Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by Ross K, Aug 10, 2008.
Moral of the story, Mourinho is a winner and that won't change.
Apart from several cup finals, the upcoming weekend will be remembered for Francesco Totti playing his final game for Roma.
With money taking over, it's almost impossible to imagine in the future that someone would reject huge offers from much bigger clubs just to stay at the club he truly loves. Legend.
I agree up to a point, but if you have 20% possession in a match it tells you something about a manager's approach and ambition. The fact that Real Madrid score so many goals says more about the difference between most of the opponents and Real Madrid, but sure expect they were impressive to watch battering those little side. Hard to really do that much damage to a team like Real Madrid, (with them being the biggest club in the world as much money as they ever want to spend etc.) even for a short termist like Mourinho (feel like we've discussed this at length though maybe we should just leave it?). Embarrassing behaviour is a bit of a trademark, especially now when he just loves to whinge. At least earlier in his career like when he was at Chelsea the first time he was a bit more entertaining (to think he called himself the happy one when he came back), or maybe it was because it was new.
Think you were underachieving with what you had though, the players are not as **** as Mourinho has tried to make them out to be to justify his failings. Rashford has been ok, but he was better last season but I think that was more a purple patch so I wouldn't put that on Mourinho. I just don't rate him that highly so I think his solid level is about where he is, think he's a sort of Theo Walcott level player, not a world star, which is pretty good of course but I think people just got carried away. Martial is a great talent and he has regressed a lot this year which I think is a reflection on Mourinho's poor skills at managing youngsters, don't even get me started on his car crash with Luke Shaw, who he just seems to absolutely hate for some reason. The wastefulness is just a reflection of where you're at, and you're right Liverpool have had that in some recent years, broke a record for amount of times hit the woodwork one season, and the opposition goalkeeper seeming to have the game of his life against you so often. But cheer up, 300 million more investment and you'll find the team to be strangely less wasteful goalkeepers won't seem to keep having worldie's every time.
True, and he almost did despite everything but you are right. But I think it's less likely now with Mourinho, because like Wenger, I think the game has moved on without him, of course they still both know football and probably aren't going to turn into appalling managers, but because of this are no longer the top class managers that they used to be in my view so I don't see why it'd be any different for Man Utd.
Fixed that for you mate.
Think you're probably right about Totti, how many one club men are we going to see going forward, very few. Absolutely top quality player though, just one of those players you can't help admiring, to take a football manager phrase.
12 years ago today
By far the greatest European cup final of all time.
And one of the best nights of my life.
Ah memories, what a ****ing game, what a night. Wouldn't it be lovely to get another one.
Also known as the night that ended Shevchenko's career.
hope the standard of the prem improves soon..its all gone a bit sh!te.
folk moan about la liga but at least most of la liga teams play actual football, and r-madrid, a-madrid, Barcelona are in latters stages of champ lg, sevilla have won the Europa league 3 or 4 times in recent years too.
come on prem..at least try to end the Spanish domination.
Not to point out the obvious. You gotta be in to win and now you're there again. Time to dream of those night again. Providing you get past your prelim match.
Yeah weird, ever since Liverpool stopped being in it regularly, English teams consistently getting to the later stages has stopped. Coincidence? I think not!
Think City and Chelsea are probably best placed to make a go of it at the moment, expect improvements soon though, the top sides in the Prem seem to be looking stronger these days.
Well yeah it's been a while, last time was a bit of a shambles but I'll be expecting more next season. Don't expect to be challenging for it yet, but can always dream.
De Gea odds have improved on staying after United got into the champions league.
Van Dijk is linked with everybody. Keane and Lindelof as well.
Well trodden path Southampton to Liverpool, come on Virgil, you know it makes sense.
Who you hoping for?
I don't really know who we'll bring in. Most of the rumours seem to be more about people leaving than those coming in (Lukaku and Morata aside, hardly the most inspiring though!).
Hoping for Griezmann, as well as one quality midfielder and center back. It could turn into a very special squad.
On this day 18 years ago, one of the top 3-4 most epic finals in CL history. De Baby-faced snikmorder scoring to seal the treble will never be forgotten.
Time flies so fast...
It certainly does.
Griezmann will be the United galactico signing this summer. I'd be taking my shirt to get Griezmann 7 on it now if I still got names on my shirts.
It says United are looking for 4 signings. A centre-back, utility defender and a centre midfielder.
4 signings. Center back, utility defender, center midfielder. I assume and hope the fourth will be Griezmann.
Soon the number of Englishmen in the club will be lower than the number of Spaniards and the French. I can imagine some French freestyle happening in the dressing room after big wins.
I think that the potential is already there, and that the squad already has a lot of depth and options. It just needs fine tuning. A lot of the new signings from this season like Pogba will look more comfortable next season, while players like Rashford will continue to mature.
Untilabout February, Man Utd were playing very good football in the league, they were just struggling to convert their chances. They were battering teams but drawing too many matches. They already have a good base to build on, and I'm sure Mourinho will plug in the gaps and strengthen in the key areas, like he did at Inter in the summer of 2009, Chelsea in the summer of 2014 etc.
I think that with a direct entry into next season's Champions League group stage (they don't have to play in a qualifying round like Liverpool) plus 2 trophies, it has been a successful first season for Mourinho at Man Utd. He is just a born winner and always delivers trophies. Obviously next season he absolutely has to challenge for the title, or if not then make a deep run in the Champions League. If they don't come close to winning either, then his Man Utd legacy could descend into a failure to deliver. Man Utd have to get back to competing at the top end for either the Premier League or Champions League or both.
It's amazing that he has won 4 European trophies during his career at 3 different clubs from different countries.
Looking back to his 2003 UEFA Cup win with Porto, it's easy to conclude that as they had Deco, Ferreira, Carvalho etc that they were strong favourites to beat Celtic. But I think that his Porto team was assembled on a noticeably smaller budget than O'Neill's Celtic team. Both Celtic and Rangers were spending a lot of money at that time. And then the next year to win a Champions League title in the modern day 32 team era with a Portuguese club was just superhuman.
On the flipside, while he didn't fail at Real Madrid, I don't think he did a particularly amazing job there either. He took over anamazingly strong squad at the biggest club in the world, which had just finished with 96 points in La Liga the previous season. Also Ronaldo was hitting his physical peak then. In 2011/2012 and 2012/2013 I think he had a stronger squad than Barcelona, who became way too reliant on Messi for goals and were weak in defence with Pique losing the plot for a few years and Puyol past his best. His 2012 title win was hugely impressive; 100 points, 121 goals, 16 away wins, but in 2012/2013 he won nothing, fell out with everyone and the admitted that the title race was over as early as November. It's funny when people say that he ended Barcelona's dominance or knocked them off their perch. He didn't. Barcelona were allowed to regain their domestic supremacy in 2012/2013 without any trouble at all.
The good ol days with Rangers back in the 90s. Hard to believe there was a time that I followed it just as closely as the premier league. Back when they were going for 10 in a row and they had Gazza, Laudrup, Albertz, Goram, Gough etc.
FA Cup final day!
2003 and Chris Baird feels like yesterday.
Wenger going for his 7th yet has never won the league cup.
Totally forgot about it. Brook, Spence and Chocolate brownies have taken over my mind. I'm sure I'll watch a bit of the final. Not hyped for it.
Losing the traditional 3pm timeslot and other stuff buggered it up.
I will watch but it has lost its luster
Great call, blatant dive
I decide to support Chelsea for the first time this season and this is what I get. Hope you have a meltdown in the league just like last year you mugs.
I'm glad for Arsenal and particularly Wenger. One wonders what he said before the match to help fire up his squad to play for each other and for him like that. Great stuff.
I am watching though.
It's killing me waiting for the fight. It's pure agony.
Dear oh dear how poor were Chelsea today.
We're champions again!
7 FA Cups for Wenger, some going
Also Celtic complete an unbeaten domestic season, well done wee Brendy Rodgers.
French, German and Spanish cup finals tonight too..
Conte said last week his biggest challenge was to prepare the team for this match, not physically but mentally. Arsenal would have maximum motivation due it being an opportunity to salvage their poor season while for Chelsa this match was something of a bonus.
The comments themselves where of course an attempt to focus and motivate Chelsea.
Amazing to win 7 times. I hope he has a few 7 and 7's tonight.
Just put it on there. I know what you mean. It is hard to contain all the hype that is going through my body now. Looking forward to it. Quite interested in Groves as well.
Saddest day this year
Well done to Wenger and the boys, capitalised on a pretty poor performance from the blues and finally pocket some silverware to salvage an otherwise forgettable season! We were outplayed from the start pretty much. Didn't look like there was a clear plan, lost possession too many times, became very complacent after the equaliser - but defence was good. Had a bit of luck too, could easily have been a 4-1 scoreline.
A tactical dinosaur past his best, still won more than all other English clubs this season.
Don't get triggered guys, whether it's two or three the point stands anyway.
Borussia Dortmund finally won the German cup after losing the final in all of the previous three years. 2-1 win over Eintracht Frankfurt. Their first trophy outside of the German Supercup since 2012.
PSG won in France thanks to an injury time own goal. 1-0 win over Angers. No Ibra no party for them.
Barcelona with the third Spanish cup in a row, 3-1 win over Deportivo Alaves. After a 4 year break we will have a Spanish supercup between Barca and Real, two legs in August. Speaking of supercups I am tempted to try attending the European one when Man United will meet Juve/Real in Skopje.
It's always nicer to end a season with a trophy. Third Copa del Rey in a row, stretching the record to 29. Tougher match than many people expected, Deportivo Alaves competed so well and scored a beautiful equalizing goal but we won 3-1 thanks to goals from Messi, Neymar and Alcacer.
Luis Enrique says goodbye to Barcelona after three years of managing. Like Pep Guardiola, he's won all competitions. Two La Liga titles, three Copa del Rey titles, one Champions League, one European Super Cup, one Spanish Super Cup and one FIFA Club World Cup. His first season was the best and third was the worst but still that's a great contribution. Gracias Lucho.
I am running out of adjectives to describe Messi. Another show from him tonight.
Another super precise shot from outside the box, and another magical run + assist. That's 54 goals and 18 assists in only 52 appearances this season. But if you watch him regularly these numbers are just even more impressive because that's not all what the guy is about. Far from it actually. Over this season nobody has come close to him in terms of individual performances. But we all know that Ronaldo will win the Ballon d'Or if Real win the Champions League. This time I hope Juventus won't allow it for that reason, even more than because of the usual rivalry between the clubs.
Congratulations to all domestic league and cup winners of this season.
The Europa Cup is a consolation prize for clubs with Champions League title aspirations and expectations. All football fans know this.
Well I'll always prefer competing in the Champions League but since the club competed in the Europa League this season I'd have preferred them taking it seriously and winning it over tanking and losing early, especially since it was the only major trophy missing from the collection.
Yeah, I saw it as the means to an end and I hope we are never in that competition again. I bet I enjoyed the cup winners' cup win over Barcelona a lot more than I did on Wednesday. I'm sure I've referred to the Europa League as a mickey mouse cup. Back in the Champions league is what counts. Back in prime time.
Two steps slow in everything they did all game. Around the half hour mark Matic played a simple 5 yard sideways pass to Kante and he hit it so hard and high it hit him straight in the face
Credit to Arsenal, only one team turned up today. Chelsea were lucky it wasn't a cricket score.
What an excellent performance from Arsenal, they completely dominated the game from start to finish. I thought the fact they were 'only' 1-0 up at half-time having wasted so many chances to increase their lead, would come back to cost them, but it didn't.
If I was an Arsenal fan (no had vested interest in their finances and accounts), I would much prefer finishing 5th and winning the FA Cup, than finishing 4th and winning nothing. Much better to win a major trophy, than qualify for a competition that they have no chance of winning anyway and that they are only making up the numbers in. They've been in the Champions League for 19 years in a row anyway, so I think the novelty of CL football wore off a long time ago.
For all the criticism that Enrique has faced during the last 14-15 months or so, (and I guess his first 4 months in the job before MSN clicked), at least he can say that during his 3 years at Barcelona he had a better record in every single major competition than Mourinho had during his 3 years at Real Madrid:
Champions League titles: Enrique 1-0 Mourinho
La Liga titles: Enrique 2-1 Mourinho
Copa Del Rey titles: Enrique 3-1 Mourinho
Club World Cup titles: Enrique 1-0 Mourinho
I just love taking unnecessary digs at Mourinho.
I agree with most of this. He ended our streak but Barcelona's dominance resumed later. 2012-13 was the most straightforward La Liga we ever won. Personally I was a bit disappointed we didn't break Real Madrid's record of 100 points but only tied it. In the first half of the season we had 18 wins, 1 draw and no losses. Everything was clicking so well, the record was there for the taking. Messi did something incredible that season, scoring in 21 consecutive league games, all 19 opponents. But this season the reliance on him was far more clear than ever. Even though several reinforcements are needed, extending his contract should be the main priority.
Fair play to Arsenal, they were excellent, much better side probably should have been more and Mertesacker being so good despite playing only 37 minutes of football this season and never having played in a back three apparently? Saw that Arsenal defence and though that was ripe for Chelsea to go at but they gave them very little so well played.
Yeah I know what you mean, it probably should be the case that finishing 5th and winning the FA Cup should be better but the fact is, as you say the financial factors are important, but more than that it is the calibre of players that you can sign when you're in the Europa League (unless you pay absurd wages like Man Utd and even then it isn't always going to work) that you tend to attract mean that it's very hard to get back in, just ask Liverpool after they dropped out in 2010.
Never seems to have been that popular does he? But you have to say he's done pretty well really, think most managers would be very happy with those sort of results over a three year period.
Long live unnecessary digs at Mourinho, he loves an unnecessary dig himself, so he's more than earned a bit back.
With a Champions League place granted for winning the Europa Cup that's the far bigger gain than the Cup itself especially for a club like ManU. It's better to win it than not obviously because of the CL place up for grabs.
I thought they'd crumble if Chelsea started playing but well played Arsenal for dominating the match. Chelsea looked heavy-legged out there. Didn't see that one coming.
Happy Totti Day everyone!
70 thousand people and it's tough to find a single person that didn't shed a tear as Totti was making a full circle greeting the crowd and doing his speech. Most of his teammates couldn't stay calm either. I have never seen anything like this and probably never will. Forget all the titles and individual prizes, this is what football is all about. Grazie Francesco.
No other player that we know of right now will earn this kind of farewell. Because none of them will be like Francesco Totti.
A player I can't help admiring.
He is not a soulless organisation like a lot of them.
Presenting the European Golden Boot winner for this season.
Watch and be shocked how this guy is likely to miss out on the biggest individual titles of 2017.
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