The Prince Phantom 93P is a gift to us from TW - My Review/AMA

Faris

Professional
I haven't hit with 14x18 but the 18x20 93P is a beautifully balanced stick. Even if I did add weight I would make sure the balance stayed the same. If adding weight to hoop, make sure to counter weight at handle. I hit with it stock whenever I hit with it every now and then, and I have had absolutely zero issues but that is just me and everyone swings different and have different preferences.
 

Anton

Legend
wex


I think the static weight of my 93P is at max weight already, but I agree that it could use more stability. I've wondered what the effect of adding weight only to 12, 2/10 and 3/9 o'clock be. I'd like the extra SW, but like the ATP style swing. I'd also consider replacing leather with synthetic to reduce weight. Which would make it even more HH and have a higher SW with added weight to head and less weight at tail.
Lead on 93P V-throat is the best bang per gram from my testing.
 

Tommy Haas

Hall of Fame
Lead on 93P V-throat is the best bang per gram from my testing.
Thanks. This is what I trying to get at. Did you find weight placed right in the middle of the yoke provided the best bang for the gram or lower towards the V or higher towards the Y?
 

stephenclown

Professional
On the contrary I found lead in the throat took away that magic manoeuvrability, especially at the net. It was more solid, but I wanted that flex and whip. I just have it from 10-2, 2 layers each side. Dunno the swing weight but it feels amazing.
 

hurworld

Hall of Fame
gee its already 9 points HL, I'm not sure it needs much more tail weighting. Did you remove the leather grip?
No I didn't remove the leather grip. With strings and OG mine is/was 32cm balance (7.5 HL?). I'll probably need to re-measure again just to be sure.

I personally would disagree with that, plenty of weight on that handle as far as I'm concerned...but trying it for yourself is really the only way to confirm.

Problem with theorizing about adding weight is a lot like theorizing about rackets you havent played with yet. You have certian pre-conceptions (that with experience turn out true more often) but you really don't know for sure untill you actually try it.

My take on 93P is that it's plenty fast, and it's bigger problem in stock form is stability. I have weight on the throat and loop sides, which makes volleying easy peasy - just touch the ball with strings and you get solid voley.
Thanks, I have no problem swinging it from baseline. I just want to have it more maneuverable up at the net, that's all. I'll give it a go (5g blu-tack under butt cap) next time I play doubles and see if it helps.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
No I didn't remove the leather grip. With strings and OG mine is/was 32cm balance (7.5 HL?). I'll probably need to re-measure again just to be sure.


Thanks, I have no problem swinging it from baseline. I just want to have it more maneuverable up at the net, that's all. I'll give it a go (5g blu-tack under butt cap) next time I play doubles and see if it helps.
It sounds like yours may be off spec. If that is the case i think the added weight at the butt will help you a lot.
 

Anton

Legend
Thanks. This is what I trying to get at. Did you find weight placed right in the middle of the yoke provided the best bang for the gram or lower towards the V or higher towards the Y?
I have .25” lead tape spanning from top and coming in one inch short of bottom of the inside of throat.
 

spinerella

New User
I personally would disagree with that, plenty of weight on that handle as far as I'm concerned...but trying it for yourself is really the only way to confirm.

Problem with theorizing about adding weight is a lot like theorizing about rackets you havent played with yet. You have certian pre-conceptions (that with experience turn out true more often) but you really don't know for sure untill you actually try it.

My take on 93P is that it's plenty fast, and it's bigger problem in stock form is stability. I have weight on the throat and loop sides, which makes volleying easy peasy - just touch the ball with strings and you get solid voley.
Could you upload some pics showing where you added weight in the throat. Thanks!
 

FourOutOfFive

New User
After some more playing time with my 18x20s I’m looking for a bit more stability (on volleys and returns) and plow through. I don’t want to add too much weight since I enjoy the whippy balance, but I want to see some noticeable improvement so I can get some confidence on challenging shots. Which placement have you all found better on the racquet, 2&10 or 3&9?
 

hurworld

Hall of Fame
After some more playing time with my 18x20s I’m looking for a bit more stability (on volleys and returns) and plow through. I don’t want to add too much weight since I enjoy the whippy balance, but I want to see some noticeable improvement so I can get some confidence on challenging shots. Which placement have you all found better on the racquet, 2&10 or 3&9?
I think weights in the throat is best to increase overall mass (and hence plow-through) without affecting balance (and hence whippiness).
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
I'm fairly sure this gift is from Prince as well as TW. The amount of good frames they've done recently suggests that their development team knows what they are doing.
I think they’ve taken the strong feedback from the 93p and expanded the Phantom line accordingly.
 

Tao69

Rookie
I think they’ve taken the strong feedback from the 93p and expanded the Phantom line accordingly.
It's a good response to market demand by Prince if that's the case, most companies assume they know what the market wants or believe they can just set the market. They haven't tried to make this stick for everyone, but for a target demographic and it's great to see.
 

Boubi

Rookie
Tested it outside, it was not the same story...still a nice racquet but you get pushed around by heavy shots....in comparison the babolat aero pure tour helped me much more and was comfortable enough...
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
Getting pushed around with a 350 gram frame is a timing issue. Not the racquet.
I’m way better going blow for blow with the 93p against heavy hitters. The Phantom 100s don’t plow as nicely for me. Even if I’m late I can arm a flat shot back with depth and pace.

But admittedly I play a lot of guys with pusher strokes so I’m usually the guy producing pace.

Of course I’ve played with a lot of Babolat owners and few of them hit with big pace. The hardest shots I face come from guys using Wilson Prostaffs and 6.1s. The hardest hitter I’ve faced ever does use a Babolat though. An old Control Tour.
 

Boubi

Rookie
Around 5.5-6? At that level you will know exactly what you are, or are you talking about a different ratings system than USTA?
Another rating. To give an idea, we are both ''première série, -4 and -15'', difficult to precisely say to which usta ranking it can really be compared
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
We both have the same level around 5.5 - 6, pushed around because less manœuvrable, speed sometimes matters...
I’d think as you get better, plow matters more than speed. Most ATP pros use rackets in the 340-360 gm static weight range.

I’m not in their class or your class but one would like to think that as you increase in pace you also increase in footwork and anticipation, so that you are still setup in plenty of time to swing a 350 gm racquet.
 
I’d think as you get better, plow matters more than speed. Most ATP pros use rackets in the 340-360 gm static weight range.

I’m not in their class or your class but one would like to think that as you increase in pace you also increase in footwork and anticipation, so that you are still setup in plenty of time to swing a 350 gm racquet.
I just played with the same player at the same court where I demoed the 93P last year. At the time I struggled with getting enough power being pulled wide on ground strokes, and dumping all my volleys into the net. I gave the demo back thinking, “someday...”

Finally bought a 93P at a Thanksgiving “Black Friday” sale, and I’ve been playing with it for the last several months. This time (strung at least 15 lbs looser) I really appreciated the plow on those wide shots, and the effortless maneuverability at the net. No significant changes to the racquet, but playing with it has trained me to up my game enough to use its strengths rather than focus on what I saw as its weaknesses.

I keep messing with other racquets, but I keep coming back to this one when it matters.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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Boubi

Rookie
I’d think as you get better, plow matters more than speed. Most ATP pros use rackets in the 340-360 gm static weight range.

I’m not in their class or your class but one would like to think that as you increase in pace you also increase in footwork and anticipation, so that you are still setup in plenty of time to swing a 350 gm racquet.
''Plenty of time'' is really theoritical i am afraid. What pleased me with the pure aero is that it is not too light (not to get pushed around) and in the same time is light enough to react in emergency situations. I did not say 93p is a bad racquet but it will not help you if you are under a big pressure, launch angle is low too , it will play short if you do not always pay attention. That being said i understand it pleases a lot of people
 

Faris

Professional
''Plenty of time'' is really theoritical i am afraid. What pleased me with the pure aero is that it is not too light (not to get pushed around) and in the same time is light enough to react in emergency situations. I did not say 93p is a bad racquet but it will not help you if you are under a big pressure, launch angle is low too , it will play short if you do not always pay attention. That being said i understand it pleases a lot of people
I agree. Quite a few have said that about 93P including myself here in this thread. Come crunch time if one is late to the ball and hustling about, you won't find the power and forgiveness in 93P you do from tweeners. Thats a simple fact. It is a great racquet nevertheless. But one has to acknowledge ones own strengths and weaknesses.
 

Tao69

Rookie
''Plenty of time'' is really theoritical i am afraid. What pleased me with the pure aero is that it is not too light (not to get pushed around) and in the same time is light enough to react in emergency situations. I did not say 93p is a bad racquet but it will not help you if you are under a big pressure, launch angle is low too , it will play short if you do not always pay attention. That being said i understand it pleases a lot of people
There’s nothing free or easy about the 93P, it keeps you honest about where your game is at, that includes any poor preparation, timing issues or being in more defensive situations where a different racquet might bail you out. What it does do is force you to focus, and with that comes improvement and eventually better tennis.
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
''Plenty of time'' is really theoritical i am afraid. What pleased me with the pure aero is that it is not too light (not to get pushed around) and in the same time is light enough to react in emergency situations. I did not say 93p is a bad racquet but it will not help you if you are under a big pressure, launch angle is low too , it will play short if you do not always pay attention. That being said i understand it pleases a lot of people
Sometimes short works. I've finessed more than my share of sharply angled droppers when pulled out wide with the 93P that led to winning points. But I'm lucky enough to play with the 40+ crowd so that helps give some advantage to the short ball.

I played for years with a Aero Pro Team and PD+ and never felt those frames did me any good when stretched out on the run. I was always going to lose the point unless I hit a miracle lob into the far corner.

But I do get the lower launch angle issue. I've put some balls into the net that otherwise would go over with a higher launch angle racket. But the corollary is also true that I've hit balls through the court faster because of the lower launch angle that's put me into the drivers seat of a point.

Problem is people have preconceived notions and then use confirmation bias to regale a racquets flaws. It's heavy so they recall the times they swung late. It's small head so they recall the frame shots. Even though it may not be happening nearly as often as they suppose.

Fact is, if you have been used to 12 oz racquets it will feel right. If you'e been used to 11 oz racquets it won't feel as right. We are what we've grown used to. Then we try to come up for reasons why its the racquets fault.
 

mad dog1

G.O.A.T.
Another hint with 93p is that, to my knowledge, no single pro uses it
Pros typically like to use frames from racquet companies that will pay them. Prince with its recent financial troubles probably isn’t in a good position to do so. Just a guess.

For the record, I have a pp 93p 18/20 and it’s a great frame but it’s not the best one for me. Too much weight to accelerate quickly sometimes to execute certain shots.
 

grhcan99

Semi-Pro
Another hint with 93p is that, to my knowledge, no single pro uses it
Babolat would really be happy to hear that their marketing works and that the money they dole out for sponsoring Nadal and the other pros are paying off. You do know that Nadal's racquet is not what is sold at the stores, right?
 

mhkeuns

Hall of Fame
I can understand almost all reasons for not liking the 93P. I understand that it isn't for everyone, as I thought initially (*I thought it was the best stick for everyone who had decent strokes and wanted to play attacking style - obviously it doesn't work for everyone.). What I don't understand is how some people crap on the frame because no professional players use it. I play my best tennis with it, and I think if it was made by Wilson, Babolat or Head, we would have some pros playing with it, or at least some pros will play with the 93P paint job.
 

FourOutOfFive

New User
I can understand almost all reasons for not liking the 93P. I understand that it isn't for everyone, as I thought initially (*I thought it was the best stick for everyone who had decent strokes and wanted to play attacking style - obviously it doesn't work for everyone.). What I don't understand is how some people crap on the frame because no professional players use it. I play my best tennis with it, and I think if it was made by Wilson, Babolat or Head, we would have some pros playing with it, or at least some pros will play with the 93P paint job.
100% agree with this. Not everyone is going to like something, and I respect anyone who can lay down their criticisms in an articulate manner. However if you bring in stupid reasonings and don’t have any idea what the hell you’re talking about.... Yeah, check please.
 

kenyee

Semi-Pro
Fact is, if you have been used to 12 oz racquets it will feel right. If you'e been used to 11 oz racquets it won't feel as right. We are what we've grown used to. Then we try to come up for reasons why its the racquets fault.
That's probably the best indicator...I've tried lighter racquets and hated them...have to weight them up to at least 12oz or my swing and timing is enough to bother my arm :-(
 

Boubi

Rookie
Babolat would really be happy to hear that their marketing works and that the money they dole out for sponsoring Nadal and the other pros are paying off. You do know that Nadal's racquet is not what is sold at the stores, right?
OK, then let me know which pro is using a 93 sq inch racquet ?
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
Fed has no trouble with a 90 playing the guys he plays now. No doubt he has a bit more power now, but 93 vs 100 can be done. Kids just don’t grow up playing with them anymore.
 

Tao69

Rookie
It proves that this 93P is just a good racquet for recreational players
Yeah, I’d agree with that. I found myself migrating up to bigger racquets, probably for a few reasons; market offerings, hype and I couldn’t help myself. In reality though at the recreational level your racquet is probably the smallest area of improvement you could make, so the 93P is just as good as any other and a lot of fun to play with.
 

Tao69

Rookie
Why no love for the 93P 14x18. It's a BEAST!
I have both, I prefer the 18x20, but that’s probably my style of play (All Court).

I can’t quite gel with the 14x18, it’s fun to sit on the baseline with, but I find once I start moving into the court it’s just not as precise as I would like. Similar with serves, great spin, but don’t hit my spots with the same consistency. I also send way more shots long with it. Still, it’s fun to use it now and then.
 
OK, then let me know which pro is using a 93 sq inch racquet ?
Grigor Dimitrov has mostly played with an 18x17 prostaff rok 93. I believe Robin Haase only recently switched from the prestige classic mid. Of course Federer didn’t switch from the pro staff 90 till his thirties. Additionally, Head size doesn’t directly indicate ease of play. I imagine that Novak’s 95” is probably very similar in forgiveness to many of the Prince 93” frames.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah this frame plays the same as a 95 honestly. I don’t think too many would debate that. Plenty of pros use 95 size heads. At the end of the day, thats truly meaningless. Any high level player would know this already.
 

FourOutOfFive

New User
It proves that this 93P is just a good racquet for recreational players
What? Just because the racquet doesn't work for you, it automatically rules it out of any form of competitive tennis? There are many pros using similar frames to the 93P.

Now, if we dig into what you specifically didn't like about the frame, you mention multiple times about the lack of maneuverability. You must be very used to 11oz frames, because this racquet is possibly the fastest swinging 12oz stick you can buy. I don't know of a single professional player that plays with a racquet under 12oz, and slamming a racquet of this weight for maneuverability issues when you're just not used to it is a bit ignorant.

If you don't like the frame, cool. I respect your opinion. But then going about and saying this racquet is only good for recreational play is just flat out factually incorrect. I don't think you have any idea what you're talking about and your blind criticisms have done absolutely nothing for this thread.
 
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