The reason why Djokovic's 2011 feat is special.

FreeBird

Legend
Looking at the stats for total number of different semifinalists at the 4 slams for the 16 slots:

2007:
Federer (4)
Djokovic (3)
Nadal (2)
Davydenko (2)
Gonzales (1)
Roddick (1)
Haas (1)
Gasquet (1)
Ferrer (1)

Total: 9

2008:
Nadal (4)
Federer (4)
Djokovic (3)
Murray (1)
Tsonga (1)
Monfils (1)
Safin (1)
Schüttler (1)

Total: 8

2009:
Federer (4)
Nadal (2)
Del Potro (2)
Roddick (2)
Soderling (1)
Verdasco (1)
Gonzales (1)
Murray (1)
Haas (1)
Djokovic (1)

Total: 10

2010:
Nadal (3)
Federer (2)
Djokovic (2)
Murray (2)
Berdych (2)
Soderling (1)
Tsonga (1)
Cilic (1)
Melzer (1)
Youzhny (1)

Total: 10

2011:
Djokovic (4)
Murray (4)
Nadal (3)
Federer (3)
Ferrer (1)
Tsonga (1
)

Total: 6

2012:
Djokovic (4)
Murray (3)
Federer (3)
Nadal (2)
Ferrer (2)
Tsonga (1)
Berdych (1)

Total: 7

2013:
Djokovic (4)
Nadal (2)
Murray (2)
Ferrer (2)
Federer (1)
Tsonga (1)
Del Potro (1)
Janowicz (1)
Gasquet (1)
Wawrinka (1)

Total: 10

2014:
Djokovic (3)
Federer (3)
Nadal (2)
Wawrinka (1)
Berdych (1)
Murray (1)
Gulbis (1)
Dimitrov (1)
Raonic (1)
Nishikori (1)
Cilic (1)

Total: 11


2011 had the least upsets for the top seeds and all the top players were there in SF (without 'OMG, I caused an upset and am just content to reach SF' players). In 2011, you had to pass through the best players in SFs and Fs to win it. 2012 had 7 different SFists and it was one of the great years too.

It has been felt that 2014 has produced low quality tennis. This can be reflected in the stats with 11 different SFists for 2014.
 
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Deleted member 307496

Guest
2011 is also the same year many different journeymen from Federer's era had a stay in the top 10.
 
N

Nathaniel_Near

Guest
A lot of posters have recently stated that the strongest two years in recent history are 2011-2012, so it's interesting that this personal take on what constitutes a strong year seems to match up to that.
 

FreeBird

Legend
2011 is also the same year many different journeymen from Federer's era had a stay in the top 10.
And also an year where Top 4 players from Fed's era (Davy and Nalby) were not even in Top 20. Hahaha. So braindead logic of yours.
 
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D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
And also an year where Top 4 players from Fed's era (Davy and Nalby) were not even in Top 20. Hahaha. So braindead logic of yours.
Washed up Davydenko and Nalbandian who had surgeries weren't in the top 20 in 2011 means what? Nothing. Explain why players who got dominated by these two during 2004-2007 were stable top 10 players in 2011?
 
Washed up Davydenko and Nalbandian who had surgeries weren't in the top 20 in 2011 means what? Nothing. Explain why players who got dominated by these two during 2004-2007 were stable top 10 players in 2011?
It's bad for you health to laugh while eating soup.
 

FreeBird

Legend
Washed up Davydenko and Nalbandian who had surgeries weren't in the top 20 in 2011 means what? Nothing. Explain why players who got dominated by these two during 2004-2007 were stable top 10 players in 2011?
2006 rankings:

1. Switzerland Roger Federer US$8,343,885
2. Spain Rafael Nadal 3,746,360
3. United States Andy Roddick 2,214,890
4. Russia Nikolay Davydenko 2,026,845
5. United States James Blake 1,894,295
6. Croatia Ivan Ljubičić 1,713,167
7. Spain Tommy Robredo 1,454,675
8. Argentina David Nalbandian 1,420,040
9. Croatia Mario Ančić 1,276,265
10. Sweden Jonas Björkman 1,221,485

Hahaha.. Almost 35 year-old Top 10 Jonas Bjorkman...Where was regular Top 4 Roddick in 2011? Robredo in Top 8. Hahaha.


Compared to:

1 Novak Djokovic (SRB) 13,475 18
2 Rafael Nadal (ESP) 9,375 19
3 Andy Murray (GBR) 7,380 18
4 Roger Federer (SUI) 6,670 18
5 David Ferrer (ESP) 4,480 22
6 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (FRA) 3,535 24
7 [ Tomáš Berdych (CZE) 3,300 23
8 Mardy Fish (USA) 2,965 23
9 Janko Tipsarević (SRB) 2,395 27
10 Nicolás Almagro (ESP)

Look at the top 6. These were the only guys who reached SF and you had to beat them to win a slam.

Are you saying that Roddick, Davy, Black, Ljubicic, Fed, NAdal >> Djokovic, Murray, Fed, NAdal, Ferrer, Tsonga?

 
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Robredo in Top 8. Hahaha.
Why is that laughable? Almost EIGHT years later the guy was #14 in the world in April of this year when one month away from his 32nd birthday and is currently ranked #18.

This is the problem with every Fed, Rafa and Novak fanboy on this forum. They tear down everyone who is not their guy as if he is a chump, without seeming to realise that if that were true it would harm their own guy's standing.
 

conway

Banned
Robredo hasn't declined any though. He is playing the way he always has. The same way Ferrer is playing his best ever tennis in his 30s (atleast up until last year). They don't seem to follow the regular pattern of others in their 30s, even Federer, who have declined somewhat. Must be a Spanish thing.

2006 was a very weak year and Robredo would never be as high as YE#7 in anything except a very weak year. And don't come up with any Ferrer examples since Ferrer is a way better player than Robredo is.
 
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D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
2006 rankings:

1. Switzerland Roger Federer US$8,343,885
2. Spain Rafael Nadal 3,746,360
3. United States Andy Roddick 2,214,890
4. Russia Nikolay Davydenko 2,026,845
5. United States James Blake 1,894,295
6. Croatia Ivan Ljubičić 1,713,167
7. Spain Tommy Robredo 1,454,675
8. Argentina David Nalbandian 1,420,040
9. Croatia Mario Ančić 1,276,265
10. Sweden Jonas Björkman 1,221,485

Hahaha.. Almost 35 year-old Top 10 Jonas Bjorkman...Where was regular Top 4 Roddick in 2011? Robredo in Top 8. Hahaha.


Compared to:

1 Novak Djokovic (SRB) 13,475 18
2 Rafael Nadal (ESP) 9,375 19
3 Andy Murray (GBR) 7,380 18
4 Roger Federer (SUI) 6,670 18
5 David Ferrer (ESP) 4,480 22
6 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (FRA) 3,535 24
7 [ Tomáš Berdych (CZE) 3,300 23
8 Mardy Fish (USA) 2,965 23
9 Janko Tipsarević (SRB) 2,395 27
10 Nicolás Almagro (ESP)

Look at the top 6. These were the only guys who reached SF and you had to beat them to win a slam.

Are you saying that Roddick, Davy, Black, Ljubicic, Fed, NAdal >> Djokovic, Murray, Fed, NAdal, Ferrer, Tsonga?

1 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 12,870
2 Djokovic, Novak (SRB) 9,640
3 Federer, Roger (SUI) 8,550
4 Murray, Andy (GBR) 5,905
5 Soderling, Robin (SWE) 5,420
6 Ferrer, David (ESP) 4,840
7 Berdych, Tomas (CZE) 3,900
8 Melzer, Jurgen (AUT) 2,975
9 Monfils, Gael (FRA) 2,600
10 Fish, Mardy (USA) 2,401

 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
Robredo hasn't declined any though. He is playing the way he always has. The same way Ferrer is playing his best ever tennis in his 30s (atleast up until last year). They don't seem to follow the regular pattern of others in their 30s, even Federer, who have declined somewhat. Must be a Spanish thing.

2006 was a very weak year and Robredo would never be as high as YE#7 in anything except a very weak year. And don't come up with any Ferrer examples since Ferrer is a way better player than Robredo is.
So basically "Robredo wouldn't have been a top 8 player in any year except a weak year because Ferrer is a better player than him and I say so".

I'm in tears at you saying Robredo hasn't declined and is still playing the same game. I honestly am.
 

FreeBird

Legend
1 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 12,870
2 Djokovic, Novak (SRB) 9,640
3 Federer, Roger (SUI) 8,550
4 Murray, Andy (GBR) 5,905
5 Soderling, Robin (SWE) 5,420
6 Ferrer, David (ESP) 4,840
7 Berdych, Tomas (CZE) 3,900
8 Melzer, Jurgen (AUT) 2,975
9 Monfils, Gael (FRA) 2,600
10 Fish, Mardy (USA) 2,401

This is start of 2011, not end. Also, did they reach semis? Big 4 and Tsonga, Ferrer were the one who reached semis, not some random mugs.
 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
Real 2006 rankings.

1 Federer, Roger (SUI) 8,370
2 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 4,470
3 Davydenko, Nikolay (RUS) 2,825
4 Blake, James (USA) 2,530
5 Ljubicic, Ivan (CRO) 2,495
6 Roddick, Andy (USA) 2,415
7 Robredo, Tommy (ESP) 2,375
8 Nalbandian, David (ARG) 2,295
9 Ancic, Mario (CRO) 2,060
10 Gonzalez, Fernando (CHI) 2,015

Lmao at FreeBird trying to say that Tsonga and Ferrer are any better than Roddick or Davydenko.
 

FreeBird

Legend
So basically "Robredo wouldn't have been a top 8 player in any year except a weak year because Ferrer is a better player than him and I say so".

I'm in tears at you saying Robredo hasn't declined and is still playing the same game. I honestly am.
Robredo was not even Top 30 in 2011. :lol:
 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
This is start of 2011, not end. Also, did they reach semis? Big 4 and Tsonga, Ferrer were the one who reached semis, not some random mugs.
1 Djokovic, Novak (SRB) 13,630
2 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 9,595
3 Federer, Roger (SUI) 8,170
4 Murray, Andy (GBR) 7,380
5 Ferrer, David (ESP) 4,925
6 Tsonga, Jo-Wilfried (FRA) 4,335
7 Berdych, Tomas (CZE) 3,700
8 Fish, Mardy (USA) 2,965
9 Tipsarevic, Janko (SRB) 2,595
10 Almagro, Nicolas (ESP) 2,380
 

FreeBird

Legend
Real 2006 rankings.

1 Federer, Roger (SUI) 8,370
2 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 4,470
3 Davydenko, Nikolay (RUS) 2,825
4 Blake, James (USA) 2,530
5 Ljubicic, Ivan (CRO) 2,495
6 Roddick, Andy (USA) 2,415
7 Robredo, Tommy (ESP) 2,375
8 Nalbandian, David (ARG) 2,295
9 Ancic, Mario (CRO) 2,060
10 Gonzalez, Fernando (CHI) 2,015

Lmao at FreeBird trying to say that Tsonga and Ferrer are any better than Roddick or Davydenko.
I didn't say. Murray, Djokovic, Ferrer, Tsonga >>> Roddick, Ljubicic, Blake, Davy...Lmao at Sabratha trying to say that Murray, Djokovic don't count.
 
Do people not realise that if they tear down the other top guys they make their own guy look bad?

If Novak is so great and Fed is so terrible then how come older Fed beat peak Novak at RG and was a MP away from going 2-1 against him in Majors that year? And even older Fed managed to get to #1 over Novak in 2012. It is because they are both great players, that is why.
 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
I didn't say. Murray, Djokovic, Ferrer, Tsonga >>> Roddick, Ljubicic, Blake, Davy...Lmao at Sabratha trying to say that Murray, Djokovic don't count.
Slamless Murray in 2011 is meant to count? He was basically a walkover for Nadal in this time period.
 

FreeBird

Legend
Do people not realise that if they tear down the other top guys they make their own guy look bad?

If Novak is so great and Fed is so terrible then how come older Fed beat peak Novak at RG and was a MP away from going 2-1 against him in Majors that year? And even older Fed managed to get to #1 over Novak in 2012. It is because they are both great players, that is why.
Listen, Federer >>>>>>>>>>>>> Novak. But the competition was weak in 2004-07 as compared to 2011. No way Federer would have amassed 13 slams in a span of 4 years with the 2011 competition.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
Saby are you seriously trying to argue that 2006 was stronger than 2011?! :shock::shock:
You should know by now that you cannot compared years or eras.

Tommy Haas beating Novak at 35 and Robredo beating Novak this year are ample testament that no era is weak or strong.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
Only 1 guy lost an opportunity yesterday and you know it. :)
Haha, joke.

Novak had it on a platter, more so after beating Murray and with no Nadal to face.

Fed is not guaranteed to win anything, even a 250. He just uses his experience to win matches and stay at No.3 . If you think it is the same Fed, you are delusional.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
I'm only talking about 2006 and 2011 though, no other years.
2011 Novak had a phenomenal year , matched only by Fed and McEnroe of the past. That is all what can be said of 2011.

No way you can say that year is better than any other year.

Since 2010 it is top heavy but you had more all round players in the prior years.

One cannot make a judgement of the years based on which players make the top 10 list.
 
Listen, Federer >>>>>>>>>>>>> Novak. But the competition was weak in 2004-07 as compared to 2011. No way Federer would have amassed 13 slams in a span of 4 years with the 2011 competition.
You can look at the 2011 field two different ways.

Novak had 9-time Major winner Nadal and 16-time Major winner Roger to deal with. So, on paper, it does not really even matter who else is in the top 10. No one has ever had two such successful all-time greats to compete with at the same time.

On the other hand, in this unparalleled-looking field, Novak had success that he has never seen again. From AO through to the USO, he won 10 titles from 11 finals from 12 tournaments, including 3 of the 4 Majors and going 6-0 against Nadal and 4-1 against Fed. From IW until Wimbledon, Nadal reached 8 out of 9 finals. So you had two guys just dominating the tour, with one of them (Djokovic) dominating the other when they met.

Did Djokovic just happen to hit his best form ever during a super strong field? Or is he only winning 1 Major a year since then because the field has gotten stronger?

This is why I don't tend to care about judging the strength of eras as they can be interpreted different ways and just look at achievements.
 

D.Nalby12

G.O.A.T.
Listen, Federer >>>>>>>>>>>>> Novak. But the competition was weak in 2004-07 as compared to 2011. No way Federer would have amassed 13 slams in a span of 4 years with the 2011 competition.
And no way Djokovic would've amassed 3 GS season with 2006 competition including peak Fed. It works either a way I don't think so called "Peak Djokovic" lost 41 match streak to past prime Fed on his worst surface, luckily survived at USO again to post prime Fed could win more than 1 GS in 2006, I'm not sure with 1 also.


Basically a needless hyping thread, problem with Djokovic fans is most of them didn't follow Tennis in 2004-07, the era dominance of peak Fed. If you watch highlights of 2006 USO final and the way Roddick was playing inspired clutch Tennis with Connors, you'll realize his improvements were huge then almost like Murray with Lendl, only difference was Peak Fed didn't gift it Roddick like Djokovic gifted to Murray.


Djokovic had great year but still he was still behind in W/L%, total wins compared to each of Fed's dominant year. He luckily won USO, he couldn't win WTF like Fed did because he lost Tipsarevic there, was Tipsa strong player then ? :lol:
or getting bagelled by Nishikori (Who further lost to Fed!)
was ultimate indicator of great season?

Also Djokovic has weak competition too when he won Wimbledon as Tsonga took Fed out while Murray was taken by Nadal. These two players further exposed him on grass beating him in next two Wimbledons.


Further indicator of his level wasn't any close to Fed that he couldn't maintain his dominant reputation after that lost GS matches to Fed (again!), Murray, Nadal (Can excuse this one).

If you call Murray a strong era player then you have to agree with Hewitt, Safin were too with almost same resume.

Murray beating him in USO 2012, Wimbledon 2013 Finals was biggest taint to his legacy since post prime Fed beat Murray thrice in GS finals, while prime Djokovic lost two.

I don't think (which is matter of fact) Peak Fed would've lost GS final to Murray let as alone two. He would be slam less and you with your hype army would be bashing him as weak era player. :lol:


Djokovic played great, second best peak level of the era but only for 6 months and USO while Fed managed to maintain his level for straight Years or his level was untouchable.
In 2012 lot of players exposed him including post prime Fed, Murray, Nadal shows he wasn't untouchable.


After all I don't believe in above logic, every player is great if you talk about players with high calibre but hyping your boy for something that he couldn't achieve by shooting others which are clearly better making subjective, biased argument based on limited knowledge is losers game. I'm out now, keep on hype job, may be your boy will win 20 GS (Actual 10)
since every GS won in this era automatically equates to 2 GS won in other era, ain't it?
 

D.Nalby12

G.O.A.T.
Saby are you seriously trying to argue that 2006 was stronger than 2011?! :shock::shock:
Weren't you made troll argument like Murray>> Hewitt??

Put 2011 Djokovic in 2006, I'm not sure he'll win GS against peak Fed even Roddick's 2006 USO is comparable to Djokovic's who luckily survived against post prime Fed go on to win beating Nadal against him he had mental edge.

Since then Djokovic lost to Murray, Nadal, Nishikori at USO, trend shows he got ultra lucky winning his lone USO.
 
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Djokovic2011

Bionic Poster
Weren't you made troll argument like Murray>> Hewitt??

Put 2011 Djokovic in 2006, I'm not sure he'll win GS against peak Fed even Roddick's 2006 USO is comparable to Djokovic's who luckily survived against post prime Fed go on to win beating Nadal against him he had mental edge.

Since then Djokovic lost to Murray, Nadal, Nishikori at USO, trend shows he got ultra lucky winning his lone USO.

 

TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
Are you saying that Roddick, Davy, Black, Ljubicic, Fed, NAdal >> Djokovic, Murray, Fed, NAdal, Ferrer, Tsonga?

Prime Federer is better than past prime Federer.

Ljubicic in 2005 & 2006 level is just as good as Tsonga at his best.

Most people have agree that Davydenko > Ferrer.

2006 Nadal was a greater clay courter than he was in 2011.

LOL at referring Blake as "black". You have a problem with him?

Anyway, everyone has his own opinion, having a smiley icon doesn't make your opinion is fact.
 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
What a great bump.

"Nobody was questioning Djokovic's success before 2015, nobody called 2011 a weak era, he was getting all the praise for his first 5-6 Slams..." LMAO
People were questioning Djokovic's success and his 2011 raised eyebrows again because 2014 was a crummy year in terms of competition.

The bottom of the top 10 wasn't great in 2011, you must agree with that surely.
 
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