The gut/poly thread

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#1
I think this thread is way overdue so here we go! I will share my experiences with different gut/poly hybrids and I hope you all can add yours as well, so that we'll have one place where we gather experiences with different setups for comparison and optimization.

First of all, Tonic+ <15L/4G 16L. 4G is very stiff, so the stringbed is firm and has a very crisp response, despite the gut in the mains. The response is precise and touch shots are easy to execute. Control is the major aspect of this stringbed, as 4G's low power makes it hard to overhit; however, there is good pop off the stringbed (pop≠power). For whatever reason, this particular setup grabs the ball more than other hybrids (feels somewhat similar to a shaped string in this regard), which makes the launch angle noticeably high in comparison to some other hybrids. In combination with the low power/control, this makes many shots land fairly short, so a powerful swing is advisable. The big downside is that 4G dents and notches quite easily, despite its stiffness. As a result, the movement of the mains is inhibited, which firms up the stringbed further and can lead to a slightly erratic response. Furthermore, this setup will have less durability and playability duration than some other hybrids. I enjoyed this setup most on serve and at net, where the ball grab and control allowed me to really hit my spots and add some nasty spin. From the baseline I would have preferred a slightly lower launch angle, which is more cohesive to hitting through the ball. I personally would use this specific stringjob for serve and volley play. This setup is ideal for people who want a firm feeling stringbed with good ball grab and control, but with the added comfort and playability of gut.

Next, Tonic+ <15L/Hawk 17. Hawk is not nearly as stiff as 4G, but it still is a fairly firm monofilament. Hawk however is significantly more slick than 4G and it does not dent. As a result, this stringbed has impressive durability and playability duration. The setup has a more plush feel with better ball pocketing and comfort than the stringbed with 4G, but it still has some crispness to it. For whatever reason, ball grab is not as pronounced, so this setup will not be for people who enjoy that aspect of shaped polys. The response is very consistent and there is a good balance of power, spin and control. The way the ball reacts off the stringbed is a lot like a full setup of round strings and it promotes an aggressive swing that goes through the contact point more than a exaggerated WW technique. I really enjoyed this setup on the return and from the baseline, as it was quite versatile and it made it a lot easier to finish the point than the setup with 4G. I missed the ball grab on serve and the control/low power and crisp feel on the volley though. I can see myself using this setup in regular singles play due to its predictability and versatility. I recommend it for players who want a plush, yet precise stringbed, but do not want a lot of ball grab (and the high launch angle as a result) and like to hit through the ball (even flat) more than ripping the felt off the ball with exaggerated topspin strokes.

Regularly updated links to all reviews/comments on setups in this thread:
Pacific Classic/YPTP main characteristics - KaiserW
gut/4G in IGPMP - torpantennis
Pacific Classic/Co.Focus - Triskadekaphilia
Gosen Polylon Polyquest as poly cross with Tonic + and other gut main - 0d1n
Links to Chicago Jack's awesome reviews on the setups he tried! - ChicagoJack
Comments and links to "dying" of poly crosses and Monogut ZX - ChicagoJack
Comments/review on Signum Pro Outbreak as a very comfortable poly cross - kicker75 (quoted in my comment)
Sonic Pro Edge initial impressions + Head Hawk further impressions - STW
Tension loss of Wilson Champion's Choice - Ghost3789
Lynx vs Hawk as crosses comparison - STW
Extensive reviews of Hawk, Lynx and Sonic Pro Edge as crosses + ranking characteristics - STW
4G and Co.Focus as crosses - SpinDr.
VS 17/Max Power - Edberg's Iceburg
Tourna Black Zone vs YPTP as a cross - KaiserW
Gut/SPPP in Blade 98S - Buford T Justice
Tension loss of VS 16/SPPP 16 - Buford T Justice
Tension loss of VS 16/SPPP 16 #2 - Buford T Justice
VS Black and Max Power in RF97 - PGlock
Gut/poly in Blade 98S with big tension differential - Buford T Justice
Stringsaver overkill - Buford T Justice
Legend/Tour XC in the Savage Banana (Prince Tour 98 ESP) - KYHacker
Performance comparison between Outlast, Black Fire and Max Power as crosses - Franklin_B
"The Frankenstringjob" (Champion Choice in Blade 98S with a ton of string savers) - Buford T Justice
Tension loss of "The Frankenstringjob" - Buford T Justice
"The Frankenstringjob" eats stringsavers too! - Buford T Justice
Extensive review of Max Power as a cross vs 4G - torpantennis
Generalized relation for different gauges of poly crosses - STW
Restringing used gut mains to prolong usable string life - ricardo
Method for restringing used gut mains explained - ricardo
Max Power vs 4G as cross + comments on low tension loss poly crosses - torpantennis
Why gut/poly and not poly/gut? - STW
Tourna Black Zone vs PL II as crosses - dave
Head Lynx 17 as a cross in Blade 93 - AHJS
Topspin Cyber Blue crosses notch quickly - SOY78
Head Hawk isn't suited as a cross for dense string patterns - comments by AHJS (in quotes) who uses a Blade 93
Extensive reviews of Revolve 17 and Max Power 17 as crosses - STW
Ranking of characteristics of poly crosses I have used as of the 1st of April 2015 - STW
Tough Gut is susceptible to breakage while tying off (both mains and crosses) - STW and AHJS
Tough Gut susceptible to breakage while tying off and comparison to Tonic + - 0d1n
Comments on VS Team/Alu Power 16L + Alu Power crosses have poor playability duration - PGlock
Comments on VS/Hawk and VS/Alu Power Soft - PGlock
Hawk Touch 17 as a cross in a Blade 93 + comparison to Lynx 17 - AHJS
Thin poly crosses (may) reduce durability and lead to decreased string movement - lcalamar
Thick poly crosses seem to work better - lcalamar
Alu Power Soft: Too soft in a gut/poly hybrid? - QuadCam
Alu Power Soft lasts a lot longer in the crosses than regular Alu - PGlock
Links continued in post 4
 
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anubis

Hall of Fame
#2
My go-to gut/poly combo is Tonic+/Solinco Outlast. Always string the crosses 3 lbs looser than the mains. It's a good combination, even though I have various other poly strings lying around (including packs of 4G), I wouldn't consider them. None are as slick as Outlast, and I need my mains to move well over the crosses.
 

KaiserW

Hall of Fame
#3
Do you guys feel Tonic is the same as VS in terms of feel? From reading the description it states it is the same just did not pass the quality standards of VS. There will be some gauge inconsistentency.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#4
Do you guys feel Tonic is the same as VS in terms of feel? From reading the description it states it is the same just did not pass the quality standards of VS. There will be some gauge inconsistentency.
I'm not sure… I personally don't feel much of a difference, but there are guys who can feel even minute differences between strings, so I am not the best guy to ask… I'd say it depends on how string sensitive you are.

Continued links to reviews/comments on setups:
VS Team/Monogut ZX and VS Team/YPTP in Ai98 - Laniarty
Extensive review of Black Fire crosses in (customized) PS 90 + rankings of characteristics of setups used as of 24. April 2015 - STW
Comparison between Revolve and Outlast as cross strings - tomseek
Comparison between VS Touch/4G & VS Touch/ALU Power Soft - elias ch
Review of Revolve crosses in (customized) PS 90 + rankings of characteristics of setups used as of 1. of May 2015 - STW
Which kind of textured string works well in the crosses, but without a huge decrease in durability - VoodooBoot
Gut/poly vs Poly/Syn gut + Tough Gut/Alu Fluoro - SloppyStringJobs
Olive oil for gut/poly maintenance works great! - TenFanLA
Feedback on Black Zone and Hawk as crosses - Nojoke
Cheap gut from the bay, quality? Meh - SloppyStringJobs
Gauge inconsistencies of cheap gut from the bay - SloppyStringJobs
Impressive durability/playability duration of gut/poly in dense string patterns (particularly Tonic + 15L mains) - Power Player
Black Magic as a cross - seekay
String savers decrease string movement (by the way, I agree) - tomseek
Tension differential and the launch angle explained - SpinToWin
ZX/multi vs Poly/multi - fgs
Durability of Tonic + Longevity relative to Tough Gut - ChicagoJack
Added weight of Naturalgutwholesale - 0d1n
Naturalgutwholesale vs Tonic + performance - 0d1n
Shaped polys DO tear through gut faster, even if they have flat sides - Franklin_B
Babolat PHT resists denting as a cross - Allcourtguy
Gut/Lux Element comments - LiquidWhip
gut/poly vs poly/gut - fgs
Black Fire and lacking touch/linear response as a cross #1/ post #2 - SpinToWin
Control benefit of tension differential in gut/poly - tegg96
Gut/ZX softer than even gut/soft poly - WayCool
Luxilon Natural Gut Review (TCS crosses) - haqqani1777
 
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KaiserW

Hall of Fame
#5
My main setup has been Pacific Classic/YPTP 16L. I choose YPTP because one of my main concerns is comfort. This setup has good power, control, touch, durability, and decent spin. The one thing I would like is a little more spin. Going to try Outlast next.

Any comfort issues with Outlast as cross and how long is it lasting you?
 
#6
First of all, Tonic+ <15L/4G 16L. 4G is very stiff, so the stringbed is firm and has a very crisp response, despite the gut in the mains. The response is precise and touch shots are easy to execute. Control is the major aspect of this stringbed, as 4G's low power makes it hard to overhit; however, there is good pop off the stringbed (pop≠power). For whatever reason, this particular setup grabs the ball more than other hybrids (feels somewhat similar to a shaped string in this regard), which makes the launch angle noticeably high in comparison to some other hybrids. In combination with the low power/control, this makes many shots land fairly short, so a powerful swing is advisable. The big downside is that 4G dents and notches quite easily, despite its stiffness. As a result, the movement of the mains is inhibited, which firms up the stringbed further and can lead to a slightly erratic response. Furthermore, this setup will have less durability and playability duration than some other hybrids. I enjoyed this setup most on serve and at net, where the ball grab and control allowed me to really hit my spots and add some nasty spin. From the baseline I would have preferred a slightly lower launch angle, which is more cohesive to hitting through the ball. I personally would use this specific stringjob for serve and volley play. This setup is ideal for people who want a firm feeling stringbed with good ball grab and control, but with the added comfort and playability of gut.
I have gut/4G 16L at 52/46 in IGPMP. I have no idea what the gut mains are, I just asked the pro stringer to use whatever gut in mains. I fully agree with the key points of this 4G cross setup:
  • Crisp stringbed
  • High launch angle
  • Nasty grab on the ball
  • Denting of crosses and erratic response
  • Control oriented feel

I hate the high launch angle of this setup. It's almost impossible to hit the flatter finalizing shots through the ball with it. But the grab on the ball is sick, this is the best ever slicing and volleying setup. I have transformed into a strange mix of slice junkballer & moonballer & S/V player with this setup. My slice return of serve is ridiculously efficient, I slice all returns now! No fear of one dimensional game if you use this setup, but be prepared to spraying some balls into the back fence, as the high launch angle requires extreme wristy swing. If consistency is your game, then this is not a good setup. I think I'll try some slicker and more denting resistant crosses the next time. But I think I'll miss the grab this setup has on slices.

Like you said, it's the 4G crosses that dent, rather than the "stiff" 4G sawing through the gut mains. Strange enough, when I used NXT/4G multi/poly setup, 4G was not denting at all and it was just sawing rails to the multi mains. That setup had totally different feel! So gut seems to have too stiff surface for 4G crosses.

Do you think it's possible to combine this nasty grab on the ball AND low launch angle with any setup? That'd ultimately be what I want.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#7
I have gut/4G 16L at 52/46 in IGPMP. I have no idea what the gut mains are, I just asked the pro stringer to use whatever gut in mains. I fully agree with the key points of this 4G cross setup:
  • Crisp stringbed
  • High launch angle
  • Nasty grab on the ball
  • Denting of crosses and erratic response
  • Control oriented feel

I hate the high launch angle of this setup. It's almost impossible to hit the flatter finalizing shots through the ball with it. But the grab on the ball is sick, this is the best ever slicing and volleying setup. I have transformed into a strange mix of slice junkballer & moonballer & S/V player with this setup. My slice return of serve is ridiculously efficient, I slice all returns now! No fear of one dimensional game if you use this setup, but be prepared to spraying some balls into the back fence, as the high launch angle requires extreme wristy swing. If consistency is your game, then this is not a good setup. I think I'll try some slicker and more denting resistant crosses the next time. But I think I'll miss the grab this setup has on slices.

Like you said, it's the 4G crosses that dent, rather than the "stiff" 4G sawing through the gut mains. Strange enough, when I used NXT/4G multi/poly setup, 4G was not denting at all and it was just sawing rails to the multi mains. That setup had totally different feel! So gut seems to have too stiff surface for 4G crosses.

Do you think it's possible to combine this nasty grab on the ball AND low launch angle with any setup? That'd ultimately be what I want.
That sounds like a tough task, as the ball grab more or less results in the high launch angle. I will continue updating this thread as I use different crosses though, perhaps I'll find something while testing.
 
#8
That sounds like a tough task, as the ball grab more or less results in the high launch angle. I will continue updating this thread as I use different crosses though, perhaps I'll find something while testing.
I think you sometimes said that lowering the tension of crosses increases launch angle? So maybe gut/4G with the crosses at a bit higher tension than mains? Or how about shaped/slick poly/poly setup, with crosses also at a bit higher tension than mains?

I really liked the low launch angle of full bed ProLine II, but that setup has no grab.
 
#9
I find that the preferred string set up of Dimitrov and the Williams sisters of Gut/4G to not have enough spin potential. The difference between it and the Gut/ALU in spin is massive IMO.

With regards to you not finding enough grab with PLII, it can be because of the low spin potential of the string. It's a rounder string and doesn't have the ability to grab the ball in comparison to other polyesters. If you want a more spin friendly PLII, there are definitely options to try out there.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#10
I think you sometimes said that lowering the tension of crosses increases launch angle? So maybe gut/4G with the crosses at a bit higher tension than mains? Or how about shaped/slick poly/poly setup, with crosses also at a bit higher tension than mains?

I really liked the low launch angle of full bed ProLine II, but that setup has no grab.
You could try raising the 4G tension. That should definitely lower the launch angle.
 
#11
I find that the preferred string set up of Dimitrov and the Williams sisters of Gut/4G to not have enough spin potential. The difference between it and the Gut/ALU in spin is massive IMO.

With regards to you not finding enough grab with PLII, it can be because of the low spin potential of the string. It's a rounder string and doesn't have the ability to grab the ball in comparison to other polyesters. If you want a more spin friendly PLII, there are definitely options to try out there.
I began my gut/poly "career" with Federer setup, gut/ALU Rough, couple of years ago. Maybe I should go back there, but with the slick ALU? Maybe the shorter life of ALU is not a problem in crosses?
 
#13
I began my gut/poly "career" with Federer setup, gut/ALU Rough, couple of years ago. Maybe I should go back there, but with the slick ALU? Maybe the shorter life of ALU is not a problem in crosses?
I found that the shorter life of the ALU to not be a huge problem. Since it is in the crosses you won't feel it the string go dead as much. I played with the set up for about a year. I did re-string somewhat often because I liked it fresh and for matches it was what I wanted to do. I tried Sonic Pro Edge 1.30 in the crosses in the Fall and I did not like it compared to the ALU.
 
#14
Vs +ALU = Long Life

I began my gut/poly "career" with Federer setup, gut/ALU Rough, couple of years ago. Maybe I should go back there, but with the slick ALU? Maybe the shorter life of ALU is not a problem in crosses?
I just compared a Graphene Radical Pro freshly strung played with 2 sets to another that is 5 months old and has dozens and dozens of sets on it, felt the same. After the 1st day, it plays the same for months of heavy hitting, and takes forever to break. Just go mid 50's and do the crosses 4 pounds lighter.

Point being, ALU life is great when used as a cross with Gut. IMO, this setup
saves money in the long run, and you get the benefit of ultimate playability.
 
#16
ALU just has that problem of tension maintenance. The difference in tension between gut and ALU will be huge after a while. Max power has better tension maintenance. Has anybody tried it as a cross to gut? Is it resistant to denting?
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#17
ALU just has that problem of tension maintenance. The difference in tension between gut and ALU will be huge after a while. Max power has better tension maintenance. Has anybody tried it as a cross to gut? Is it resistant to denting?
I have used it in a full bed and it did not dent from what I can remember. If nobody chimes in you'll have to wait until I test it with gut in the mains.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#18
I just wonder how the denting problem works. Is the denting pronounced more by increasing the tension of mains, or by increasing the tension of crosses?
I don't think it's either, it's just the string itself which determines whether it will dent or not. Differences in tension won't make a huge difference.
 
#19
Again

I have used it in a full bed and it did not dent from what I can remember. If nobody chimes in you'll have to wait until I test it with gut in the mains.
Like I said, as a cross and guts as mains, it will last forever. 9 months straight with this setup, every aspect of it shines. Stamina, playability, tension stability, power, comfort, feel.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#20
Like I said, as a cross and guts as mains, it will last forever. 9 months straight with this setup, every aspect of it shines. Stamina, playability, tension stability, power, comfort, feel.
I don't quite agree, Alu doesn't last that long (unless you do not hit hard or with a lot of spin). Also, I was referring to Max Power.
 
#21
I am currently experimenting with Babolat VS Team 17 mains at 55lbs and ALU Power 16L crosses at 52lbs in a Pro Staff RF97. After 8 hours, I must say that it is incredibly comfortable, has plenty of feel and good spin and control. The downside is that it may be too powerful. I hit a one handed backhand and the ball is landing long when I take full cut at the ball which I like to do.

I chose ALU Power for the crosses because I have been playing with a full bed of it for several years, generally at 52 to 54lbs tension, and wanted to maintain some consistency in the string bed.

I am expecting about 15 to 20 hours of play out of this setup and normally get about 8 to 10 hours out of a full bed of ALU Power 16L.
 
#22
I am currently experimenting with Babolat VS Team 17 mains at 55lbs and ALU Power 16L crosses at 52lbs in a Pro Staff RF97. After 8 hours, I must say that it is incredibly comfortable, has plenty of feel and good spin and control. The downside is that it may be too powerful. I hit a one handed backhand and the ball is landing long when I take full cut at the ball which I like to do.

I chose ALU Power for the crosses because I have been playing with a full bed of it for several years, generally at 52 to 54lbs tension, and wanted to maintain some consistency in the string bed.

I am expecting about 15 to 20 hours of play out of this setup and normally get about 8 to 10 hours out of a full bed of ALU Power 16L.
I suggest you try increasing the tension on your VS to 60 lbs.
 
#23
My go-to gut/poly combo is Tonic+/Solinco Outlast. Always string the crosses 3 lbs looser than the mains. It's a good combination, even though I have various other poly strings lying around (including packs of 4G), I wouldn't consider them. None are as slick as Outlast, and I need my mains to move well over the crosses.
I also use outlast and a 3 lb difference:). works well for me but so far I have only tried it with klip legend (still using my first job now for 20 hours or so).
 
#24
So I tried out my Tough Gut / Pro Tornado combo today and I only played for an hour, strung up at 58/54 and the string is already very slack. Gut is freying pretty badly also too..


Will update later in the week once I've played abit more with it as I don't want to cut out gut.
 
#25
I suggest you try increasing the tension on your VS to 60 lbs.
I have never seriously considered such a large difference between the main and cross tension, and generally only vary between two and five pounds difference. Would increasing cross tension to 53lbs and main tension to 58lbs accomplish something similar?
 
#26
I have never seriously considered such a large difference between the main and cross tension, and generally only vary between two and five pounds difference. Would increasing cross tension to 53lbs and main tension to 58lbs accomplish something similar?
That's fine. Just remember if you are not used to the higher tension on the poly, you may experience arm discomfort, which may lead to an arm injury.

Increasing the tension on gut gives you more control without it being as harsh on the arm.

* Edit: I notice that you increased the poly tension only by 1 lb. Your body may adjust to that without a hitch.
 
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McLovin

Hall of Fame
#27
So I tried out my Tough Gut / Pro Tornado combo today and I only played for an hour, strung up at 58/54 and the string is already very slack. Gut is freying pretty badly also too..
Tried Tornado years ago. Didn't like it at all (felt tinny), and it is possibly the worst cross for gut mains. Why? Because it is shaped AND twisted, so when it slides, its edges are pretty much cutting into the gut.

IMO, the best cross for gut is a round, smooth, low friction poly. Prestretch it so the tension drop is a bit less, and indoors it can last 2-3 months. Currently I'm using Pacific's cheap poly, Poly Force Original (Silver Series), and am loving it, but I've used many others (MSV Co. Focus, Topspin Concept Pure, Kirschbaum Pro Line II, etc.). There is a difference, you just need to play around a little & see what suits you best.
 
#28
I have used it in a full bed and it did not dent from what I can remember. If nobody chimes in you'll have to wait until I test it with gut in the mains.
I have not used Max Power in a full bed but because of your suggestion have been curious to try it as a cross string with gut as well. Currently have a few sets on hand due to the great pricing. My concern with this is that it is stiffer than ALU Power, at least according to TW University.
 
#29
I am rocking pacific classic and msv co focus. 56/48. I like this stringbed so much that I don't have any interest in trying another poly cross currently.

I was using full gut prior to this. Once I got used to the higher launch angle in the hybrid it has been all good. I am hitting heavier balls with more topspin but still fairly flat. It has made my game better since I have a fuller and slightly more vertical follow through.

Best thing about it: almost everything. Price is good, durability is great, plays consistently, and great feel and spin. It lasts over 30 hours before I can feel the poly cross dying. At that point spin and feel go down a little bit but still playable. I use a microgel radical midplus but also using it in other head frames like prestige and pro tour.

I tried using MSV Focus hex as a cross at the same tension since it is a string that I like in a full bed when using polys. Disappointing. It does have a bit more spin than cofocus but also feels noticably stiffer. Also I can feel the string dying after 6-8 hours which is strange since it takes at least twice as long for a full bed of hex to die on me. The extra spin I get from it seems to be the result of hitting harder as the string bed is stiffer/deader. It seems to overpower the gut feel whereas cofocus melds in to the background.

This is a great thread!
 
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#30
Do you guys feel Tonic is the same as VS in terms of feel? From reading the description it states it is the same just did not pass the quality standards of VS. There will be some gauge inconsistentency.
They are the same as you stated. Guage just isn't perfect. A 16G is more like a 1.33 or <.
 
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SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#32
I have not used Max Power in a full bed but because of your suggestion have been curious to try it as a cross string with gut as well. Currently have a few sets on hand due to the great pricing. My concern with this is that it is stiffer than ALU Power, at least according to TW University.
I don't think you need to worry. Perceived stiffness also takes string movement into account, as better string movement absorbs more energy and thus transmits less shock (it's why dead poly feels so intolerably stiff, even though it has lost tension). Max Power is better than Alu in this regard, so there is not much difference between the strings in comfort IMO.
 
#33
I don't think you need to worry. Perceived stiffness also takes string movement into account, as better string movement absorbs more energy and thus transmits less shock (it's why dead poly feels so intolerably stiff, even though it has lost tension). Max Power is better than Alu in this regard, so there is not much difference between the strings in comfort IMO.
Well then, next up may be Babolat VS Touch 16 mains and Max Power 17 crosses.
 

0d1n

Hall of Fame
#35
Have currently tried 3 gut/poly setups:
- 1 unidentified, received as gift gut main @ 25 kg...already very dry as it was packaged unproperly / Gosen Polylon Polyquest crosses @ 23.5 kg
- 1 Babolat Tonic + Longevity 15g mains @ 25 kg / Gosen Polylon Polyquest crosses 23.5 kg

As one would expect these two setups played very similarly...the babolat gut one being slightly more powerful/comfortable.
I got 15ish hours out of the babolat tonic one until I snapped 2 mains, and I've got 7.5 hours on the other one and it's still going strong. I am using string savers whenever I see some "danger".
Plenty of power, good control, great feel. It's pretty much the best setup I've ever played...in the sense that it played very well and very consistently even through changing temperatures and through the lifespan of the string.
I've had other setups that played great for the first few hours...but I've been affected a lot more by the passing of time and/or the changes in temperature with those strings. Even a syn gut main poly cross plays great for a few hours, but it loses tension a lot more quickly leading to slightly less control and more string movement. It also breaks in less than half the time (in the same thickness). To be fair, if bought in a reel syn gut is also about 15-20 times cheaper than real gut ... so... :).

- 1 Babolat Tonic + Longevity 15g mains @ 24 kg / Gosen Polylon Polyquest crosses 23 kg

I've played this setup for about 3 hours...and I've decided to only use it in practice.
It's perfect for offense as it gives me plenty of power and feel. If I'm in position and balanced I can spin the ball enough and it gives me a ton of oooomph. However I struggle to control the ball when I'm not perfectly balanced and or I'm stretched ...in defense.
Hitting the ball slightly late leads to it being long very easily, and slices also tend to go long too easily when hitting my normal strokes. I'm sure I could adjust, but I don't want to change my strokes to adapt to a particular tension, so I just use it for practice...when it doesn't matter if I hit slightly long.

Waiting for the "unknown gut" to break now so that I can test a similar setup with Pacific Toughgut 1.35 mm in the mains (just bought 2 packs of it...waiting for that test).
If that gives me similar playability and more durability, it may just become my tournament string. Fingers crossed :)


Edit.
P.S. The polylon polyquest used in these setups is the 17G (1.24 mm). It's a string I'm very familiar with since I used it a lot in a full bed...it's cheap, smooth/slippery enough, and I have 2 reels of the stuff so it seemed like a logical option :).
 
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#36
I began my gut/poly "career" with Federer setup, gut/ALU Rough, couple of years ago. Maybe I should go back there, but with the slick ALU? Maybe the shorter life of ALU is not a problem in crosses?
I'm suprised no one has commented on trying Gut with TB Diamond Rough. Might be a good substitute to ALU Rough.

I'm not a fan of gut and 4G. It makes the string bed so stiff and robs the gut of its power. I feel like it dominates the string bed which shouldn't be the case with gut mains.
 

0d1n

Hall of Fame
#38
So I tried out my Tough Gut / Pro Tornado combo today and I only played for an hour, strung up at 58/54 and the string is already very slack. Gut is freying pretty badly also too..


Will update later in the week once I've played abit more with it as I don't want to cut out gut.
If you are talking about Signum Pro Tornado...try Hyperion instead of Tornado if you like that type of string. It is cheaper and it should give you similar characteristics but a ton more durability for the gut since it's a round and slick string.
 
A

Attila_the_gorilla

Guest
#39
I'm wondering why Novak and Roger use Alu Power Rough in the crosses, instead of the slick Alu Power. Any ideas?
 
#40
They can switch their racquets so often that they don't consider whether or not a rougher/textured string in the cross can shred the gut, reducing its playability duration. Perhaps, using the Rough does enhance the spin potential of the string bed overall.
 
#42
They can switch their racquets so often that they don't consider whether or not a rougher/textured string in the cross can shred the gut, reducing its playability duration. Perhaps, using the Rough does enhance the spin potential of the string bed overall.
The ALU Rough texture doesn't damage the gut.
 
#43
I'm suprised no one has commented on trying Gut with TB Diamond Rough. Might be a good substitute to ALU Rough.

I'm not a fan of gut and 4G. It makes the string bed so stiff and robs the gut of its power. I feel like it dominates the string bed which shouldn't be the case with gut mains.
The 4g is incredibly stiff and also has great tension maintenance for a poly. If I were to use it I would decrease tension quite a bit.

I am not too worried about the difference in numbers between mains and crosses. For instance I may use 56-44 lbs with gut and 4g. The stiffness of the 4g will make the actual tension seem much closer than the listed 12 point tension difference.
 
#44
I'm a 5.0 player who hits with a lot of topspin, and a pretty big kick serve, so I need a lot of bite on the ball. I have been using either Signum PPP 17, TournaBHB7, or Solinco tour bite soft 17 in the mains with OG sheep micro 17 in the crosses for years. Like this setup, but have had some very mild shoulder discomfort in the past year and am looking for something a bit arm friendlier.

I think I need a setup that has a high "launch angle". Actually never heard that term before, but I assume it means that when you are hitting a topspin groundstroke the ball grabs and goes high over the net instead of going lower over the net.

Was thinking about trying tonic + 16 mains and Alu Power 16L in the crosses.

How will the feel of this setup compare to my current setup as far as bite and power?

I currently string 51 mains, 54 crosses, what tension do you think I should use for this new setup (Babolat pure drive)
 
#45
Prob a tiny bit less bite and def more power (than tbs in main).

I would suggest you start at approximately 55 main / 50 cross. If you have serious arm problems you might want to consider other cross than alu power, such as pro line 2 or alu fluoro at similar tension.

I'm a 5.0 player who hits with a lot of topspin, and a pretty big kick serve, so I need a lot of bite on the ball. I have been using either Signum PPP 17, TournaBHB7, or Solinco tour bite soft 17 in the mains with OG sheep micro 17 in the crosses for years. Like this setup, but have had some very mild shoulder discomfort in the past year and am looking for something a bit arm friendlier.

I think I need a setup that has a high "launch angle". Actually never heard that term before, but I assume it means that when you are hitting a topspin groundstroke the ball grabs and goes high over the net instead of going lower over the net.

Was thinking about trying tonic + 16 mains and Alu Power 16L in the crosses.

How will the feel of this setup compare to my current setup as far as bite and power?

I currently string 51 mains, 54 crosses, what tension do you think I should use for this new setup (Babolat pure drive)
 
#46
Prob a tiny bit less bite and def more power (than tbs in main).

I would suggest you start at approximately 55 main / 50 cross. If you have serious arm problems you might want to consider other cross than alu power, such as pro line 2 or alu fluoro at similar tension.
Thanks for the tips. My shoulder problem I would rate as a minor annoyance right now. Mostly I just want to try a different setup after years of the same thing, and with a lot of pros using the guy/poly I am curious to try it.
 
#47
Thanks for the tips. My shoulder problem I would rate as a minor annoyance right now. Mostly I just want to try a different setup after years of the same thing, and with a lot of pros using the guy/poly I am curious to try it.
If its a shoulder problem then its probably due to the racquet or your technique, but just in case you should try the gut poly setup.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#48
It should never need to be restrung until it breaks. Power, spin, everything mentioned, I've never seen any sort of diminishment to warrant clipping them out.
Alu isn't especially slick and it loses a lot of tension too. Furthermore, its characteristics do change with time. Don't get me wrong, the hybrid plays exceptionally well initially, but it does not last as long playability wise as others.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#49
The 4g is incredibly stiff and also has great tension maintenance for a poly. If I were to use it I would decrease tension quite a bit.

I am not too worried about the difference in numbers between mains and crosses. For instance I may use 56-44 lbs with gut and 4g. The stiffness of the 4g will make the actual tension seem much closer than the listed 12 point tension difference.
Look at my sig.... Yeah, been there, done that, same result.
 

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
#50
what about GUT and RPM blast 18 G string ? would this give enough power ? and control too? and is this better than the 17 G RPM hybrid?
RPM Blast is the most short lived cross I know of. If you have the money to restring your gut/poly hybrid every few hours, be my guest.

The ALU Rough texture doesn't damage the gut.
It does however reduce string movement and playability duration IME.
 
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