THE final: [3] Nadal vs [4] Thiem - Barcelona Open 2017

Who will prevail?


  • Total voters
    68
  • Poll closed .
All credit for Nadal this year goes to Carlos Moya. He is hitting with more ambition and following through the ball much more this year. Thiem is probably the 3rd best clay court player in the world right now and he dismantled him with ease.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Rafa building confidence like this he will maybe do well later on non clay too

Well, he's already been in 2 big hardcourt finals, AO and Miami and only got stopped by goating Fed. Will be interesting to see if his grasscourt game will finally take off again (he's playing the Queens-Wimby double again this year).
 

Mr Feeny

Hall of Fame
Rafa building confidence like this he will maybe do well later on non clay too

Not if he runs into Federer. Then again, he's gotten spanked everytime during recent memory on grass, losing to people ranked outside the top 100 and nobodies. If his confidence is enough to get him through the first 3 rounds, that's something.

It's a different task all together to run into the big dogs. Kyrgios, Novak, Federer, and Andy would paste him at Wimbledon.
 

ruerooo

Legend
Tbf has anyone called him the future of tennis? He's not better than Krygios or Zverev. He's older than both. Mentally weaker than both.

Who would suggest that he's the future of tennis?


People who are jonesing on the NextGenners usually define "the future of X surface" as "the one who can dethrone the current King".

I personally would broaden my definition -- I'd say DT is probably one of the best NextGenners on this surface, but he's still going to have to go some to beat Rafa, for cripes' sake (like, IDK what these people are expecting; if you're up against Rafa in good form in a clay final on his home court that's named after him, you should kind of expect a beatdown, no? Or at least a masterclass) -- but that's just me.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Not if he runs into Federer. Then again, he's gotten spanked everytime during recent memory on grass, losing to people ranked outside the top 100 and nobodies. If his confidence is enough to get him through the first 3 rounds, that's something.

It's a different task all together to run into the big dogs. Kyrgios, Novak, Federer, and Andy would paste him at Wimbledon.

Grass... was more thinking HC. Grass season is a quick thing and don't expect a lot from him. But never know.
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
You know, that clay sweep might be possible for Nadal. Thiem was supposed to be one of his strongest challengers and he got brutally rekt.

Who said that? It's a sad state of affairs when Thiem is supposed to be one of Nadal's strongest challengers on clay.

Right now the truth is that Nadal has no challengers on clay and the only guy that is ever going to be a serious challenge for him on clay this year is Djokovic if he can get his head out of his ass (or Stanimal if he shows up at RG), but that's a big if and even that might not be enough. As you say Nadal is wrecking the field on clay right now. It's not surprising either.
 
2

2HBH-DTL

Guest
Everyone's in awe for the 10 titles in MC and now 10 in Barcelona. Beating all mugs the way whole way, no?
 

Mr Feeny

Hall of Fame
People who are jonesing on the NextGenners usually define "the future of X surface" as "the one who can dethrone the current King".

I personally would broaden my definition -- I'd say DT is probably one of the best NextGenners on this surface, but he's still going to have to go some to beat Rafa, for cripes' sake (like, IDK what these people are expecting; if you're up against Rafa in good form in a clay final on his home court that's named after him, you should kind of expect a beatdown, no? Or at least a masterclass) -- but that's just me.

Ah. I thought he was talking about who is expected to dominate tennis. I would have thought either Kyrgios or Zverev. Thiem is a better clay player than either but clay is only 1 surface and hardly as important as Hardcourts to who'll be gunning for world number 1, given that hardcourts dominate the ATP schedule.

Let's wait and see. Even Dimitrov and Raonic looked all but set to take the next step after 2014, and it never happened. I'm almost wary of being into the hype with any of these youngsters. The most incompetent, gutless, mentally fragile, useless generation in tennis history.

I don't even know if I've seen something similar to this in any other sport, where the younger generation players at their physical peaks are just useless and can't beat the older ones. In European football, this is never the case. Lots of talented and dominant 18-22 year olds. In NBA, they're already dominating at the ages of 20-21.
I've never seen a situation like this before. Anywhere. In any sport.
 

mightyrick

Legend
I thought Thiem was great on clay ??????? what happened here with breadstick on 2nd set ???

Thiem is "good", but not great on clay (yet). Rather, is game is well-suited to clay. Pretty big serve. High-spin groundstrokes on both sides. High net clearance on all his shots. Great movement. Plays comfortably from behind the baseline. One-handed backhand allows him to create extreme cross-court angles on the backhand side to pull his opponents off court.

He is like a young Wawrinka in many aspects. He just needs to develop (almost) the exact same aspects of his game that Wawrinka had to develop.

I think the big things Thiem needs to develop are:

1) He must learn to position himself aggressively ON the baseline and take the ball early on both sides -- in order to take time away from his opponents. To me, this was what brought Wawrinka's game to a totally different level.

2) He needs to practice the footwork necessary to make his game more high-percentage. Namely, sliding. Thiem is VERY fast, but he always ends up taking an extra step on many of his shots -- instead of sliding into them. It causes him to mis-hit and shank balls.

3) More patience and better shot selection.

If he solves #1, I think he can win MS1000s. If he solves #2 and #3, I think he can win slams.
 

ruerooo

Legend
I believe it's referred to as HC. Many will disagree though.

Yeah - I wasn't taking issue with anyone's identification of the surface. I was just saying that if a player is better on one surface than another, his (or her) BP conversion rate is likely also going to be better on the surface on which s/he is better as well.

:)
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
Words of wisdom for today. Most of us thought so as well. Well, you see, I even added "an epic TB" option to the poll! :oops:

But to be fair, it's Thiem fault that he didn't try his best and denied us a great match.
who is 'us'?
i can guess as to the subgroup, but would rather you tell me.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
Thiem to get the taste of meeting Rafa in a clay final, like Federer and Novak very well know how it feels. Its just so hard.

Please don't compare Thiem to Federer and Djokovic because it's an insult to Federer and Djokovic.
Federer at close to age 36 could go to the FO tomorrow without any clay practice and do a much better job vs Nadal. Djokovic who has been a shadow of his former self for a year could do the same. Thiem isn't in the same galaxy as players like Federer and Djokovic and I've got news for you, he never will be.

I honestly don't know what some posters are seeing when they see a player like Thiem play. He's not a favorite to win the FO. I wouldn't even classify him as a dark horse.There's nothing remarkable about Thiem other than the fact that he's a top ten player in a very weak field. The only reason he barely beat Murray the other day is because Murray is playing like crap at the moment and clay is Murray's weakest surface. The fact that some posters were thinking or more realistically hoping Thiem would beat Nadal in this form on clay is a sick joke. Do people actually watch these players or do they wear a blindfold when they have these matches on?
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Please don't compare Thiem to Federer and Djokovic because it's an insult to Federer and Djokovic.
Federer at close to age 36 could go to the FO tomorrow without any clay practice and do a much better job vs Nadal. Djokovic who has been a shadow of his former self for a year could do the same. Thiem isn't in the same galaxy as players like Federer and Djokovic and I've got news for you, he never will be.

I honestly don't know what some posters are seeing when they see a player like Thiem play. He's not a favorite to win the FO. I wouldn't even classify him as a dark horse.There's nothing remarkable about Thiem other than the fact that he's a top ten player in a very weak field. The only reason he barely beat Murray the other day is because Murray is playing like crap at the moment and clay is Murray's weakest surface. The fact that some posters were thinking or more realistically hoping Thiem would beat Nadal in this form on clay is a sick joke. Do people actually watch these players or do they wear a blindfold when they have these matches on?

I didn't compare them as players, but the feeling of meeting Rafa on clay. Chill out.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
I didn't compare them as players, but the feeling of meeting Rafa on clay. Chill out.

But I'm saying it's not the same at all as Djokovic or Federer facing Nadal on clay and wouldn't be the same feeling because Thiem doesn't have their games and more importantly doesn't have their champion's mentality. As I said, Federer could step out on RG tomorrow and be a much bigger challenge vs Nadal than Thiem. Thiem is in the top ten only because the field is a disaster below the Big Four players and guys like Tsonga, Berdych and Ferrer are aging. Thiem is basically filler in the top ten.
 
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