The American Men Are Not Natural Athletes

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

I agree too. I think american football and baseball look so dumb, not sure how many fall for such game. More than the sport, I hate to see these fat people who are playing this sport at professional level only for their power. They give a wrong picture of athletes to American kids. I agree that they may be very good players in their sport, but you need to have a certain body condition to call yourself a professional sports person.

Most of those fat people are in better shape than you are probably. It's not about standing still and using your hulk strength. To be a great lineman you have to have great footwork, proper technique and the ability to push someone coming at your who is equally strong all the while maintaining your ground. You can't venture forward(except when the play is a run) and if you go too far back the pocket collapses. Don't take such an ignorant view of the sport. Many of those huge 6 foot 6+ 325+ pound lineman are unbelievably agile.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

IMHO - no need to throw shade on other sports because you like tennis. I've heard similar, disparaging comments about soccer or tennis from people who are not that familiar about the sport.

Outside of defensive and offensive linemen, football players are incredibly fit and fast. Same for certain positions in baseball. You can be a lumbering hulk and play first base, but you have to be a great athlete to play short stop or some of the outfield positions on defense. I'm not a huge fan of either but I can respect the players for what they do.

Even defensive and offensive lineman are incredibly fit and fast. Julius Peppers is amazing and is 6 foot 7, 280 pounds. Lineman might not have straight line speed, but their agility is exceptional. Also, I'm not a huge football fan. Much bigger fan of tennis and cycling.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

I get it that you think that Futbol is superior uber alles but dont demean pro football or basketball as doubtless you watch neither. I doubt you could understand the most basic offensive or defensive scheme, not to mention analyzing a defense in .02 seconds and delivering a ball with pinpoint precision and in time with the receiver. All sports require brains as well as athletic ability.

I mean, how would it be if I said cricket was a dumb silly sport. Granted, I have no experience of it or understand it because I dont play it and am not exposed to it.

Most pro football players and nearly all basketball players are extremely fit.
Even the so called 'fat' offensive and defensive lineman, while they are large, are strong and suprisingly quick.

Virtually no basketball players are fat. There are exceptions are like charles barkley, shaq etc..but most pro basketball players barely have any fat on them.

Quoted for the undeniable lack of bias.

 

[sureshs]

I get it that you think that Futbol is superior uber alles but dont demean pro football or basketball as doubtless you watch neither. I doubt you could understand the most basic offensive or defensive scheme, not to mention analyzing a defense in .02 seconds and delivering a ball with pinpoint precision and in time with the receiver. All sports require brains as well as athletic ability.

I mean, how would it be if I said cricket was a dumb silly sport. Granted, I have no experience of it or understand it because I dont play it and am not exposed to it.

Most pro football players and nearly all basketball players are extremely fit.
Even the so called 'fat' offensive and defensive lineman, while they are large, are strong and suprisingly quick.

Virtually no basketball players are fat. There are exceptions are like charles barkley, shaq etc..but most pro basketball players barely have any fat on them.

You do what you need to compete. If someone wants to be slim and play football, let him give it a try. If someone wants to be slim and be a heavyweight wrestler, give it a try.

 

[tlm]

Define "natural" athlete?

All these guys are incredibly athletic, you have to be to even be in the top 100 in the ATP. If you are saying that these guys aren't in the upper end of the very elite athletes that become stars in other American sports, then I could agree.

While that is a factor, tennis requires more than just athletic talent. You also have to look at how the American style of tennis and tennis training has lagged behind the rest of the world and the rest of the world has caught up and surpassed us.

Sorry but there is no way in hell that all of these guys are incredibly athletic. Do you ever listen when roddick is clod hopping around the court you can hear his terrible footwork, or how about the over grown dork isner then last but not least there is fish, incredibly athletic you have got to be kidding.

 

[sargeinaz]

Sorry but there is no way in hell that all of these guys are incredibly athletic. Do you ever listen when roddick is clod hopping around the court you can hear his terrible footwork, or how about the over grown dork isner then last but not least there is fish, incredibly athletic you have got to be kidding.

Roddick is a world class athlete whether you like it or not. Man some of you talk about these guys like theyre some scrubs at your local park. Also, America has the best athletes. Stop kidding yourselves. The football players here are ridiculous. Also players like Kobe and Lebron. There is no athlete like Lebron. Some of you kill me with your European people are more athletic and play soccer blah blah.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

Sorry but there is no way in hell that all of these guys are incredibly athletic. Do you ever listen when roddick is clod hopping around the court you can hear his terrible footwork, or how about the over grown dork isner then last but not least there is fish, incredibly athletic you have got to be kidding.

What fantasy land do you hail from where guys like these are not incredible athletes? Try hanging 30 minutes with some of the guys that are mere D1 collegiate tennis players (about 6.0 on average). Then come back and tell us how these guys are not incredibly athletic.
.

 

[sargeinaz]

What fantasy land do you hail from where guys like these are not incredible athletes? Try hanging 30 minubtes with some of the guys that ONLY play D1 collegiate tennis (about 6.0 on average). Then come back and tell us how these guys are not incredibly athletic.

You didn't know that Roddick is not incredibly athletic because his feet are loud when he runs? Obviously if he grew up in Europe or was a real athlete he would be quieter.

 

[chatt_town]

I agree with this. The ones that are currently playing do lack the athleticism it takes. I've said it in other threads. Until America starts looking at some other areas to get it's talent, you are going to hear generation after generation that "these are the new big guns" and each time it will be a let down.

I've been seriously following tennis for the past 5-6 years and am amazed by the increasing level of athleticism needed to be at the highest level (Top 30). The more and more I watch, the more convinced I am that the top American men are not natural athletes. If you compare the foot speed, agility, and flexibility of the Top players to Fish, Isner and Roddick it's not even close. Ryan Harrison and Donald Young are better athletes but no where near the levels needed to compete with the Djokovics, Nadals, Federers or Murrays. Players like Tsonga, Ferrer, Monfils, Dolgo, Del Potro are just a few of the other top players who are awesome athletes. I don't think that there are any current or up and coming American men who can compete athletically with them.

I know that Isner has been doing well lately but he is truly just a serve and forehand who has to rely on tiebreaks to win. Fish has had his moment in the sun and will not be able to repeat what he did last year. Roddick, God bless him, has gotten the most of his ability through hard work and has had a wonderful career but he would achieved more if he were blessed with natural athleticism.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

You didn't know that Roddick is not incredibly athletic because his feet are loud when he runs? Obviously if he grew up in Europe or was a real athlete he would be quieter.

??????????

 

[SLD76]

I agree with this. The ones that are currently playing do lack the athleticism it takes. I've said it in other threads. Until America starts looking at some other areas to get it's talent, you are going to hear generation after generation that "these are the new big guns" and each time it will be a let down.

or maybe the bottom line is, fish, roddick, querry, dent, etc....just arent as good as the top players.

it happens. could be a lack of training, could be marginalized athleticism, but at the end of the day, they just arent as talented.

which harkens back to my earlier posts...we lose really good athletes to other sports because tennis isnt as accessible and not as popular as they are.


And for the life of me,....I dont know why tennis doesnt make more of an effort to get kids early.

Think about it, in nearly every suburban community in this country there is pop warner football, or community basketball, soccer, gymnastics and most certainly little league baseball. They expose kids early to these sports and get them playing when they are 5,6 and 7. Then these kids get to middle and HS where they play for school teams and then on down the line. Tennis has no such infrastructure. Oh sure, there may be lessons at the local park in the summer on the basics, but they dont have the same sort of organized team play that other sports have. Maybe because tennis for young kids takes a while to learn but...on the other hand, thats how you spot the kids who have the hand eye coordination and who may have potential to become tennis players.

IMO, thats the only way to reverse the tide of losing players to other sports, build more courts and be more of a presence in the local community. It takes money no doubt, but surely the USTA has some cash?

 

[joeri888]

It's a lot of sacrifice to become a worldclass tennisplayer. You have to have little to lose if you gonna go all out for it.

 

[tlm]

Roddick is a world class athlete whether you like it or not. Man some of you talk about these guys like theyre some scrubs at your local park. Also, America has the best athletes. Stop kidding yourselves. The football players here are ridiculous. Also players like Kobe and Lebron. There is no athlete like Lebron. Some of you kill me with your European people are more athletic and play soccer blah blah.

So roddick is a world class athlete okay whatever you say. I never said that they were not good tennis players, the subject was how natural of athletes the american tennis players are.

You are going off in all different directions, try to stay on the subject. Also America does have many great athletes never did i say anything to claim that it does not. But again the American tennis players are not that great of athletes, can you separate the two?

It just proves my point when you have to start talking about other sports in America to find great athletes as your examples.If you think that the top American TENNIS PLAYERS compare athletically to most of the rest of the tour then you have no clue.

 

[cc0509]

Roddick is a world class athlete whether you like it or not. Man some of you talk about these guys like theyre some scrubs at your local park. Also, America has the best athletes. Stop kidding yourselves. The football players here are ridiculous. Also players like Kobe and Lebron. There is no athlete like Lebron. Some of you kill me with your European people are more athletic and play soccer blah blah.

Roddick may be a world class athlete but he does not compare to tennis players like Borg or Nadal for example in terms of pure athleticism. They aren't even on the same map.

 

[FlamEnemY]

ok but as I said..its expensive in europe too, but is far more popular.

And futhermore...Im pretty sure Djoker and Nalbandians families are well off....

I remember reading that Nalbandians grandfather built him in a tennis court at the family home. Yes, poor David..struggling with poverty, rofl.

Yeah, sure, I get what you are saying. But there are far less "rich" people in Serbia as there are in the US, that's what I wanted to say. The problem is, like you said, in the popularity of the sport and the relative income a player can generate by playing tennis vs playing basketball, for example.

 

[Bjorn99]

I have thought about this in the past.

I think that almost all European children play soccer since they are very young (3 or 4 years old), whereas American children play basketball, baseball and football.

I would think soccer is really good to your lower body (specially legs, it develops strong and coordinate legs) whereas American sports maybe develop more of the upper body coordination (arms).

Sampras was an amazing athlete, but in kind of basketball sense, whereas Nadal, Ferrer would be amazing athletes in a kind of soccer sense.

It is just a feeling I have sometimes, that maybe some of this is part of the reason.

Tennis is a running game. Until its played digitally, North Americans, with their video game obsessions are going to be a distant second to last.

 

[Bjorn99]

And unless you are top ten, there is NO MONEY in tennis. If you are interested in making money, take up golf.

 

[SLD76]

Tennis is a running game. Until its played digitally, North Americans, with their video game obsessions are going to be a distant second to last.

sheer ignorance. never mind the fact that US routinely dominates track and field.

dear god people, futbol isnt the only sport in the world worth a damn. sheesh.

 

[SLD76]

And unless you are top ten, there is NO MONEY in tennis. If you are interested in making money, take up golf.

there *is* money in tennis even at the challenger level. prize money ranges in those tourneys from 30-150k. half of the working people in the US currently make less than 40k a year.

you wont be a millionare, but you can earn a decent living.

never mind the fact that you can earn hundreds of dollars an hour giving lessons.

but the problem is, even to get to that level of competition is extremely hard and takes alot of time, commitment and money.

 

[sargeinaz]

Roddick may be a world class athlete but he does not compare to tennis players like Borg or Nadal for example in terms of pure athleticism. They aren't even on the same map.

Pete Sampras is just as athletic as Borg or Nadal. People talk about Borg like he was usain bolt.

 

[nereis]

Pete Sampras is just as athletic as Borg or Nadal. People talk about Borg like he was usain bolt.

Borg could compete with Olympic athletes and give a good account of himself.

Sampras, as fast as he was, was never much of a grinder due to his congenital blood problems.

Borg was both fast and had great stamina.

 

[sargeinaz]

So roddick is a world class athlete okay whatever you say. I never said that they were not good tennis players, the subject was how natural of athletes the american tennis players are.

You are going off in all different directions, try to stay on the subject. Also America does have many great athletes never did i say anything to claim that it does not. But again the American tennis players are not that great of athletes, can you separate the two?

It just proves my point when you have to start talking about other sports in America to find great athletes as your examples.If you think that the top American TENNIS PLAYERS compare athletically to most of the rest of the tour then you have no clue.

You claimed he wasnt a world class athlete because his feet stomp loudly when he runs. That's a pretty stupid reason to declare him not being an incredible athlete. Thats like me saying Nadal and the rest of Europe are not world class athletes because their measly serves dont reach 140+.

Also, if youre a great athlete in America, youre not going to waste your time with tennis. You're going to play basketball or football or baseball and make a lot more money. So the lack of "incredible athletes" in American tennis is not an indicator of anything. Do other countries say they have a lack of incredible athletes in basketball, baseball or swimming etc?

 

[sargeinaz]

Borg could compete with Olympic athletes and give a good account of himself.

Sampras, as fast as he was, was never much of a grinder due to his congenital blood problems.

Borg was both fast and had great stamina.

Borg was in the Olympics? He ran a race on film against Olympic runners? Id love to see this. Im not doubting you or that he was fast, I just want to see where it shows he was as fast as people who spend their whole life doing nothing except running.

 

[nereis]

You claimed he wasnt a world class athlete because his feet stomp loudly when he runs. That's a pretty stupid reason to declare him not being an incredible athlete. Thats like me saying Nadal and the rest of Europe are not world class athletes because their measly serves dont reach 140+.

Also, if youre a great athlete in America, youre not going to waste your time with tennis. You're going to play basketball or football or baseball and make a lot more money. So the lack of "incredible athletes" in American tennis is not an indicator of anything. Do other countries say they have a lack of incredible athletes in basketball, baseball or swimming etc?

Let's not get too carried away. The topic is the dearth of natural athletes in American tennis and the possible causes of this, not a lack of natural athletes in America in general.

I think we can all agree that Roddick, for all the work on movement he's done, will never approach Hewitt/Nadal levels of speed around the court. While he is gifted in the shoulder department having a big serve doesn't matter as much anymore when the game has experienced a paradigm shift towards a more movement exploitation based metagame due to the slowing down of surfaces.

 

[813wilson]

It's a shame that the original post - dumb as it was - has spun into a thread that is starting to throw blanket coverage on "Americans" and comparisons of "our sports against others".

The fact that Roddicks "twitch muscles" are not as good as Hewitts does not make him less athletic.....

 

[nereis]

Borg was in the Olympics? He ran a race on film against Olympic runners? Id love to see this. Im not doubting you or that he was fast, I just want to see where it shows he was as fast as people who spend their whole life doing nothing except running.

Borg was competing against Olympic athletes on TV for money. Here's the results.

http://www.thesuperstars.org/athletes/borg.html

http://www.thesuperstars.org/comp/76eur5fra.html

A 12.3 100m dash without spikes or blocks for ***** and giggles is pretty damn respectable.

Beat the 110m hurdler over the 600m steeplechase too.

To be able to beat Olympic athletes regardless of whether or not the distance is favourable to them is quite a feat.

I don't think any of the top players today would be able to replicate that sort of feat bar Monfils.

 

[jackson vile]

Good point, shows Borg's true GOAT class.

Borg was competing against Olympic athletes on TV for money. Here's the results.

http://www.thesuperstars.org/athletes/borg.html

http://www.thesuperstars.org/comp/76eur5fra.html

A 12.3 100m dash without spikes or blocks for ***** and giggles is pretty damn respectable.

Beat the 110m hurdler over the 600m steeplechase too.

To be able to beat Olympic athletes regardless of whether or not the distance is favourable to them is quite a feat.

I don't think any of the top players today would be able to replicate that sort of feat bar Monfils.

 

[FlamEnemY]

http://www.thesuperstars.org/comp/76eur5fra.html

Holy S..t.

This is amazing.

 

[chatt_town]

I couldn't have said it better myself. That was exactly my point. It's not only about exposure but the cost. Right now, your parents pretty much have to be a doctor or lawyer or something to be able to get the best lessons. Well just as your post indicated, just because you can afford the lessons doesn't mean you are going to be a great tennis player. I think Roddick and Dent got the most of their talent but it's obviously going to take more than a big serve to win on the big stage and the current American tennis players just don't have it. The talent is here, we just have to be willing to accept the fact that it is not always in affluent areas. Once we get past that, you'll see the tide turn.

or maybe the bottom line is, fish, roddick, querry, dent, etc....just arent as good as the top players.

it happens. could be a lack of training, could be marginalized athleticism, but at the end of the day, they just arent as talented.

which harkens back to my earlier posts...we lose really good athletes to other sports because tennis isnt as accessible and not as popular as they are.


And for the life of me,....I dont know why tennis doesnt make more of an effort to get kids early.

Think about it, in nearly every suburban community in this country there is pop warner football, or community basketball, soccer, gymnastics and most certainly little league baseball. They expose kids early to these sports and get them playing when they are 5,6 and 7. Then these kids get to middle and HS where they play for school teams and then on down the line. Tennis has no such infrastructure. Oh sure, there may be lessons at the local park in the summer on the basics, but they dont have the same sort of organized team play that other sports have. Maybe because tennis for young kids takes a while to learn but...on the other hand, thats how you spot the kids who have the hand eye coordination and who may have potential to become tennis players.

IMO, thats the only way to reverse the tide of losing players to other sports, build more courts and be more of a presence in the local community. It takes money no doubt, but surely the USTA has some cash?

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

Roddick is a world class athlete whether you like it or not. Man some of you talk about these guys like theyre some scrubs at your local park. Also, America has the best athletes. Stop kidding yourselves. The football players here are ridiculous. Also players like Kobe and Lebron. There is no athlete like Lebron. Some of you kill me with your European people are more athletic and play soccer blah blah.

You were saying?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7hlL4sJek

Proud American here. Don't be naive. Soccer takes athletic talent. Europe, Asia, South America, Africa, Australia, and North America all have amazing athletes.

*No hate for Antarctica...... Just not sure what athletes they have made I am sure their penguins are top tier.

 

[DRII]

America has plenty of natural athletes. It is the difference in training focus that has produced a nation of one-two hitters.

What Lendl taught the rest of the world was that superior movement and solid groundstrokes could beat top tier talent. The American academies however saw the one-two punch aspect of his game rather than the fundamentals.

The choice to train juniors on hard courts instead of clay, which forces them to develop a complete game, compounds the difficulty of raising good movers inhouse.

Now, if most the tour was still played on slick carpets and 90s grass you'd see a lot of American success. But the academies did not realise that a paradigm shift was taking place and as a result American tennis has fallen behind relative to its standing in the 90s.

I generally agree with what your saying, and think (unlike the OP) that tennis has become less explosively athletic.

It seems that the 'Europeanization' (major focus on foot work, stroke consistency, and point production) of tennis is here to stay for at least a while longer, especially with the continued homogenization of surfaces...

However, much like with basketball (internationally), has made the sport less exciting.

I would like to see men's tennis become more 'Americanized' (ie explosive athleticism) like the Williams sisters did to women's tennis in the late 90's and early 2000's!

 

[li0scc0]

A 12.3 100m dash without spikes or blocks for ***** and giggles is pretty damn respectable.

.

Actually that is pretty slow. 12.3? In the 100m? Would finish over a second behind an average high school sprinter, and 1.5 seconds behind a good high school sprinter.
That is hardly world class.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

What fantasy land do you hail from where guys like these are not incredible athletes? Try hanging 30 minutes with some of the guys that are mere D1 collegiate tennis players (about 6.0 on average). Then come back and tell us how these guys are not incredibly athletic.
.

The only problem is you're also factoring in the skills of tennis which one isn't born with. It's a little hard to create a universal criteria that all athletes would have. If you were to take someone who had played tennis for years and put them up against say Cadel Evans(TDF 2011 Champion), despite Evans being the vastly superior athlete(in all probability) I'd put my money on the person who had played tennis for years.

It's not their athletic talent that would be overwhelming, but their learned talent of spins, pace, and consistency that would get most.

 

[NamRanger]

You were saying?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7hlL4sJek

Proud American here. Don't be naive. Soccer takes athletic talent. Europe, Asia, South America, Africa, Australia, and North America all have amazing athletes.

*No hate for Antarctica...... Just not sure what athletes they have made I am sure their penguins are top tier.

Indeed it does, however, the OP is correct in that American Tennis does not have many great athletes, because all the great athletes go to sports that pay more and have less risk. Roddick is a world class athlete in the sense that he would have likely made a great pitcher/quarterback by sheer virtue of his arm strength/shoulder flexibility/durability, but that's about it. His movement has always been sloppy, despite the fact that he has above average speed.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

I agree with this. The ones that are currently playing do lack the athleticism it takes. I've said it in other threads. Until America starts looking at some other areas to get it's talent, you are going to hear generation after generation that "these are the new big guns" and each time it will be a let down.

Agreed. The USTA has been picking up and supporting juniors who show results early on. The problem with that is they don't always correlate to success later on. They should be taking players with attacking games, not merely ones with results because they could just be faster in terms of maturation compared to others their same age. The main thing working against tennis is the risk reward. It's highly unlikely that they'd make more money over the course of a career when compared to the other American sporting staples; basketball, football, and baseball. I remember when someone said on this forum that Nadal and Federer could have gone on to play professional soccer and they would have most likely made more money that way than what an average tennis player does. If money is a motivating factor, then tennis will take a secondary position to most.

 

[NamRanger]

Agreed. The USTA has been picking up and supporting juniors who show results early on. The problem with that is they don't always correlate to success later on. They should be taking players with attacking games, not merely ones with results because they could just be faster in terms of maturation compared to others their same age. The main thing working against tennis is the risk reward. It's highly unlikely that they'd make more money over the course of a career when compared to the other American sporting staples; basketball, football, and baseball. I remember when someone said on this forum that Nadal and Federer could have gone on to play professional soccer and they would have most likely made more money that way than what an average tennis player does. If money is a motivating factor, then tennis will take a secondary position to most.

And that is a HUGE factor, because the parents want their kid to succeed. It is very unlikely that you will make enough money to sustain yourself in tennis. You have to be top 30 in the world to make a comfortable living (TonLars and various other people who have attempted to go pro have gone on record about this). Outside of that threshold, you're barely making more than your average blue collar worker.


For sports like football, basketball, baseball, etc. you can be riding the bench and still be making 6+ figures.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

Tennis is a running game. Until its played digitally, North Americans, with their video game obsessions are going to be a distant second to last.

Yes well until the rest of the world doesn't have to hold the child'd hand and kiss them when they fall they will never succeed in football.


See it sound sort of dumb doesn't it. You might also note that until he was arrested the Modern Warfare 3 player was a German, but I guess he's American because he plays video games right?

http://venturebeat.com/2012/01/23/kim-dotcom-falls-modernwarfare-3/

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

And that is a HUGE factor, because the parents want their kid to succeed. It is very unlikely that you will make enough money to sustain yourself in tennis. You have to be top 30 in the world to make a comfortable living (TonLars and various other people who have attempted to go pro have gone on record about this). Outside of that threshold, you're barely making more than your average blue collar worker.


For sports like football, basketball, baseball, etc. you can be riding the bench and still be making 6+ figures.

And pay for NONE of their travel minus food which is a negligible cost. The cost of travel is what can kill people. It still makes me laugh when football, baseball, and basketball players talk about their excessive travel. It doesn't seem to come close to Tennis in terms of stress or money.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

Indeed it does, however, the OP is correct in that American Tennis does not have many great athletes, because all the great athletes go to sports that pay more and have less risk. Roddick is a world class athlete in the sense that he would have likely made a great pitcher/quarterback by sheer virtue of his arm strength/shoulder flexibility/durability, but that's about it. His movement has always been sloppy, despite the fact that he has above average speed.

Agreed, although I can't see Roddick being a great quarterback due to the aforementioned "movement has always been sloppy."

 

[sargeinaz]

Not once did I say soccer doest take athletic talent. I just said that growing up playing soccer doesnt make you a better athlete.

 

[DRII]

I think some people are confusing good athlete with good mover. Not always the same thing.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

I think some people are confusing good athlete with good mover. Not always the same thing.

Could you elaborate a bit more please.

 

[celoft]

Yeah Murray's mum was such a pauper that she could afford to send him to an expensive Spanish academy for several years..

Still waiting for his first clay title.

 

[JRstriker12]

Sorry but there is no way in hell that all of these guys are incredibly athletic. Do you ever listen when roddick is clod hopping around the court you can hear his terrible footwork, or how about the over grown dork isner then last but not least there is fish, incredibly athletic you have got to be kidding.

Sorry, but there's no way have a clue of what your are talking about.

If you could be a non-athlete and win a Grand Slam like Roddick or break the ATP top 20 and beat Federer (considered one of the most graceful and athletic tennis players of all time) like Isner by being a non-athlete, then that's just a damning indictment of tennis as a sport.

You clearly have no idea of how athletic you have to be just to make it on tour.

 

[DRII]

Could you elaborate a bit more please.

I'm saying that a good athlete is not necessarily a good mover (Roddick, Berdych, perhaps Delpo), or a good mover not necessarily a good athlete (Davydenko sic, sometimes Murray).

Seems like the major criticism of the top Americans in this thread is their lack of movement skills (footwork and footspeed).

 

[tlm]

You claimed he wasnt a world class athlete because his feet stomp loudly when he runs. That's a pretty stupid reason to declare him not being an incredible athlete. Thats like me saying Nadal and the rest of Europe are not world class athletes because their measly serves dont reach 140+.

Also, if youre a great athlete in America, youre not going to waste your time with tennis. You're going to play basketball or football or baseball and make a lot more money. So the lack of "incredible athletes" in American tennis is not an indicator of anything. Do other countries say they have a lack of incredible athletes in basketball, baseball or swimming etc?

His foot stomping and slow movement are just one example, how about his 4.5 level backhand and volley's. I never said that he was totally non athletic, but to call him incredibly athletic is so far off it is hard to believe that anyone would even debate that.

Then you compare rafa who is obviously incredibly athletic, stating that because his serve is not that strong some could say that he is not that athletic. Well for one thing he is using his off arm for serving and even if he wasn't just because you can blast a big serve does not mean you are a great athlete.

As in roddick his serve is his only strong point, without that he probably would have been lucky to break the top 50. But a guy like rafa who is a incredible athlete can win 10 majors with a weak serve, now that proves how great of an athlete he is.

Now i will agree that most of the great American athletes do play other sports, that part you have right. Again that just proves my point again that most of the American tennis players are not incredible athletes, the great ones are playing other sports.

 

[tlm]

Sorry, but there's no way have a clue of what your are talking about.

If you could be a non-athlete and win a Grand Slam like Roddick or break the ATP top 20 and beat Federer (considered one of the most graceful and athletic tennis players of all time) like Isner by being a non-athlete, then that's just a damning indictment of tennis as a sport.

You clearly have no idea of how athletic you have to be just to make it on tour.

I never said that any of the American tennis players are non athletic, that is you exaggerating. I said that the top American players in recent years are not incredible athletes, there is a big difference from being non athletic and a super athlete.

 

[Limpinhitter]

I've been seriously following tennis for the past 5-6 years and am amazed by the increasing level of athleticism needed to be at the highest level (Top 30). The more and more I watch, the more convinced I am that the top American men are not natural athletes. If you compare the foot speed, agility, and flexibility of the Top players to Fish, Isner and Roddick it's not even close. Ryan Harrison and Donald Young are better athletes but no where near the levels needed to compete with the Djokovics, Nadals, Federers or Murrays. Players like Tsonga, Ferrer, Monfils, Dolgo, Del Potro are just a few of the other top players who are awesome athletes. I don't think that there are any current or up and coming American men who can compete athletically with them.

I know that Isner has been doing well lately but he is truly just a serve and forehand who has to rely on tiebreaks to win. Fish has had his moment in the sun and will not be able to repeat what he did last year. Roddick, God bless him, has gotten the most of his ability through hard work and has had a wonderful career but he would achieved more if he were blessed with natural athleticism.

That's because the best American athletes generally play in the NBA, NFL and MLB. Oh, and the PBA, of course.

 

[SLD76]

His foot stomping and slow movement are just one example, how about his 4.5 level backhand and volley's. I never said that he was totally non athletic, but to call him incredibly athletic is so far off it is hard to believe that anyone would even debate that.

Then you compare rafa who is obviously incredibly athletic, stating that because his serve is not that strong some could say that he is not that athletic. Well for one thing he is using his off arm for serving and even if he wasn't just because you can blast a big serve does not mean you are a great athlete.

As in roddick his serve is his only strong point, without that he probably would have been lucky to break the top 50. But a guy like rafa who is a incredible athlete can win 10 majors with a weak serve, now that proves how great of an athlete he is.

Now i will agree that most of the great American athletes do play other sports, that part you have right. Again that just proves my point again that most of the American tennis players are not incredible athletes, the great ones are playing other sports.

some people really need some damn perspective.

As if anyone could stay in the top 10 for so long with 4.5 strokes. Just because Roddick looks feeble compared to Rafa, Roger, Djoker and Murray doesnt mean he has no skill or ability.

Sheer ignorance.




As to the second bolded...as I said before, its not that the current american players are inferior athletes, they are inferior talents. Talent and athleticism are two different things. Sharapova and Davenport were not tremendously athletic compared to others, but they are extremely talented. James Blake is an incredible athlete, but not as talented as other players. My hypothesis is that there may be someone on a baseball or a football field right now that could be phenomenal at tennis, but chose the more accessible sport to play.

Case and point? Drew Breeze regularly beat Roddick as an amateur player.
He is now one of top quarterbacks in football and just set a record for yards thrown in a season. How would he have fared in tennis? We'll never know.

 

[SLD76]

I couldn't have said it better myself. That was exactly my point. It's not only about exposure but the cost. Right now, your parents pretty much have to be a doctor or lawyer or something to be able to get the best lessons. Well just as your post indicated, just because you can afford the lessons doesn't mean you are going to be a great tennis player. I think Roddick and Dent got the most of their talent but it's obviously going to take more than a big serve to win on the big stage and the current American tennis players just don't have it. The talent is here, we just have to be willing to accept the fact that it is not always in affluent areas. Once we get past that, you'll see the tide turn.

There is another aspect that I just considered today regarding attracting more young kids to the game early. I realize that tennis is at its heart, singular competition. I mean, its basically you vs your opponent. No team, no backup, no cooperation. That is very hard to translate to small children, so already tennis is at a disadvantage to other team based sports. The kids can have fun, joke around etc and most importantly not have the pressure on them that singles tennis imposes. These are the advantages that baskeball, football , baseball and soccer enjoy.

So, much as I was annoyed by their commercials during the USO and as silly as I think it is to lower the nets for kids, I give the USTA some credit for making the game kid friendly and at least getting them interested.