Opendaroof
Rookie
You really think Madrid is relevant? It is the worst Clay surface for Nadal.
The 2021 Rome masters 1000 R16 matchup :- (2) Rafael Nadal [ESP] versus (13) Denis Shapovalov [CAN]
- Thread starter Rafa4LifeEver
- Start date
dapchai
Legend
It's not really about the surface itself but the altitude and dry condition which favor the servebots more than other big clay events do.
Harry_Wild
G.O.A.T.
Rafa wins in a 3 set thriller with a 3rd set tiebreaker and Rafa is in to the round of 16! That is how to earn it!
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Deleted member 770948
Guest
Harry_Wild
G.O.A.T.
dapchai
Legend
Was this banner from 2011?
Rafa wins in a 3 set thriller tiebreaker and is in to round of 16!
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Deleted member 770948
Guest
Zverev has always had self-belief at Masters, 14-9 vs. Top 10 players........but has no self-belief at Slams, and is therefore 0-9 vs. Top 10 players.
That's the common theme for all these guys........Thiem beat Nadal FOUR times on clay, including THREE times in straight sets........and Nadal has won 12 of their 13 sets at Roland Garros....
Zverev and Thiem have the biggest problems of all.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Nadal15thslam
Hall of Fame
Rg is soo much different. The court is so big, the bounce of the ball is perfect for Nadal, he's like a king in his kingdom, there's a certain aura. He looks beatable this year but it's still very hard to beat him at Rg.
Harry_Wild
G.O.A.T.
Probably around that era! He even more powerful now in 2021! Competition is much more severe too!
dapchai
Legend
Yeah the competition seems so impossible that those millionaire tennis players don't want to win anymore. They hand the trophies to their opponents, no wonder.
clayqueen
Talk Tennis Guru
Shapovalov:
"These matches, you have nothing to lose... I also think I have what it takes to beat these guys," Shapovalov later reflected. "It's not a surprise to me. It's just a tough loss. Of course, it's not the first time Rafa's done this. I'm not the first person to lose with match points. For sure, he does well with the pressure in those moments.
"Just something I have to take back and just make a couple changes. But I'm definitely happy with where my game's at, relatively speaking, against the greatest player on this surface."
www.atptour.com
"These matches, you have nothing to lose... I also think I have what it takes to beat these guys," Shapovalov later reflected. "It's not a surprise to me. It's just a tough loss. Of course, it's not the first time Rafa's done this. I'm not the first person to lose with match points. For sure, he does well with the pressure in those moments.
"Just something I have to take back and just make a couple changes. But I'm definitely happy with where my game's at, relatively speaking, against the greatest player on this surface."
Nadal Saves M.Ps., Denies Shapovalov Upset In Rome Thriller | ATP Tour | Tennis
Rafael Nadal booked his 16th quarter-final at the Internazionali BNL d’Italia after saving match points in a three-and-a-half hour epic against 13th seed Denis Shapovalov.
www.atptour.com
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
Someone like Shapo with 1 hbh and all UFEs - Nadal should be roasting.
The fact that Nadal was match points down, tell you that he is playing this worst tennis till date.
Today's Nadal would have been beaten by Zverev, Titspas, Thiem, Novak easily IMO.
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
Excellent post. Nadal is a pale shadow of himself. A younger Nadal would have destroyed a 1 hbh + UFE machine that Shapo is, in straight sets.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Lol, today's version of Nadal would never show up against Djokovic.
EddieChang
Rookie
Nadal is definitely much slower but has gotten a lot better with one two punch and backhand attacking, just better offensively
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Lol, what?
Beckerserve
Legend
Yes but Rome is not Chatrier in warmer conditions
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
Really? What makes you think so.
IMO Novak is playing better than Nadal at clay right now - at this very moment.
Novak's loss against Karetsev was a MUCH HIGHER level than Nadal has at any point this clay season.
I'm not saying Nadal can't play better and beat Novak. He surely can. But at the current level, Nadal is not looking all that great.
D
Deleted member 770948
Guest
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
You guys amuse me. It's not about the conditions.
It's about form. Nadal won RG last year in the worst conditions for him - low bounce, heavy balls, cool weather. Because he played really well.
If Nadal doesn't play well, it doesn't matter if it's warm, sunny and the ball is bouncing higher than mount everest -- he will lose.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
These days Nadal plays every clay court match against Djokovic like his life depends on it. There's no way in a month of Sundays he'd put in a performance like he did today if he saw Novak on the other side of the net.
Beckerserve
Legend
He played well at Rome 2020 did he?
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
Nope. Not at all.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
Shapo's power was just too much for RAFA. this is bad sign. next time they with sinner, they could be overpowered
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
You realize that Nadal has a losing H2h vs Djokovic. Most of the tight matches Djokovic wins and Djokovic has totally dominated their rivalry since 2011. When they play, Nadal is the one who is always under most pressure.
Beckerserve
Legend
So what is the point you are making about the FO? 3 weeks till 2nd week starts.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Nah, Nadal has mental problems against Djokovic. I don't know how he won the last 4 clay meetings given that he tried to choke in all of them at least for one set.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
The problem with Djokovic and Nadal nearly always being the top 2 seeds is that they can only meet in the final by which stage Nadal has usually got into more of a groove and ironed out any of the kinks in his game.
For instance I think there's a decent chance that Djokovic would've beaten the version of Nadal we saw lose to Schwartzman in the quarter finals of Rome last year but had they met in the final I'm fairly certain Nadal would've put another beatdown on him. Just the way it is these days when it comes to their matchup on clay.
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
Just because something happened before it will happen again?
So Nadal will play crap in the leadups and always win RG? Some day it will stop happening.
Sorry_to_tell_you_mate
Professional
D
Deleted member 770948
Guest
If they make Roland Garros into best-of-3-sets........reduce the size of the court........and hypnotize Nadal and wipe his memory....
He had two MPs. Did you even watch it ?
Sorry_to_tell_you_mate
Professional
And Djokovic had the control of that match but still lost.
You're equally awful poster as that guy in your Avatar.
dapchai
Legend
They were actually MPs with Nadal on serve, so I think Shapo shouldn't be so ashamed of that.
On clay Nadal is troubled by pace but Djokovic does not have that pace off his groundstrokes to trouble Nadal on clay. But still due to mental issues Nadal lost a set to Djokovic at Rome 2019. But you need pace on your groundstrokes to trouble nadal.
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Deleted member 770948
Guest
Yeah that 2019 Rome match was the most lopsided match Nadal-Djokovic have ever played with a deciding set, 60 46 61.
clayqueen
Talk Tennis Guru
Rafa threw Djoker the 2nd set because he didn't want to humiliate him too much.
Jokervich
Hall of Fame
That is some epic choking. But at the same time, we'd be saying something completely different if he took one of those match points.
marc45
G.O.A.T.
speaking of mental problems....
Beckerserve
Legend
He has often won RG post 2010 looking rubbish before. You may be judging him pre 2010 when he truly was unbeatable on clay. That was a long time ago.
The Sinner generation i have hope for but its too early for them this FO. The tsitsipas zverev generation will not beat Nadal on clay or Djokovic over 5 sets. They will choke.
Beckerserve
Legend
Rafa game is obsolete. Has been for years. However mentally he is rock solid. These Next Gen are snowflakes so for all their power when it really matters they will miss. Rafa knows this.
marc45
G.O.A.T.
my god, the projection
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Deleted member 770948
Guest
Denis is known for playing a low-percentage and risky brand of tennis, and that is exposed when Nadal raises his level (which he tends to do at the end of sets) and forces Denis into difficult positions.
I didn't see any evidence of Denis choking.
Choking would be Nadal vs. Rublev at Monte Carlo, when Nadal served 7 double-faults including 2 of them on break points....
Whereas its not like Denis made uncharacteristic errors on big points today.
bluetrain4
G.O.A.T.
I just saw the highlights. How did Nada get out of that? I know, Shapo is erratic at the worst times, but still. Nadal seems relieved to get out of these matches, but doesn't seem too thrilled with himself. Looks mentally tired. But, these matches show us that even getting by a subpar Nadal on clay is a tought feat - even more so best of 5 sets.
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Deleted member 770948
Guest
Nadal's forehand is a lot better this year than 2019 and 2020, and he's more athletic this year too and moving better than the last 2 years........obviously 2020 he didn't play tennis for many months so no surprise........ and 2019 he was told to limit his practice early in the year because he'd had ankle surgery at the end of 2018.
His matches are close, but he won Barcelona........whereas in 2019 he didn't even make the Final of his first 3 clay events........and Rome 2020 was so bad he lost to Schwartzman for the first time ever.
The only negative I see today is his serving........but he's never needed his serve at Roland Garros because his forehand is able to control the points at Roland Garros a lot more than at other places.
So if he played Rublev (whom he lost to at Monte Carlo in 3 sets) at Roland Garros, I don't believe he'd lose a set.
And I also don't believe he'd lose a set to Zverev at Roland Garros........and don't forget Nadal was on top for most of the 1st Set at Madrid, despite the surface allowing Zverev to serve rockets.
catskillthunder
Professional
As big a Nadal fan as I am, my personal opinion is he wont win RG this year.
