The Big3 WON matches and tournaments while being sick

L

Lauren_Girl'

Hall of Fame
Am I the only one feeling a little bothered by what happened to Sinner? It was a Masters final, the guy skipped the Canada Open, won all his Cincinnati matches in straight sets, had 2 days to rest between matches. He wasn't injured or even tired. Just sick. And he withdraws after hardly 15 minutes. Didn't even let Alcaraz finish this first set to avoid the bagel.
Sure it was hot but not THAT hot. 31 according to the informations given by the ATP.
I watched a 36 years old guy winning Cincinnati and the US Open 2 years ago, in much much hotter conditions. 38 degrees when Alcaraz/Djokovic started (even warmer for the WTA final between Muchova and Gauff). The grandpa won this final agains the world number #1 in 3h50, with a very high intensity. 3 weeks later he trashed Fritz, Shelton and Medvedev with over 35 degrees.
I watched this same guy winning Masters tournaments with flu and high fever. Paris-Bercy 2019 comes to my mind, he was sick the whole week and won anyway.
There are plenty of examples with Nadal and Federer as well. Nadal won one his Roland Garros semifinals with Gastroenteritis. He beat Shapovalov and Berrettini in Australia with severe sickness.
Federer literally never withdrew in his career in the middle of a match. No matter how unwell he was.
Why can't Sinner overcome this kind of sickness and try harder? He is 24, in his PRIME, world number #1. Definitely no injury. Had more than enough time to rest between his matches. There is no valid excuse to pull out so early in the match.
Zverev and Shelton look even more embarrassing than Sinner because they weren't even sick. They're in their 20s and unable to overcome hard conditions. Zverev could hardly move at the end of his SF. Shelton tanked the match and didn't even try.
I see so many people blaming the ATP and feeling sorry for the players (and I don't really disagree) but you have to admit none of these guys should be in a discussion with the Big 3. Prime Big 3 would never withdraw in a big final after 15 minutes just because they're sick. They were fighting until the end unless they were seriously injured.
 
Your points are 100% valid, but Sinner plays to win USO. It was very smart to just stop, but he should have done so before starting.

This way he has best odds to recover for USO, Alcaraz benefits as well, but not as satisfied.
 
Needeth I remind you?

2011

Dumspter fire Cincinatti

Randy Murray vs. Norvak Djokovic

Finals

Eastern European medicine isn't kicking in for Djokovic and he retires 3 games into the second set.

_54728319_54728318.jpg.webp



ALSO: Take a guess who won the 2011 Mens Singles US Open.

Clue: It wasn't ole Ran Murray.
 
indyfob2008 said:
We will never see anyone top what Sampras did down in Melbourne, throwing up on the court, and coming back to win...
Click to expand...
What about Tsitsipas going to clear his colon for 10 minutes and then coming back to beat Randolph Murray at the US Open?

Stuff legends are made of.
 
Cramerica said:
Needeth I remind you?

2011

Dumspter fire Cincinatti

Randy Murray vs. Norvak Djokovic

Finals

Eastern European medicine isn't kicking in for Djokovic and he retires 3 games into the second set.

_54728319_54728318.jpg.webp



ALSO: Take a guess who won the 2011 Mens Singles US Open.

Clue: It wasn't ole Ran Murray.
Click to expand...


I knew this was gonna come upp....
BIG DIFFERENCE is, Djokovic was INJURED. In the shoulder and the elbow. Same injuries that bothered him later in Basel Paris and London. He called MTO in his 2 previous matches in that tournament (vs Monfils and Berdych). Could hardly serve by the end of the 1st set of the final.

Sinner wasn't injured at all.

And Djokovic withdrew in the middle of the 2nd set, after 1h15 of play. Sinner didn't even finish the 1st set. 15 minutes and he left.

Apples and oranges but thank you.
 
Lauren_Girl' said:
I knew this was gonna come upp....
BIG DIFFERENCE is, Djokovic was INJURED. In the shoulder and the elbow. Same injuries that bothered him later in Basel Paris and London. He called MTO in his 2 previous matches in that tournament (vs Monfils and Berdych). Could hardly serve by the end of the 1st set of the final.

Sinner wasn't injured at all.

And Djokovic withdrew in the middle of the 2nd set, after 1h15 of play. Sinner didn't even finish the 1st set. 15 minutes and he left.

Apples and oranges but thank you.
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Sure they're the same. If you can't play because you're about to shoot black tar out your behind and barf out yesterday's lunch, how's that any different htan having a bum elbow? Either way you can't physically go on.
 
Cramerica said:
Sure they're the same. If you can't play because you're about to shoot black tar out your behind and barf out yesterday's lunch, how's that any different htan having a bum elbow? Either way you can't physically go on.
Click to expand...

Sure you can. Like I said in my OP. Djokovic, Nadal and Federer literally WON TOURNAMENTS while sick. And more than once.
Djokovic won 5 consecutive matchs in Paris-Bercy with flu. In 2024 he got to the 1/2 of the Australian Open while sick the whole tournament.
Nadal beat Berrettini and Shapovalov in Australia while totally sick and half dead on the court.
That's what separates ATG from other players.

Withdrawing because you're injured and don't want to make the injury worse is a completely different context. I would never blame an injured player for retiring in the middle of a match. But retiring because of Flu/fever is more questionable specially when you're 24 in your prime like Sinner.
 
Lauren_Girl' said:
Sure you can. Like I said in my OP. Djokovic, Nadal and Federer literally WON TOURNAMENTS while sick. And more than once.
Djokovic won 5 consecutive matchs in Paris-Bercy with flu. In 2024 he got to the 1/2 of the Australian Open while sick the whole tournament.
Nadal beat Berrettini and Shapovalov in Australia while totally sick and half dead on the court.
That's what separates ATG from other players.

Withdrawing because you're injured and don't want to make the injury worse is a completely different context. I would never blame an injured player for retiring in the middle of a match. But retiring because of Flu/fever is more questionable specially when you're 24 in your prime like Sinner.
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First, those guys did pull out of matches due to tummy aches (well maybe not Federer). Case in point, I'll take Nadal: he pulled out Abu Dhabi in like 2012 due to a tummy virus. He's also withdrew from Qatar and the Australian Open in 2013 with stomach bugs. These guys are traveling all the time, they're going to eat bad food from time to time.

If anything, Sinner shouldn't have even played at all in the final round of Cincinnatti. He had the US Open to prepare for and if he's sick, then he shouldn't take chances.
 
Everyone (except Federer) has withdrawn from matches due to illness and often they gave a walkover if they were really sick - Djokovic was infamous for it when he was young. I suspect OP doesn’t play tennis and has no idea of how draining it can be to play competitive tennis if you are sick with a fever. You can’t move properly or get your normal racquet head speed when you feel drained of energy. I give Sinner credit for trying to play instead of giving a walkover as it was probably clear before the match that he was not in the health required to beat Alcaraz. Obviously only Sinner and his doctor know how sick he was - you can play through mild symptoms, but not an illness that saps all your energy.
 
Sinner had a fever on 38C (100.5 Fahrenheit) sunday evening and was feeling worse on monday.

I agree he should have pulled out before start, but sometimes you dont know exactly how the body will respond to physical activity. There have certainly been times when im a little sick, and dont feel that bad when i rest. Then i go to the gym and just have to go back to bed after 5-10 mins. Sinner also had the heat to deal with on top of it.

Federer should have pulled out sometimes. I remember he was injured vs Raonic W2016, he didnt play for the rest of the season. Now im not saying he would heal faster if he retired, but there is definetly a chance that the injury gets more severe if you keep on playing.
 
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Jonas78 said:
Sinner had a fever on 38C (100.5 Fahrenheit) sunday evening and was feeling worse on monday.

I agree he should have pulled out before start, but sometimes you dont know exactly how the body will respond to physical activity. There have certainly been times when im a little sick, and dont feel that bad when i rest. Then i go to the gym and just have to go back to bed after 5-10 mins. Sinner also had the heat to deal with on top of it.

Federer should have pulled out sometimes. I remember he was injured vs Raonic W2016, he didnt play for the rest of the season. Now im not saying he would heal faster if he retired, but there is definetly a chance that the injury gets more severe if you keep on playing.
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Stop with the revisionist history. Federer finished the match and walked off under his own power. Federer didn’t return for the rest of the season because he came back too soon after having knee surgery that year. He used the rest of year to properly rehab from that knee surgery.
 
TennisXpert@2023 said:
Stop with the revisionist history. Federer finished the match and walked off under his own power. Federer didn’t return for the rest of the season because he came back too soon after having knee surgery that year. He used the rest of year to properly rehab from that knee surgery.
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I dont see how this disproves my point. If you are injured, then playing on might make an injury more severe. Thats all. Federer made this a principle, i dont know if it was smart though.
 
Lauren_Girl' said:
I knew this was gonna come upp....
BIG DIFFERENCE is, Djokovic was INJURED. In the shoulder and the elbow. Same injuries that bothered him later in Basel Paris and London. He called MTO in his 2 previous matches in that tournament (vs Monfils and Berdych). Could hardly serve by the end of the 1st set of the final.

Sinner wasn't injured at all.

And Djokovic withdrew in the middle of the 2nd set, after 1h15 of play. Sinner didn't even finish the 1st set. 15 minutes and he left.

Apples and oranges but thank you.
Click to expand...
piczs.jpg
 
Jonas78 said:
I dont see how this disproves my point. If you are injured, then playing on might make an injury more severe. Thats all. Federer made this a principle, i dont know if it was smart though.
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He was not injured in that particular match. Federer didn’t feel the need to retire from the match. Him retiring from the match wouldn’t have prolonged his career because he had more knee surgeries due to just the amount of tennis played.
 
TennisXpert@2023 said:
He was not injured in that particular match. Federer didn’t feel the need to retire from the match. Him retiring from the match wouldn’t have prolonged his career because he had more knee surgeries due to just the amount of tennis played.
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Did you watch it? He was leading 2-1 in sets and was 40-0 on serve in the 4th set, when he suddenly couldn't move well. He got broken leading 40-0 on grass vs a player with no return game, and after that he was done. Yes he was reinjured during that match, and it was a very clear moment during the match it happened. You think he would beat Cilic in 5 sets 2 days earlier if he was injured?

Federer never retired, ofc that doesnt mean he never was injured. He played many matches with injuries but was too stubborn to retire.
 
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Jonas78 said:
Did you watch it? He was leading 2-1 in sets and was 40-0 on serve in the 4th set, when he suddenly couldn't move well. He got broken leading 40-0 on grass vs a player with no return game, and after that he was done. Yes he was reinjured during that match, and it was a very clear moment during the match it happened. You think he would beat Cilic in 5 sets 2 days earlier if he was injured?

Federer never retired, ofc that doesnt mean he never was injured. He played many matches with injuries but was too stubborn to retire.
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Federer not retiring in a match at the drop of a hat has nothing to do with being stubborn, its called being professional.
 
Cramerica said:
What about Tsitsipas going to clear his colon for 10 minutes and then coming back to beat Randolph Murray at the US Open?

Stuff legends are made of.
Click to expand...
I am giving Ttsiti a pass on this.

I timed how long it takes to strip off my clothes, put on fresh underwear and socks. Shirt. Shorts. Tie my shoes.

Fresh wrist band. Tie my bandana, and carefully study the result in the locker room mirror to make sure my hair still looks like tennis Jesus.

10 minutes.
 
Fed likely won Estoril 2008 while recovering from mono. Don’t know if he still actually had the illness by then but doubtless he was in the recovery phase. His training was completely screwed in those early months of 2008.
 
Third Serve said:
Fed likely won Estoril 2008 while recovering from mono. Don’t know if he still actually had the illness by then but doubtless he was in the recovery phase. His training was completely screwed in those early months of 2008.
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But he didn’t retire from any match to save face. When a player went into a match against Federer, they either won or lost, no gift retirement.
 
He did the right thing, tried to give it a go and he lost 5 games in 20 minutes so he obviously wasn't up to it and decided to retire. Maybe if he hadn't tried at all the criticisim would be fine but he did.


TearTheRoofOff said:
Fed was obviously a total chad for this, though I'm sure he'd have had to retire if he badly rolled his ankle or something; luckily he never did - perhaps a testament to the old codger's footwork, balance etc.
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I think he probably should have retired against Sandgren or Djokovic at AO 2020.
 
The Big 3 were built differently. They didn't whine or complain they got on with it. Federer got to the Quarter finals of Wimbledon in 2021 basically with hampered movement given his knee issues got to the point where retirement was looming, Nadal won slams with knee issues (I remember his knee tendonitis years ago) and his foot issues, Djokovic won slams with shoulder issues and tears in his thigh and abdominal muscles.
 
Zardoz7/12 said:
The Big 3 were built differently. They didn't whine or complain they got on with it. Federer got to the Quarter finals of Wimbledon in 2021 basically with hampered movement given his knee issues got to the point where retirement was looming, Nadal won slams with knee issues (I remember his knee tendonitis years ago) and his foot issues, Djokovic won slams with shoulder issues and tears in his thigh and abdominal muscles.
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I agree they were all warriors compared to Sinner but we do Federer a disservice to put him in the same category with the other two.
 
I am sorry, Op should see history of Djokovic retirements from 2007-2010

Am I right they started watching from 2011 ??
 
ND-13 said:
I am sorry, Op should see history of Djokovic retirements from 2007-2010

Am I right they started watching from 2011 ??
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You are correct.

I've already disproved the OP's theory by citing a number of specific examples, which is why OP has now disappeared and likely now dances on OnlyFans with shame.
 
objection_ said:

ASAP Sports Transcripts - Tennis - 2020 - AUSTRALIAN OPEN - January 30 - Roger Federer

ASAPSports FastScripts, a system using state-of-the-art technology created to produce verbatim FastScripts of press conferences and player/team interviews at sporting events around the globe.
www.asapsports.com
Rog says he thinks he had a good chance of playing the semi, only gave himself a 3% chance to win.
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It's amazing that Federer beat Millman and Sandgren at the 2020 Australian Open. Millman (who had previously beaten Federer at the 2018 US Open) was 8-4 up in the fifth set champions' tiebreak, 2 points from victory, only for Federer to win 6 points in a row to win the match. Sandgren had 7 match points to beat Federer and failed.
 
Mustard said:
It's amazing that Federer beat Millman and Sandgren at the 2020 Australian Open. Millman (who had previously beaten Federer at the 2018 US Open) was 8-4 up in the fifth set champions' tiebreak, 2 points from victory, only for Federer to win 6 points in a row to win the match. Sandgren had 7 match points to beat Federer and failed.
Click to expand...
The humidity in the 2018 US open match was absurd. IIRC it was another choke where Fed blew set points in the 2nd. He looked like he couldn't wait to get off the court.
 
Mustard said:
It's amazing that Federer beat Millman and Sandgren at the 2020 Australian Open. Millman (who had previously beaten Federer at the 2018 US Open) was 8-4 up in the fifth set champions' tiebreak, 2 points from victory, only for Federer to win 6 points in a row to win the match. Sandgren had 7 match points to beat Federer and failed.
Click to expand...
What was so amazing about Federer not quitting in a match because he was down?
 
objection_ said:

ASAP Sports Transcripts - Tennis - 2020 - AUSTRALIAN OPEN - January 30 - Roger Federer

ASAPSports FastScripts, a system using state-of-the-art technology created to produce verbatim FastScripts of press conferences and player/team interviews at sporting events around the globe.
www.asapsports.com
Rog says he thinks he had a good chance of playing the semi, only gave himself a 3% chance to win.
Click to expand...
Thanks for this. I remembered this interview as Fed saying he believed he would be fine but knew there was a chance he wouldn't be and, if so, it would have been his first retirement. This is not quite what he said, so thanks for the clarification.
 
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