The Greatest Songs of the 20th Century

For whatever it's worth, my personal greatest songs list. Only English and only songs, no instrumentals.

1. King Crimson - Starless
2. Jeff Buckley - Grace
3. Radiohead - Present Tense
4. Stevie Wonder - Visions
5. Fiona Apple - Paper Bag
6. Marillion - Script for a Jester's Tear
7. Alice in Chains - Rooster
8. Lianne La Havas - Courage
9. Beatles - Because
10. Steely Dan - Home At Last
 
10. Steely Dan - Home At Last
One of my favourite Steely Dan tracks. Gotta love that Purdie shuffle

Back to rock guitar solos, my favourite is probably the outro to Bold as Love by Hendrix. For me, it's definitely one of the greatest musical moments of the 20th century. I couldn't actually find the track on youtube, sadly.

I don't know if I would call either of these among the greatest songs of the twentieth century, but they also give me goose bumps:

And here's one of the greatest live tracks I've had the chance to see (it says 2002 in the video, but the album from which this track comes is from 1999... so I think it counts):
Edit: I changed this last vid to the full track instead of the first half of the song
 
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I once read that you tend to listen to the same music you grew up with. In essence, you like to go back to the songs you've heard until you are around 30. Perhaps this is true. I don't know if I will ever have the zeal to study about an all new genre of music, try to discover obscure albums, recordings and the sort. My personal greatest will therefore probably stem from the songs I have heard in the past. In other words, I may hear a great piece of music, might appreciate it wholeheartedly, but will it be in my personal list of greatest, played in repeat mode when I am 60 if I first heard it at only 50?
 
One of my favourite Steely Dan tracks. Gotta love that Purdie shuffle

Back to rock guitar solos, my favourite is probably the outro to Bold as Love by Hendrix. For me, it's definitely one of the greatest musical moments of the 20th century. I couldn't actually find the track on youtube, sadly.

I don't know if I would call either of these among the greatest songs of the twentieth century, but they also give me goose bumps:

And here's one of the greatest live tracks I've had the chance to see (it says 2002 in the video, but the album from which this track comes is from 1999... so I think it counts):
Edit: I changed this last vid to the full track instead of the first half of the song

Thanks, I have seen that video about the Purdie shuffle. I figured you might have given you shared an Adam Neely vid in the earlier post, hehe. The full classic albums documentary on Aja is also a brilliant watch. Purdie was the hidden gem of Steely Dan. Carlton makes Kid Charlemagne with his incredible solo but so does Purdie driving the song with his amazing groove. Like Martin Barre in Tull, he is so quietly effective that his contribution gets obscured a bit. Albeit he was not a full fledged member of the band...
 
For whatever it's worth, my personal greatest songs list. Only English and only songs, no instrumentals.

1. King Crimson - Starless
2. Jeff Buckley - Grace
3. Radiohead - Present Tense
4. Stevie Wonder - Visions
5. Fiona Apple - Paper Bag
6. Marillion - Script for a Jester's Tear
7. Alice in Chains - Rooster
8. Lianne La Havas - Courage
9. Beatles - Because
10. Steely Dan - Home At Last
I know only 2 in your list!
 
I once read that you tend to listen to the same music you grew up with. In essence, you like to go back to the songs you've heard until you are around 30. Perhaps this is true. I don't know if I will ever have the zeal to study about an all new genre of music, try to discover obscure albums, recordings and the sort. My personal greatest will therefore probably stem from the songs I have heard in the past. In other words, I may hear a great piece of music, might appreciate it wholeheartedly, but will it be in my personal list of greatest, played in repeat mode when I am 60 if I first heard it at only 50?
This is an interesting topic. Now...I did 'discover' hip hop only in the last couple of years or so which would appear to break that rule. But then, in another way, I had already been introduced to hip hop in a way via Pettai Rap. I just had to get to listen to the kind of hip hop I would like. I think by your thirties, your preferences do get well sorted. The other thing is it has become insanely easy to discover music via the internet. So...I honestly don't think there are too many Western genres I have left out at this point. If I don't listen to some, it's because I have decided there isn't much in it for me. Now...maybe there are fertile lands awaiting me in worlds like Oriental or Chinese music, I don't know. If I knew where to look, I would bite.
 
This is an interesting topic. Now...I did 'discover' hip hop only in the last couple of years or so which would appear to break that rule. But then, in another way, I had already been introduced to hip hop in a way via Pettai Rap. I just had to get to listen to the kind of hip hop I would like. I think by your thirties, your preferences do get well sorted. The other thing is it has become insanely easy to discover music via the internet. So...I honestly don't think there are too many Western genres I have left out at this point. If I don't listen to some, it's because I have decided there isn't much in it for me. Now...maybe there are fertile lands awaiting me in worlds like Oriental or Chinese music, I don't know. If I knew where to look, I would bite.
Indeed! People who are passionate about music will find avenues to discover and learn but as the saying goes, exception proves the rule. I am not referring to a temporary catchy phase of listening to a genre, mind you. I am talking about revisits. You will probably revisit time and again, the music you've heard in your first couple or three decades of your life. Or at least, that is what I read!
 
For whatever it's worth, my personal greatest songs list. Only English and only songs, no instrumentals.

1. King Crimson - Starless
2. Jeff Buckley - Grace
3. Radiohead - Present Tense
4. Stevie Wonder - Visions
5. Fiona Apple - Paper Bag
6. Marillion - Script for a Jester's Tear
7. Alice in Chains - Rooster
8. Lianne La Havas - Courage
9. Beatles - Because
10. Steely Dan - Home At Last
3 & 8 are from this century 8-B
 
This is an interesting topic. Now...I did 'discover' hip hop only in the last couple of years or so which would appear to break that rule. But then, in another way, I had already been introduced to hip hop in a way via Pettai Rap. I just had to get to listen to the kind of hip hop I would like. I think by your thirties, your preferences do get well sorted. The other thing is it has become insanely easy to discover music via the internet. So...I honestly don't think there are too many Western genres I have left out at this point. If I don't listen to some, it's because I have decided there isn't much in it for me. Now...maybe there are fertile lands awaiting me in worlds like Oriental or Chinese music, I don't know. If I knew where to look, I would bite.
Here's a similar article

https://www.businessinsider.in/thel...ns-why-this-could-be/articleshow/64494143.cms
 
Indeed! People who are passionate about music will find avenues to discover and learn but as the saying goes, exception proves the rule. I am not referring to a temporary catchy phase of listening to a genre, mind you. I am talking about revisits. You will probably revisit time and again, the music you've heard in your first couple or three decades of your life. Or at least, that is what I read!
idk, works differently for different people. I tend to listen over and over to the big new 'discovery' of the year. So, Lianne La Havas' s/t took up a lot of my time this year. In 2016, it was Radiohead's Moon Shaped Pool.

It depends also how you listen to music. My cousin once said she matches music to her mood and would not like to listen to sad music when she's happy and also that she thinks about how the music reflects on her personality. I said a great sad song makes me happy :D to have heard it and I definitely don't attempt to relate the music to my personality. Anything goes as long as I like it. Basically, I am more of a nerd so I don't necessarily use music to associate it with old memories. I do revisit songs I had heard years before but that's just because I like them.
 
I also don't think this is necessarily about exceptions. I am among the younger members of progarchives.com and all these folks in their 50s and 60s still keep tracking down new albums. And they track them down in piles and piles. It's like they listen to music all day, lol. I just think us musophiles are a small minority of the absolute population and therefore never get interviewed by whoever does these surveys.
 
idk, works differently for different people. I tend to listen over and over to the big new 'discovery' of the year. So, Lianne La Havas' s/t took up a lot of my time this year. In 2016, it was Radiohead's Moon Shaped Pool.

It depends also how you listen to music. My cousin once said she matches music to her mood and would not like to listen to sad music when she's happy and also that she thinks about how the music reflects on her personality. I said a great sad song makes me happy :D to have heard it and I definitely don't attempt to relate the music to my personality. Anything goes as long as I like it. Basically, I am more of a nerd so I don't necessarily use music to associate it with old memories. I do revisit songs I had heard years before but that's just because I like them.
Am I your cousin? :) that's definitely me too. I tend to listen to music that matches my mood and also time of the day. Is it any surprise, therefore that there are ragas specifically dedicated to mornings, evenings etc?

I also don't think this is necessarily about exceptions. I am among the younger members of progarchives.com and all these folks in their 50s and 60s still keep tracking down new albums. And they track them down in piles and piles. It's like they listen to music all day, lol. I just think us musophiles are a small minority of the absolute population and therefore never get interviewed by whoever does these surveys.
Yep - small minority indeed. I don't know if I would dedicate hours suddenly discovering and trying to listen to as much as I can, say, hip hop. Mostly, will not but I would not mind discovering a new sufi artist and listening to him/her all day. Hip Hop is just too removed from my tastes.
 
Am I your cousin? :) that's definitely me too. I tend to listen to music that matches my mood and also time of the day. Is it any surprise, therefore that there are ragas specifically dedicated to mornings, evenings etc?


Yep - small minority indeed. I don't know if I would dedicate hours suddenly discovering and trying to listen to as much as I can, say, hip hop. Mostly, will not but I would not mind discovering a new sufi artist and listening to him/her all day. Hip Hop is just too removed from my tastes.
Eye guess SourFresh will now abandon Hiz planz two beecum MC Hammereshs. Eye will give hymn the bad noose.
 
This is an interesting topic. Now...I did 'discover' hip hop only in the last couple of years or so which would appear to break that rule. But then, in another way, I had already been introduced to hip hop in a way via Pettai Rap. I just had to get to listen to the kind of hip hop I would like. I think by your thirties, your preferences do get well sorted. The other thing is it has become insanely easy to discover music via the internet. So...I honestly don't think there are too many Western genres I have left out at this point. If I don't listen to some, it's because I have decided there isn't much in it for me. Now...maybe there are fertile lands awaiting me in worlds like Oriental or Chinese music, I don't know. If I knew where to look, I would bite.
Yep - small minority indeed. I don't know if I would dedicate hours suddenly discovering and trying to listen to as much as I can, say, hip hop. Mostly, will not but I would not mind discovering a new sufi artist and listening to him/her all day. Hip Hop is just too removed from my tastes.

I think the secret to gaining access to different genres of music is to find a starting point that bridges two styles. For instance, if you like country music and want to learn about jazz, you could look into some great Nashville musicians like Chet Atkins, Jerry Douglas, Bélà Fleck, Allison Kraus, and move into their specific catalogue and approach that. Once you've absorbed some of the jazz vocabulary from listening to those artists, then it's possible to move around in jazz more easily. I wouldn't recommend Steve Coleman's Rhythm People to a country fan looking to get into jazz, there's no way that will stick.

Honestly, I think jazz by itself is just wide enough to bridge just about any genre with enough determination. Rock to Hiphop? Get into fusion, and make your way towards the hiphop genre. EDM to country? Start with nujazz, and make your way in. It's kinda like the Kevin Bacon of music.

Having said that, I have a hard time enjoying lots of hiphop, mostly because of the aesthetics of many of the big recordings. I hate the booming synth bass and trap hihat sound, and it's hard for me to get over that hurdle. Get rappers in front of a jazz band, and I really enjoy it:
 
Am I your cousin? :) that's definitely me too. I tend to listen to music that matches my mood and also time of the day. Is it any surprise, therefore that there are ragas specifically dedicated to mornings, evenings etc?
I am mostly in the Raja school of looking at this, "Kaalaiyil paaduvathu kaalaiyin ragam, maalayil paaduvathu maalaiyin ragam ".
 

Most people I know became quite obdurate as they got older. For me it's nonsense, however.

I also doubt this supposed phenomenon will last very long, due to the changing nature of exposure of musics in breadth and the exponential diversity of their intertextual networks, in their continually diversifying combination with other arts and leisure. This then harvests 'nostalgia' through association and also expands the range of musically resonant inference due to the nearness of commonalities which 'bridge styles'. The ledger of forms only grows and their mixing in a variety of contexts only escalates in experience. This leads to a quite different formation of expectation during the years of the supposed plasticity and amenability for judgment and taste, from when one is young to the OAP age of 30 or whatever. Thus, I'm supposing that the coming generations will have as a fixed 'state' a mode of change, flux, stylistic elision, rather than a stable formation which is narrower in scope and too distant from so many other styles to compel through a sort of receptive inference.
 
Indeed! People who are passionate about music will find avenues to discover and learn but as the saying goes, exception proves the rule. I am not referring to a temporary catchy phase of listening to a genre, mind you. I am talking about revisits. You will probably revisit time and again, the music you've heard in your first couple or three decades of your life. Or at least, that is what I read!
The music that I listened to in my teens through early thirties still resonate the most strongly with me. The Clash and other punk bands were the first to grab my emotions when I was in high school in the early 1980s, followed by New Wave, alternative bands, and classic 60s & 70s rock in college, then bands like Nirvana and Oasis. That's around the time my tastes seems to have been defined, though I have kept exploring new bands and genres. I have been subsequently exploring more blues, jazz and classical which are emotionally powerful, but evocative in a different way.
Why Do We Even Listen to New Music?
Our brains reward us for seeking out what we already know. So why should we reach to listen to something we don’t?
By Jeremy D. Larson
April 6, 2020


Why do we even listen to new music anymore? Most people have all the songs they could ever need by the time they turn 30. Spotify, Apple Music, and YouTube can whisk us back to the gates and gables of our youth when life was simpler. Why leap off a cliff hoping you’ll be rescued by your new favorite album on the way down when you can lay supine on the terra firma of your “Summer Rewind” playlist? Not just in times of great stress, but for all times, I genuinely ask: Why spend time on something you might not like?

It was a question that Coco Chanel, Marcel Duchamp, and the rest of the Parisian audience might have asked at the 1913 premiere of Igor Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring, an orchestral ballet inspired by the Russian composer’s dream about a young girl dancing herself to death. On a muggy night at the end of May, inside a newly constructed theater along the Seine, those who chose to bear witness to something new experienced a piece of music that would presage a new world of art.

Stravinsky, having already thrilled Paris with his ferociously complex Firebird ballet three years earlier, was the bright young thing of symphonic music in Paris, and The Rite was to be something essentially unheard of. Drawing from the Slavic and Lithuanian folk music of his homeland and his viscerally atavistic brain, Stravinsky blackened his score with rhythmic and harmonic tension, stretching phrases to their outer limits and never bothering to resolve them. The harmonies were difficult to name and his rhythms impossible to follow. Leonard Bernstein later described The Rite as “the best dissonances anyone ever thought up, and the best asymmetries and polytonalities and polyrhythms and whatever else you care to name.”

After months of grueling rehearsals, the lights finally drew down at the Théâtre des Champs-Élysées that evening. The Rite began with a solo bassoon squeezing out a riff so high in its register that it sounded uncannily like a broken English horn. This alien sound was—apparently and unintentionally—so strange that chuckles erupted from the bourgeoisie in the mezzanine boxes and rippled through the crowd below. The dissonant opening gave way to the martial assault of the second movement, “The Augurs of Spring,” and the dancers—choreographed by the legendary Vaslav Nijinsky of the Ballets Russes—bounded on stage, moving squeamishly and at jagged angles. As recounted in the daily newspaper Le Figaro and in various books and memoirs since, the chuckles turned into jeers, then shouting, and soon the audience was whipped into such a frenzy that their cries drowned out the orchestra.

Many members of the audience could not fathom this new music; their brains—figuratively, but to a certain extent, literally—broke. A brawl ensued, vegetables were thrown, and 40 people were ejected from the theater. It was a fiasco consonant with Stravinsky’s full-bore attack on the received history of classical music, and thus, every delicate sense in the room.

Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring is now hailed as the most sweepingly influential piece of music composed in the early 20th century, a tectonic shift in form and aesthetic that was, as the critic Alex Ross wrote in his book The Rest Is Noise, “lowdown yet sophisticated, smartly savage, style and muscle intertwined.” Within the brambles of The Rite are the seeds of an entire outgrowth of modernism: jazz, experimental, and electronic music flow back to The Rite.

We love the things we know because we know them and therefore we love them. But there is a physiological explanation for our nostalgia and our desire to seek comfort in the familiar. It can help us understand why listening to new music is so hard, and why it can make us feel uneasy, angry, or even riotous.

It has to do with the plasticity of our brain. Our brains change as they recognize new patterns in the world, which is what makes brains, well, useful. When it comes to hearing music, a network of nerves in the auditory cortex called the corticofugal network helps catalog the different patterns of music. When a specific sound maps onto a pattern, our brain releases a corresponding amount of dopamine, the main chemical source of some of our most intense emotions. This is the essential reason why music triggers such powerful emotional reactions, and why, as an art form, it is so inextricably tied to our emotional responses.

In his book Proust Was a Neuroscientist, the writer and one-time neuroscience lab worker Jonah Lehrer writes about how the essential joy of music comes in how songs subtly toy with patterns in our brains, spiking the dopamine more and more without sending it off the charts. “Someone Like You” is Bruce Springsteen’s “I’m Goin’ Down” is Cheap Trick’s “I Want You to Want Me” is Rachel Platten’s “Fight Song” and so on—this is the entire neuroscientific marketing plan behind pop music. But when we hear something that hasn’t already been mapped onto the brain, the corticofugal network goes a bit haywire, and our brain releases too much dopamine as a response. When there is no anchor or no pattern on which to map, music registers as unpleasant, or in layman’s terms, bad.
“If the dopamine neurons can’t correlate their firing with outside events,” Lehrer writes, “the brain is unable to make cogent associations.” We go a bit mad. No wonder the audience at the premiere of Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring thought that it sucked: there was almost no precedent for it.

The way the corticofugal system learns new patterns limits our experiences by making everything we already know far more pleasurable than everything we don’t. It’s not just the strange allure of the song your mother played when you were little or wanting to go back to that time in high school driving down country roads with the radio on. It’s that our brains actually fight against the unfamiliarity of life. “We are built to abhor the uncertainty of newness,” writes Lehrer.

The coda to the famous The Rite of Spring riot at its premiere in Paris is not often told, but it’s crucial to the full life of the piece. After the melee of that evening, the ballet continued running at the theater for many months. Alex Ross writes: “Subsequent performances were packed, and at each one the opposition dwindled. At the second, there was noise only during the latter part of the ballet; at the third, ‘vigorous applause’ and little protest. At a concert performance of Rite one year later, ‘unprecedented exaltation’ and a ‘fever of adoration’ swept over the crowd, and admirers mobbed Stravinsky in the street afterward, in a riot of delight.” What is unheard of could define history—might as well come for the show.
https://pitchfork.com/features/article/listen-to-music/
 
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I am mostly in the Raja school of looking at this, "Kaalaiyil paaduvathu kaalaiyin ragam, maalayil paaduvathu maalaiyin ragam ".
Didn't know he said something of the sort. Nice share, but of course you are familiar with morning vs evening ragas. I certainly trust the evocative moods that are brought around by certain melodies - like raag Malhar is often associated with the rains. I often love to listen to amritavarshini or Malhar during the monsoons. It has a seperate 'kick'.
 
Most people I know became quite obdurate as they got older. For me it's nonsense, however.

I also doubt this supposed phenomenon will last very long, due to the changing nature of exposure of musics in breadth and the exponential diversity of their intertextual networks, in their continually diversifying combination with other arts and leisure. This then harvests 'nostalgia' through association and also expands the range of musically resonant inference due to the nearness of commonalities which 'bridge styles'. The ledger of forms only grows and their mixing in a variety of contexts only escalates in experience. This leads to a quite different formation of expectation during the years of the supposed plasticity and amenability for judgment and taste, from when one is young to the OAP age of 30 or whatever. Thus, I'm supposing that the coming generations will have as a fixed 'state' a mode of change, flux, stylistic elision, rather than a stable formation which is narrower in scope and too distant from so many other styles to compel through a sort of receptive inference.
Hey, how's the you?

I think the article does touch upon nostalgia. It's a very strong factor. As @Dolgopolov85 mentioned in one of his posts, I don't think the survey was conducted among genuine musicophiles.

It's not just music, most humans are not interested in seeking information the same way after a particular age. Very few are genuinely interested in expanding their horizons. Our minds are far more receptive to things that are new when young.
 
Hey, how's the you?

I think the article does touch upon nostalgia. It's a very strong factor. As @Dolgopolov85 mentioned in one of his posts, I don't think the survey was conducted among genuine musicophiles.

It's not just music, most humans are not interested in seeking information the same way after a particular age. Very few are genuinely interested in expanding their horizons. Our minds are far more receptive to things that are new when young.


Yes, but that's based on a tempo of life which is in rapid transition in which the key period of formation is now starting to suppose movement over stasis rather than the inverse. It's possible that the current and coming condition may overcome some of what may well be a softwired inclination, at least to a degree where a remarkable amount of people from the coming generations have it as a mode of being to be continually expanding their horizons.

In the case of music, the field of receptivity for understanding and enjoying musical connections is dependent somewhat on the ratio between nearness of style and the overall space of all musical form. If the latter becomes capped or has its growth slowed, than the artistic creation which follows mostly 'fills in the gaps', presenting in formative years a nexus in which the threshold for associational connections covers a vast array of styles, and possibly the majority in the general sense.

This is something to keep an eye on over the next century, for my money anyway.
 
The music that I listened to in my teens through early thirties still resonate the most strongly with me. The Clash and other punk bands were the first to grab my emotions when I was in high school in the early 1980s, followed by New Wave, alternative bands, and classic 60s & 70s rock in college, then bands like Nirvana and Oasis. That's around the time my tastes seems to have been defined, though I have kept exploring new bands and genres. I have been subsequently exploring more blues, jazz and classical which are emotionally powerful, but evocative in a different way.

Why Do We Even Listen to New Music?
Our brains reward us for seeking out what we already know. So why should we reach to listen to something we don’t?
By Jeremy D. Larson
April 6, 2020


Why do we even listen to new music anymore? Most people have all the songs they could ever need by the time they turn 30. Spotify, Apple Music, and YouTube can whisk us back to the gates and gables of our youth when life was simpler. Why leap off a cliff hoping you’ll be rescued by your new favorite album on the way down when you can lay supine on the terra firma of your “Summer Rewind” playlist? Not just in times of great stress, but for all times, I genuinely ask: Why spend time on something you might not like?

It was a question that Coco Chanel, Marcel Duchamp, and the rest of the Parisian audience might have asked at the 1913 premiere of Igor Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring, an orchestral ballet inspired by the Russian composer’s dream about a young girl dancing herself to death. On a muggy night at the end of May, inside a newly constructed theater along the Seine, those who chose to bear witness to something new experienced a piece of music that would presage a new world of art.

Stravinsky, having already thrilled Paris with his ferociously complex Firebird ballet three years earlier, was the bright young thing of symphonic music in Paris, and The Rite was to be something essentially unheard of. Drawing from the Slavic and Lithuanian folk music of his homeland and his viscerally atavistic brain, Stravinsky blackened his score with rhythmic and harmonic tension, stretching phrases to their outer limits and never bothering to resolve them. The harmonies were difficult to name and his rhythms impossible to follow. Leonard Bernstein later described The Rite as “the best dissonances anyone ever thought up, and the best asymmetries and polytonalities and polyrhythms and whatever else you care to name.”

After months of grueling rehearsals, the lights finally drew down at the Théâtre des Champs-Élysées that evening. The Rite began with a solo bassoon squeezing out a riff so high in its register that it sounded uncannily like a broken English horn. This alien sound was—apparently and unintentionally—so strange that chuckles erupted from the bourgeoisie in the mezzanine boxes and rippled through the crowd below. The dissonant opening gave way to the martial assault of the second movement, “The Augurs of Spring,” and the dancers—choreographed by the legendary Vaslav Nijinsky of the Ballets Russes—bounded on stage, moving squeamishly and at jagged angles. As recounted in the daily newspaper Le Figaro and in various books and memoirs since, the chuckles turned into jeers, then shouting, and soon the audience was whipped into such a frenzy that their cries drowned out the orchestra.

Many members of the audience could not fathom this new music; their brains—figuratively, but to a certain extent, literally—broke. A brawl ensued, vegetables were thrown, and 40 people were ejected from the theater. It was a fiasco consonant with Stravinsky’s full-bore attack on the received history of classical music, and thus, every delicate sense in the room.

Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring is now hailed as the most sweepingly influential piece of music composed in the early 20th century, a tectonic shift in form and aesthetic that was, as the critic Alex Ross wrote in his book The Rest Is Noise, “lowdown yet sophisticated, smartly savage, style and muscle intertwined.” Within the brambles of The Rite are the seeds of an entire outgrowth of modernism: jazz, experimental, and electronic music flow back to The Rite.

We love the things we know because we know them and therefore we love them. But there is a physiological explanation for our nostalgia and our desire to seek comfort in the familiar. It can help us understand why listening to new music is so hard, and why it can make us feel uneasy, angry, or even riotous.

It has to do with the plasticity of our brain. Our brains change as they recognize new patterns in the world, which is what makes brains, well, useful. When it comes to hearing music, a network of nerves in the auditory cortex called the corticofugal network helps catalog the different patterns of music. When a specific sound maps onto a pattern, our brain releases a corresponding amount of dopamine, the main chemical source of some of our most intense emotions. This is the essential reason why music triggers such powerful emotional reactions, and why, as an art form, it is so inextricably tied to our emotional responses.

In his book Proust Was a Neuroscientist, the writer and one-time neuroscience lab worker Jonah Lehrer writes about how the essential joy of music comes in how songs subtly toy with patterns in our brains, spiking the dopamine more and more without sending it off the charts. “Someone Like You” is Bruce Springsteen’s “I’m Goin’ Down” is Cheap Trick’s “I Want You to Want Me” is Rachel Platten’s “Fight Song” and so on—this is the entire neuroscientific marketing plan behind pop music. But when we hear something that hasn’t already been mapped onto the brain, the corticofugal network goes a bit haywire, and our brain releases too much dopamine as a response. When there is no anchor or no pattern on which to map, music registers as unpleasant, or in layman’s terms, bad.
“If the dopamine neurons can’t correlate their firing with outside events,” Lehrer writes, “the brain is unable to make cogent associations.” We go a bit mad. No wonder the audience at the premiere of Stravinsky’s The Rite of Spring thought that it sucked: there was almost no precedent for it.

The way the corticofugal system learns new patterns limits our experiences by making everything we already know far more pleasurable than everything we don’t. It’s not just the strange allure of the song your mother played when you were little or wanting to go back to that time in high school driving down country roads with the radio on. It’s that our brains actually fight against the unfamiliarity of life. “We are built to abhor the uncertainty of newness,” writes Lehrer.

The coda to the famous The Rite of Spring riot at its premiere in Paris is not often told, but it’s crucial to the full life of the piece. After the melee of that evening, the ballet continued running at the theater for many months. Alex Ross writes: “Subsequent performances were packed, and at each one the opposition dwindled. At the second, there was noise only during the latter part of the ballet; at the third, ‘vigorous applause’ and little protest. At a concert performance of Rite one year later, ‘unprecedented exaltation’ and a ‘fever of adoration’ swept over the crowd, and admirers mobbed Stravinsky in the street afterward, in a riot of delight.” What is unheard of could define history—might as well come for the show.
https://pitchfork.com/features/article/listen-to-music/
What a lovely share!

We are built to abhor the uncertainty of newness,” writes Lehrer


How true! Not just in music, but every little aspect of life. As you grow older you start preferring your comfort zone, your own little routines etc. Heck if someone takes away my regular parking spot at work it annoys me a bit. We all love some form of regularity. There are those exceptions of course.
 
Yes, but that's based on a tempo of life which is in rapid transition in which the key period of formation is now starting to suppose movement over stasis rather than the inverse. It's possible that the current and coming condition may overcome some of what may well be a softwired inclination, at least to a degree where a remarkable amount of people from the coming generations have it as a mode of being to be continually expanding their horizons.

In the case of music, the field of receptivity for understanding and enjoying musical connections is dependent somewhat on the ratio between nearness of style and the overall space of all musical form. If the latter becomes capped or has its growth slowed, than the artistic creation which follows mostly 'fills in the gaps', presenting in formative years a nexus in which the threshold for associational connections covers a vast array of styles, and possibly the majority in the general sense.

This is something to keep an eye on over the next century, for my money anyway.
We have not really had the chance to see this, since this ubiquitous availabllility of music is only more recent. Despite all the availability of YouTube or Spotify, my mum still goes back to listening to the songs of her youth - the 70's early 80's and my dad, still a decade earlier. Whether the present generations that have grown up with the vast availability will be any different from the 50 something or the 60 something of today is something only time can tell. Well if TT is around and you do drop by, we will revisit this topic ;)
 
More housekeeping:

Maybe a tossup between The Beatles' Yesterday, the Stones' Satisfaction, Zeppelin's Stairway to Heaven, Jethro Tull's Thick as a Brick (is that one song?), White Rabbit by Jefferson Airplane, Take Five or Blue Rondo a la Turk by Dave Brubeck, My Favorite Things by Rodgers & Hammerstein, Summertime by Billie Holiday (excellent version by Janis Joplin), Peggy Lee's Fever, Chick Corea's Spain and his What Game Shall We Play Today, Sergio Mendes' Mas Que Nada, Miles Davis' All Blues and Concerto de Aranjuez (Sketches of Spain).

Liner note: White Rabbit (by Grace Slick) was inspired by Lewis Carol, Ravel's Bolero and Miles Davis' Sketches of Spain. And, of course, LSD.

To be clear the Concierto de Aranjuez is a work by Joaquín Rodrigo, not Miles, and this greatest of all guitar concertos is so perfectly tailored for the neglected instrument (in the classical world) that it's impossible to name any performance with a different lead instrument as the best out there.

But yes, it's one of the few classical pieces from the last century that have entered the mainstream. Here's John Williams (no relation to the film composer and arguably the greatest of all guitarists) performing the famous Adagio at his "Seville Concert":


I’m way too “uneducated” to have these talks, I love music but I know very little of the hidden meanings of jazz or music theory or classical in the 20th century. However this past century was full of wonderful music, and I appreciate it on a daily basis.

Ain't nothing wrong with that! Welcome and don't be shy about sharing your faves with us.

Have always loved the Coltrane version of My Favorite Things as well as a number of vocal versions of it. You may consider it sacrilegious but one of my newer favorite versions is this amusing Xmas/Frito Lay rendition from Anna Kendrick:

I know you like that one a lot. It's charming and shows the wide appeal of Rodgers and Hammerstein's (probably) best-known song.

Which brings me to my intentional omission of Bernstein's immortal West Side Story. This is where the cliche of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts clearly applies, and I don't think any of its individual songs, beloved as they are, is a serious challenger to the likes of "Over the Rainbow" and "Unchained Melody," but if I had to pick one:


And while this doesn't fit the current bill "Cool" due to its near twelve-tone fugue (yes, really) is quite possibly the most complex song ever heard on Broadway (and was acknowledged as such by bandleader Bobby Sanabria at this leg of his West Side Story Reimagined tour I attended two years ago):


But these aren't my fave WST numbers, one of which is the rousing "Dance at the Gym":


Few things in life make me as eager to get up and dance as that "Mambo!" Can't wait to see how Spielberg will handle this sequence in his upcoming adaptation (still scheduled for release this year, but we'll see).

And "America":


Of course there's plenty more where that came from. America may have produced "greater" musical works (including Bernstein's own Candide) in the 20th century, but none will likely prove more enduring than this evergreen favorite and Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue and "Summertime" (I'm not quite sold on the whole Porgy and Bess).

It's almost sad how so much online discourse is so heavily biased to western sensibilities, it really narrows down the range of content that gets publicity and coverage. Look at Rolling Stone's top 500 albums of all time, and the vast majority of them are from the US and UK, and by UK I mostly mean British Invasion stuff. I only remember seeing one album from an African artist, Fela Kuti. No Arabic music, no Indian music, no east Asian music - and these are all very reductive categories to begin with - but we got a Madonna compilation album.

I mean even for a western only list, it's pretty bad. There are only like 5 jazz albums - the most recent being from 1970 - not a single classical record, no Zappa, but thank god we got Blur and Britney Spears!
I think the big issue I have with Rolling Stone's list is not so much that the content isn't good or important, but there's a certain pretention about the "greatest albums of all time" being almost exclusive to english popular music, and how accessibility is a big part of why most albums were picked. I feel like there's a trend in music (and other media as well) that peak has already been achieved, the GOAT albums have already been made, there's not point in looking at anything else, but "we also gotta keep up with da young kids, so let's put Kanye in there", without really looking outside of mainstream pop for more recent great albums. The RS critics' tastes haven't evolved very much in the past 30-40 years, their understanding of music outside of pop/classic rock is still really limited. Kinda like how in Guitar Player magazine the "best solo of all time" voted is still Stairway to Heaven, even though it wasn't even the greatest rock solo at the time of its release. I think it's especially noticeable as a jazz fan, and I can't imagine what it might feel like for classical fans, or for people who live in places where local musical culture is so different to mainstream pop music that the whole concept of "good music" is extremely limiting.

FYI I'm a classically (self-)trained pianist myself and still listen to more classical and jazz than pop/rock, but I don't mind RS's focus on the latter which they make no bones about. You can't fully appreciate the former without a strong background in music theory which the vast majority of listeners (or even performers) don't have, so the mainstream music mags devote their space to the more democratic pop, hip hop, rock, country and electronic with occasional forays into jazz and international. And it's not like classical and jazz are wanting for their own flagship publications (Gramophone and DownBeat, respectively). I just don't see much of a problem with this arrangement.

The decline of journalism at large in favor of profit maximization is a far bigger systematic issue. This balkanization of music industries which was probably inevitable with the emergence of the internet is just a drop in the bucket by comparison.

And I'm sorry, but if you don't see what makes Madonna and Kanye, whatever their personal quirks or failings, two of the most important musicians (yes, musicians) in pop history you're simply not very familiar with their work or what the critics actually say about it.
 
If I ever hear that fat Hawaiian guy with the ukulele singing OTR I will cut my veins with a rusty nail.

I also can't say I agree with some of the choices in this thread. Unbelievable that Irving Berlin hasn't even been mentioned. Wow. Are you people from Mars?

Songs like White Christmas and What'll I do? (from Berlin) are GOAT material. The same goes for Someone to Watch over Me (Gerschwin) To each his own, but I have always thought that Over the Rainbow is just too saccharine for my tastes.

I also like Ebb Tide much more than Unchained Melody, but people tend to disagree.

No offense, but I can't think of a great songwriter who produced more kitsch than Berlin and to hold up his omission as this conspitorial injustice while touting the RB's overwrought "Ebb Tide" as superior to their classic "Unchained Melody" and knocking IZ's tastefully streamlined (and now almost equally classic) "Over the Rainbow" as "too saccharine" just doesn't wash.

But yes, Berlin's "White Christmas" certainly belongs up there. My rationale was that it's a holiday song and as such perhaps lacks the perennial appeal of its peers, but I'm certainly willing to acknowledge it as one of the 20th century's best. And while we're at it let me also give a shout-out to "Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas" (Hugh Martin and very arguably Ralph Blane), given a memorable performance by Judy (again!) in Vincente Minnelli's beloved Christmas musical Meet Me in St. Louis:


Now Gershwin was if anything an even more talented songwriter who might well have surpassed Berlin if not for his premature death at age 38, but most of his best works in the popular genre, even such a sentimental torch song as "Some to Watch Over Me," basically belong to the art songs of his era. Contrast them with "Summertime" which incorporates elements of African American spirituals more than probably any of his other songs, which in turn means it'll likely outlast them all.

Greatest songs or greatest records? You will note the grammy awards have separate categories for 'song of the year' and 'record of the year'. For instance, for The Beatles you mention Yesterday first. Great song, but as a finished product is it as good as A Day In The Life? Or Strawberry Fields Forever? Not sure there are any songs mentioned yet that would make my personal top 250 songs which is to say nothing of the quality of the songs mentioned but is an indicator of the vastness of popular music which can certainly never be taken in by any one person in a lifetime

Let's get one thing straight: the Grammys are a joke - remember Milli Vanilli (and I say that as someone who counts their quinessential Eurotrash as one of his non-guilty pleasures), or Jethro friggin' Tull over Metallica AND Jane's addiction for the inaugural (and soon defunct) Best Hard Rock/Metal Performance in '89? - and we shouldn't be looking to the Academy for guidance on anything.

Case in point: what is the difference between a great song and a great record anyway? For award purposes it might make sense to distinguish between songwriting and performance/production, but it surely takes both to make a song great, no?

Which brings us to a prime example:

This is surely one of the most memorable songs.


Not even the best track on the original Dolly Parton album:


But yes, Whitney did turn what was a merely first-rate Dolly record into a transcendent powerhouse ballad that may well outlive anything by the country legend save her signature song "Jolene." Me from late last year in response to a philistine who was hyping up Whitney the schlock-meister as this pop goddess almost on par with Madonna (I'm including the fanboyish part about Madge to double as a response to an earlier slam against her):

We agree on sports vs. pop culture overall, but Whitney even at her absolute peak was no MJ or Madonna. Not even close, either in cultural impact or in artistic merit which will ultimately decide their legacy. Houston was at best a tremendously gifted vocalist who abandoned her gospel roots for pop schlock which she turned into commercial gold through one-of-a-kind pipes and charisma. And like others of its kind that gold will ultimately prove fraudulent - with the one exception courtesy of Dolly, yes, which somehow makes perfect sense as it's an unwieldy mixture of sincerity and self-delusion that she struggled to balance throughout her career. This one time her gospel influence won out, almost overpowering Dolly's fragile aria of resigned love which dimmer critics mistook for bombast but which in fact imbues the song with an additional layer of catharsis missing from the original. For that reason "I Will Always" will always be known as Houston's signature song even though she didn't write a word or note of it, and I do expect it to endure as long as Parton's own timeless classic "Jolene" which appeared on the same original album, but this version is in the end not one but two covers - one serving as a return to Houston's Black Baptist heritage and the other as a tribute to the country great whom she clearly wanted to do justice. No wonder she never came close to duplicating the stroke of serendipity.

Now I can already hear you saying, "But Madonna was never half the singer Whitney was." No, she wasn't, nor is she much of an instrumentalist. But she's had a hand in most of her best songs, which are among the most enduring pop confections ever written and span at least three decades: "Lucky Star," "Into the Groove," "Live to Tell," "Papa Don't Preach," "True Blue," "Open Your Heart," "La Isla Bonita," "Who's That Girl," "Like a Prayer," "Express Yourself," "Cherish," "Oh Father," "Dear Jessie," "Vogue," "This Used to Be My Playground," "Deeper and Deeper," "Rain," "I'll Remember," "Secret," "Take a Bow," "You'll See," "Frozen," "Ray of Light," "Drowned World/Substitute for Love," "The Power of Good-Bye," "Nothing Really Matters," "Music," "Don't Tell Me," "Hung Up," "Sorry," "Get Together," "Jump," "Celebration" and likely more to come. And that doesn't even include such first-rate singles as "Holiday," "Borderline," "Material Girl" and "Dress You Up" that she handed over to her collaborators early in her career.

Not even MJ boasts as extensive a parade of hits, and while Madge has never been a great lyricist and remains like Jackson a dance artist at heart "Like a Prayer" is among the most majestic of all art pop while "Live to Tell" finds her at her most searingly introspective. Add to that "Vogue," "Express Yourself" and other immortal dance anthems and a constant urge to reinvent oneself (which you typically dismiss as attention grabbing and nothing more) and you've got a pop royalty second only to Jackson since the Beatles. By contrast Whitney wasn't an auteur of any kind but more of a producer-editor who needed the right material and circumstances to strike gold. Not everyone can be an MJ or MDNA, and there's no shame in that.

Now I'll revise this analysis somewhat with a little more generosity by granting that there are indeed two auteurs here, though Whitney could've never done it without Dolly while it's conceivable another gifted (presumably Black) singer might have given this ballad a different but equally soaring treatment. And Kirk Whalum deserves at least an honorary mention for his sax solo in the song's bridge and coda, without which it would not have achieved its full tear-your-heart-out power. It may be hyperbolic to say just about all great American music has been influenced by Black artists, but close enough.

P.S. I'll get to Madge's best dance tracks eventually, but here are two of her own best ballads from the above cavalcade of hits:

 
We have not really had the chance to see this, since this ubiquitous availabllility of music is only more recent. Despite all the availability of YouTube or Spotify, my mum still goes back to listening to the songs of her youth - the 70's early 80's and my dad, still a decade earlier. Whether the present generations that have grown up with the vast availability will be any different from the 50 something or the 60 something of today is something only time can tell. Well if TT is around and you do drop by, we will revisit this topic ;)
But I think actually Indian moms and dads are a good counter example. They do tend to know and like the new songs of say the latest Rajni film. My mom is not a musophile but she loves Innum Konjam Neram.

While I think embracing new, especially very new/different, styles may get difficult with age, the thesis that people over the age of 30 may not feel like they need new songs AT ALL sounds extreme to me and contra to everything I have experienced. I knew thathas and paatis who liked the Roja songs back in the day. And at least until recently, adult contemporary was a huge market by its own and it couldn't have sustained itself unless older listeners had been buying new albums. So the explanation for such trends could be a combination of (a) poor sample or small sample size and (b) older people simply finding it a hassle to choose the songs they like out of so many up on YouTube or Spotify etc. Radio and TV made passive discovery of new songs easy while the new songs promote active efforts on the part of the listener. If you tried to get new music you would like off the radio, you would be bombarded by pop that caters way too much to younger demographics. There is a reason why Adele had stupendous success with (forgive me for saying so) relatively unexceptional talents. Nobody was trying to play that space anymore and she brought back listeners of all ages rather than just teenyboppers and young adults.
 
Didn't know he said something of the sort. Nice share, but of course you are familiar with morning vs evening ragas. I certainly trust the evocative moods that are brought around by certain melodies - like raag Malhar is often associated with the rains. I often love to listen to amritavarshini or Malhar during the monsoons. It has a seperate 'kick'.
Sure but I guess his point was you can coax different flavours out of the same raga depending on how you arrange the notes because that's all they are at the end of the day - notes. It is not a conclusion that sits well with purists but I think he demonstrated this repeatedly over his long and prolific career.
 
Here's a song I've heard probably 300 times or more and somehow I never get sick of it, it feels fresh every time. Is it one of the greatest songs ever? Hard to say, I'd say it's one the best songs ever that was also a massive hit single

A friend called me up one night and said “meet me at 74th and Broadway at 730pm, don’t ask questions.” So I did and we walked a few feet to The Beacon Theater, NYC where he had scalped a couple of Tears for Fears tickets on the way home ! Songs from the Big Chair was a great album.

This thread reminds me how much I miss live music performances. :cry:
 
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Ain't nothing wrong with that! Welcome and don't be shy about sharing your faves with us.
After some time, I think of all the songs I’ve listened to this is probably my favorite. Calm, nice lyrics and chorus, and a wonderful tune that can go with a lot of things.
 
But I think actually Indian moms and dads are a good counter example. They do tend to know and like the new songs of say the latest Rajni film. My mom is not a musophile but she loves Innum Konjam Neram.

While I think embracing new, especially very new/different, styles may get difficult with age, the thesis that people over the age of 30 may not feel like they need new songs AT ALL sounds extreme to me and contra to everything I have experienced. I knew thathas and paatis who liked the Roja songs back in the day. And at least until recently, adult contemporary was a huge market by its own and it couldn't have sustained itself unless older listeners had been buying new albums. So the explanation for such trends could be a combination of (a) poor sample or small sample size and (b) older people simply finding it a hassle to choose the songs they like out of so many up on YouTube or Spotify etc. Radio and TV made passive discovery of new songs easy while the new songs promote active efforts on the part of the listener. If you tried to get new music you would like off the radio, you would be bombarded by pop that caters way too much to younger demographics. There is a reason why Adele had stupendous success with (forgive me for saying so) relatively unexceptional talents. Nobody was trying to play that space anymore and she brought back listeners of all ages rather than just teenyboppers and young adults.
Sorry I don't have much knowledge of Tamil films or songs! I don't think it's hard and fast in the sense that people after 30's will absolutely not explore. I think they won't stick on largely as favourites although they might be great. We need a better study for sure. I do buy the age vs rigidity being a linear graph though.
 
And I'm sorry, but if you don't see what makes Madonna and Kanye, whatever their personal quirks or failings, two of the most important musicians (yes, musicians) in pop history you're simply not very familiar with their work or what the critics actually say about it.
My point wasn't so much that Kanye doesn't belong on this list, but having him and the Flying Burrito brothers on the same list reeks of boomers trying to look hip and woke. As RS's influence wanes in the mainstream, it attaches itself to big mainstream artists to stay relevant, a thing it didn't do for about 30 years, which explains a lot of their choices (or lack thereof) in certain genres for certain periods. Downbeat has a similar problem, a guy like Christian McBride was getting voted in the critics poll as an up-and-coming bass player until at least the mid 2010s.

I'd also like to point out there hasn't been a single mention of Duke Ellington or Billy Strayhorn, either in this thread or in RS's list.
 
Having said that, I have a hard time enjoying lots of hiphop, mostly because of the aesthetics of many of the big recordings. I hate the booming synth bass and trap hihat sound, and it's hard for me to get over that hurdle. Get rappers in front of a jazz band, and I really enjoy it:
I agree in that I too dislike that booming synth bass. I like stuff like Tribe Called Quest or Tyler's own Igor album. That's not how a lot of hip hop is indeed produced and I have realized that the inane sound of a lot of mainstream hip hop had put me off the genre and its possibilities.
 
Yep - small minority indeed. I don't know if I would dedicate hours suddenly discovering and trying to listen to as much as I can, say, hip hop. Mostly, will not but I would not mind discovering a new sufi artist and listening to him/her all day. Hip Hop is just too removed from my tastes.

I didn't dedicate hours to getting into hip-hop either. What I have stopped doing is trying to binge on a new genre in the way I would have done in my twenties. I binged on so much metal in that time that I kind of got burnt out with that genre for a while. So I take it easy. As and when a really interesting reco comes along, I check it out. But I am not trying to assimilate the entire hip hop universe in a few years and don't try to do it for any other genre.
 
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