The problem with Roger Federer G.O.A.T. claims: Nadal and Djokovic rivalries
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Win rate at first 3 slam finals on preferred surface
Fed: 100
Wawrinka 100
Nadal 100
Murray 0 (novaks main comp lol)
Novak 33
Chockovic? Bear in mind novak choking basically all key moments to mugs e.g. choking no1 to murray wtf match, choking first career slam, cygs, tying fed wtf, tying nadal masters count all choked to mugs utter mugs. Does this mental fragility plaace novak a tier 4 ATG?
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CYGS
Legend
I think you need to improve your comprehension skills. The article suggests that Fed is the third wheel not Djokovic. Also are you one of the recently banned Fed fans?
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
I am a zverev fan
CYGS
Legend
But I don't see you pushing Fed down the rank because he also got straightset by Zverev at WTF. Not really convincing. Try harder.
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
My friend i agree wiyh you Fed is a weak era slam inflated mug.... just as djokovic is... but what makes it doubly worse for djokovic is that not only is he weak era slam inflater, the few slams he does have which are resonable or any achievements djokovic has are me too records and rest on djokovic beating fed (who is an inflated mug)... made worse by beating the weak era version of fed!!
The future is zverev. Even baby zverev is superior to novak peak world no 1 in red hot form level. Lol imagine if novak had peak zverev to deal with instead of weak era inflaters fedal. Novak would literally have 0-2 slams max, 10 masters and 0 WTF
D
Deleted member 757377
Guest
I won't deny it, he should have won 1-2 more slam finals against Murray and Wawrinka, who are miles ahead Philippoussis or Baghdatis by the way.
Now let's get back to Fed's embarassing score vs ATGs.
D
Deleted member 757377
Guest
@jonnyhomeboy9851
Grand Slam score:
2012-13 Murray: 39-5 (88.6%)
2015-16 Wawrinka: 37-6 (86%)
Djokovic should have won some of those slam finals, but don't you dare call Murray and Wawrinka mugs.
Grand Slam score:
2012-13 Murray: 39-5 (88.6%)
2015-16 Wawrinka: 37-6 (86%)
Djokovic should have won some of those slam finals, but don't you dare call Murray and Wawrinka mugs.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
CYGS
Legend
Talk to me when Zverev makes it to a slam semi-final.
Plamen1234
Hall of Fame
Face it - both Murray and Stan are mugs and your favorite got embarrassed by them in 4 GS Finals.US Open 2012 final - pathetic match from Djokovic.Wimbledon 2013 final - Djokovic embarrassed by Murray in straight sets lol.FO 2015 final - Peak Djokovic who supposedly is the best player ever according to some destroyed by Stan in 4 sets and of course US Open 2016 where he got destroyed again by Stan
CYGS
Legend
Let's try Djokodal are mugs and Fed the supposed goat were destroyed by both of them in more slam finals than my fingers can count. oh wait.
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
If Murray and Wawrinka are mugs how do you call Baghdatis, Philippoussis, Gonzalez, Cilic, Del Potro, Soderling?
If Murray is a mug how do you call Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, no.7/8 Agassi?
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
They are multi slam champions soley due to chokovics chokeability in finals. Same story with zverev and kcahoniv now wtf and masters winners due to chokovic.
Novak is the king maker he makes mugs legends. He created stanimal.
Fed and nadal may lose to fed nadal and djokovic but they wim grandslam finals they are supossed to woth only 1 exception each player del potro and wawrinka for injured nadal. Djokovic wins a few slam finals bs fedal but loses left right and centre to any other mug. If you said fed just lost a slam final to berdych or nadal did i would spit out my drink if novak did id be like oh again chokovic
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Thats what i mean. Baby mug zverev already 2-0 in finals vs peak in form world no 1 djokovic and still getting tossed around like trash. Imagine when zverev peaks and when novak improves even more in next 2 to 3 years. Still a lot of improvements for djokovic coming in terms of serve and tactics. Hes hitting cleaner then ever and redirecting more as well far more astute play. Baby zverev will still crush him
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
You simply cannot put on the same level all players who are not the Big3.
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Yeah thats exactly my point. I wont hold it against fed djokovic and nadal losing to each other more than needed but there losses to mugs, slam virgins and non ATGS are not acceptable. The difference between chokovic is that he loses to mugs despite being no1 in red hot form and peak. Also he cannot be relied to get the job done in slam finals versus mugs. Nadal vs ferrer fed vs baghdatis i dont even need to watch those slam finals.... with novak you just dont know whats going to happen
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Additionally to the mug losses with peak in form novak going randomly AWOL in 2017 2018 and also after 2011 (compare that to fed 18/19 slam finals), the whole pepe saga, yo yo dieting and hiring firing hiring his team and as you said yourself UNDERESTIMATING wawrinka (lmao) is novak in fact an ATG? You have to consider 14 slams is not the same in the career inflation era and certainly not after sampras, nadal and fed showed it was possible. Additionally novak doesnt have hardly any strong slam wins. He beats fed a few times but fed is overrated due to weak era so novak iant beating someone of feds calibre really. However more harming to novak is he actually lost to this overrated federer WHEN THIS FED WAS EVEN WEAKER OLDER AND DECLINED THEN HIS WEAK ERA SELF lol
Bobby Jr
G.O.A.T.
Oh ****. Must we suffer another list-making muppet saying the same crap that's been said by the same sort of people for the last 5+ years.
Tennis is NOT a head to head sport. Period. It's a "who is left standing at the end of a tournament holding the trophy" sport. That's what matters.
And that's where Federer is far and away the greater player than Nadal and Djokovic at this point in time.
Bobby Jr
G.O.A.T.
Both completely ******** stats which mean nothing, not least because they are perverted by how long, and when, a player was ranked at the top. The longer you're there the more you've obviously won - but also means the more opportunities for the others to play against you when you're #1.
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
@jonnyhomeboy9851
Most slam matches won in a season:
Murray 23
Wawrinka 21
Del Potro 17
Hewitt 17
Roddick 17
Cilic 15
Gonzalez 14
Safin 14
Soderling 14
Baghdatis 13
Tsonga 13
Anderson 12
Philippoussis 12
Most slam matches won in a season:
Murray 23
Wawrinka 21
Del Potro 17
Hewitt 17
Roddick 17
Cilic 15
Gonzalez 14
Safin 14
Soderling 14
Baghdatis 13
Tsonga 13
Anderson 12
Philippoussis 12
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
2 errors. Firatly Murray and wawrinka are inflated due to novak letting them win
Secondly murray ans wawrinka could have 10000 slam wins. Its irrelavant. They would never win an in form world no 1 nadal or federer. However, any mug cpuld beat a peak in form novak in any final no issue
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
Murray and Wawrinka were 0-2 and 1-1 against Djokovic in the seasons they got to 23 and 21 slam wins.
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Irrelvant. Put it this way. How many slams would wawrinka and murray prevent a peak nadal or fed? 0. They are fedal slam pigeons. They are even novaks pigeons outside slams. But under pressure novak is a complete flake so novak cocked it up in slams as per usual. Choked the cygs, choked when he should have got the career slam, choked when should have beat nadal at RG, choked when should have beat fed rg 2011 as he would have beaten nadal, choked when could have got wtf and masters record and to utter mugs. Now add in novaks general chokovicness e.g. pepe, disappearing in 2017 2018 after 2008 and after 2011. Chokovic
Lets not emotions cloud judgement. Lets look at the stats:
Slam final lossess suffered at hands of mugs, slam virgins and non ATGs
Federer 1/30 (3 percent - arguably 0/30)
Nadal 1/24 (4 percent again outstanding)
Djokovic 4/23 (SEVENTEEN PERCENT)
Mugovic/chokovic?
This alone puts chokovic at tier 3/4 ATG max
Murray and wawrinka could have 10000 slam wins. Its irrelavant. They would never win an in form world no 1 nadal or federer. However, any mug could beat a peak in form novak in any final no issue
CYGS
Legend
No that's not even remotely relevant to Zverev not making past the qf at the slam level. You need to stay in school and learn how to read.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
No idea what you are on about. Baby zverev and baby kachinov are tossing like trash peak in form world no 1 better than ever djokovic AT WTF FINAL AND MASTERS FINAL level. Worst of all chokovic is actually in red hot form world no 1 too. If djokovic had to face peak zverev and peak kachinov in 2008-2018 the chokovic would have 0-4 slams total and 2-10 masters max 0 WTFs
Djokovic is so lucky to have weak eras like he did and face overated post peak fed.
CYGS
Legend
Still not what I meant. Stay in school, kiddo.
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
First yes i agree most players you mentioned are mugs bar safin and aggassi. This is what makes novak even more beta as i will explain... novak holds no records in following:
Total slams
Wtf
Masters 1000
Atp 500
Atp 250
Olympics
Ye no 1
Weeks no 1
Consec no 1
Any consistency records e.g. no 1 or no 2, 1 slam every 10 years (lol this is same guy who went bye bye after 2008, 2011 and in 2017 and 2018)
His only claim to fame is beating fed and nadal occasuonally. Firstly this is negated by losing 50 times to them too but also means novaks wins vs fed arent even impressive to begin with as fed is overrated. Then add in chokovics mug losses too every mug under the sun even in finals lol
You know this anyway as you call world no 1 3 time slam champ safin a mug and aggassi well what does that make tsonga, cilic, zverev, kachinov, 30 plus nadal, 37 year fed lololol
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Baby zverev is not in school. Yes he is a mug but He is tossing peak chokovic around like trash. Hit me back when peak djokovic finally wins a final versus even baby zverev
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Holy moly, I never thought about Djoko not holding any of those records.
And now the Evolution of the game has brought Zverev in.
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Holy moly, I never thought about Djoko not holding any of those records.
And now the Evolution of the game has brought Zverev in.
Baby zverev that annihilited peak in form world no 1 red hot djokovic may be a mug but he still tossed around novak like trash. 2-0 in finals so far. The game evolves so much peak novaks game has become beta. Just imagine when baby zverev peaks approx age 27 and is tossing around an even better version of novak (novak has improved serve greatly, is more aggressive, tactically astute and motivated. I estimate he will continue to improve until age 38 if he remains this current healthy weight)
Novak is just lucky he could scramble a few wins in the weak era and especially 2015-2018. Shame he choked and was not able to win more. Chokovic keeps going bye bye e.g. after 2008, 2011, lol what happened late 2016 2017 and 2018
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Tennis_Hands
Banned
I am excite about the prospect of further improved Djokovic playing a further improved Zverev, and, imagine that, Romeo Beckham, Leo Federer, and even the local TTW recreational warrior.
What are his chances?!?
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
I am excite about the prospect of further improved Djokovic playing a further improved Zverev, and, imagine that, Romeo Beckham, Leo Federer, and even the local TTW recreational warrior.
What are his chances?!?
I meant to say shame chokovic could not win more 2014-2019 due to repeated chokes and mental fragility (what the hell happened in 2017 and 2018. He even had fed trailblazing and showing djokovic the light with 18/19 slams - so djokovic knew such domination was possible and had no excuse why did he choke it away?)
Very excited to see peak zverev go up against an increasingly peak novak. I think novak has far more scope to improve his serve and mental strength and will continue peaking. As a minimum until 38 but should be more due to his superior physique and flexibility.
Novaks game is akready beta to even mug zverev. I think it may a little early for Leo beckham and ttw warriors to surpasa it but give it one more generation who knows. Fed and nadals level of play is safe for at least 70 years. Djokovics has already been overtaken by mug level players
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
Fed fanatics get more and more rabid as Djoko and Nadal get closer.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
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Deleted member 757377
Guest
In the last 8 years Djoko ended no.1 5 times, and close no.2 two other times.Much disgust about your failure to see the ever improving game.
Sad for Hoad, sadder for the inferior Djokovic overhead.
I don't get this evolution joke.
Alfred Chicken
Rookie
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
You reminded me that wtf final vs murray where no 1 was at stake was another chokivic to a non ATG. Anytime something big is at stake he chokes it. He wont but imagine he gets to 19 slams. He would choke every slam final even if he was facing a 56 year old david ferrer. There isnt a chance in hell he gets to 21 slams even if he reaches a further 40.slam finals
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Yes he only did so because it was a weak era particulalry 2014-2019 and also because he didnt have the likea of peak zverev, kachinov (roddicks, wawrinkas and other bug servers or hitters which novak cant handle even in slam finals) Also its disgraceful chokovic didnt win more slams in this period. Fed won 11 in four years and clealry showed djokovic a pathway
Nadal_Django
Legend
Well, Djokovic didn't had the luxury to play Baghdatis, Roddick, Hewitt, Gonzalez, Philippoussis and young baby toddler clay court specialist Nadal in the Slam finals, didn't he!
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
Well, Djokovic didn't had the luxury to play Baghdatis, Roddick, Hewitt, Gonzalez, Philippoussis and young baby toddler clay court specialist Nadal in the Slam finals, didn't he!
Yes nadal had the luxury of playing those mugs and lost. Even baghdatais crushed nadal in the slam that fed beat baghdatis in hahahahah. Nadal is in same era as fed beaging those mugs to get 5 slams early on and then mugging the pre djok years before nadals 7-0 7-0 humiliatuon
TheGhostOfAgassi
Talk Tennis Guru
Great article!
Some truth
Some truth
Nadal_Django
Legend
@jonnyhomeboy9851
Baghdatis defeated Nadal in Slam match. Where, when?
Even kindergarten Nadal in his 3rd grass court tournament of his career, easily dispatched mighty Baghdatis in the 2006 Wimbledon.
Baghdatis defeated Nadal in Slam match. Where, when?
Even kindergarten Nadal in his 3rd grass court tournament of his career, easily dispatched mighty Baghdatis in the 2006 Wimbledon.
TheGhostOfAgassi
Talk Tennis Guru
jonnyhomeboy9851
Rookie
What a goat Fed is
Federer is career inflated due to weak era
Nadal is hugely career inflated in regards of ferrer, peurta etc and pre 2011 djokovic but more so by even his "good" wins being against career inflated fed and then the damning 7-0 7-0 humiliations by novak... then chokovic
Basically the future is zverev
TheGhostOfAgassi
Talk Tennis Guru
Basically Fed is no goat
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