The Prince Phantom 93P is a gift to us from TW - My Review/AMA

Dartagnan64

Legend
Two hander works well, it's solid but one hander feels more natural.

Slice is okay but I like to have a drive aswell
I thought we were talking defense? Wouldn't slice be the better go to to get you back into the point. I've hit some pretty wicked BH slices with this racket while on the run. What I'd like to perfect is the squash shot type FH slice when swung out wide to the FH side. Haven't perfected that yet.
 
One thing I've struggled with from the start is defending with this frame, whenever I'm under pressure I'm struggling. It's easy to hit a half volley and easy to slice, but blocking one handed drive feels like a real challenge for me.
Has anyone else had this ''problem''.

Yes! I initially strung mine w/Cyclone 17 at 45 lbs. and it was too stiff for me. Just got it restrung with 18 g at 40 lbs, and it really helped open up the sweet spot. I used to watch my off-center volleys just fall off my Racquet face, and when stretched to the wings could hardly get the ball back. It did teach me to hit more defensively, and to develop what I call the snakebite - a forehand desperation squash shot on the dead run that often becomes a winner. It’s now one of my secret weapons.

But I digress. I know you probably won’t agree with my string choice, but I like looser thinner polys like, just like many many people advise for this frame.



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I thought we were talking defense? Wouldn't slice be the better go to to get you back into the point. I've hit some pretty wicked BH slices with this racket while on the run. What I'd like to perfect is the squash shot type FH slice when swung out wide to the FH side. Haven't perfected that yet.
You got your post in before I was able to finish mine. I agree completely! I never hit a FH squash shot before I picked up a Phantom. Now it’s my favorite shot! Hard and low to the opposite corner makes your opponent just scratch their head like, “I thought I just won that point!?!?”


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markwillplay

Hall of Fame
Uujhh no. I actually have noticed that I can stab and get out of trouble easier than I thought. This stick has a bit of power I think. I understand what defend means and I do not believe this stick is as much of a henderence as stated. I do think that we get used to larger heads, listen to others, and jump to the conclusion that we are defenseless against a shot slightly outside our strike zone. Weight can work for you.
 

tribesmen

Professional
Jannick - As you probably already know yourself, it is not a racquet, but you. It seems you are too late. Maybe you need to adapt to a higher static weight of racquet and higher SW than you are used to, or just you have to improve footwork to be in time to hit the ball correctly.
 

Jannick

Rookie
Jannick - As you probably already know yourself, it is not a racquet, but you. It seems you are too late. Maybe you need to adapt to a higher static weight of racquet and higher SW than you are used to, or just you have to improve footwork to be in time to hit the ball correctly.
Those are some very bold assumptions.

The racquet has a lower swingweight then what I'm used to.

I never said my timing and technique is perfect, but one thing I've barely ever struggled with with my previous rackets is defending with enough weight transfer.

I think it's hard to judge concretely that my form is insufficient if the problem is relative.




The tips I got about slicing make sense, but hitting a good passing shot while pushed far behind the baseline with slice is hard, I'll try to improve on the slice and lob.
 

tribesmen

Professional
Do not be offended and do not blame the racket for your backhand drive. With every racket in this planet you can hit an excellent backhand drive.

Your slice backhand is ok because it's an emergency exit and allows it for more errors than a drive.
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
The tips I got about slicing make sense, but hitting a good passing shot while pushed far behind the baseline with slice is hard, I'll try to improve on the slice and lob.
The thing about slice defensive shots is they don’t necessarily have to be passing shots to be effective. I tend to slice low over the net and that usually leads to a popped up volley I can do something with. Unless the opponent has great hands, I’m still in the point.

Even with a Pure Drive I’m not driving passing shots from far behind the baseline. I’ll be lobbing lol.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
When it comes to the squash shot with this frame - my god it is good. If you don’t have this shot in your arsenal, spend the time, pay somebody, do whatever it takes to get it down. It will change the way you play defense off the wide FH side of the court.
 

bluebonsai

New User
I strung it up with hex power 18g main at 21kg (46lbs) and strategem 17g cross at (20.5kg) (43lbs).
Tension felt a little too low so upping it with 1kg (2lbs) next time.

One thing I've struggled with from the start is defending with this frame, whenever I'm under pressure I'm struggling. It's easy to hit a half volley and easy to slice, but blocking one handed drive feels like a real challenge for me.
Has anyone else had this ''problem''.
Hey @Jannick, when you say struggling "under pressure" are you finding trouble when pulled wide or when dealing with heavy deep shots? IIRC one of the knocks a TW playtester was when getting pulled wide. Think she normally uses a RF97, and if you're coming from a stiffer more powerful stick you might be finding a similar issue.

IMO this stick really favors linear momentum directly through the ball, not so much vertical 'whippy' strokes, especially when on defense. I hit a flat one-handed backhand with continental almost eastern grip. Forehand is more continental to semi-western and a little more loopy.

As with the previous comments to your thread, the way I've dealt with being pulled wide is to employ more slice. Even off the forehand wing the 93p affords this amazing control and touch that allows you to punch through the ball and get some wicked defensive slices.

Dealing with heavy, deep balls has actually been a challenge for me but off my forehand wing. My OHB on the other hand has never been better in dealing with these shots. Off this side, what I've found is that if you take a short back swing, hit the ball on the rise, and focus on hitting linearly back into the court with a compete follow-through you can deal with the heavy spin and pace and hit absolute lasers in response. Honestly I broke into a few fits of laughter when I first hit these shots because I was never able to do so before and it felt incredible. So when you say you're having trouble hitting blocking one-handed drives, what I'd recommend you try is set your back foot, get your front shoulder down, hit through it more and go ahead and finish your stroke. It might sound a touch cavalier, but you can really turn defense to offense damn quick with this stick by hitting linearly back through the ball.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
Those are some very bold assumptions.

The racquet has a lower swingweight then what I'm used to.

I never said my timing and technique is perfect, but one thing I've barely ever struggled with with my previous rackets is defending with enough weight transfer.

I think it's hard to judge concretely that my form is insufficient if the problem is relative.




The tips I got about slicing make sense, but hitting a good passing shot while pushed far behind the baseline with slice is hard, I'll try to improve on the slice and lob.
If your weight transfer is good, the racquet is not going to be an issue long term. This is a SW or static weight thing where you are used to something that blocks the ball back at a certain depth and now you simply have to adjust to the P93 or add lead to it if it comes to that. It’s odd to me because a 350 gram frame with a 330 SW plays so solid that I don’t have issues blocking balls back when needed.

But it’s also pretty rare that I just block balls on defense, I take a full swing or slice back. I mainly block back serves and of course, volleys.

Just so I understand, you hit passing shots on defense by simply blocking the ball back?
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
When it comes to the squash shot with this frame - my god it is good. If you don’t have this shot in your arsenal, spend the time, pay somebody, do whatever it takes to get it down. It will change the way you play defense off the wide FH side of the court.
Agree. That shot was never in my arsenal because it was awful with other rackets. But I’ve recently discovered it with the 93p and need to get it down because it’s awesome when I hit it right.
 

atelic

Rookie
Hey @Jannick, when you say struggling "under pressure" are you finding trouble when pulled wide or when dealing with heavy deep shots? IIRC one of the knocks a TW playtester was when getting pulled wide. Think she normally uses a RF97, and if you're coming from a stiffer more powerful stick you might be finding a similar issue.

IMO this stick really favors linear momentum directly through the ball, not so much vertical 'whippy' strokes, especially when on defense. I hit a flat one-handed backhand with continental almost eastern grip. Forehand is more continental to semi-western and a little more loopy.
Yeah, it's tough to figure out the exact shot in question here. I assumed Jannick was talking about a one hand block service return. Need more context on the shot in question.

As for your forehand, I would suggest trying to really end the stoke over your head versus across the shoulder on the whippy defensive shot. You may be doing this already. But I find that to be the difference in being able to flatten out the offensive shot with this racket, with standard finish across body or shoulder, and generating massive topspin when needed by finishing above the head.
 

Jannick

Rookie
Specifically struggling with an open stance one handed backhand. Being pushed so far behind that you can't step into the ball.
Next time I will try to swing fuller instead of doing the short swing I use on defense. Hope it works.

Also about the squash shot, it's a shot I rarely play, haven't knowingly tried it yet with the 93p. Looking forward to trying it.
 

atelic

Rookie
When you say "so far behind" are you referring to the baseline?

I feel perhaps that there are balls you need to be stepping into and taking on the rise, or completely of the air and coming to net on. When warming up or if you're just hitting, try playing inside or on the baseline and never backing up to develop timing and comfort with this court position.

Power should be coming from weight transfer and body rotation primarily. An open stance OHBH is going to be pretty tough to generate pace on, and will probably fatigue your arm pretty quickly, no?
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
I should have said that I do think defending is easier with a bigger face, no doubt...but that is only relative. I don't think it is that difficult to defend with this stick. I would have to admit that when I am pulle wide I usually do go to a slice, either forehand or backhand. unless I can really get there early. I am actually trying to work more on my forehand and backhand slice. I made myself come over the top of my backhand to get better at it. I played lots of matches where I just told myself to come over the top no matter what. This improved my 1hbh topspin. I need that good slice back to come in on though. I think the forehand slice iw way underused at my level (4.0). I know a couple of 4.5 players that use it a lot and it really throws pushers off.
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
Just ordered a second 93p since I’m here in Palm Desert and can get free delivery and no duties.
Will feel good to have matching sticks even though string breakage isn’t a big thing for me.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
Specifically struggling with an open stance one handed backhand. Being pushed so far behind that you can't step into the ball.
Next time I will try to swing fuller instead of doing the short swing I use on defense. Hope it works.

Also about the squash shot, it's a shot I rarely play, haven't knowingly tried it yet with the 93p. Looking forward to trying it.
Ok i think i get it. You made it sound like you were stepping into the shot, blocking it only and were able to hit winners that way.

Not saying you are old but thats what we call an old man shot. I know that one real well, as ive seen it many times. Its a smart way to redirect power when you have no other option. Honestly it works best when the ball isnt pulling you wide. Thats a shot that tweeners are simply better on. With tweeners you gain that trampoline power and lose control and touch. You just have to decide what shots you use the most and choose the racquet accordingly.
 
Specifically struggling with an open stance one handed backhand. Being pushed so far behind that you can't step into the ball.
Next time I will try to swing fuller instead of doing the short swing I use on defense. Hope it works.

Also about the squash shot, it's a shot I rarely play, haven't knowingly tried it yet with the 93p. Looking forward to trying it.
Maybe there should be a whole new thread about the 93P and the squash shot!

The 93P may not be what made me discover it (just this year), but it’s what made me fall in love with it.

Of course when it’s coming wide AND low, like ankle/shin height, it’s hard to have room for that motion.

I tried a gut/poly hybrid in my PPP 100P, and it gave that extra punch that allowed a wrist flick to do the work.

Lowering the all poly tension has helped, but makes me curious to try a guy/poly in the 93P.

knowing the next 93 is likely to be a 14/18, I’m looking at my old POG as a backup frame. Any thought about best stringing options for this classic frame?










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graycrait

Hall of Fame
POG and Phantom 93 are different head shapes. I highly doubt grommets will fit
Dang it!

And then @dak95_00 tells me this: The Graphite Pro grommets are smaller than the POG 90 grommets. The 14x18 pattern is the same and the holes line up. I have 9 POG 90s and 14 other 90 14x18s.

@jonestim , I have no doubt what you say is correct, but that won't stop me from getting at least one set and getting out my heat gun.
 

Ultra 2

Professional
Keep hearing about the 14x18 pattern coming and it’s almost February. Even at 16x19 I will most likely be a buyer.

The P93 has all the features I am interested in: Head size, weight, beam width, aramid vibration dampening material (textreme/twaron/Kevlar), and a leather grip to boot.

There’s a guy on this website that loves the Austrian made frames that are embedded with the Magical twaron material.. and has been silent on this thread. The current offering would have sparked his interest.. if not for the round head shape and he is a devout follower of the Head religion. Wondering if he has tried this one.

I do know that if a 14x18 comes out.. I would have a lighter wallet and my racquet collection would most likely be decimated.
 

JOSHL

Hall of Fame
Keep hearing about the 14x18 pattern coming and it’s almost February. Even at 16x19 I will most likely be a buyer.

The P93 has all the features I am interested in: Head size, weight, beam width, aramid vibration dampening material (textreme/twaron/Kevlar), and a leather grip to boot.

There’s a guy on this website that loves the Austrian made frames that are embedded with the Magical twaron material.. and has been silent on this thread. The current offering would have sparked his interest.. if not for the round head shape and he is a devout follower of the Head religion. Wondering if he has tried this one.

I do know that if a 14x18 comes out.. I would have a lighter wallet and my racquet collection would most likely be decimated.
The current 93p doesn’t have twaron.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
I think vsbabolat would like this frame a lot. An awful lot. But more for a little more modern version of the prestige mid. Its not the exact same thing as an old prestige but that is good.
 
But is has textreme, and the feel and touch of frames made in that era. I’m a believer of this.
Yes, but just to be clear, Textreme isn’t a material like aramid (bka by the trade names Twaron/Kevlar), it’s a proprietary weave of the material (in this case Graphite/ carbon, but the Textreme weave is in the Twaron of the Beasts and new tours) confuses yet?

Instead of the fine weave, it’s got that checkerboard look, meaning longer sections of straight fibers, making it stronger. If everyone already knows that, sorry for restating the obvious.


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Ultra 2

Professional
Whatever magic dust it is, it is translating it to a better touch/feel frame which is lacking from many current offerings that are out there. That’s what matters the most.. to me.
 
Whatever magic dust it is, it is translating it to a better touch/feel frame which is lacking from many current offerings that are out there. That’s what matters the most.. to me.
True. The irony is, if you look on the Textreme website, they say its main benefits are stiffness & lightness, the 2 things no one would ever associate with the Phantoms.


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scotus

G.O.A.T.
Just in case anyone wants to know. I put up my 93p right over my exo3 graphite 93 and the mains match up right on with spacing. The crosses are a bit closer together.
Exo3 Graphite 93 has 16 mains, whereas 93p has 18 mains. They can't match up exactly.
 

am1899

Hall of Fame
Well, I had to send my demos back last Friday. After a few hits this week, I was very impressed with the 93p. But, even as I was dropping the demos at UPS, I still had some lingering doubts about the weight of the frame (I am used to lighter frames), and the 18x20 pattern (have never played this pattern in 20+ years of playing the sport). But in spite of all that, I just took the plunge and ordered a 93p, and a set of RS Lyon to try for giggles. Moving from the PA to the 93p is going to be a significant adjustment. But I suppose, there is enough demand for this frame that if I find I cannot make the adjustment...someone will take the 93p off my hands. <Fingers crossed>
 
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Ultra 2

Professional
True. The irony is, if you look on the Textreme website, they say its main benefits are stiffness & lightness, the 2 things no one would ever associate with the Phantoms.


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Yeah, There’s so many ways to construct a tennis racquet, how the fibers are laid, woven, type or resin, how much resin, and whatever other materials used in the composition. Whatever they did, they got this one right.

As the OP stated in the title of the thread, this is a frame that TW put out for many of us in mind. A player’s frame that has almost all of the features and qualities that we’ve asked for on this forum.
 

Ultra 2

Professional
Would the 93P be denser than a Pro Staff 85? I like Natural Gut 16 gauge I don't want it to be too boardy.
The PS85 is a smaller and narrower frame than the 93P so the Prince would have a noticeably more open pattern than the PS85. That said, i’m Not a string breaker so I prefer the 17 gauge.
 

jonestim

Hall of Fame
Would the 93P be denser than a Pro Staff 85? I like Natural Gut 16 gauge I don't want it to be too boardy.
93P is less open.

Outside mains on the PS85 are about 3/4 the way between the last two mains on the 93P so the 16 center mains on the 93P are significantly tighter.

Top cross is at the same point on both frames. Last cross is actually lower on the 85.

Use 17G
 

atelic

Rookie
Alright fellow 93p crew. Last couple of posts are making me want to play with gut.

I usually play full bed of hyper g anywhere from 46 to 50lbs. Same tension mains and cross.

Happy to take string setup recommendations and test someone's out.
 

taylor15

Rookie
I am using a hybrid of Klip legend/velocity...but I may eventually just move to velocity 17 in a full bed. I love that string.
I’ve never tried velocity. How does it compare to NRG2 or maybe technifibre multifeel? I have several sets of each of those i could try. Currently I have nrg2 mains and alu power crosses and too am thinking if trying a full multi.
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
I think it is lower powered and seems to last longer for me than NRg2. You need to string it mid tension max. It also has really good spin (at least for me). It is rather muted but I like that feel myself.
 

edelp

Rookie
i tested side by side velocity and nrg2, but in another frame (DR98l) and have to agree with markwillplay. nrg2 is more powerful, lasts less and has less spin... I quite like this velocity string and will try it at one moment on the 93P.
 

ej28405

New User
You’d likely prefer 17g NG in this frame. I found it was too board like with 16g strings.
I agree with this 100%. I actually tried Wilson and Babolat 16g NG in the 93p and it was extremely 'boardy'. I can't remember what tension I had it at but it was on the higher side of the tension range because I was trying to tame some of the power than comes along with NG.
 
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