Nadal and Federer ruled the tennis world with their forehands. Obviously recover is huge as well, which is why bigger guys don't move so good.

 

[Tennisknowledge99]

Speed, fitness, body coordination, shot preparation, sidesteps, jumping ability, sliding, reflex, even more mental abilities like anticipation (Agassi) are aspects, which come to mind.

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Perhaps efficiency is also an important part of movement, which ties somewhat into fitness and is often a product of anticipation and footwork. Some players can maintain movement to their personal maximum for longer than others.

 

[LazyNinja19]

Movement consists of these attributes: speed (top speed), quickness (recovery in switching directions and acceleration), footwork, anticipation.
These are the four core elements of movement. Can you guys think of anything I'm missing?

 

[Rozroz]

Speed, fitness, body coordination, shot preparation, sidesteps, jumping ability, sliding, reflex, even more mental abilities like anticipation (Agassi) are aspects, which come to mind.

this. and highlight reading opponent well.
if you cannot read your opponent carefully, there's not a lot you can do.
all the rest comes after IMO (and of course an athlete suppose to have most of them).
proof: (as a rec player) i play 60yrs old men that just get to whenever they need, mostly by reading me well. i myself currently not so good at it, otherwise i could have had lot more gets, wins, etc..
and regarding movement: Murray reads well and have superb fitness.
OTOH Federer is extremely efficient when moving and recovering, thus he maximizes his court placement better than Murray IMO.

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Bernard Tomic has a wonderful sense of anticipation (reads the opponent well and has a feel for the flow of a rally) but it isn't enough to make up for his much weaker attributes such as his speed and quickness. His footwork is lazy as heck, too.

Would Djokovic's manner of sliding around the court and recovery count as being more efficient than Murray's more aggressive and jerkier movements? Djokovic is particularly flexible and athletic and has been able to utilise these gifts to produce an efficiency of movement that he can maintain for a 5-6 hour match.

Perhaps efficiency should be considered a core aspect of movement?

Movement consists of these attributes: speed (top speed), quickness (recovery in switching directions and acceleration), footwork, anticipation.
These are the four core elements of movement. Can you guys think of anything I'm missing?

It's possible that you're missing efficiency. What do you reckon? Everything else mentioned fits into the broader terms you've stated here, but efficiency is a good extra candidate.

 

[Aretium]

Federer is a classic example of tennis movement. Some describe him as the greatest mover of all time. It is the speed of recognition that is amazing, the placement of the feet and reaction times.

 

[HRB]

It's a combination of speed, anticipation, control, being able to change direction and re-direct. Not one thing makes the best "tennis movers".

If it was just pure speed then track athletes could take up tennis with ease, and trust me, I have a friend who is a former D1 College 100 and 200 runner, and he can't cover the court for sh#T! He simply lacks any ability to figure out where and when the ball is going to arrive, but draw a line on the court, show him, and tell him to get there as fast as he can and he'll beat you everytime.

 

[Tennisknowledge99]

this. and highlight reading opponent well.
if you cannot read your opponent carefully, there's not a lot you can do.
all the rest comes after IMO (and of course an athlete suppose to have most of them).
proof: (as a rec player) i play 60yrs old men that just get to whenever they need, mostly by reading me well. i myself currently not so good at it, otherwise i could have had lot more gets, wins, etc..
and regarding movement: Murray reads well and have superb fitness.
OTOH Federer is extremely efficient when moving and recovering, thus he maximizes his court placement better than Murray IMO.

Federer's shot anticipation and preparation are really good. The way he moves on the court looks so easy and smooth. Agassi was not the quickest, but his anticipation and vision were always the best, he possessed an amazing sense of where the ball was going, he could see 2-3 shots ahead seemingly.

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Federer is a classic example of tennis movement. Some describe him as the greatest mover of all time. It is the speed of recognition that is amazing, the placement of the feet and reaction times.

this. and highlight reading opponent well.
if you cannot read your opponent carefully, there's not a lot you can do.
all the rest comes after IMO (and of course an athlete suppose to have most of them).
proof: (as a rec player) i play 60yrs old men that just get to whenever they need, mostly by reading me well. i myself currently not so good at it, otherwise i could have had lot more gets, wins, etc..
and regarding movement: Murray reads well and have superb fitness.
OTOH Federer is extremely efficient when moving and recovering, thus he maximizes his court placement better than Murray IMO.

Speed, fitness, body coordination, shot preparation, sidesteps, jumping ability, sliding, reflex, even more mental abilities like anticipation (Agassi) are aspects, which come to mind.

The ideas of reaction times/reflex is interesting and not necessarily the same as being quick and athletic. Rozroz, your example of the difference between Murray and Federer is really good IMO.

You can see that Murray gives up ground earlier in the rally compared to say, Djokovic, even with like-for-like exchanges. The problem is further compounded when considering that Djokovic in general hits a greater weight of shot. Djokovic's greater efficiency leads to more sustainable top level movement regardless of fitness levels? ...Or it stands up better even in a fatigued state due to a greater efficiency of movement.

It's a combination of speed, anticipation, control, being able to change direction and re-direct. Not one thing makes the best "tennis movers".

If it was just pure speed then track athletes could take up tennis with ease, and trust me, I have a friend who is a former D1 College 100 and 200 runner, and he can't cover the court for sh#T! He simply lacks any ability to figure out where and when the ball is going to arrive, but draw a line on the court, show him, and tell him to get there as fast as he can and he'll beat you everytime.

That settles it. Efficiency is crucial in movement. Some fast and quick players lack the control, balance, coordination (as someone stated earlier). It isn't necessarily the same as footwork, as a player can have tidy and textbook footwork in the defensive and offensive sense yet still often end up being unbalanced and lacking control compared to the best movers (Dimitrov for example). But then, can that just be considered to be a lack of quickness and it just so happens that the source of that lack of quickness in recovery is a lack of control and coordination where as for someone else it might be a lack of more typically regarded athleticism?


-Quickness: acceleration, recovery, (reflexes?).
-Footwork: important techniques to set up for either defensive or attacking situations.
-Anticipation: read of the game.
-Efficiency: control, coordination, sustainability.
-Speed: top whack YO.

 

[Tennisknowledge99]

Horizontal and vertical movement should be one of the aspects imo. A lot of top players, or even some all time greats are mechanical when they come to the net.

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Horizontal and vertical movement should be one of the aspects imo. A lot of top players, or even some all time greats are mechanical when they come to the net.

I agree that often players have different levels of ability regarding their footwork and quickness to move forward and backwards as opposed to laterally, but I'd just consider that under the wider term of footwork, quickness, and such.

Roger Federer has tremendous footwork typically but has been known to have lazy footwork at the net when volleying—though his actual quickness and speed in moving forward is actually very good, his footwork often suffers.

...really like how many very specific aspects you're coming up with. Very compelling.

 

[Tennisknowledge99]

I agree that often players have different levels of ability regarding their footwork and quickness to move forward and backwards as opposed to laterally, but I'd just consider that under the wider term of footwork, quickness, and such.

Roger Federer has tremendous footwork typically but has been known to have lazy footwork at the net when volleying—though his actual quickness and speed in moving forward is actually very good, his footwork often suffers.

...really like how many very specific aspects you're coming up with. Very compelling.

Thanks, Nathan. I'm glad you like them.

Yep, Fed's timing of last step is often off and steps are too small during volley. He tries to use his hands too much instead of the feet. There are only a couple of really good net movers in the tour right now that have great footwork at the front of the court (Gasquet, Lopez, etc.).

 

[Backspin1183]

Footwork and anticipation are more important than just speed IMO.

Footwork is why Nadal and Federer ruled the tennis world with their forehands. Obviously recover is huge as well, which is why bigger guys don't move so good.

I couldn't have said it better. Just watched Federer-Nadal Cincinnati 2013. Only focusing on their footwork. They both looked like well trained Ninjas with their footwork. Simply the best.

 

[NatF]

I couldn't have said it better. Just watched Federer-Nadal Cincinnati 2013. Only focusing on their footwork. They both looked like well trained Ninjas with their footwork. Simply the best.

The way Fedal moves into the backhand corner is crazy good.

I remember watching an interview with Federer and Charlie Rose after the US Open in 2004. He was asked how he's been able to make the jump and play so damn well and essentially Federer just said, "I worked on my footwork."

 

[Sysyphus]

Both Murray and Monfils are examples of players with extreme speed and the the necessary athletic capacity for paramount movement, but they have quite a bit to go on in terms of efficiency, coordination and recovery. Murray is better at these attributes though, whereas Monfils has slightly more pure speed and explosiveness.

eta: Murray for instance has a higher top speed than Rafa and Nole, but they are superior in terms of footwork, efficiency and recovery.

My cents regarding those two.

 

[Noleberic123]

Both Murray and Monfils are examples of players with extreme speed and the the necessary athletic capacity for paramount movement, but they have quite a bit to go on in terms of efficiency, coordination and recovery. Murray is better at these attributes though, whereas Monfils has slightly more pure speed and explosiveness.

eta: Murray for instance has a higher top speed than Rafa and Nole, but they are superior in terms of footwork, efficiency and recovery.

My cents regarding those two.

So whos the best mover?

 

[Sysyphus]

So whos the best mover?

Of Monfils and Murray? Murray imo, in that he positions himself correctly more often for the "regular" shots, and he has a bit better anticipation too. Monfils is the best on tour for the crazy gets though, so his movement may often be perceived as slightly better than it is due to this show-factor.

 

[NEW_BORN]

-Quickness: acceleration, recovery, (reflexes?).
-Footwork: important techniques to set up for either defensive or attacking situations.
-Anticipation: read of the game.
-Efficiency: control, coordination, sustainability.
-Speed: top whack YO.

I would include Balance / Body Coordination on top of that list

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

I would include Balance on top of that list

I've accounted for balance in the efficiency section.. coordination and control and such.

Do you think it should be a separate entity from efficiency, where efficiency would describe repeatability and consistency under pressure or for a very long duration and balance would describe coordination and control?

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

-Quickness: acceleration, recovery, (reflexes?).
-Footwork: important techniques to set up for either defensive or attacking situations.
-Anticipation: read of the game.
-Efficiency: control, coordination, sustainability.
-Speed: top whack YO.


Murray
-Quickness: 8
-Footwork: 7.5 (doesn't use footwork that well to attack)
-Anticipation: 10
-Efficiency: 8
-Speed: 8.5

Monfils
-Quickness: 9.5
-Footwork: 6
-Anticipation: 7
-Efficiency: 6
-Speed: 10

 

[okdude1992]

I posted about this in another thread. To summarize my opinion: "grace" (as Murray called it in an interview) is extremely underrated in tennis movement. It ties into balance, efficiency (and therefore endurance), and also effects stroke production.

Prime Federer had this quality: effortless, fluid, natural, smooth. A counter example would be James Blake. Extremely fast, strong guy who never used those attributes in an efficient way on the tennis court. Or someone like Monfils who is an unbelievable athlete and mover, with subpar footwork.

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Out of the elements discussed here, which single element is the most important? Or is the process of movement too holistic?

 

[Deleted member 688153]

-Quickness: acceleration, recovery, (reflexes?).
-Footwork: important techniques to set up for either defensive or attacking situations.
-Anticipation: read of the game.
-Efficiency: control, coordination, sustainability.
-Speed: top whack YO.


Murray
-Quickness: 8
-Footwork: 7.5 (doesn't use footwork that well to attack)
-Anticipation: 10
-Efficiency: 8
-Speed: 8.5

Monfils
-Quickness: 9.5
-Footwork: 6
-Anticipation: 7
-Efficiency: 6
-Speed: 10

How would you rate Fedalovic with this?

 

[Anaconda]

What is movement in tennis?

Speed?

What makes Murray a better mover than Monfils? Or is he?

Movement consists of these attributes: speed (top speed), quickness (recovery in switching directions and acceleration), footwork, anticipation.
These are the four core elements of movement. Can you guys think of anything I'm missing?

Coordination, weight transfer, split step, court positioning. Anticipation is not part of movement - it's mental.

On ROS - the one hander allows you to lunge, however 2H BH gives you more reach.



What makes Murray a better mover than Monfils? Court positioning and efficiency - notice how Monfils gets injured frequently? It's down to movement.

 

[Starbuckingham]

Shoes is the most important in movement. If you wear Federer's shoes you can float like a butterfly, glide like a NetJet, prance like a goat and dance like Psy.

 

[Russeljones]

Shoes is the most important in movement. If you wear Federer's shoes you can float like a butterfly, glide like a NetJet, prance like a goat and dance like Psy.

And we shouldn't forget diet either. A diet Coke can be the difference between having your name engraved into the cup and "insert macabre play of words that makes use of the word grave"

 

[Nathaniel_Near]

Coordination, weight transfer, split step, court positioning. Anticipation is not part of movement - it's mental.

On ROS - the one hander allows you to lunge, however 2H BH gives you more reach.



What makes Murray a better mover than Monfils? Court positioning and efficiency - notice how Monfils gets injured frequently? It's down to movement.

If someone can't read the game though, they can be as fast as Usain Bolt and have the footwork of Federer and still generally move badly. A lot of the best movers are those who can read the opponents best and therefore can respond quickly and accurately. You are right in that it is not a direct sort of "moving part" of movement but it's a vital tennis skill that leads to big differences between the movement ability of many players.

 

[Bender]

Being able to get from A to B in good enough time to take an ideal swing, while spending minimal energy in the process.

 

[Starbuckingham]

And we shouldn't forget diet either. A diet Coke can be the difference between having your name engraved into the cup and "insert macabre play of words that makes use of the word grave"

Diet Coke is full of artificial sweetener and will make your footwork go Isner like.

 

[Rebel-I.N.S]

Both Murray and Monfils are examples of players with extreme speed and the the necessary athletic capacity for paramount movement, but they have quite a bit to go on in terms of efficiency, coordination and recovery. Murray is better at these attributes though, whereas Monfils has slightly more pure speed and explosiveness.

eta: Murray for instance has a higher top speed than Rafa and Nole, but they are superior in terms of footwork, efficiency and recovery.

My cents regarding those two.

Strongly disagree as this is surface dependent.

Murray's footwork (especially on grass) is better than Nole.

Nole wins on clay obviously.

 

[speedysteve]

Diet Coke is full of artificial sweetener and will make your footwork go Isner like.

LOL (10 char)