Tennis Serve Critique

Jay27

Jay27

Rookie
Hello everyone. This is my first post, so I'm fairly new to this. However, I'm between a 3.5 and 4.0 rated player (i've beaten 4.0's and i've lost to 3.5's). I started tennis about 4 years ago, and I'm trying to really fine tune things. My forehand is my weapon, and my 1 hand backhand is decent. I win more matches than I lose, but I'm wanting to improve. I'd like to become a steady 4.0 player and be competitive in the USTA at that level. I'm working on my serve, and there's many things wrong with it. If you can give me some critiques that may help, I'd really appreciate it. Currently, I serve fairly consistently in the 90's on my first serve, and about 80 on my second serve. I can reach into the 100's (107 and 105 mph are my fastest with a Speedcheck radar).

I don't think I'm getting a good knee-bend. I think I have a decent coil, but my right foot looks like it tries to compenstate for balance when I bring my feet together (it sort of overlaps to the right of my left foot--you can see in the video). I'm also not pronating on every serve. I understand the concept of pronation, but it's so hard to put into practice.

I suppose I'd like to critique my point to point method of serving and learn to get a better knee bend. Maybe it all revolves around the toss? If you can help me figure some stuff out, I think I'd be ready for my rivals in the 4.0. By the way, I just finished as a finalist in the 4.0's in a tournament in Ohio and won the 3.5 this past weekend. I got my butt kicked with the guy in the 4.0 finals. He got me 2 and 2. Oh well, I guess better luck next time!

Here's the site to which you can view my serve. It's 3:47 minutes long, and you may have to have high speed internet in order for it to buffer properly (not sure). The site is: www.brilliantbryant.com/serve.wmv

Thanks for any input!

(hitting with Dunlop 300G mid) (also hit with the 200G)
 
damn man, ever heard of compression? At least make it a quicktime (or mpg/avi) file so that i can do frame by frame. Haha. I am not so good myself, but I have a funny feeling that maybe you are launching youself up in the air a bit too soon. Try forcing yourself on the ground but still trying to reach for the ball at it's height. Hopefully the experts will finish downloading it soon and give you better tips :)
 
Try to put your right foot behind your left one but of course close to each other anyway. Also try to get your hip more into the court. Then one more thing, use Microsoft MovieMakes cause we don't want to look at you while you are picking ut balls around the court. It would make the clip so much shorter and faster to download :) Then don't forget to practise a lot of serves.
BTW, exept from the things I mentioned I think your serve looks quite nice.
 
I am no expert so take this with a grain of salt. It appears as if you need a greater weight shift back at the beginning of the serve and a more pronounced knee bend. I also felt like you were hitting the ball too late. Which is to say your weight moved forward and up, but you didn't hit the ball until you were coming back down. An earlier poster mentioned this too. We couldn't see the result of the serve but your motion generally looks good. I would expect you have a nice serve.

That being said...I typically do not care for the pinpoint stance. It seems the better, more consistent servers tend to use more of a platform stance. I think it gives you more stability, and thus more power and control. Also, there are fewer moving parts, so it is easier to get everything working together with the right timing. Plus, you don't have to worry so much about foot faults. Actually, several of the guys that I play with have foot work similar to yours, they foot fault all the time, and they don't worry about it anyway. KK, where are you...?

Seriously, you have a nice serve. Probably too good to be helped on this forum, but an hour with a pro might tweak it up for you.
 
Ok, finally got to see the movie. Yeah it's a pretty big file.
Your serve motion looks good.
You coil the shoulder and hips before you toss and uncoil into the serve.
Your toss looked consistent and you're tossing into the court so you are moving into the serve.
As for your feet, I've seen pros hit the exact way you do. e.g Lindsay Davenport. She brings her right foot beside her left foot before launching into the serve.
If it works for you then go for it.

The one thing I see you're not doing that will give you more pace is pulling in your non-dominant arm. It's just kind of lagging there right now. Pull it in to your stomach area. Will cause acceleration of your hitting arm.
 
Slazenger said:
As for your feet, I've seen pros hit the exact way you do. e.g Lindsay Davenport. She brings her right foot beside her left foot before launching into the serve. If it works for you then go for it.
Click to expand...

This makes him show his stomach towards the net instead of his side and that is not a good sign. Then he loses his hip that he needs to come under the ball.
 
If you're already serving in the 90s and 80s on your first and second serves, then you already have all you need to compete with 4.0s. I'm curious why you're focusing on your serve.

I know that's not your question in this post, but it's my opinion that the path to 4.0 from 3.5 is paved with better groundstrokes.

I'll bet the guy who beat you 2 and 2 just had stronger, more dependable groundstrokes. I don't see too many players hitting aces or service return winners at that level. The vast majority of points are slugged out after the serve has begun the rally.

Best of luck to you . . . your serve looks pretty good to me.
 
Thanks guys! I do appreciate all your advice. I especially like the advice of pulling the non-dominant hand back into the body instead of allowing it to dangle in the mists. I will certainly work on it.

I got beat with the 4.0 player in the finals because I return rather poorly (in my book of standards). Anyone who hits a fairly consistent booming first serve will pretty much win the point against me. I'm getting better, however. I can return second serves with good pace and generally do not have problems. I thrive on returning a good hard kicking serve to my forehand. One thing that really kills me in matches is the fact that I slice back serves hit to my backhand. The better players quickly pick up on it begin drilling it. I have a 1 hand backhand and it is generally used to return to the middle with a little pace...I do have some directional power, but if I want it to be consistently reliable, then I hit it back over the lowest part of the net (shoulda never switched from 2 hander to the 1 hander 4 years ago)...lol

As for my forehand, it is my weapon. I have a nice fluent stroke and I am 100% comfortable with it. I have excellent directional power with good angle shots to add to my arsenol. I just think my biggest downfall is return of serve.

My serve, however, is not too bad. I average about 6 to 8 aces in a 2 or 3 setter. My big reliable ace shot is to the deuce side out wide--sometimes flat sometimes with a little slice to it. I try to keep my opponents off balance by going down the T and out wide. I'm decent with my serves on both Add side and deuce side. I hit serve this evening at 109 on my speedcheck radar at the portsmouth racket club. There were two guys that served harder than me. One was 18 years old and a nicely ranked Junior. He served 116 (fastest), and our local pro 122 mph. I've improved pretty nicely because my average first serve speed tonight was about 99 to 103. That seemed pretty good to me, but I was really strokin the ball. I also hit 1 108, and two 105 mph. But, you know when I hit the 109, I didn't feel as if I really put a lot of effort into it. I felt really smooth and hit it really well. In my serve video that I posted on here, I was prolly at about 70 to 75 percent on most of my serves (it was a little too cold to really be strokin the ball). However, inside the racket club, I felt like I was bringnin the heat. It was a fun night because there were several people that thought they could reach the 100 mark. There were only 4 total out of about 12 people that actually achieved the 100 mark. Most actually averaged about 75 mph. It was sort of funny really. Anyway, I'll quit borin you guys. It helps to have fellow tennis patrons offer advice, so I extend a thank you to you.
 
Jay27 said:
Hello everyone. This is my first post, so I'm fairly new to this. However, I'm between a 3.5 and 4.0 rated player (i've beaten 4.0's and i've lost to 3.5's). I started tennis about 4 years ago, and I'm trying to really fine tune things. My forehand is my weapon, and my 1 hand backhand is decent. I win more matches than I lose, but I'm wanting to improve. I'd like to become a steady 4.0 player and be competitive in the USTA at that level. I'm working on my serve, and there's many things wrong with it. If you can give me some critiques that may help, I'd really appreciate it. Currently, I serve fairly consistently in the 90's on my first serve, and about 80 on my second serve. I can reach into the 100's (107 and 105 mph are my fastest with a Speedcheck radar).

I don't think I'm getting a good knee-bend. I think I have a decent coil, but my right foot looks like it tries to compenstate for balance when I bring my feet together (it sort of overlaps to the right of my left foot--you can see in the video). I'm also not pronating on every serve. I understand the concept of pronation, but it's so hard to put into practice.

I suppose I'd like to critique my point to point method of serving and learn to get a better knee bend. Maybe it all revolves around the toss? If you can help me figure some stuff out, I think I'd be ready for my rivals in the 4.0. By the way, I just finished as a finalist in the 4.0's in a tournament in Ohio and won the 3.5 this past weekend. I got my butt kicked with the guy in the 4.0 finals. He got me 2 and 2. Oh well, I guess better luck next time!

Here's the site to which you can view my serve. It's 3:47 minutes long, and you may have to have high speed internet in order for it to buffer properly (not sure). The site is: www.brilliantbryant.com/serve.wmv

Thanks for any input!

(hitting with Dunlop 300G mid) (also hit with the 200G)
Click to expand...

You are holding back too much!

1. Keep your tossing arm up longer and really go up for that ball.

2. Keep your head UP longer

3. When you bring the back foot forward, really feel your weight over the toes of both feet and push off from them - really launch.

4. Lauch upward trying to keep your feet somewhat closer together when you are going up.

5. Bring in that non-dominant arm sooner. When your in the backscratch position the non-hitting arm should be already in the body as you throw the hitting arm up to the ball. It should "trade" positions in other words. One arm goes up (tossing arm), the other gets ready to go up while the other comes down and fold in. This lauches the hitting arm with awesome rotation. If you ever get to watch a clip of Roddick in slo-mo you will see what I mean. The non-hitting arm coming in really allows the lauching of the hitting arm.

You need more upward explosion.
 
Serve looks 3.5 to 4.0 level, not too bad, fairly fluid with ok pace. You can probably hit harder but getting a high percentage in is always good too. OK, I just read your initial post and this is exactly what you are already saying.

If you goal is to get to 4.0 then your serve is already there in my opinion and maybe your just need to work on groundstrokes, strategy, and maybe do a little more conditioning (running and diet) to get into a little better shape for the longer rallies and matches at the 4.0 level.

I am a high 4.0 with a big serve (clocked this summer 109 and 110 using week old balls, I think I go about 115 with new balls when indoors) and I have actually gone to adding more slice spin (eastern backhand grip) to mine instead of trying to hit harder but will mix it up. Placement and spin are often more effective than just power alone.

Good luck with your serve and game. Seems like you are doing well in 4 years. My game might be about a half level up but I have been playing like 10 years now.
 
Bungalo Bill said:
You are holding back too much!

1. Keep your tossing arm up longer and really go up for that ball.

2. Keep your head UP longer

3. When you bring the back foot forward, really feel your weight over the toes of both feet and push off from them - really launch.

4. Lauch upward trying to keep your feet somewhat closer together when you are going up.

5. Bring in that non-dominant arm sooner. When your in the backscratch position the non-hitting arm should be already in the body as you throw the hitting arm up to the ball. It should "trade" positions in other words. One arm goes up (tossing arm), the other gets ready to go up while the other comes down and fold in. This lauches the hitting arm with awesome rotation. If you ever get to watch a clip of Roddick in slo-mo you will see what I mean. The non-hitting arm coming in really allows the lauching of the hitting arm.

You need more upward explosion.
Click to expand...

Thanks so much BB, I appreciate the advice. I was wondering when the non-dominant hand should come into the body, and you answered that perfectly. I will try and get another more compressed video that way we can see if I've made the right adjustments. Thanks so much!
 
badboi78 said:
hmm... your serve looks kind of weak
maybe this will help you:

http://www.tennisgate.com/head/en_head_newsletter_4.html

practice 'till you get that whip sound on your serve!!

even my 3.0 friend has a harder serve
Click to expand...

I'm happy to see your friend has a good serve. Thanks for the link as well. Maybe, with your help, I can soon serve as hard as your friend. How fast does your friend serve by the way? Can he hit harder than 109 (which is my fastest serve--that was in)? Also, you must keep in mind that in this video I'm only at about 75%......too cold to really crank it up, but my focus was to show everyone my serve motion and get some good advice. Thanks for your help!
 
Jay27 said:
I'm happy to see your friend has a good serve. Thanks for the link as well. Maybe, with your help, I can soon serve as hard as your friend. How fast does your friend serve by the way? Can he hit harder than 109 (which is my fastest serve--that was in)? Also, you must keep in mind that in this video I'm only at about 75%......too cold to really crank it up, but my focus was to show everyone my serve motion and get some good advice. Thanks for your help!
Click to expand...
you don't serve with a long backstracth....
 
Jay27 said:
Thanks so much BB, I appreciate the advice. I was wondering when the non-dominant hand should come into the body, and you answered that perfectly. I will try and get another more compressed video that way we can see if I've made the right adjustments. Thanks so much!
Click to expand...

You can get the feel by creating a tool that will help your serve.

Get a sturdy but flexible string/rope and attach it a tennis ball. make the string/rope length and little longer then your racquet length. Then swing the ball around and get the feel of accelerating your hitting arm just as your non-dominant arm folds in. Swing the ball around and around eliminating any hitches in the swing.
 
Thanks BB, I'll certainly try that. Today, I played a great tennis match in the 4.0's. My serve was the big hit of the day. I've played this guy before, and he's beaten me everytime I've played him. He's 3 and 0 against me (although, I've given him a good match everytime except the first). Today, I felt like I was hitting my serve harder and better than ever (I even concentrated on bringing my non-dominant arm into my body more, and pretty soon, it felt like a natural thing). I aced him more than I've aced anyone in a match. I beat him 2 and 2, and it was a great feeling. The other parts of my game were on as well, so I can't attribute it all to my serve, but it really helped.

I played a nail biter last night! A third set tie breaker loss to me; however, I would like to say, I felt really good on my serve. It feels different. Almost a smoother and easier feel. I toss the ball, but I don't feel as awkward as I used to when I go after the ball. I really think the danglin non-dominant arm hurt my swing. Anyway, I'll post a video soon. I think my serve is finally coming together. Thanks to everone for pointing out my deficiencies. Now, I need to practice like a mad duck to make it better.
 
badboi78 said:
hmm... your serve looks kind of weak
maybe this will help you:

http://www.tennisgate.com/head/en_head_newsletter_4.html

practice 'till you get that whip sound on your serve!!

even my 3.0 friend has a harder serve
Click to expand...


Its amazing to me the 2.5 rated players who critique other people's serves..LOL

Jay your serve looks good to me

If there is one thing I will criticize though, its got to be your video editing. Long time to download man :)
 
Jay27 said:
Thanks BB, I'll certainly try that. Today, I played a great tennis match in the 4.0's. My serve was the big hit of the day. I've played this guy before, and he's beaten me everytime I've played him. He's 3 and 0 against me (although, I've given him a good match everytime except the first). Today, I felt like I was hitting my serve harder and better than ever (I even concentrated on bringing my non-dominant arm into my body more, and pretty soon, it felt like a natural thing). I aced him more than I've aced anyone in a match. I beat him 2 and 2, and it was a great feeling. The other parts of my game were on as well, so I can't attribute it all to my serve, but it really helped.

I played a nail biter last night! A third set tie breaker loss to me; however, I would like to say, I felt really good on my serve. It feels different. Almost a smoother and easier feel. I toss the ball, but I don't feel as awkward as I used to when I go after the ball. I really think the danglin non-dominant arm hurt my swing. Anyway, I'll post a video soon. I think my serve is finally coming together. Thanks to everone for pointing out my deficiencies. Now, I need to practice like a mad duck to make it better.
Click to expand...

Sounds great!
 
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